Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #94

[No it's not]

You are a doll!!!!! But I was actually referring to a video that aired before the bodies were found. Do you recall that one? You might have posted that as well. It was of two young men in the dark or at dusk talking about searching for the girls.

The video:

 

[Jax49]

You are a doll!!!!! But I was actually referring to a video that aired before the bodies were found. Do you recall that one? You might have posted that as well. It was of two young men in the dark or at dusk talking about searching for the girls.

The one where the young man talks about looking in trash cans?

 

[x_files]

Someone posted it here. I've looked and can't find it. I think actually on the last thread. It was a news video from before the bodies were found and featured two young guys who were searching when it was dark.

This one:

 

[x_files]

The one where the young man talks about looking in trash cans?

I'm trying to find that video too.

 

[Dee10]

baptism in the same river?

Yes, I was looking in the teen ministry pictures it might have been the teen directors page to see if Libby attended the functions. I noticed a number of pictures taken there with members standing on the bridge watching people get baptized. I didn't see Libby in any of the picture though, so if she was a member I missed her or IDK.

 

[waltzingmatilda]

BOOM! This to me is everything!! Summer vacation for students esp. out of town college young adults returning home.

Hmmmm. This would also coincide with Carter's request at the presser for not asking family for interviews for the next two weeks. Yes?

 

[x_files]

Of note: Everybody who knew C. Rivera, the accused killer of Mollie Tibbetts, said there was nothing that changed about his personality and he was back at work like normal the next day.

No consciousness then no guilt or strange behavior sounds like a classic psychopath.

 

[zencompass]

Serial killers can be impulsive, and I do think there was an element of that here (not that he’s a serial killer, but I think he is in effect one).

We still don’t know how the girls we’re killed, but if there was a great deal of violence, then this guy is exactly what I think he’s is.

Mostly disorganized.

Disorganized offender (from F.B.I. bulletin):
NCJRS Abstract - National Criminal Justice Reference Service

"...the disorganized offender is likely to be of below average intelligence, low birth order, and subjected to harsh parental discipline. He is in a confused and distressed state of mind at the time of the murder, is socially inadequate, and sexually incompetent. The crime scene shows that the crime was committed suddenly with no set plan of action for deterring detection. Facial destruction and sexually sadistic acts performed after the murder are typical. Disorganized offenders usually leave the victim in the same position in which he or she was killed and make no attempt to conceal the body."

 

[x_files]

Yes, I was looking in the teen ministry pictures it might have been the teen directors page to see if Libby attended the functions. I noticed a number of pictures taken there with members standing on the bridge watching people get baptized. I didn't see Libby in any of the picture though, so if she was a member I missed her or IDK.

ok, that's a strange connection perhaps to a religious nut?!

 

[popoludnie]

You are a doll!!!!! But I was actually referring to a video that aired before the bodies were found. Do you recall that one? You might have posted that as well. It was of two young men in the dark or at dusk talking about searching for the girls.

 

[Jax49]

I'm trying to find that video too.

See above, post 1210.

 

[RedBeard]

And having that information would tell us a lot about this crime, and the guy who committed it.

How did he kill them?

Was there overkill?

Were they clothed?

Where were their bodies located in relation to one another?

How were they positioned?

Of course these are key details that need to remain a secret, but they would provide us with tremendous insight.

Yea even just a vague cause of death would be revealing, I honestly think LE kinda bungled their public outreach efforts by being so closed lipped, I understand the importance of discretion; but if we don't know anything other than this may or may not be the guy who may or may of not did this or that, the public really isn't going to be of much use.

They hinted at the crime being about "power" but literally every malicious crime is about power when you get down to the nitty gritty. Burglaries are largely about power and violating people, robberies, stabbings, fights. If the crime was sexual I assume there wasn't activity that would leave dna, but would still satiate that compulsion.

Also by them being tight lipped it makes it sound like to me that they have literally nothing but a bunch of educated guesses, which could work in their favor if they are surveiling someone; but if they don't have a suspect identified they are just hindering the investigation.

If you don't have anything, you do everything you can to get it within procedure and the law. I have never seen a case like this honestly, I understand the respecting of victims aspect too, but I say respect their memory by not letting the case go even colder. William Butler Yeats said, don't wait till the iron is hot to strike; make the iron hot by striking. Forensics, this and that don't make up for good old fashioned police work imo.

