IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #29

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In Abby's obituary, it stated the following, "She loved to camp and swim, and loved being outdoors, she liked riding ATV's with her family on camping trips to Michigan." Is it possible the fishing photo was taken on a camping trip in MI? JMO.

That's kind of what I was thinking. It's just as likely the photo was taken by the Monon High Bridge as it is it was taken somewhere else, on vacation for instance. That being said, I don't think the location of where the photo was taken will break this case wide open.
JMO.
 
Am I the only one that won't go outside at night since this? Am I the only one that jumps at every bump in the night?

Noooo, i have 15 acres that back up to 50,000 acres of state land. I have a fully trained German Shepherd personal protection dog, who can take down 2 men, if need be, and I'm still scared ****- less , walking him. I can't imagine what i would do if i saw someone like BG coming toward me....
 
Thanks! It's horrifying to think of what it contains - I'm still haunted by reading the Bittaker/Norris transcripts, and I suspect this may be along those same lines.

JMO but often times these murderers are into the fear/control/power aspect - it's a major part of the thrill. I think people are jumping ahead to sex offenders too quickly.

It worries me that perhaps two friends were chosen deliberately to maximize the victims fear and thus the murderers excitement (e.g., murder one and observe the fear in the next). Bittaker and Norris I recall specifically enjoyed observing the fear in their victims.

Anyhow, seems reasonable to think a gun is involved (hard to imagine how else you'd control 2 people, and I can't unsee the outline in the photo!), but there's very little reason to suspect one was used in the killing -- too risky with the gunshot sound and nearby properties. Which leads me to believe killer(s) had a preferred method of killing silently, perhaps strangulation, drowning, or a knife. LE didn't seem to immediately know whether the crime was a homicide however, and mentioned they suspected it only based on how the bodies were found.

We should be careful about assuming this is a sex-related murder by a pedophile(s). I know it seems obvious given the gender and age of the victims, and statically I'd think it likely, but as of yet there is no evidence and no indication by LE. And given how confused they seem about this case, I have to wonder if the lack of apparent motive is why.

I also had a "The Most Dangerous Game" sort of scenario go through my mind. I'm not attached to it as a theory, but I added it to my personal list of "possibilities". And it's not pretty.

Edited- wording


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Can someone fill me in please ?? Ive been missing out on the updates as my mom just passed and I am just getting back to work and back to WS to catch up, but I am at a loss here.

<mod snip>

You are all so wonderful to keep being so diligent with these cases !!
Let's find the BG and have Justice for these 2 young girls and their families.

I am sorry you lost your mother. Enough said.
 
I totally agree and asked the same question awhile ago. What in the world could get that response?



I remember reading very early on, that LE had thought it possible the girls might have tried to go visit Libby's brother. Anyone else remember that? I'll do my best to locate the article.
 
Noooo, i have 15 acres that back up to 50,000 acres of state land. I have a fully trained German Shepherd personal protection dog, who can take down 2 men, if need be, and I'm still scared ****- less , walking him. I can't imagine what i would do if i saw someone like BG coming toward me....

I have a pit bull that was rescued from a fighting ring...she's really sweet but really protective of me. She was freaking out the other night and I could hear noises on my porch. Long story short, I almost called the cops on a cat. Definitely on edge!
 
What the case and others remind us is that there is evil out there, it can happen anywhere to anyone and to be aware especially in remote areas.
 
I remember reading very early on, that LE had thought it possible the girls might have tried to go visit Libby's brother. Anyone else remember that? I'll do my best to locate the article.

Iirc it was her mother's father that said it, iirc a call was placed to them when they couldn't Find them that evening. Could be wrong but that is the way i thought maybe i read or took it. Jmo
 
Uh Radar online posted a story this morning that is not accurate IMO. Calling this the "snapchat killer"???? Is this the first time this has been put out there like that? So irresponsible IMO. When these stories get sensationalized it just confuses things IMO. Unless it's been quoted elsewhere that LE actually used that term?
 
