Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #144

[Yemelyan]

I read that as covering his bases because he knew he'd been in the area, but didn't know how much LE knew, so he needed a preemptive excuse to be there without committing to anything in particular. For all he knew, there there was footage of him or his car from someplace he drove by, or someone who happened to get a photo, or there was something else that put him in the area.

"The area" meaning that specific part of Peru where N Country Club Rd is?

 

[Boxer]

I don't think the Vegas trip started until about seven or eight days after the murders.

From reading the transcript of the interview, it sounds like KAK's alibi for the 13th was that he spent most of the day at home and that he doesn't remember if he went anywhere in the afternoon, but if he did it was probably to his grandparents' house in Peru since that's where he went most afternoons. In the interview, police seem to challenge him on this statement, saying "you went near your grandparents' house but you did not go to their house." He then offers the possibility that he could have been at the house of his close friend, a drug dealer, instead. Never does he say, in this particular interview, that he has a specific memory of that afternoon that places him in a particular spot, only that these are places that he often or usually went. MOO based on the transcript.

Thank you.
Toss his phone in the flower bed at his grandparents, and it would be in its routine place for the time.
I wonder about KAKs handgun access.

 

[Yemelyan]

Thank you.
Toss his phone in the flower bed at his grandparents, and it would be in its routine place for the time.
I wonder about KAKs handgun access.

Except, the interviewers reminded KAK that the phone was actively used to download/view sexually explicit material during the time it was in the vicinity of (but not at) his grandparents. So it was not just passively sitting under a bush the whole time.

 

[Boxer]

Except, the interviewers reminded KAK that the phone was actively used to download/view sexually explicit material during the time it was in the vicinity of (but not at) his grandparents. So it was not just passively sitting under a bush the whole time.

Thank you.
So his alibi is that he was watching (csm)*advertiser censored* at his grandparents house.

 

[Yemelyan]

Thank you.
So his alibi is that he was watching (csm)*advertiser censored* at his grandparents house.

Well, sort of - he says he doesn't remember, but this is what he must have done, based on his usual activities. When confronted with the fact that the phone could not be exactly at the grandparents', he says possibly he was at his dealer's house instead (which is evidently in the vicinity of the grandparents).

Keep in mind that though this specific interview is years later, LE are reminding him about details of what he told them just 12 or so days after the murders, when his activities - on the day that a girl he had talked to on social media was brutally murdered, and whose death he had extensively googled - should have been somewhat fresh in his mind.

 

[FrostedGlass]

I want to know more about his close friend, the drug dealer.

Did he go there to exchange his product for the drug dealers product? Did they sit there together, getting high and watching children being sexually abused on his big screen tv?

 

[Nobody_special]

Murder Sheet has a new episode up: “The Delphi Murders: Who is Tony Kline? Part Three”

Listening to it now but there’s new info (at least to me) on TK peeping when he was in high school and using a stick to raise the nightgown of a sleeping female through her window.

edit: it was TK who had a reputation in high school as a Peeping Tom and used the stick on his unconscious victim, not KAK.

 

[Prime8]

I'm not as knowledgable as some about the case, but since there is no other answer, I'll give a very basic answer, from memory. Hopefully this will prime the pump and others will weigh in with more accurate and complete answers for you.

KAK and/or his dad were involved in online catfishing/grooming/CSAM of young girls. They lived in Peru or Kokomo. Soon after the murders, LE found an association between an online profile involving KAK, and LG. They investigated and found CSAM. However, there was no arrest of KAK until 2020.

A youtube channel/blog called the Murder Page got ahold of an interview between KAK and LE, and published it. I have not read or listened to it, although many here have. LE grilled him and many believe his answers show he could be, or could know who BG is. Some believe his dad is BG.
Their voices are apparently available out there somewhere. KAK is in jail. The dad is, I guess, at the home.

I would say the simple majority here believe neither KAK nor his dad are BG, but that they know who is.

A few corrections/updates:

• In Dec. 2021, ISP asked for information from people who interacted with an online account Anthony_Schots (sp?), which was a catfishing account.
• KAK was found to be the "owner" of the A_S account. KAK has been arrested on numerous CSAM counts.
• The Murder Sheet is the podcast that got a hold of the documents, which are a few years old now but do confirm that the A_S account was in contact with Libby in the month of the murder as well as at least one of her friends.
• KAK has loosely admitted to talking to Libby but denies any meet up or involvement in the murders.
• KAK claims that maybe a friend/roommate that lived out of state could have had access to his phone but no one else could have.
• The incident that led to the search of KAK's devices occurred 1 week after the murders. A girl who was in contact with the A_S account, gave him her address to meet up. When she came home, she said a masked man was outside her window. KAK denies it was him. KAK actually knows that family.
• The dad, TK, has a history of violence, stalking and making obscene phone calls but has not been publicly, directly linked to catfishing or CSAM.