 

[gitana1]

Regarding steroids (prednisone, not the weight lifter kind), while I don’t see any sensible reason to consider them, they can make you hostile and moody. I’ve been on them many times. The time I was on them for months I was a raging lunatic. They gave me insomnia, mood swings, low blood sugar, and rage. I was truly temporarily insane.

IMO, this was a deliberate act. Not a roid rage insanity thing which usually involves domestic violence and bar fights. Beating someone to death or suddenly strangling or stabbing them.

Not quietly following them and calmly directing them down the hill.

 

[x_files]

See above, post 1210.

Thank you!

 

[wary]

Ah, that was the mention previously stated — but as I see it, it is meaningless. The movie The Shack debuted (theaters or straight to streaming??) March 3, 2017, and this youth group watched a different movie on their “last?” theater night, March 3, 2017.

Lots of angles are potentially relevant to the case, this “correlation” someone drew makes me shrug.

The Shack opened in 2888 theaters—you might well have had church groups getting together to go to see it, but it certainly wouldn’t have been ‘movie night at the church.’

 

[Tiger Stripes]

But he's been referred to as perhaps being in a position of... "trust". Just thinking out-loud here... Trying to think of different possibilities here.
Could that trust be...
a. an educational trust (i. e., a teacher, a coach, a school bus driver, a cafeteria worker -- all of whom, by the way, per state law, must pass background checks; teachers and coaches, for sure, in addition to passing background checks must also be finger-printed), b. a religious/community trust (i. e., a member of the clergy, a counselor, either at a school, at a library, or at a "helping place" [possibly somewhere that teens like to hang out], a worker at a Christian camp, or someone who occasionally has gone on youth group outings),
c. a filial trust (i. e., an extended family member, perhaps rarely seen/visited, but known among other family members; in such a case, then, the DNA that was gathered back in February of 2017 may be of use, but... [memory gets fuzzy on this point] seems like I recall having read back in 2017 something about there having been an issue with the gathering or the preserving of the DNA; someone who recalls please update us all; thanks).

 

[Evinrude]

Also, looking at posts from a year ago, I followed a link to a news article that one of the fathers stated that when the girls didn’t show up for him to pick them up, he did a brief search and came across a guy walking from bridge. Father asked man if he had seen two young girls when the man said he had not.
I had never read that prior to today.

 

[pepper 34]

Jmo, it would be an enormous waste of public funds to start tip-taking all over again in force, if they know who they are after. And why show an image at all, in that case? Why not focus on the individuals you believe are closest to this man? They could have retracted the original image, and left it at that, if they know who this man is.

But, by having the local press release and inviting the public... I think they are focusing on the people they believe are closest to this man. I, personally, don't think they know who it is exactly... although they might have suspicions about a few locals. We do know, from the presser that they do think the person is local, comes into the locality or lived there at one time.

 

[gitana1]

Yea even just a vague cause of death would be revealing, I honestly think LE kinda bungled their public outreach efforts by being so closed lipped, I understand the importance of discretion; but if we don't know anything other than this may or may not be the guy who may or may of not did this or that, the public really isn't going to be of much use.

The hinted at some the crime being about "power" but literally every malicious crime is about power when you get down to the nitty gritty. Burglaries are largely about power and violating people, robberies, stabbings, fights. If the crime was sexual I assume there wasn't activity that would leave dna, but would still satiate that compulsion.

Also by them being tight lipped it makes it sound like to me that they have literally nothing but a bunch of educated guesses, which could work in their favor if they are surveiling someone; but if they don't have a suspect identified they are just hindering the investigation.

If you don't have anything, you do everything you can to get it within procedure and the law. I have never seen a case like this honestly, I understand the respecting of victims aspect too, but I say respect their memory by not letting the case go even colder. William Butler Yeats said, don't wait till the iron is hot to strike; make the iron hot by striking. Forensics, this and that don't make up for good old fashioned police work imo.

The release of info in this case or lack thereof is very, very typical. They aren't going to solve it by giving us their investigative details like cause of death, IMO. That's how you destroy a case and lose all ability to solve it.

The public is not meant to investigate this case. That's not what LE is looking for with public outreach. They're looking for witness tips. People who saw or heard or remembered or noticed something about the crime or someone they know.

 

[joyanne1960]

Professional discussion about this case is now up at Wondery's Best Case Worst Case, with Francey Hakes and Jim Clemente, with two FBI guests: https://wondery.com/shows/best-case-worst-case/