Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #94

[margarita25]

Thank you for taking the time to do that!! Greatly appreciated!

JMO
I think that this is a valid observation holding alot of merit. I can see what your seeing based on your pics and arrows/circles.

I have been wondering about the 'possible' backpack LE was alerting the public to look for. I could never figure out where he would have hid it as it never seemed to be on him in the stills or video.

This analysis shows me clearly he could have had one the entire time.
Great job!

Now...if it is a backpack, what did this monster have in it?

Kill kit. (Moo.)

 

[moonlessnight]

I agree that I don't believe he has kids. Don't know why other than I don't think he is socially fnctional enough to manage the relationships to create that. Which would mean he is less of a cunning psychopath and more of a socially/developmentally challenged individual (not making any claims of diagnosis, just that his social skills are not well developed or adjusted either from environment or genetics). I think this kid is YOUNG AND SCRAWNY. Not 180-200 lbs. LE may be trying to make BG complacent that they have NO clue who they are looking for. I'm not sure what their strategy is, but the guy in the video is much thinner than he appears. I think he may even be like puberty-age gangly.

Good morning (well, afternoon) everyone, today's thoughts:

• I remain unconvinced that it is possible to accurately or definitively diagnose disabilities, mental or physical, from a single step or a sketch. As far as I'm concerned, all related conclusions in regard to this material is speculation, which may provide some kind of comfort in armchair deduction, but is not conclusive enough to say one way or the other.
• I know there has been a lot of speculation re: Delphi United Methodist Church. I think there is valid reasoning behind it, but I also think people have been very pointed in their discussion about it, and am of the opinion that if you believe you have such targeted information regarding a possible suspect, you are better off contacting police or the sheriff's office than asking for thoughts or opinions here.
• I no longer think that BG necessarily has children of his own, but I think it very likely that he is deeply tied to his family and the community families in the area. A beloved son, sibling, possibly someone that many families in Delphi have had contact with.
• I still do not think that he has committed violent crimes either before or since the attacks. I think it was likely a one-off, that he intended to commit the attack when he went to the trail, and that he did not specifically target Abby or Libby prior to this.
• I continue to think that it is inappropriate and irrelevant to continue to speculate or implicate sex offenders or suspects based on sketch #1.

 

[bradfordsleuth]

Kill kit. (Moo.)

Ugh.
I knew that was coming.

 

[HongKongPhooey]

Kill kit. (Moo.)

That would mean def premeditated then. Is the general feeling that this was planned and not opportunistic?

 

[margarita25]

Is the one you're thinking about a photo taken from Cr 300 and it vaguely shows the cabin through the trees? I kept a screen cap of that one but haven't posted it because I don't know where/who it came from. The distance between Cr300 and the cabin is appx. 400'.

Here's a screen cap (hopefully I posted it right) of what has also been depicted as the cabin. This is an older cap because it's easier to recognize as a building; it's still there in GE after the girls were murdered. It can't be seen when the trees are leafed out.

Thank you for the reply and visual, FrostedGlass. Bringing this forward to stare at:

 

[bradfordsleuth]

That would mean def premeditated then. Is the general feeling that this was planned and not opportunistic?

I think he planned TO attack but not WHO to attack until the opportunity arose.

 

[margarita25]

That would mean def premeditated then. Is the general feeling that this was planned and not opportunistic?

Differing opinions.

My opinion is he was definitely hunting to rape and kill. I believe the girls were in the wrong place at the wrong time, and if it wasn’t them it could/would have been someone else that day.

I think he planned TO attack but not WHO to attack until the opportunity arose.

Agreed.

 

[kc1023]

I don't know the story behind the sketch but I think the killer has been in contact with LE.
mOO

let me add on this...I think the killer knows things he could only know if he was in Delphi over the course of the investigation and this is how they know he lives in Delphi.

mOO

Hmm. Could this be why they think he might crack somehow? As in he contacted them either because he's not getting his recognition and fame so he has to "help" LE or something or on some subconscious level perhaps he wants them to catch him before something bad happens again?

I would imagine if he did contact them, he would have had to provide some huge detail to verify his identity which then maybe that detail divulged a clue he didn't intend. Somehow connected to the vehicle or the alternate sketch?

jmo it just made me think that might add up together somehow

 

[fred&edna]

It's a small town AND there's a $200,000 reward. It seems nearly impossible his identity hasn't been reported to LE by someone.

 

[msnorabarnacle]

Whew! This was harder than I thought. I had to try to screen shot right when reflection on bag occurred.

Disclaimer: Obviously, this is just my perception. Once I “see” something, it’s very hard to unsee it. Also, I feel that I can visualize the pack better in watching the video, than in “still” shots. So, take a look at the video to see what you think. Especially pay attention to the way the zipper or label on the bag appears/disappears based on reflection of light.

