Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #95

[MsBetsy]

I really do think this is an experienced killer/abductor/attacker, primarily because it appears he cased the area carefully prior to the attack. Predators like this spend a lot of time driving around, looking for places where kids hang out, that are remote and out of the way. He had figured the Monon Bridge Trail was a good place to do this and spent enough time planning how he would get there, where he would attack and how he would get out undetected. He figured out the hidden parking spot close to the trail, the remote area of the creek above the bridge where he could attack the girls unseen, then escape away from the trail parking area. He knew kids would be out of school, etc. Knew how to disguise himself but not attract attention.

He spent a lot of time planning this attack and pulled it off. Most first timers wouldn't have done so much advance planning. JMO

I think he may have fantasized about it for awhile, but I am not getting the idea he has done this before.
I think it was his first murder.
If he is from Delphi he may already be familiar with the area where he murdered them. He may have planned it in his mind, but I'm not sure about any careful planning before he acted out his impulses.
I do think he planned to or hoped to do it on that day, though. Imo

 

[weepingangel]

Delphi Daughters: Untold story of Abby & Libby

Liberty German dreamed of becoming a science teacher.

She was interested in solving crimes or finding clues and her curiosity in the sciences was serious business. She attended several classes at nearby Purdue University to try out different areas to see what interested her most.

 

[MsBetsy]

I think they asked if you were parked there and would be able to describe other cars parked there during 12-5 PM

I think they are looking for the driver or someone who knows the driver of a specific car. Imo

 

[DancingMuse]

Best Case Worst Case Delphi Murders Podcast

Thanks so much Choochoobella for posting these re-caps.
Much appreciated.

 

[gregjrichards]

Seeing some posts elsewhere where people are looking into the desktop that was briefly shown during the PC and the files on it. People are thinking perhaps there were clues to the killer on it. Has anyone here shared photos from the PC we could look at?

It is interesting to consider. Was there was a photo of a red vehicle on the screen? I hope I am remembering correctly. Can you imagine if that is the vehicle they are looking for? and it was a hidden message to BG. Forgive me if I am wrong. Speculation.

 

[gregjrichards]

Delphi Daughters: Untold story of Abby & Libby

Liberty German dreamed of becoming a science teacher.

She was interested in solving crimes or finding clues and her curiosity in the sciences was serious business. She attended several classes at nearby Purdue University to try out different areas to see what interested her most.

Thank you for posting this it is much appreciated.

 

[Charlot123]

As tragic and horrific as this case is, I am in awe of the fact that this case will end up being solved, in large part, to the quick wit and bravery of a fourteen year old. She outsmarted the Coward.

Amateur opinion and speculation

And how sad that because of this , two good, talented, girls, future young women, lost their lives...they had future ahead of them, both, good, interesting future, and now it ended so senselessly.

 

[Falling Down]

Best Case Worst Case Delphi Murders Podcast


What does the location of this crime tell you about the offender?


Jim said the perpetrator is probably from around Delphi and spends a significant amount of time there. Whether he grew up there or landed there from somewhere else, we don’t know, but Jim said the offender knew that this was a place where little girls who fit his fantasy could be. Jim’s profile of the offender: He’s the kind of guy who fantasized a great deal about doing this. This was not impulsive. This is something that he had planned for. It didn’t go exactly as he planned, but he had thought about this, he was compulsive, he had played this fantasy out in his mind over and over. He took steps to carry it out: preparing a place to carry out the crime, figuring out how to threaten and control the victim, and preparing a place where he could be unseen until a victim arrived. He has some level of criminal sophistication that only comes from having committed precursive crimes. He might have exhibited peeping behavior, he might have broken into residences to go through underwear drawers, etc. He gets off on the excitement and thrill of being in a place you’re not supposed to be and looking at people’s intimate things. He almost certainly did these things, but we don’t know whether he was caught for these misdemeanor crimes. He seems to have some forensic sophistication because it doesn’t seem at though he left much forensic evidence behind.


