Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #138

[FromGermany1]

well of course he is absolutely a serial killer..and these are not his first murders..this is 100 percent a serial killer who kills for sexual excitement and fulfillment of fantasies he has about controlling and abusing his victims and
getting away with it. mOO

Accent on: Getting away with it. IMO
I don't know, what BG did to his victims except killing them, but I always have a feeling, his goal was to activate media for years to come and to remain unknown/uncaught, quasy building some indelible history. IMO
Btw, JBC wouldn't fit in my picture of someone with this motive.
Of course, I might be wrong the whole time.

 

[FromGermany1]

But public sources (soda cup, kleenex, etc) aren't going to be comprehensive.

I think, they indeed have for a long time. Within TV movies a sample always seems to help the investigators ....

 

[minazoe]

Do you believe that this case is connected to the Evansdale case?
I definitely think and wholeheartedly believe that they are. JMO.

As a numbers person (and a patterns person) I most assuredly believe that they are connected. And because of my autie, obsessive brain, I am in the process of a decoding project that I’ve been working on, regarding both cases. When I am finished, I will be submitting my work to the FBI, as well as the tip lines, and more.

100 percent .

 

[watcher9]

100 percent .

I too feel they are connected.

The only kink in that theory to me though is the 2013 kidnapping of Kathlynn Shepard (15) and DH (12) in Dayton Iowa by Michael J Klunder. It happened 90 miles to the west of Evansdale where the cousins L and L were taken in 2012. He murdered KS who was later found in a river but DH was able to escape and alert authorities. MJK committed suicide before he could be arrested. It was a logical assumption that those two cases were connected but later LE came out and said they could find no connection between the two.

If he had not died and was never caught, I would have sworn that all three cases are related. Each case has similar attributes. The children even looked similar. One older, larger child and one younger, smaller child taken with no witnesses and bodies were later found in or near water.

LE are saying they can find no connection between the Delphi case and the Evansdale case either so now you have to wonder if all three cases could have been caused by a different killer.

Couldn't find a link any longer to KS's thread but MJK is discussed in this link.

IA - IA - KLUNDER, Michael J: Violent Sexual Offender, Murderer, and Suspected SK

Body Found in River Identified as Missing Iowa Girl Kathlynn Shepard's

 

[minazoe]

I think the similarities in all the victims cannot be coincidence. Is it likely? think about it..no. since we all know that sexually motivated killers often have a victim type , not always but for instance pedo's have an age range and often prefer a certain type of child, like a redhead or blonde male children etc. Also true that all 4 girls being left out in the open in a public park area. think about it 4 little girls similar in structure and left outside like trash.

and don't get me started on the Flora fires, because I also feel this arson crime is connected.

mOO

 

[heartgoesout]

There are literally no details of this crime released to make, as amateurs, any real comparisons other than one or two very, very general similarities.
Why when LE gives info to the public, such as cases are not related, it is not believed?

 

[infinit]

There are literally no details of this crime released to make, as amateurs, any real comparisons other than one or two very, very general similarities.
Why when LE gives info to the public, such as cases are not related, it is not believed?

There was an awful case here in the UK recently where LE got it very wrong. Serial killer who killed 4. The first 3 the Police refused to accept were connected even though they were all drugged with the same date-rape drug and 2 were found in literally the same graveyard.
Who were Stephen Port's victims and what was he convicted of? | ITV News

 

[minazoe]

There are literally no details of this crime released to make, as amateurs, any real comparisons other than one or two very, very general similarities.
Why when LE gives info to the public, such as cases are not related, it is not believed?

I understand you , but there is some percentage of what we don't actually know that we will prove correct about..there is some percentage because of odds...so some odds are in our favor.

that said. Just because the police cannot locate a connection, or find one...or rule possible ones out..means literally nothing..it only means that haven't found anything..

there is no connection until the the moment there is. all the cases are unsolved and open.

mOO

 

[UnapologeticallyAspie]

I understand you , but there is some percentage of what we don't actually know that we will prove correct about..there is some percentage because of odds...so some odds are in our favor.

that said. Just because the police cannot locate a connection, or find one...or rule possible ones out..means literally nothing..it only means that haven't found anything..

there is no connection until the the moment there is. all the cases are unsolved and open.

mOO

Agreed.
And to add, just because LE says to the public that there is no connection does not mean that there isn’t a connection. Maybe Tom local agencies there isn’t.

I just cannot see the FBI in particular saying yes or no or otherwise. Has the FBI explicitly stated that the cases aren’t aren’t related? Or has that only been local LE?
The FBI maybe work with local LE offices, but they also work on their own, not necessarily informing various local LE departments about what they’re doing, what leads they have in other states, etc.
IMO it’s not one big project with everyone from all various jurisdictions at the local, state and federal levels working together 100% of the time about various cases, only that specific XYZ agency about their XYZ case. And ESPECIALLY regarding collecting info, analyzing it, and doing other such work about serial killers. Rhetorical question here: ha so any local LE office said ever cracked a serial killer case?
The local & state LEOs can only do so much, only have access to so much, and they can’t cross state lines to work with one another, like the FBI can.
And who’s to say that the FBI would even do this. IMHO they wouldn’t.