Pic 1: I have drawn an arrow to where I *think* I see the light catching on a label or zipper on his bag.

Pic 2: Circled in red, I tried to indicate the general idea of where I see the (dark colored) bag...which obviously would be overlapping in appearance with his arm.

Pic 3: I drew 2 arrows where what many think to be a sweatshirt hood could possibly be the top of a pack. (Which would be lighter in color than rest of bag, due to light, and possibly it is exposing contents to an open topped duffle type bag). I’m less sure about this pic showing a bag or not.


Link to GH’s stabilized video.

Of course, I could be wrong, and there is no bag/pack/duffle. But I feel I can see one.
MOO.

I feel like he has a bag or things stuffed inside of the right side of his jacket. You can see it bulging and it looks as though the weight of whatever's in there is bottom heavy -- maybe even that brown material that's hanging from his coat is part of this bag or whatever he's carrying in there. The more I watch, I'm also convinced that his right hand isn't as much in his pocket, but rather holding whatever's inside as the placement of the right hand is slightly higher. In the last frame of the video, you can see his jacket is bulging, causing gaps between the buttons.

Also, in the very first frame, I see a glare on his right wrist, which may be his skin or perhaps a watch that's catching the sun's glare? If it were a watch, that'd make him a lefty!

 

[HongKongPhooey]

Differing opinions.

My opinion is he was definitely hunting to rape and kill. I believe the girls were in the wrong place at the wrong time, and if it wasn’t them could/would have been someone else.


Agreed.

Thank you

 

[moonlessnight]

there are no straps coming around the front of the coat around his shoulders. It is more likely he has stuff inside the coat in the back. There is definite bulk all the way around the collar, though.

Woah, the third pic with your arrows: I don’t think I’ve ever noticed that before?! That does look like the top of a pack?! Wth is that? How have I not seen that before? Feel free to tell me I’m seeing things, I will not be offended!

 

[allboys]

Thank you for taking the time to do that!! Greatly appreciated!

JMO
I think that this is a valid observation holding alot of merit. I can see what your seeing based on your pics and arrows/circles.

I have been wondering about the 'possible' backpack LE was alerting the public to look for. I could never figure out where he would have hid it as it never seemed to be on him in the stills or video.

This analysis shows me clearly he could have had one the entire time.
Great job!

Now...if it is a backpack, what did this monster have in it?

All kinds of possibilities, but one thing that comes to mind is... a change of clothes.

 

[MassGuy]

I agree that I don't believe he has kids. Don't know why other than I don't think he is socially fnctional enough to manage the relationships to create that. Which would mean he is less of a cunning psychopath and more of a socially/developmentally challenged individual (not making any claims of diagnosis, just that his social skills are not well developed or adjusted either from environment or genetics). I think this kid is YOUNG AND SCRAWNY. Not 180-200 lbs. LE may be trying to make BG complacent that they have NO clue who they are looking for. I'm not sure what their strategy is, but the guy in the video is much thinner than he appears. I think he may even be like puberty-age gangly.

Yeah, I definitely don’t think this guy is a criminal mastermind.

I think the tendency is to view him almost like a movie character; cunning, intelligent, and unassailable.

I don’t think he’s that. At all.

He’s an evil loser who got lucky.

Lucky for now, anyways.

 

[Quinquin]

I don't think you can discount how important it is that the perpetrator led the girls off the trail in a seemingly random direction and across a creek onto private property. I would be very surprised if the perp was not familiar with or a regular visitor of the property the girls were found on. While the property owner has been ruled out as a suspect, there are plenty of people who either worked on or visited the large farm/ranch that he owned. If the perp is native to Delphi or a nearby town there's little chance he hasn't been on that property or had some interaction with the owner at some point in time.

I also think it is possible that the girls were the ones who knew where to cross the creek and he followed/chased them. So many possibilities....

 

[apples12]

I agree that I don't believe he has kids. Don't know why other than I don't think he is socially fnctional enough to manage the relationships to create that. Which would mean he is less of a cunning psychopath and more of a socially/developmentally challenged individual (not making any claims of diagnosis, just that his social skills are not well developed or adjusted either from environment or genetics). I think this kid is YOUNG AND SCRAWNY. Not 180-200 lbs. LE may be trying to make BG complacent that they have NO clue who they are looking for. I'm not sure what their strategy is, but the guy in the video is much thinner than he appears. I think he may even be like puberty-age gangly.

I agree. Skinny, young looking, twenty-something man with challenges in social relationships.