Maureen thought it likely the perpetrator has been stalking the trail. She thought it was likely that in the 18,000 tips LE got in the first four months after the crime, some tips were probably from people who had seen this guy at some point in the past on the trail. She thought it was likely some people had called in tips on the perpetrator since LE is very sure that this guy has been living in the town or his family lives in the town or he works there or plays there.


Jim Clemente called this trail/bridge a “target-rich environment.” He likened it to the area in which Hannah Graham of UVA was abducted before being murdered. He talked about how Hannah was walking around, inebriated, and a guy who claimed to be a good Samaritan had started following her. While that guy was following her, Jesse Matthew (Hannah’s killer), showed up and put his arm around Hannah and walked off with her. Jim questions the motive of “the good Samaritan.” He thinks that guy might have wanted to sexually assault Hannah too. On video, we can see that “the good Samaritan” was lying in wait, stepping into the shadows as he followed Hannah, but Jim said that guy was following Hannah so slowly that the other guy was able to overtake her first. He gave that example to describe another target-rich environment. When there are vulnerable victims around, these guys are drawn to these target-rich environments. Jim said that in these environments, predators are looking for vulnerability, availability and desirability. Sometimes desirability may simply be a combination of vulnerability and availability. Abby and Libby were in a target-rich environment and happened to fall into this guy’s net. Jim also cited Israel Keyes as a predator who set traps and chose victims that were vulnerable and available; there was not a desirability factor in who he killed. Israel buried kill kits across the nation and set traps He killed the first vulnerable, available person or people to come by. Jim said there are offenders who are get off on the kill itself.

^^^^THIS

My hunch, and it's just a layman's assessment of the nature of the crimes and a possible partial psych profile, is that this killer gets off on the terror, the fear, and, more importantly, the media attention. I'll bet he gets off on the media posts, articles, etc., but as Supt. Carter noted, BG is looking closely at what LE knows. He's like a voyeur into his own crimes, after the fact, and like I said gets off on the attention. Much different than other killers I've seen detailed here on WS and around the Web.

Of course, JMO.

 

[MistyWaters]

In the latest presser, LE touched on some information some of us knew about, but had not heard it from "official" sources. Information shared early on and possibly more recently by witnesses, who claim a vehicle was parked at the abandoned Dept. of Social Services building, during the hours in question on Feb. 13th, 2017. LE are looking for more information about that vehicle, and would to hear from the owner.

The building was demolished/razed in mid-2018.

Here are two handy images of the building, one shows C.R. 300 and I drew a line where the main trail to the MHB begins. My theory up to this point was that BG may have parked at the DSS building, but may have moved his vehicle to the cemetery further down C.R. 300. Now, I'm thinking the was parked at the DSS building the whole time. Kinda makes sense, the parking area by the trail, where A&L were dropped off, could handle maybe 3 vehicles. People pulling into the parking area would more likely take note of a vehicle parked there, vs. driving by something parked at the abandoned DSS building. Just trying to frame this in a psychological sense.

One image is from a video posted to YouTube in late October. 2016, from a user who wanted to show how to get to the trail and parking area. The other is from a MSM video, the words on the image wrongly indicate the girls were still missing, the video is from after they were found and shows the DSS building.

The YT user came from the south on IN 25. When I was out there Summer of '17, I came from the north on 25. That highway has been there since roughly 2014. There are no indications that MHB is in that area, no signs on 25, none on C.R. 300. You have to know it's there, I can't stress this enough, and it's easy to drive right by the former parking area, which is now blocked off most of the time and on private property. I almost missed it while driving through there. One sign is set back from the road a bit, easy to miss.

It takes roughly one minute to drive from the DSS building to the former parking area, walking would take probably 5-6 minutes or so via the trail (the trailhead is near to the old parking area).

JMO

Thank you for sharing all this clear but comprehensive information about the parking lot and the main access area. You’ve answered several questions for me.

I believe I also noticed a couple threads ago @gitana1 posted that Kelsey said she dropped the girls off at that main access to Monon High Bridge.

