Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #141

[carbuff]

I agree that he may have intended to kidnap them, but he obviously came prepared to kill them if his plans failed. I do believe that the girls made a run for it so maybe he was afraid they could ID him. Of course, it’s possible that BG planned to kill them all along,

Yeah, that's another one of the things I guess we probably won't know until somebody is arrested and convicted

 

[carbuff]

I always thought this spot looked like it possibly showed footfalls, disturbances that look like human traffic may have gone through in places. There was a very HD of this shot in some article. I swear I saw what looked like footsteps.

So maybe it's in the area LE believes the victims crossed the creek or maybe searchers did?

The area behind that photo looks very like a photo in JC's Facebook photos. It was a selfie of himself with a tent pitched in front of a fallen tree a lot like that one. Of course there are a lot of creekside areas in the midwest that look just like that, so it doesn't prove anything. But it's giving me the creeps.

 

[zencompass]

Wishing @Tricia and all of the wonderful Moderators on @Websleuths a Happy New Year!

It is because of all of your dedication and hard work that makes Websleuths such a safe and comfortable place to discuss cases from around the world, surrounded by compassionate members who are genuinely caring.

May this New Year 2022 bring answers to these cases and be a safer place for everyone.

 

[Snow_In _June]

I have been following this case for years, and I don't recall anything about "two young women who were closely behind Libby & Abby on the trail"

Can you please provide more detail? Thank you and Happy New Year!

I got it from GH YT (I think i can mention that channel - If not MODS please delete post channel- She/They took a photo on the same day on the bridge not long after A&L were there which GH used when he was calculating the time line and flow of the crime in conjunction with Libby's photos. I must admit I havent seen it on MSM myself. But it has been spoken about quite a lot in the past. They are also said to have passed FSG on their way to the bridge. I have also been following for nearly 5 years. and the whole case baffles me.

Happy New Year
SIJ

 

[zencompass]

I got it from GH YT (I think i can mention that channel - If not MODS please delete post channel- She/They took a photo on the same day on the bridge not long after A&L were there which GH used when he was calculating the time line and flow of the crime in conjunction with Libby's photos. I must admit I havent seen it on MSM myself. But it has been spoken about quite a lot in the past. They are also said to have passed FSG on their way to the bridge. I have also been following for nearly 5 years. and the whole case baffles me.

Happy New Year
SIJ

Happy New Year to you, @Snow_In _June !

We have so few details from the L.E. that it is the most baffling case I've come across too!

May today be the day!

 

[FrostedGlass]

I got it from GH YT (I think i can mention that channel - If not MODS please delete post channel- She/They took a photo on the same day on the bridge not long after A&L were there which GH used when he was calculating the time line and flow of the crime in conjunction with Libby's photos. I must admit I havent seen it on MSM myself. But it has been spoken about quite a lot in the past. They are also said to have passed FSG on their way to the bridge. I have also been following for nearly 5 years. and the whole case baffles me.

Happy New Year
SIJ

This one?

 

[MollyDDD]

This wasn't a photograph taken by LE or the FBI to document the scene, it was taken by a local photojournalist who was working for the Pharos Tribune. Not sure if that affects your theory at all as the photo wasn't "evidence," per se.

I stand corrected.

The area behind that photo looks very like a photo in JC's Facebook photos. It was a selfie of himself with a tent pitched in front of a fallen tree a lot like that one. Of course there are a lot of creekside areas in the midwest that look just like that, so it doesn't prove anything. But it's giving me the creeps.

This has always puzzled me. Why would a person intentionally try to be suspected of a heinous crime? All of

All of his cryptic comments, including previous unsolved murders, his curious tattoos, that “stance” in the photo on the mountain, him in the tent, in the water and on the bridge overlooking the water. <modsnip> I mean, come on, who does that? Most criminals don’t want to be caught but JBC seems to taunting LE, IMO. Then his conviction of assaulting the 9 year old in his basement! WTH?

 

[HistoryNut]

I stand corrected.

This has always puzzled me. Why would a person intentionally try to be suspected of a heinous crime? <modsnip> All of his cryptic comments, including previous unsolved murders, his curious tattoos, that “stance” in the photo on the mountain, him in the tent, in the water and on the bridge overlooking the water. I mean, come on, who does that? Most criminals don’t want to be caught but JBC seems to taunting LE, IMO. Then his conviction of assaulting the 9 year old in his basement! WTH?

I know. Crazy. At this point I wouldn’t be surprised by anything, but I still can’t dismiss The possibility that JBC is BG.