 

[TL4S]

Well, sort of - he says he doesn't remember, but this is what he must have done, based on his usual activities. When confronted with the fact that the phone could not be exactly at the grandparents', he says possibly he was at his dealer's house instead (which is evidently in the vicinity of the grandparents).

Keep in mind that though this specific interview is years later, LE are reminding him about details of what he told them just 12 or so days after the murders, when his activities - on the day that a girl he had talked to on social media was brutally murdered, and whose death he had extensively googled - should have been somewhat fresh in his mind.

IIrc, KAK still maintained he had never been on or knew anyone who lived on Country Club Road, even after the drug dealer friend conversation. He said he only knew it intersected with the road his grandparents lived on.

 

[Nobody_special]

Murder Sheet has a new episode up: “The Delphi Murders: Who is Tony Kline? Part Three”

Listening to it now but there’s new info (at least to me) on TK peeping when he was in high school and using a stick to raise the nightgown of a sleeping female through her window.

edit: it was TK who had a reputation in high school as a Peeping Tom and used the stick on his unconscious victim, not KAK.

Just finished listening to the episode. I recommend listening to it and the other Murder Sheet Delphi episodes but for those who may not have the time right now:


They mentioned that they share any “sensitive or significant” details with LE before releasing them and that they’ve been asked to hold back on some things, which they’ve agreed to do. LE was ok with the details that are in this episode.


Murder Sheet reached out to KAK and asked him if he would agree to an interview. He responded with a letter. In it, he said that his lawyer advised him against doing any other video visits, “due to how my last one went” but said that he would respond via written letters, though he’s yet to do so. He also claims that he’s been wrongly accused.


The episode features a conversation with one of TK’s classmates who said that she was followed home by TK when they were both in HS. She said that he was trying to hide in the bushes across the street, she confronted him and he fled. It definitely made her uncomfortable and she said that she avoided him after that. She also said that he had a reputation as a “super creeper” and as a peeping Tom. When asked, she said that she couldn’t remember his voice and didn’t see any resemblance to the first sketch but that she does see a resemblance to the second (as do I).

 

[Yemelyan]

IIrc, KAK still maintained he had never been on or knew anyone who lived on Country Club Road, even after the drug dealer friend conversation. He said he only knew it intersected with the road his grandparents lived on.

You're right - and his family associations, which are revealed in things like the obituary of his grandfather (if you look at the last names of the people listed there), reveal that is most likely another lie.

 

[TL4S]

You're right - and his family associations, which are revealed in things like the obituary of his grandfather (if you look at the last names of the people listed there), reveal that is most likely another lie.

Indeed...

 

[gitana1]

I'm not as knowledgable as some about the case, but since there is no other answer, I'll give a very basic answer, from memory. Hopefully this will prime the pump and others will weigh in with more accurate and complete answers for you.

KAK and/or his dad were involved in online catfishing/grooming/CSAM of young girls. They lived in Peru or Kokomo. Soon after the murders, LE found an association between an online profile involving KAK, and LG. They investigated and found CSAM. However, there was no arrest of KAK until 2020.

A youtube channel/blog called the Murder Page got ahold of an interview between KAK and LE, and published it. I have not read or listened to it, although many here have. LE grilled him and many believe his answers show he could be, or could know who BG is. Some believe his dad is BG.
Their voices are apparently available out there somewhere. KAK is in jail. The dad is, I guess, at the home.

I would say the simple majority here believe neither KAK nor his dad are BG, but that they know who is.

Thanks so much, Ready!! I appreciate the answer. Do you know why the majority think it’s not them? And those who do think it’s them, what are their arguments?

TIA to any who answer.

 

[minazoe]

Thank you.
So his alibi is that he was watching (csm)*advertiser censored* at his grandparents house.

now you've officially heard everything..

 

[AC4RD]

And those who do think it’s them, what are their arguments? TIA to any who answer.

KAK is a known deviant with a sexual interest in chiildren--he admits that. He also admits to having been in contact with Libby, among others, and seemed (in the transcript, MHO) not to object when LE said he was the last outside person known to be in contact with Libby other than the murderer.

After the murders another girl who had been in contact with KAK reported a Peeping Tom to the local police. After the murders, KAK apparently went to Las Vegas for several days (the timelines still aren't clear to me.) KAK put a bunch of "work history" on facebook that included his being hired as a casino card dealer the same day as the murders--but we know he posted that over a year *after* he claims it happened. No casino reported knowing KAK to the "Murder Sheet" podcasters.

KAK admits that he wiped information from his electronic devices, and presumably hid his main phone when his house was searched two weeks after the murders. Many of us assume he did so to hide criminal evidence.

