IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 - #33

[SouthernCutie]

I'm curious as to whether the digital billboards with the tip line number are still active across the country.

There's one right outside Nashville Tn

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[Elle*Bee]

Is there a link to the interview where RL makes that statement?

Yes, the link is right there in the post you quoted.

No snark intended as I know posts -- and news articles -- are frequently updated.

 

[MzOpinion8d]

Ok, this is MOO only but gathered from many puzzle pieces along the way thanks to everyone that posted anything on this case. Yes, so much repetition and rehashing but it all matters - it all swirls around until it starts to click and every contribution is part of the puzzle. I admittedly still have some missing or unclear pieces and I COULD BE 1000% WRONG but...


It is JMO that RL was not home when the girls were killed and he had NO knowledge of the crime at that time. I believe he may have been less than truthful with his alibi later due to his probation and that is what they finally used to land him in the pokey. I don't believe LE thinks RL is the primary suspect but I think they feel sure RL knows who is (as do they). I believe in MOO that RL may have found out as early as sometime after the first search for what was then "missing girls" was completed and called off for the night. I think it turned out that BG is very well-known to RL which compelled RL to then begin assisting BG so that BG would not be discovered. It is possible that he still did not quite find out until a few days later but at some point RL became aware. I do not think RL was directly involved in killing A&L in any way.


I am reminded here of the tagline of Netflix' show Bloodline: "We are not bad people, but we did a bad thing". I think this is applies very much to RL and his involvement IMO. As an aside, I am still feeling sad for his happy, little dog.


MOO I think it is possible the girls' bodies were moved from or through RL's property (or from the grain bin through RL's property) down to where they were ultimately found but that the intention was possibly to get them in the water to destroy evidence at the very least and to possibly make it seem they had fallen from the bridge or had some other accident. (Remember, we do not know COD and LE seemed uncertain of the scene upon the discovery - I don't have time now to find links so MOO this but I think this is pretty well stipulated info at this point.) Also, how many of us have wondered why would a killer leave the bodies on his own property? I don't think that was the plan at all but there was some reason they didn't make it off the property and into the water. I am NOT saying RL is the killer here, just a general "no one in their right mind would want this on their own property" kind of thing.


It is JMO that Libby's phone likely did ping or otherwise appear to be located on Bicycle Bridge Road (in Delphi) but may have been in a vehicle parked on BBR which caused the SW to be for the wrong house. I think it may have been balled up in other crime scene evidence in the vehicle or something but I do not think it was in Libby's possession at this time. I really am not settled on whether LE has the actual phone or not but I feel certain that data from attempting to locate it is what lead to BBR either way. I am skeptical of it being cell phone tower pinging and think it is more likely it was phone device tracking done by a member of Libby's family and/or LE. It must have been something reliable enough to get the SW at any rate IMO. I believe BBR is a key component in this case if you are so inclined to research it further.


MOO but I suspect LE's mention of "blind alleys needing to be closed" (not a direct quote) would include things like RSOs and drifter types at this point. I think they threw everything at this case in the early days to cover all the bases (billboards, national coverage, etc) and rightfully, thankfully so. I think the picture began to reveal itself to LE once they were able to get their bearings on the case and get people interviewed and alibis checked and so on.


Lastly, it is MOO that this case is on it's way to resolution and I hope the arrest goes smoothly and there are no standoffs or anything. I think BG must know they are about to nab their guy. MOO


The above is my opinion only.

If he thinks they're close to arresting him, BG is thousands of miles away by now.

 

[Ashley95]

There's one right outside Nashville Tn

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I think this says alot doesn't? There must be a cost involved in having these up?

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[elmomom]

Two teenagers who don't show up at an appointed time is not two homicide victims. Big difference when they make that statement *after* the girls are found murdered. Im sure we've all read the rumors about the scene, but based on ISP "stuff of nightmares" I'm going to take them at their word. Of course, it's possible the LEO was referring to a nightmare of two girls being murdered but it is my impression, given they have released so little info from the phone, just two photos and a brief sound bite of three or four words, the remainder was what he was referring to.

I think you may have misunderstood my post. I was responding to Bernie wondering if it was possible that LE knew on the night they went missing that they were in danger, and were hoping by downplaying it publicly, the abductor woould let them go. My response was only about them saying they were not aware that they were in danger that first night when they called off the search. I think if they truly thought the kids had been abducted, there is no way they would have called off the search. I hope this is a little more clear?

 

[tlcya]

Alrighty folks. This thread will be closed for a bout an hour. Take a breather. May be a good time to read the rules linked in my signature.

See you in an hour.

 

[Mcumings]

Thank you for your observations.

Did you happen to see the Delphi U-Store on 300N? It is a self storage facility and I have been wondering if the may have been there or parked there. It is close to one of the drop off points for the trails.