 

[Schmitz5100]

I can’t find a link but iirc Libby had already chosen a future career as a forensic investigator, or something very similar. So early on there was a lot of discussion how she ingeniously applied that same keen interest by using her own cellphone to record this guy. Tragically it became evidence in her own murder investigation.

Was her phone found on her or was it found later someplace else? It’s hard to believe such evidence would have been left behind by this creep.

 

[cody22]

It is interesting to consider. Was there was a photo of a red vehicle on the screen? I hope I am remembering correctly. Can you imagine if that is the vehicle they are looking for? and it was a hidden message to BG. Forgive me if I am wrong. Speculation.

If my memory is correct, the vehicle on the screen was a red pickup truck...moo

 

[ab01]

Kids cutting donuts with their cars ?.....moo

That was my first thought

 

[gregjrichards]

If my memory is correct, the vehicle on the screen was a red pickup truck...moo

Yes it was why was a photo of that vehicle in particular on the screen?

 

[Cyber sleuth]

Seeing some posts elsewhere where people are looking into the desktop that was briefly shown during the PC and the files on it. People are thinking perhaps there were clues to the killer on it. Has anyone here shared photos from the PC we could look at?

I took screenshots but they were a bit too blurry.

 

[abeaman02]

I try and keep up with all the threads and maybe this was stated before and I just missed it, so if it has been I apologize for rehashing it. Maybe LE held this presser to get BG moving and/or talking. If they do have a suspect or suspects could they have possibly bugged his house or have surveillance on him and they are hoping that the presser will get him to make sure any evidence he has is still hidden thus leading them to it, or if he has told anyone, just start talking. Especially since a form of this tactic was used recently in the Rhoden murders. This is my opinion only.

 

[MsBetsy]

^^^^THIS

My hunch, and it's just a layman's assessment of the nature of the crimes and a possible partial psych profile, is that this killer gets off on the terror, the fear, and, more importantly, the media attention. I'll bet he gets off on the media posts, articles, etc., but as Supt. Carter noted, BG is looking closely at what LE knows. He's like a voyeur into his own crimes, after the fact, and like I said gets off on the attention. Much different than other killers I've seen detailed here on WS and around the Web.

Of course, JMO.

Very much like a serial killer.
I wonder if he has gone back to the crime scene to "relive" the whole thing.

 

[RedBeard]

I think he may have fantasized about it for awhile, but I am not getting the idea he has done this before.
I think it was his first murder.
If he is from Delphi he may already be familiar with the area where he murdered them. He may have planned it in his mind, but I'm not sure about any careful planning before he acted out his impulses.
I do think he planned to or hoped to do it on that day, though. Imo

I agree, most serial killers start out like this, they go out on impulses and seemingly get lucky before they move on to a pattern. I wouldn't go so far as to say he is a serial killer yet, but he obviously is either crazy or evil enough to kill in such a matter of fact way as the case has been purported (we don't know the facts so thats just speculation) . I kinda worry about the latest press conference for the fact this might be his first homicide and if he is easily jostled it could induce him to act again depending on his psyche. I wanna trust law enforcement though and hope they know a lot more than some of us think and they have a good profile/moving the case further.

 

[Betty P]

Best Case Worst Case Delphi Murders Podcast


What does the location of this crime tell you about the offender?


Jim said the perpetrator is probably from around Delphi and spends a significant amount of time there. Whether he grew up there or landed there from somewhere else, we don’t know, but Jim said the offender knew that this was a place where little girls who fit his fantasy could be. Jim’s profile of the offender: He’s the kind of guy who fantasized a great deal about doing this. This was not impulsive. This is something that he had planned for. It didn’t go exactly as he planned, but he had thought about this, he was compulsive, he had played this fantasy out in his mind over and over. He took steps to carry it out: preparing a place to carry out the crime, figuring out how to threaten and control the victim, and preparing a place where he could be unseen until a victim arrived. He has some level of criminal sophistication that only comes from having committed precursive crimes. He might have exhibited peeping behavior, he might have broken into residences to go through underwear drawers, etc. He gets off on the excitement and thrill of being in a place you’re not supposed to be and looking at people’s intimate things. He almost certainly did these things, but we don’t know whether he was caught for these misdemeanor crimes. He seems to have some forensic sophistication because it doesn’t seem as though he left much forensic evidence behind.


