Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #120

[Justice101]

Satellite surveillance always in space

Reportedly, there are satellites in the sky over our enemies.. that can read a license plate. However, they are military or NSA and they won't give info to law enforcement because might not be admissible in court.. plus the reactively moist atmosphere over the US plus they are not spying on Americans with their best satellites, will probably mean no help from the government.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

3 yrs, high profile, the murderer walks among us, surveillance is so advanced as to read license plates...why not appeal to Vice President Pence, formerly gov of Indiana.

I might be naive but couldnt you even be as specific to zoom to the woods at the specfic time on feb 13th 2017???

If you are talking of the possibility of satellite photos from the afternoon of 2/13/2017, I’ve was wondering about that too about a year or so ago and even researched it a little bit. Never could confirm there were stationary satellites that could supply photos anytime over Indiana. Other satellites are used for things like agriculture and come over only on occasion. Those photos would be available for a price but I never saw one with the time and place we need. My guess is LE has already looked into this. Seems like we think alike.

 

[Eclipsed]

I don’t believe there was surveillance in the area.

Satellite surveillance always in space

 

[evilwise]

Satellite surveillance always in space

Don't forget about deja vu

 

[CrimeDawg123]

A huge problem with this case for me, and I’m sure others will feel the same, is the way LE talks about it. I can’t decide if they’re trying to be purposefully confusing or not (perhaps to throw BG off?) but the way they phrase things often makes it seem like they’re walking back on comments. Sometimes I even wonder if they’re letting out little hints about what they know or suspect, but then following it up with “or maybe not.” The more I think about it, the more it seems like they’re playing mind games with someone (not the general public).

For example:
“Somebody may have already interviewed him," said Riley. "I'm not going to say they have or have not, but there's a possibility that has happened.”

Here’s the link to the article that example came from:
ISP on Delphi killer: 'Somebody may have already interviewed him'

"I can’t decide if they’re trying to be purposefully confusing or not"
I completely agree with you. The April 2019 press conference was a mess that required two followup statements. I don't understand how that level of error was possible given that LE announced the press conference days in advance. Perhaps they were purposefully trying to confuse. Scratches head...

 

[Gumbeaux]

I don’t believe there was surveillance in the area.

Is it possible to retroactively search Google Earth?? Or a bigger boys satellite?

I'm guessing someone here has tried it. I've been following since the early days, but don't recall this possibility being discussed.

 

[evilwise]

"I can’t decide if they’re trying to be purposefully oconfusing or not"
I completely agree with you. The April 2019 press conference was a mess that required two followup statements. I don't understand how that level of error was possible given that LE announced the press conference days in advance. Perhaps they were purposefully trying to confuse. Scratches head...

Smart people can have any number of reasons to delegate to dumb people

 

[carbuff]

"I can’t decide if they’re trying to be purposefully confusing or not"
I completely agree with you. The April 2019 press conference was a mess that required two followup statements. I don't understand how that level of error was possible given that LE announced the press conference days in advance. Perhaps they were purposefully trying to confuse. Scratches head...

I think they fell into the trap of knowing what they meant and not realizing nobody else could figure out what the hell they meant.

 

[NameUser]

Satellite surveillance always in space

Is it possible to retroactively search Google Earth?? Or a bigger boys satellite?

I'm guessing someone here has tried it. I've been following since the early days, but don't recall this possibility being discussed.

Even if google had satellite pictures from(not available online from my searches) that day, I don't think there would be much more detail than the photos than those taken by Libby. It would also have to have the photo snapped in that 30 minute time frame to capture anything that may be helpful.

Also for the satellite that have high enough power to be zoomed in on, I think they need a specified target and I doubt they would be looking in the woods of Delphi that day.

 

[TheVisual]

If you are talking of the possibility of satellite photos from the afternoon of 2/13/2017, I’ve was wondering about that too about a year or so ago and even researched it a little bit. Never could confirm there were stationary satellites that could supply photos anytime over Indiana. Other satellites are used for things like agriculture and come over only on occasion. Those photos would be available for a price but I never saw one with the time and place we need. My guess is LE has already looked into this. Seems like we think alike.

Gray Hughes bought a satellite photo but was not the exact time the girls murder was happening.

 

[tresir2012]

My God this article is depressing

I don't know, I have picked some encouraging snippets. It's nowhere near a cold case and they are still getting tips. I have just copied some to stay within the 10% allowed.