 

[moonlessnight]

yes, exactly. I don't think either hand is actually inside pockets. They both seem to be supporting the bulk of the gear inside the coat. Maybe that is the mannerism LE wants people to see.

ETA - I've always noticed his shoulders are elevated and head is down and forward. Now I think he is using his shoulders to help hold up whatever his hands are supporting around his waist (you can see the skin of both of his hands outside his clothing/gear). This tells me he is not physically strong bc he isn't using arm muscles to support the weight/bulk - he is using his upper traps which is what people who are just starting to work out with too much weight do - and hurt their necks/shoulders.

I feel like he has a bag or things stuffed inside of the right side of his jacket. You can see it bulging and it looks as though the weight of whatever's in there is bottom heavy -- maybe even that brown material that's hanging from his coat is part of this bag or whatever he's carrying in there. The more I watch, I'm also convinced that his right hand isn't as much in his pocket, but rather holding whatever's inside as the placement of the right hand is slightly higher. In the last frame of the video, you can see his jacket is bulging, causing gaps between the buttons.

Also, in the very first frame, I see a glare on his right wrist, which may be his skin or perhaps a watch that's catching the sun's glare? If it were a watch, that'd make him a lefty!

 

[MassGuy]

That would mean def premeditated then. Is the general feeling that this was planned and not opportunistic?

It could be both. A mix.

He came prepared to kill, but hadn’t set his sights on a particular target.

Perhaps he did this sort of thing a lot (stalking the woods), and just came across an opportunity to actually kill, on that day.

I’m not sold on the backpack idea, although it’s certainly possible.

I think he had a knife on him, one that he always carried.

 

[dansbia]

Forgive me if this has already been stated, I've been trying to read everything the last page I completely read was page 25 of thread 91.

My theory.

BG wore a disguise that day, extra clothing, fake facial hair, etc and parked at the welfare building. He had to be faking a leg injury, I don't think anyone with drop foot would walk on that bridge. My brother has drop foot and walks like Frankenstein and loses his balance often and sometimes falls, he is always holding on to something. Everything he said was caught on Libby's phone I don't think her phone stopped recording until it was found or the battery died which would of been late that night. Teenagers usually make sure their phones are fully charged when leaving. I can only imagine what LE knows and lives with. I imagine he may of smoked a cigarette after he did what he did, a satisfaction thing, maybe talking to the girls (post mortem) either he was sorry and ashamed or he was gloating. And LE heard this. From the statement the way you left them, I believe it's gruesome, satanic, torturous. The reference to the shack maybe he left a mark on them one of them having a higher increment such as 1 and 2 or 3 and 4, depending on how many times he done this. Or maybe it was just the religious connection (I'll get back to that). I believe he took off his disguise and put it in the backpack. I think he cleaned himself up, left them and ran into second witness (maybe even family looking for them) I think he left around 5 to move the car and came back as a searcher (thinking no one would realize he even left) he may of helped remind people not to search that area cause it was private property. He may be a trusted member of the church and that's the reason for all the Christian comments at PC I also think the book referred to was the Bible. He may be a first responder who claims to be so holy. When 2nd witness came forward and sketch was drawn it was set aside as he was there to help he wasn't a suspect. Maybe they tried making the pieces not fit to excuse him but they just couldn't or something has happened that is showing that he is indeed a suspect. maybe all aLong he had been very close to the investigation, even trying to guide it. Maybe this is the new direction the change from witness one to witness two.

Maybe recording says "hey guys, can you help me get down the hill?" Faking a leg injury. Even if liberty didn't trust him and started recording him doesn't mean he didn't try a ruse that was unsuccessful and then he had to force them

I pray something breaks soon and these precious girls and their families get Justice

 

[Quinquin]

I've been thinking about the Feb 13 timeline, specifically the speculations about where the girls "might be" when it was realized they weren't responding to text msgs/calls. IIRC... It was thought they might have gone to a friend's house and forgotten to call. And, it was speculated that Libby had mentioned wanting to visit her mom. Was it also true that maybe she attempted to do this previously (not recently) but sometime before? If so, how did she go about it... particularly if her mother lived outside Indiana?

I feel sure this was discussed back in '17 but I also remember I dismissed any speculation about it being a factor.

Maybe I should dismiss it again BUT I also feel as if I should turn my thoughts to new directions. I'm NOT speculating on family involvement! I'm simply wondering if my memory is even slightly correct on this topic.

You are remembering correctly. It was said in an interview of Libby's GF on the night that they were still listed as "missing". I watched that recently as it was linked by a WS poster. It was the first I had heard that they initially thought that Libby might have tried to go to visit her mom. And I also, like you, was wondering how they thought she would have tried to get there.