All moo-ing here.

 

[UnapologeticallyAspie]

Oh, I am positive that the BG is either a serial killer, or on his way to become such. Only in the Internet time, “walking in plain sight might as well mean”, “a gamer sitting at home”.

As a pattern person, @UnapologeticallyAspie, can you explain the public’s fascination with Ted Bundy? Is it because he was well-versed, educated white guy? He did walk in plain sight, because he was, in so many ways, the majority in 1969.

Unfortunately I cannot. In in a pattern type of way.
My own personal views on the public’s fascination re: TB’s have nothing to do with my brain full of patterns. Only my own hunch/views/assumptions regarding why.

 

[iamnotagolem]

To me the victims in Evansdale are very different, because they were young children, prepubescent. Unless this killers only preference is 2 girls, I just don’t think they’re related.

 

[minazoe]

ok so what I get from this " no connection " stuff is that they cannot for instance place a certain type of vehicle in both crimes, or they can't conclusively match partial DNA samples, or one has a witness and the other crime doesn't. None of their persons of interest are shared, none of the families are related in any way. there are no common friends or anything that connects them, schools, jobs, hobbies.

quite frankly they have zero evidence in the Evansdale case. not even cause of death...nothing..a possible vehicle, that's about it..

so no they can't find any connection..and no doubt they will need to find new evidence or get a confession to solve it.

so it doesn't literally mean there is "no connection". you are exactly right. mOO

 

[distracted]

Even if LE thought there's a connection between this case and others, they wouldn't announce it. They wouldn't even allude to it. And if asked, they would deny it.

 

[FromGermany1]

I understand you , but there is some percentage of what we don't actually know that we will prove correct about..there is some percentage because of odds...so some odds are in our favor.

that said. Just because the police cannot locate a connection, or find one...or rule possible ones out..means literally nothing..it only means that haven't found anything..

there is no connection until the the moment there is. all the cases are unsolved and open.

mOO

bbm
So.

 

[Charlot123]

Accent on: Getting away with it. IMO
I don't know, what BG did to his victims except killing them, but I always have a feeling, his goal was to activate media for years to come and to remain unknown/uncaught, quasy building some indelible history. IMO
Btw, JBC wouldn't fit in my picture of someone with this motive.
Of course, I might be wrong the whole time.

There might be several motives, of sexual type, but neither fits JBC, in my mind. I don't have any specific poi, or one poi, but either scenario involves a technologically-savvy person.

But I always wanted to ask: do you think he is quiet, or, posts like we all, occasionally leaving "crumbs" of info about himself that we don't notice? And then he enjoys the facts that we miss them?

He might be "posting in plain sight", too, there are tons of outlets.

 

[FromGermany1]

He might be "posting in plain sight", too, there are tons of outlets.

bbm
I think so.

 

[distracted]

There might be several motives, of sexual type, but neither fits JBC, in my mind. I don't have any specific poi, or one poi, but either scenario involves a technologically-savvy person.

But I always wanted to ask: do you think he is quiet, or, posts like we all, occasionally leaving "crumbs" of info about himself that we don't notice? And then he enjoys the facts that we miss them?

He might be "posting in plain sight", too, there are tons of outlets.

No. I don't think he's technologically savvy either. I'm not even sure he has a computer. Maybe a cell phone. Maybe.

I think he got lucky. Mistakes were made and he got lucky and thus has managed to evade capture.

 

[minazoe]

I mean if you look at it as just a straight shot it's easy too see why this is so difficult..he executed his plan quickly..he got in, he got out..there is no precursor,
there is no history with the victims that is known..the DNA evidence is possibly compromised by water ..and even though BG was seen, recorded and filmed, he is still not recognized as he has concealed his identity, either intentionally or not.

while he did stage the crime scene...he must have done so quickly...

really blows my mind that he wasn't caught..there was so little time..

the phone really is interesting because it was discarded.

who discarded it? and when?

this brings up cat fishing theories...if he met them on line he had to know there was a phone somewhere..

maybe libby just tossed it...but why?

mOO

 

[AC4RD]

... he executed his plan quickly..he got in, he got out..
... while he did stage the crime scene...he must have done so quickly...

You've hit the nail on the head, for one of the most troubling parts of this, to me (and IMOO): The killer got in, got the girls, took them, and was back out undetected, like a phantom.

He must have known there were other people in the area; he knew a couple of screams from either of the girls might have brought rescuers; despite that, he must have been fairly certain he could get away without being recognized. How in the world could he be so sure he wouldn't be caught? This is Jack-the-Ripper territory (savage murder with others nearby, undetected in the crime and unidentified afterwards.) This is just hard to believe--but the killer must have been sure he had at least a good (or better) chance of getting away. How? Who in the world could have been that confident about his plan?

 

[minazoe]

He had to have ditched those clothes or he put them in a bag and cut out with just the hoodie on and maybe he had two layers of jeans, not uncommon among the homeless.. No hat on..totally different look. mOO

added: he would have been soaking wet though..unless he had dry clothes stashed down there somewhere in the trees.