"We never throw anything out," said Carter. "When we are done with all we have, we start over. I think I got 18 tips yesterday. Just me at my desk."

"There has been some criticism of me, and I'm willing to take that. I can't explain all the things that I know."

Just police and the killer have that knowledge.

"He has no idea what we know, but one day he will," Carter added.

"I can't think of a time in my entire career, or in many other careers, where we have the voice of the person we believe is the killer, a photograph of who we believe is connected to the murder, and even a snip-it of how he moves," said Carter.

Carter said more information could be released in the future, but for now, this is what we are getting. He thinks it's enough.

He wants you to remember the two sketches are not photographs.

"I believe that eventually, we are going to be able to say this person's the killer, and there's a combination of those two images that will land on his face, whatever that might look like," Carter explained.

 

[Charlot123]

A huge problem with this case for me, and I’m sure others will feel the same, is the way LE talks about it. I can’t decide if they’re trying to be purposefully confusing or not (perhaps to throw BG off?) but the way they phrase things often makes it seem like they’re walking back on comments. Sometimes I even wonder if they’re letting out little hints about what they know or suspect, but then following it up with “or maybe not.” The more I think about it, the more it seems like they’re playing mind games with someone (not the general public).

For example:
“Somebody may have already interviewed him," said Riley. "I'm not going to say they have or have not, but there's a possibility that has happened.”

Here’s the link to the article that example came from:
ISP on Delphi killer: 'Somebody may have already interviewed him'

Or, “as he stood there on his first day”. To us, it means nothing. But to BG, this first day might be a hint. Dis he move from elsewhere? Did he jog on the bridge?

Or maybe, “had the girls taken the left turn...”
...Or had BG taken the left turn, which is essentially the same (they would have not met). To us, it sounds odd. But to BG, it could mean, he really turned the wrong way, somewhere, not his usual way, and LE know it.

(Or does it mean BG is left-handed? Could be, some said it looks like he carries a gun on the “wrong” side. Discussed here).

Or “it is about power to you”. Open to interpretations.

I think if DC is not having enough data to arrest (hopefully, only yet), but as a Christian, feels bad about the case, he just drops these hints.

(I just hope he knows, because if BG is some truck driver, now watching the pressers somewhere in Montana, or elsewhere, he might be laughing his guts out.)

 

[JnRyan]

He wants you to remember the two sketches are not photographs.

"I believe that eventually, we are going to be able to say this person's the killer, and there's a combination of those two images that will land on his face, whatever that might look like," Carter explained.

When we had the first sketch I heard the comment that this could look anyone of thousands of guys in the midwest. Now we have a 2nd sketch and ISP says the killer's actual face is 'somewhere in between' or 'a combination of those two images'. With this possibility he really could be ANYONE!

 

[Charlot123]

When we had the first sketch I heard the comment that this could look anyone of thousands of guys in the midwest. Now we have a 2nd sketch and ISP says the killer's actual face is 'somewhere in between' or 'a combination of those two images'. With this possibility he really could be ANYONE!

He probably doesn’t stand out too much. Otherwise more people would have noticed him. This is what I think, average gait and look...

As to the voice, I think he is enraged. Why?

 

[Serdavc]

This is my first post but I’ve been following this case for two years. I was following the GSK investigation and I ran across the story of Abby and Libby and couldn’t stop thinking of those poor girls and their families. Sorry if post is too long and if I’ve done anything against TOS, please flag my post.

@Falling Down. I think you are 100% correct. “The conclusion I've come to is there's a very high likelihood BG not only knows the bridge area and areas immediately around C.R. 300, the "area in question" in this case, but he knew it before the highway opened in 2014.”


@awsidooger, I think this is exactly what BG did: “But if Bridge Guy did know the Monon High area previously, instead of discovering it recently online, then absolutely there is great chance he remembered it from the pre-State Road 25 and Freedom Bridge days, and merely operated accordingly on February 13th, 2017, just as he would have 10 years or more earlier.”