 

[carbuff]

This has always puzzled me. Why would a person intentionally try to be suspected of a heinous crime? All of the photos he’s posted in and around the crime scene area. All of his cryptic comments, including previous unsolved murders, his curious tattoos, that “stance” in the photo on the mountain, him in the tent, in the water and on the bridge overlooking the water. I mean, come on, who does that? Most criminals don’t want to be caught but JBC seems to taunting LE, IMO. Then his conviction of assaulting the 9 year old in his basement! WTH?

I don't know why, but it seems that a lot of serial killers engage in taunting. I guess they think they're smarter than LE or something.

Sometimes there's an element of "please stop me." I don't think it's exactly remorse, but part of the brain seems to realize what the killer is doing is wrong. I don't know whether JBC feels any of that, but some of the comments on his Facebook, about doing things to ruin his life when things are going too well, kind of sound like he might have some awareness.

 

[minazoe]

here's what it is...

the killer does this behavior because he wants connection. he wants to skirt the lines..he takes delight in the duping of people and passing the truth disguised as something else under the noses of idiots.

I also noticed a kind of fishing for sympathy or approval ...even though the approval is won under false pretenses...like he says some garbage about needing time alone and hating people and then we are all in this thing together...and so you throw him a bone and click the like button...not knowing you are feeding something else ..

he skirts the lines..like the little redhead...you are sad that he can't have the little redhead or it's unrequited..you don't know he's talking about a child..but he knows and he is trying to normalize these sick behaviors by giving you spotty info and getting you to approve of it ..

he is wishing you could know what he really is and approve of everything he does..understand his
anger and his problems and accept him any way..he has an excuse everyone can understand.

in this way he convinces himself also that he is in control..he's in control on Facebook, on the street , in his crimes and also in control of what the police can know.

does he want to be caught? could be but because he wants the attention and he wants to show the LE all the ways in which he outsmarted them..he wants to hear them say he was their hardest case,
their most terrifying subject, that he is the stuff of books and movies.

mOO

 

[Georgia8]

The crime with the nine year old girl shows a total lack of control planning forethought etc. The Delphi crime just seems so different. Trying to insert yourself into a crime is common. And using social media to get attention and get people to approve of them? That's common too.

 

[minazoe]

the crime for me showed that JBC overestimated the privacy of having his own house..he was arrogant..he shooed the police away...he probably had a long running fantasy of having his own basement while he was incarcerated ...he thought he could get away with it and after the cops left he didn't skip a beat...he went right back to abusing this child and attempting to kill her.

was he disorganized? or was that cop just smarter than him and followed his nose...? mOO

 

[Charlot123]

The crime with the nine year old girl shows a total lack of control planning forethought etc. The Delphi crime just seems so different. Trying to insert yourself into a crime is common. And using social media to get attention and get people to approve of them? That's common too.

The Delphi crime is different. First, JBC didn’t even walk far with his victim and was apprehended immediately. If anything, he was a total moron. This guy, the BG…why no DNA? Did he learn his biology too well, or did he plan it exceptionally well? (Consider this, it was before the GSK story hit the newspapers. In 2017, Gedmatch being used by LE was not common occurrence, so he must have been on some genealogy sites…and how could he have signed into them without someone close to him at least being tested there?).

How can one avoid being identified by DNA, given that around 2013-2015, there was an outburst of genetic testing?

Either it is a very specific situation, or, the CS was so messed up and unprofessionally handled, that any lawyer can make a mincemeat of the case.

Either way, the case doesn’t look well for ISP. I am thinking of what BG had to know, and what professional skills to have, to organize it that well.

Either committed by someone too close to criminalistics and having experience at killing swiftly, or by a SK with Dahmer’s intelligence, but better planning, and ISP none the wiser.

JCK doesn’t fit either group,

 

[minazoe]

I disagree... I also think a killer can be spontaneous in one crime and have an elaborate plan in another depending on which fantasies are driving the boat...

look at how quickly this man ensnared this child and was a mere seconds away from ending her life. Who can really know what kind of clean up and disposal he would have planned upon and how he would make her disappear , maybe even go out for awhile and help the cops search for her after he sobered up a little.. would he have been caught down the line? we just don't know..maybe we would be still looking for her and saying whoever did this had been a great planner and left no evidence or crime scene anywhere...then what?

mOO

 

[Charlot123]

I disagree... I also think a killer can be spontaneous in one crime and have an elaborate plan in another depending on which fantasies are driving the boat...

look at how quickly this man ensnared this child and was a mere seconds away from ending her life. Who can really know what kind of clean up and disposal he would have planned upon and how he would make her disappear , maybe even go out for awhile and help the cops search for her after he sobered up a little.. would he have been caught down the line? we just don't know..maybe we would be still looking for her and saying whoever did this had been a great planner and left no evidence or crime scene anywhere...then what?

mOO

A nine-year old child vs two athletic teenagers?