This is the picture I had mentioned in an earlier post where someone had pointed out where it looks like a person standing behind a tree below the bridge. The area that they referenced was on the opposite side of where you have there blue circle. Look on Abigail's left. Follow the tracks 25-30 yards behind her and look for the tall white birch tree and follow it down to its trunk.

Yes, I can see where a hand and part of the sleeve would be proportionate to Abigail's size on the bridge. Sort of lurking in the shadow. Could also be a shoulder and shadow.


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Uh Radar online posted a story this morning that is not accurate IMO. Calling this the "snapchat killer"???? Is this the first time this has been put out there like that? So irresponsible IMO. When these stories get sensationalized it just confuses things IMO. Unless it's been quoted elsewhere that LE actually used that term?
They also are reporting another ARREST. hmmmmmmmm?????
 
I also had a "The Most Dangerous Game" sort of scenario go through my mind. I'm not attached to it as a theory, but I put it on my my personal list. And it's not pretty.


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I've seen the movie or read the book a very long time ago. I get what you mean but I don't think it's quite the same. In that plot, wasn't it more about the challenge/thrill of the hunt? I don't get the sense that's what we're dealing with here. The main reason for that is there is no "challenge" in this particular case - the victims were essentially helpless young girls, presumably cornered on a bridge with no escape. That's not the type of situation I'd see a hunter gaining a thrill from. Instead it is the type of situation someone who was seeking absolute control would create, similar to how many serial killers behave.

What I'm stumped by is the supposed creek crossing. It plays an extremely important role in this case, but it doesn't make a lot of sense given the other evidence. One theory I have is that the killer led them to the creek (but not across) for isolation (one less direction to run in) or destruction of evidence, some fetish with drowning, or something to that effect. Perhaps he then murdered his first victim, with the intent of inducing absolute fear into his remaining victim, who fled across the creek, and was murdered or died of previous wounds there. LE never clarified whether the bodies were in the same vicinity. I am suspecting they were not.

What's confusing is that it seems pretty clear this was premeditated, and perhaps even the murderer(s) knew the victims. Given this level of preparation I find it hard to believe a victim was able to flee at all, and I can't think of any other reason for crossing that creek.
 
They also are reporting another ARREST. hmmmmmmmm?????

I believe they are being misleading. IMO they are just talking about the old arrest of RL. JMO
What do you think?
 
Uh Radar online posted a story this morning that is not accurate IMO. Calling this the "snapchat killer"???? Is this the first time this has been put out there like that? So irresponsible IMO. When these stories get sensationalized it just confuses things IMO. Unless it's been quoted elsewhere that LE actually used that term?

I think the UK gutter press coined the term 'snapchat killer' Anything to grab the headlines, facts not required
 
I believe they are being misleading. IMO they are just talking about the old arrest of RL. JMO
What do you think?
They are saying it is a different arrest. They say not RL. I don't know... they are a tabloid.
 
I've seen the movie or read the book a very long time ago. I get what you mean but I don't think it's quite the same. In that plot, wasn't it more about the challenge/thrill of the hunt? I don't get the sense that's what we're dealing with here. The main reason for that is there is no "challenge" in this particular case - the victims were essentially helpless young girls, presumably cornered on a bridge with no escape. That's not the type of situation I'd see a hunter gaining a thrill from. Instead it is the type of situation someone who was seeking absolute control would create, similar to how many serial killers behave.

What I'm stumped by is the supposed creek crossing. It plays an extremely important role in this case, but it doesn't make a lot of sense given the other evidence. One theory I have is that the killer led them to the creek (but not across) for isolation (one less direction to run in) or destruction of evidence, some fetish with drowning, or something to that effect. Perhaps he then murdered his first victim, with the intent of inducing absolute fear into his remaining victim, who fled across the creek, and was murdered or died of previous wounds there. LE never clarified whether the bodies were in the same vicinity. I am suspecting they were not.

What's confusing is that it seems pretty clear this was premeditated, and perhaps even the murderer(s) knew the victims. Given this level of preparation I find it hard to believe a victim was able to flee at all, and I can't think of any other reason for crossing that creek.

Nope. Not the same, but after 29 threads my grip on realistic and rational is starting to go sideways!


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