Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #120

[carbuff]

Interesting. Seems to be the same Charles Gerard, but he died of Lou Gehrig’s disease in 2005. A big local donor, it seems. His mom’s maiden name drew my attention. The same Mary? So who would be staring at her name? I understand there were no direct relatives left.

Charles Gerard (Deceased), Delphi, IN Indiana

ETA: the same Mary I (Timmons) Gerard, the same Charles Gerard. But how could he donate the land in 2008 if he died in 2005?

bam

Most likely it was a bequest in his will, which would have had to be probated and so forth, which takes time. And then making whatever arrangments went with the bequest--possibly setting up a trust, or selling off some assets to raise the money, would take more time. It could easily take two or three years.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

DC has made that statement multiple times, including as recently as January of this year (note video linked on page 1). He must believe it, and hopefully with reason.

Also of note in that video, he says they have a full picture of what happened - an "aerial snapshot" if you will. So I do think they maybe know which way BG came and left. There's glimmers of hope.

Just another example of Carter and LE muddling their own statements. Just a day or two after the April 2019 press conference LE put out a statement saying and clarifying that the old sketch was no longer relevant, it’s secondary, etc. and that the new sketch was the guy they were looking for, the new sketch was the killer. Now the killer’s face is a combination of both. I have no confidence LE knows what they know or what they’re doing.

 

[Marzipan]

“Vehicle” broadly or “car” specifically for CPS lot? Have LE used both words?
I bet you longtimers have discussed a bunch of times. Still catching up. Listened to DTH podcast and now listening to Scene of the Crime podcast. Learning more info from STC but DTH is really well done too.

Whether or not the vehicle parked at the CPS lot was related to BG is pivotal, IMO.

No matter if he knew the area prior to the Hoosier Heartland Highway or not, if he knew the area at all, he'd have known about the cemetery. IMO,

However, since there was a car in question parked at the CPS lot, I tend to believe it's related to BG, and considering what I said about the cemetery, I think parking at the CPS lot indicates the crime was not well planned out. JMO

 

[curiousgene]

You know what is interesting? Her family tree is open. It is surprising how many people in that line died without having kids. Her siblings, her kid, and even generation above. And even on the side lines. She was a Timmons, and her son looked (slightly) like a darker male version of Libby, so I thought, maybe they were related? 2nd uncle or so? But he was an only child, and his aunts and uncles left no kids. (((

The Timmons surname intrigued me too. I felt the same way maybe the family was distantly related since Libby's mom is a Timmons too. It was indeed surprising to see there is no new generation in the family.

 

[TL4S]

“Vehicle” broadly or “car” specifically for CPS lot? Have LE used both words?
I bet you longtimers have discussed a bunch of times. Still catching up. Listened to DTH podcast and now listening to Scene of the Crime podcast. Learning more info from STC but DTH is really well done too.

In one interview, Riley specifies "car."

 

[Deleted member 102539]

error

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Whistler Woods - NICHES Land Trust

How to Get There
From downtown Delphi, Indiana: Head east on Indiana 25, turn north on 300 North, look for sign for trail head marking Delphi Trail System. Park at the lot, and head east over the Freedom Bridge. NICHES property is on the south after crossing the Freedom Bridge.

 

[layer]

Regarding the sketches... I have a funny feeling that the BG#1 sketch was basically an artist's rendering of the BG photos/video, while the BG#2 sketch came from an actual eyewitness, and was initially rejected by LE because it bears little resemblance to the BG photos/video.

Obviously MOO

 

[Deleted member 102539]

‘It’s a parent’s worst nightmare’: What killed these girls?
15th Dec 2017 5:27 AM
Indiana State Police are looking beyond the town of Delphi for the man photographed near the trail around the time a relative dropped the girls off, Sgt. Kim Riley told WLFI-TV in Lafayette earlier this year.

 

[Fizzle]

Assuming for a second that the crime was planned in detail (which I'm not sure I believe), is there a place to park near the south end of the bridge? I know that there is no public parking because it is all private land. However, is there a culdesac or street close to that end of the bridge where he could have parked? This would assume that he planned in advance to corner victim(s) at the south end of the bridge and then have any easy escape from that point.

 

[Charlot123]

The Timmons surname intrigued me too. I felt the same way maybe the family was distantly related since Libby's mom is a Timmons too. It was indeed surprising to see there is no new generation in the family.

No, and if you go higher, you see the same pattern. Many people never got married, or got married late and had one child, and the child died before the parents. So sad. Charles Gerard died of ALS, and there seems to be MS in that family, too. Nothing related to the case, but reminds you that life was not that easy in old times.