Here is how I came to agree with you both:

The Hoosier Heartland Hwy removed the Andersons fertilizer facilities that were next to the CPS building in what was known as Deer Creek Commerce Center. See Environmental impact document from 2002. SR 25 Hoosier Heartland Highway from Interstate 65 Interchange to US 24, Tippecanoe, Carroll and Cass Counties

Here are my thoughts: MOO
-I think BG parked at old CPS building because it was ALL that was left of where he was used to parking. (I don’t think it was a CPS building worker only because this was an office of 10 people that administered welfare checks and food stamps- not a lot of time to wander the trails.) See the Environmental Impact statement referenced in above link.
-The CPS was razed in 2018 but maybe the fire in that building was BG covering tracks? I don’t think the cause of the fire was ever determined correct?
-If BG parked there because he worked or delivered at the Andersons Inc. fertilizer plant (sometime before it closed 2011 or earlier) that doesn’t exist there anymore, what companies were represented by the trucks/shipping containers right beside the trail head on old map (see below) where Andersons Inc. used to be before highway 25 was built? LE should focus on them. The plant was literally at the trail head to the MHB. Maybe BG is someone who was used to getting out and stretching his legs and having a smoke on the trails?
-Below is a link to maps that got me thinking about the Andersons Inc. -you have to zoom into Carroll County and look for the CPS building and you will see that the Andersons owned all the land around the CPS building and they had buildings there. ETA that the screen shot of pre 2011 area is at end of post.


thanks for posting the land maps and posting it @skibaboo
Land Parcels County IDHS

I think another WSer, I think- @Charlot123 mentioned a construction worker of Highway 25 possibly being BG and that seems very possible as well. Sorry for not quoting.

-I think the reason Tobe Leazenby says he’s heard “that voice” is because he truly has. Maybe talking to a construction worker on his shift during the building of Highway 25 or someone in line at a coffee shop. I think he’s definitely heard that voice in person.
-I think the day before Valentines Day is very significant. I think he was convinced no one was going to say no to him ever again. I’m wondering if there was a ‘Bonnie’ element similar to GSK. But I also waver that he is possibly an Incel.
-It struck me when I learned that
trash in Delphi is always picked up on Tuesday mornings at 6am and the murders were committed on a Monday. Covering tracks? Ditching evidence?
-Did BG fish: have a fishing pole? That’s why nobody questioned wet clothes? I’m in the camp that thinks those brave girls ran across the creek to escape and not that they were brought there on purpose.
-Somewhere in the construction of the new highway and Valentine’s Day is BG. And It’s all in the Environmental impact statement of route 25. I just can’t figure it out.
-I can’t rule out a connection to the Evansdale murders, there are too many similarities to say they aren’t connected but I can’t find a definitive link. And I’ve searched a lot about grain elevators in both areas.

-Thank you to all the WSers for their thoughts and time, I’m only building upon what you have already worked hard on. Thank you to Tricia for keeping this site above board and honest and honoring the victims and their families. LET TODAY BE THE DAY.

MOO

 

[heartgoesout]

It said No HUNTING or motorized vehicles. JMO, could that have given him pause? If I were DC it would have caught my eye.

The sign in question the DC was talking about is the 501 trail sign. It simply says Mary I. Gerard Nature Reserve with an arrow, 501 steps and at one point Monon High Bridge with an arrow. I believe you are talking about the sign at the entrance to the trails.

 

[carbuff]

He probably doesn’t stand out too much. Otherwise more people would have noticed him. This is what I think, average gait and look...

As to the voice, I think he is enraged. Why?

Enraged, or some kind of suppressed strong emotion.

 

[Hatfield]

This is my first post but I’ve been following this case for two years. I was following the GSK investigation and I ran across the story of Abby and Libby and couldn’t stop thinking of those poor girls and their families. Sorry if post is too long and if I’ve done anything against TOS, please flag my post.

@Falling Down. I think you are 100% correct. “The conclusion I've come to is there's a very high likelihood BG not only knows the bridge area and areas immediately around C.R. 300, the "area in question" in this case, but he knew it before the highway opened in 2014.”


@awsidooger, I think this is exactly what BG did: “But if Bridge Guy did know the Monon High area previously, instead of discovering it recently online, then absolutely there is great chance he remembered it from the pre-State Road 25 and Freedom Bridge days, and merely operated accordingly on February 13th, 2017, just as he would have 10 years or more earlier.”