Over a year after the murders, TK, KAK's father, posted a message on FB with a picture of KAK saying "my boy is coming home--he hasn't been here in over two years." The 'over 2 years' is greatly incorrect and TK must have lied deliberately since he apparently was with KAK immediately after the murders. Many of us assume TK did this to provide a pathetically weak and laughably fictional alibi for his son.

Those are the major points as I recall them, Gypsy Lass. I would add that the pictures of KAK from the Las Vegas trip *to me* and this is just my opinion, look to me that he easily could physically be Bridge Guy from the video.

All this is just my own poor opinion. I also think law enforcement has more evidence than we know, pointing to KAK, but he's in jail and not getting out any time soon, so there's no urgency in an arrest. (shrug) JMHO.

 

[Boxer]

Thanks so much, Ready!! I appreciate the answer. Do you know why the majority think it’s not them? And those who do think it’s them, what are their arguments?

TIA to any who answer.

I juat think that KAK the best POI so far.
He is basically the last contact with Libby from the underbelly of their area.

The wipes.on phones book end the murder.
Libby a week before was killed and KAKs two weeks after.

Libby continued to comminicate with A_S. But apparently not too worried about content as it was IIRC her grandmother's phone.

Opportunity - Yes. All dissembling afterwards suggests there is no clear alibi.

Means - Is there some Indiana male that doesn't have a Glock available in some way?
BG looks to have a borrowed gun since it looks pretty impromptu shoved butt first into his jacket pocket.
Knives abound in thrift stores and Walmart.

Motive.
The motive is unclear,

The wiped phones probably told the tale.

 

[Prime8]

Did anyone listen to today's Murder Sheet podcast? There's some interesting information about TK. He followed a girl home once, hiding whenever she would look over. She knew it was TK as she was familiar with him. She then heard rumors that he was a peeping tom. TK also was caught peeping, that peeping incident escalated into him reaching through the window and raising the nightgown of the girl he was looking at.

 

[Schatz]

Did anyone listen to today's Murder Sheet podcast? There's some interesting information about TK. He followed a girl home once, hiding whenever she would look over. She knew it was TK as she was familiar with him. She then heard rumors that he was a peeping tom. TK also was caught peeping, that peeping incident escalated into him reaching through the window and raising the nightgown of the girl he was looking at.

Woah.

 

[gitana1]

KAK is a known deviant with a sexual interest in chiildren--he admits that. He also admits to having been in contact with Libby, among others, and seemed (in the transcript, MHO) not to object when LE said he was the last outside person known to be in contact with Libby other than the murderer.

After the murders another girl who had been in contact with KAK reported a Peeping Tom to the local police. After the murders, KAK apparently went to Las Vegas for several days (the timelines still aren't clear to me.) KAK put a bunch of "work history" on facebook that included his being hired as a casino card dealer the same day as the murders--but we know he posted that over a year *after* he claims it happened. No casino reported knowing KAK to the "Murder Sheet" podcasters.

KAK admits that he wiped information from his electronic devices, and presumably hid his main phone when his house was searched two weeks after the murders. Many of us assume he did so to hide criminal evidence.

Over a year after the murders, TK, KAK's father, posted a message on FB with a picture of KAK saying "my boy is coming home--he hasn't been here in over two years." The 'over 2 years' is greatly incorrect and TK must have lied deliberately since he apparently was with KAK immediately after the murders. Many of us assume TK did this to provide a pathetically weak and laughably fictional alibi for his son.

Those are the major points as I recall them, Gypsy Lass. I would add that the pictures of KAK from the Las Vegas trip *to me* and this is just my opinion, look to me that he easily could physically be Bridge Guy from the video.

All this is just my own poor opinion. I also think law enforcement has more evidence than we know, pointing to KAK, but he's in jail and not getting out any time soon, so there's no urgency in an arrest. (shrug) JMHO.

Wow! That’s pretty intense. I can see why you would think it’s him.

Anyone have a link to the Vegas photos? And/or to a recording of his voice?

 

[gitana1]

I juat think that KAK the best POI so far.
He is basically the last contact with Libby from the underbelly of their area.

The wipes.on phones book end the murder.
Libby a week before was killed and KAKs two weeks after.

Libby continued to comminicate with A_S. But apparently not too worried about content as it was IIRC her grandmother's phone.

Opportunity - Yes. All dissembling afterwards suggests there is no clear alibi.

Means - Is there some Indiana male that doesn't have a Glock available in some way?
BG looks to have a borrowed gun since it looks pretty impromptu shoved butt first into his jacket pocket.
Knives abound in thrift stores and Walmart.

Motive.
The motive is unclear,

The wiped phones probably told the tale.

Thanks for that! I have some confusion. Who is AS? And what do you mean that Libby continued to communicate with that person? After what?

Also, did Libby wipe her phone at some point?

He looks like a good POI. So strange.