 

[layer]

Assuming for a second that the crime was planned in detail (which I'm not sure I believe), is there a place to park near the south end of the bridge? I know that there is no public parking because it is all private land. However, is there a culdesac or street close to that end of the bridge where he could have parked?

There are places to pull off the road, this was the next day:

 

[heartgoesout]

You know what is interesting? Her family tree is open. It is surprising how many people in that line died without having kids. Her siblings, her kid, and even generation above. And even on the side lines. She was a Timmons, and her son looked (slightly) like a darker male version of Libby, so I thought, maybe they were related? 2nd uncle or so? But he was an only child, and his aunts and uncles left no kids. (((

So no relation?

 

[heartgoesout]

Assuming for a second that the crime was planned in detail (which I'm not sure I believe), is there a place to park near the south end of the bridge? I know that there is no public parking because it is all private land. However, is there a culdesac or street close to that end of the bridge where he could have parked? This would assume that he planned in advance to corner victim(s) at the south end of the bridge and then have any easy escape from that point.

The private road under the bridge heading south leads right to Abby's home.

 

[JnRyan]

Regarding the sketches... I have a funny feeling that the BG#1 sketch was basically an artist's rendering of the BG photos/video, while the BG#2 sketch came from an actual eyewitness, and was initially rejected by LE because it bears little resemblance to the BG photos/video.

Obviously MOO

I don't believe you are the only one with that theory.

 

[Charlot123]

So no relation?

Well, they say if there is the same last name and area, there were once common ancestors. So I assume, probably higher up the line. But not immediate relatives, as it seems.

 

[sunshineray]

I totally agree that something went awry early on. I’m not quite sure what exactly sent them down the wrong path in the investigation, but I can only imagine the level of frustration felt by LE (& the victims families), when they realized they had potentially been chasing all of the wrong leads for two years!

I wouldn’t say those two years were wasted by any means. They’ve followed and eliminated thousands of leads, I’m sure that every piece of evidence they could come up with has been analyzed, and I would think that, even if they don’t have a specific POI, their list of potential suspects is much shorter than when they started. However, at least on the surface, it appears they’ve spent two very crucial years chasing the wrong rabbit.
My own opinion here, but I think they’ve identified the person in the original sketch. I think that when they figured out who it was, OBG confessed to being there that day, but is claiming to have been there for other nefarious reasons and didn’t want it to be known. IF THAT’S THE CASE, then OBG may have provided information of what HE saw on the trails that day, and that information may have added additional weight to the witness statement provided by the witness that saw NBG doing “something suspicious”.
This would explain why the sketch of OBG is now “secondary”. Maybe LE still can’t rule him out completely in regards to participating in some manner, but they no longer need information from the public to identify him.
It’s just a guess on my part, but when I consider this possibility, listening to that presser makes a lot more sense to me.
MOO....

BBM

How about something to do with the two warranted searches? The only two that I know of were mentioned in MMS. I also think something went wrong early on. It's possible the almost stalemate situation I feel LE is in has roots in their activities the first week after the girls were found murdered. AJMO

 

[JnRyan]

Regarding the sketches... I have a funny feeling that the BG#1 sketch was basically an artist's rendering of the BG photos/video, while the BG#2 sketch came from an actual eyewitness, and was initially rejected by LE because it bears little resemblance to the BG photos/video.

Obviously MOO

1st Sgt Holeman of the ISP stated at 2018 CrimeCon that the first sketch was a composite of multiple witnesses and because they kept revising the sketch and going back to the witnesses so it took a few months. Sketch #2 was done early (17 Feb 2017?) and I don't believe LE has ever revealed that source. But like you I believe it came from a single witness. I do believe the first sketch was influenced by the video, though, as well as multiple eyewitnesses although no one in LE has ever admitted to that point.

 

[JnRyan]

BBM

How about something to do with the two warranted searches? The only two that I know of were mentioned in MMS. I also think something went wrong early on. It's possible the almost stalemate situation I feel LE is in has roots in their activities the first week after the girls were found murdered. AJMO

I think so, too. Like ignoring the original sketch and spending a few months on the sketch that first released. Over 2 years later LE goes back to the original sketch. I almost wonder if the volume of tips overwhelmed them and then they had the massive task force to manage in the beginning.

 

[Charlot123]

BBM

How about something to do with the two warranted searches? The only two that I know of were mentioned in MMS. I also think something went wrong early on. It's possible the almost stalemate situation I feel LE is in has roots in their activities the first week after the girls were found murdered. AJMO

Although one can’t blame them for lack of experience. Had it happened today, with all the knowledge LE has gotten in this case, I am sure they would have managed well. But it is a rare murder, and it happened in a very rural, safe, area.