A neighbor vs “knowing the lay of the land”?

Mostly, many believe he has a gun and used it to intimidate.

Was JBC, a former convict, allowed to have guns? Did he have them?

This guy, BG, is either so far from the case that he always flew under the radar, or, he is super close, so close that his presence in the search group was explained, and his DNA could be explained. I don’t believe it is JBC.

 

[HistoryNut]

the crime for me showed that JBC overestimated the privacy of having his own house..he was arrogant..he shooed the police away...he probably had a long running fantasy of having his own basement while he was incarcerated ...he thought he could get away with it and after the cops left he didn't skip a beat...he went right back to abusing this child and attempting to kill her.

was he disorganized? or was that cop just smarter than him and followed his nose...? mOO

At his sentencing, it was reported that he said he suffers from schizophrenia and alcoholism. To me, that explains part of it, but t think there are even darker things wrong with him like the lack of a conscience. IMO

 

[StarryStarryNight]

The only thing that makes me discount JBC at this time is the fact he is convicted and sentenced and we’ve heard no more about him. I haven’t totally scratched him off the list though. LE may still be trying to place him in Delphi. We’ll see.
To me, JBC’s Lafayette crime and Delphi are similar. Forget the age difference of the victims, I don’t think that matters at all. The Lafayette assault happened during the day with people around. Yes he lured the girl inside but that’s still pretty bold with a block party going on. He persisted with the attack even though people and LE were calling her name and looking for her. Completely invested in doing what he wanted to do. He admitted that he would have killed her if not discovered.
The Delphi crime was committed in the middle of the day on public trails and the killer persisted despite people at some point looking for the girls and calling their names. I think the killer had a gun and a knife and that was the extent of his planning other than planning to kill someone that day. Opportunity was his doorway in, and luck was his exit. He is not a genius. He is a lucky SOB.
The incredible boldness of both these attacks is shocking and a bit unheard of. Two attacks like this within a few miles of each other makes me wonder.
I am less certain right now Chadwell is the Delphi killer, but until LE arrests someone else JBC is still on my list.

 

[Marlo56]

Personally, and just my opinion, the more I think about this murder, the more premeditated and carefully planned it seems.

He resisted the urge to kill long enough to get them to a particular spot. He went in multiple layers, ie a disguise, loaded with weapons. The YBG sketch would indicate, to me, that these layers were always intended to be stripped off so as to look different at the crime scene compared to how he looked leaving it.

There is more I could say about that, but I'm never clear about the rules here regarding speculation / rumours.

So all that to say that this sounds like an organised psychopath, unlike the general profile people generally seem to be looking for. The known meth dealers and rapists are impulsive. This person has restraint. Psychopaths like this are typically boring, every day people. They don't appear to be the devil incarnate. I think (and again, just my opinion) that this will turn out to be a fairly average person, quite young, with a normal job, a normal family, etc. This also fits with Carter's comments about the identity being a shock to the community.

 

[Marlo56]

Another thing I wanted to post about is the jacket. I went back through the first couple of threads and found mention of the Subaru plant in LaFayette:

Found Deceased - IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #38

The Subaru company colours are typically various shades of blue. It's difficult to find images of workers at the plant wearing jackets as they're indoors, so typically just wearing blue t-shirts. Also, many jackets I found online are covered in bright logos.

However, I did find a Subaru jacket for sale on Ebay that looks, in my opinion, to be the exact shade of blue as the jacket in the video. It's a shame that the right side of the BG video is obscured by shade as it would likely be the side that an identifier like a logo would appear on. I've attached images anyway. Perhaps a local familiar with the plant will know how typical the Ebay listed jacket is of the ones that would have been worn by workers in 2017.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

Another thing I wanted to post about is the jacket. I went back through the first couple of threads and found mention of the Subaru plant in LaFayette:

Found Deceased - IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #38

The Subaru company colours are typically various shades of blue. It's difficult to find images of workers at the plant wearing jackets as they're indoors, so typically just wearing blue t-shirts. Also, many jackets I found online are covered in bright logos.

However, I did find a Subaru jacket for sale on Ebay that looks, in my opinion, to be the exact shade of blue as the jacket in the video. It's a shame that the right side of the BG video is obscured by shade as it would likely be the side that an identifier like a logo would appear on. I've attached images anyway. Perhaps a local familiar with the plant will know how typical the Ebay listed jacket is of the ones that would have been worn by workers in 2017.

View attachment 328551 View attachment 328552 View attachment 328553

Interesting and a good find on the jacket
LE said they may have missed something early on.
There was someone LE questioned early on from a car manufacturing plant…I don’t remember which one.