Here is how I came to agree with you both:

The Hoosier Heartland Hwy removed the Andersons fertilizer facilities that were next to the CPS building in what was known as Deer Creek Commerce Center. See Environmental impact document from 2002. SR 25 Hoosier Heartland Highway from Interstate 65 Interchange to US 24, Tippecanoe, Carroll and Cass Counties

Here are my thoughts: MOO
-I think BG parked at old CPS building because it was ALL that was left of where he was used to parking. (I don’t think it was a CPS building worker only because this was an office of 10 people that administered welfare checks and food stamps- not a lot of time to wander the trails.) See the Environmental Impact statement referenced in above link.
-The CPS was razed in 2018 but maybe the fire in that building was BG covering tracks? I don’t think the cause of the fire was ever determined correct?
-If BG parked there because he worked or delivered at the Andersons Inc. fertilizer plant (sometime before it closed 2011 or earlier) that doesn’t exist there anymore, what companies were represented by the trucks/shipping containers right beside the trail head on old map (see below) where Andersons Inc. used to be before highway 25 was built? LE should focus on them. The plant was literally at the trail head to the MHB. Maybe BG is someone who was used to getting out and stretching his legs and having a smoke on the trails?
-Below is a link to maps that got me thinking about the Andersons Inc. -you have to zoom into Carroll County and look for the CPS building and you will see that the Andersons owned all the land around the CPS building and they had buildings there. ETA that the screen shot of pre 2011 area is at end of post.


thanks for posting the land maps and posting it @skibaboo
Land Parcels County IDHS

I think another WSer, I think- @Charlot123 mentioned a construction worker of Highway 25 possibly being BG and that seems very possible as well. Sorry for not quoting.

-I think the reason Tobe Leazenby says he’s heard “that voice” is because he truly has. Maybe talking to a construction worker on his shift during the building of Highway 25 or someone in line at a coffee shop. I think he’s definitely heard that voice in person.
-I think the day before Valentines Day is very significant. I think he was convinced no one was going to say no to him ever again. I’m wondering if there was a ‘Bonnie’ element similar to GSK. But I also waver that he is possibly an Incel.
-It struck me when I learned that
trash in Delphi is always picked up on Tuesday mornings at 6am and the murders were committed on a Monday. Covering tracks? Ditching evidence?
-Did BG fish: have a fishing pole? That’s why nobody questioned wet clothes? I’m in the camp that thinks those brave girls ran across the creek to escape and not that they were brought there on purpose.
-Somewhere in the construction of the new highway and Valentine’s Day is BG. And It’s all in the Environmental impact statement of route 25. I just can’t figure it out.
-I can’t rule out a connection to the Evansdale murders, there are too many similarities to say they aren’t connected but I can’t find a definitive link. And I’ve searched a lot about grain elevators in both areas.

-Thank you to all the WSers for their thoughts and time, I’m only building upon what you have already worked hard on. Thank you to Tricia for keeping this site above board and honest and honoring the victims and their families. LET TODAY BE THE DAY.

MOO

Great Post.

I especially agree with this part:

"I think BG parked at old CPS building because it was ALL that was left of where he was used to parking."

Ive always felt he knew the area well because of how he directed the girls to go down toward the river and away from the bridge and to a spot where nobody on the bridge area could really see them. Im also pretty sure he would be heading in the direction of however he planned to escape from the area too. Its not like he would head back to the bridge area after killing the girls, so I suspect his escape route was in that same general direction.

Im not convinced yet he had a vehicle but if he did, then it makes sense what you are saying about where he parked. Ive seriously entertained that he may have had a motorcycle parked near there and made his getaway by motorcycle. Mainly because they move very quickly and usually are faster than cars in a flat out race. Plus the added benefit of going through some rough ground if he had it parked somewhat in the woods.

The area out the backside near the cemetary where the fields meet that back road that takes us away from the area had a few "trails" that a motorcycle could make easy use of.

Anyway, thanks for posting that great post and lets hope LE can finally solve this case soon. Its been way too long already.

 

[BNA]

The sign in question the DC was talking about is the 501 trail sign. It simply says Mary I. Gerard Nature Reserve with an arrow, 501 steps and at one point Monon High Bridge with an arrow. I believe you are talking about the sign at the entrance to the trails.

I have been trying to figure out who Mary I. Gerard is/was. No luck so far.

 

[heartgoesout]

I have been trying to figure out who Mary I. Gerard is/was. No luck so far.

Whistler Woods - NICHES Land Trust