Maureen thought it likely the perpetrator has been stalking the trail. She thought it was likely that in the 18,000 tips LE got in the first four months after the crime, some tips were probably from people who had seen this guy at some point in the past on the trail. She thought it was likely some people had called in tips on the perpetrator since LE is very sure that this guy has been living in the town or his family lives in the town or he works there or plays there.


Jim Clemente called this trail/bridge a “target-rich environment.” He likened it to the area in which Hannah Graham of UVA was abducted before being murdered. He talked about how Hannah was walking around, inebriated, and a guy who claimed to be a good Samaritan had started following her. While that guy was following her, Jesse Matthew (Hannah’s killer), showed up and put his arm around Hannah and walked off with her. Jim questions the motive of “the good Samaritan.” He thinks that guy might have wanted to sexually assault Hannah too. On video, we can see that “the good Samaritan” was lying in wait, stepping into the shadows as he followed Hannah, but Jim said that guy was following Hannah so slowly that the other guy was able to overtake her first. He gave that example to describe another target-rich environment. When there are vulnerable victims around, these guys are drawn to these target-rich environments. Jim said that in these environments, predators are looking for vulnerability, availability and desirability. Sometimes desirability may simply be a combination of vulnerability and availability. Abby and Libby were in a target-rich environment and happened to fall into this guy’s net. Jim also cited Israel Keyes as a predator who set traps and chose victims that were vulnerable and available; there was not a desirability factor in who he killed. Israel buried kill kits across the nation and set traps He killed the first vulnerable, available person or people to come by. Jim said there are offenders who are get off on the kill itself.

Thank you Choochoobella! Great work and this is some very helpful information from the former FBI agents. I found this particularly interesting

He has some level of criminal sophistication that only comes from having committed precursive crimes. He might have exhibited peeping behavior, he might have broken into residences to go through underwear drawers, etc. He gets off on the excitement and thrill of being in a place you’re not supposed to be and looking at people’s intimate things. He almost certainly did these things, but we don’t know whether he was caught for these misdemeanor crimes. He seems to have some forensic sophistication because it doesn’t seem at though he left much forensic evidence behind.


Maureen thought it likely the perpetrator has been stalking the trail. She thought it was likely that in the 18,000 tips LE got in the first four months after the crime, some tips were probably from people who had seen this guy at some point in the past on the trail. She thought it was likely some people had called in tips on the perpetrator since LE is very sure that this guy has been living in the town or his family lives in the town or he works there or plays there.

BBM

I've always felt he's local (from Delphi or the surrounding towns/cities) and he's done these precursive things before, especially voyeurism and/or stalking. They also say he had a vivid fantasy life and had fantasized about committing this crime. Planned out all the details. He's someone about whom family or local LE might say "Well, he's just a creep, or he's just joking around. He wouldn't kill anyone. He's harmless. It's not him." They probably have interviewed him already.

 

[MistyWaters]

Was her phone found on her or was it found later someplace else? It’s hard to believe such evidence would have been left behind by this creep.

Good point. The definition of “near” is never really specific. How near is near? My opinion only, I think she either tossed it in the river as they were attempting to flee or managed to quickly chuck it in a bush or between deadfall on the ground where it wasn’t noticed.

 

[slightlyaskew]

Makes me wonder her motives. Did he look so scary that she decided to capture him, or did the girls plan to make a photo and expose him to the whole world, for something he did? Like, pretending to be a peer and talking to them online?

And did the BG eliminate them as witnesses, or is it his modus operandi, to lure teenagers/women into a trap?

Some if the nations best computer analysts have poured over every possible inch of the girls online activity. There is little to no chance this is a catfish.