Another question. You have narrowed the age range to 38-42 years. From looking at the video stills of the I myself have narrowed it to about 25-50 years. How did you come up with your age range?

I based my age range on the picture along with the sound of his voice. According to radford university serial killer database the average age of a white male american serial killer is 34. As i do not believe this is his first he will be older so i put him at 38 to 42. I did see the ustore place and that is a possible place for him to hide. The reason i suspect the cemetery is that it is a 2 minute drive from the trail head if you drive the speed limit. I drove and timed it. I did find a place in the back of the cemetery to park a car and have it relatively hidden from the road. RL wasnt home so he wouldnt have seen it and RLs place is barely visible from that spot. There is a ravine that runs from that very corner to the bridge. The girls had at least a 20 minute walk to get to that point. Thats how long it took the wife and i to push a stroller there anyway. That would give him plenty of time to reach a hiding place and wait for them to pass then follow them onto the bridge. I was able to recreate the picture that was captured from the video. They were sitting on the last platform on the bridge. I am now working to calculate BG height.

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[Tricia]

Hand off to the left.

I've re-opened the thread and going to be on here with you all while Tlcya and our other incredible mods take a break.

The other mods are much nicer than me so behave

Tricia

 

[Suglo]

Oooohhhh Kay I just saw some disturbing tweets from someone who knows RL. I hate to make assumptions based on the way people behave on social media but if RL knows this person well and is actually friends with them, oh boy OK. It doesn't make you a murderer but it makes you a completely different person than you are acting like on these news interviews. IMO MOO

How do you know if the person on twitter is who they say they are? Twitter is ground zero for trolls.


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[GhostGhost]

If this was my friend or family member, I'd say they had a serious problem with alcohol

https://public.courts.in.gov/mycase...pbGVFbmQiOm51bGwsIkNvdW50eUNvZGUiOm51bGx9fQ==

State of Indiana v. Ronald E Logan
08D01-1402-FD-000016
Court Carroll Superior Court
Case Type FD - Class D Felony
Filed 02/27/2014
Status 10/08/2014, Decided
Charges 9-30-5-3(a)(1)/FD: Operating a Vehicle with a BAC of .08 or greater, 9-30-5-2(b)/MA: Operating A Vehicle While Intoxicated; Endangering A Person, 9-30-5-1(a)(1)/MC: Operating a Vehicle with a BAC of .08 or More per Blood, 35-44.1-2-3(d)(1)/MA: False Informing, 9-24-19-2/MA: Driving While Suspended (Prior w/in 10 years), 9-21-8-31/IFC: Failure to Yield Right of Way at Entrance to Through Highway
Parties State of Indiana, Logan
Attorneys Bean, Achey, Rozzi Filed 02/27/2014

State of Indiana vs. Ronald Logan
08D01-1312-FD-000107
Court Carroll Superior Court
Case Type FD - Class D Felony
Filed 12/03/2013
Status 09/15/2014, Decided
Charges 9-30-5-2(a) & (b)/FD: Operating a Vehicle While Intoxicated Endangering a Person, 9-30-5-1(a)(2)/MC: Operating a Vehicle with a BAC of .08 or More per Breath
Parties State of Indiana, Logan
Attorneys Bean, Achey Filed 12/03/2013

State of Indiana vs. Ronald Logan
08D01-1102-IF-000134
Court Carroll Superior Court
Case Type IF - Infraction
Filed 02/23/2011
Status 09/22/2011, Decided
Charges 9-24-19-1/IFA: Driving While Suspended
Parties State of Indiana, Logan Filed 02/23/2011

State of Indiana v. Ronald Logan
08D01-1102-CM-000031
Court Carroll Superior Court
Case Type CM - Criminal Misdemeanor
Filed 02/08/2011
Status 06/21/2011, Decided
Charges 9-30-5-2(a)/MA: Operating a Vehicle While Intoxicated Endangering a Person, 9-30-5-1(a)/MC: Oper Veh w/ Alcohol Concentration Equivalent to at Least .08 but Less than .15, 35-44-2-2(d)(1)/MA: False Informing, 9-30-15-3/IFC: Open Alcoholic Beverage Container During Operation of a Motor Vehicle, 9-24-19-1/IFA: Driving While Suspended
Parties State of Indiana, Logan
Attorneys Bean, Knecht Filed 02/08/2011

State of Indiana v. Ronald Logan
08D01-1101-CM-000001
Court Carroll Superior Court
Case Type CM - Criminal Misdemeanor
Filed 01/05/2011
Status 06/14/2011, Decided
Charges 9-30-5-2(a)/MA: Operating a Vehicle While Intoxicated Endangering a Person, 9-30-5-1(a)/MC: Oper Veh w/ Alcohol Concentration Equivalent to at Least .08 but Less than .15
Parties State of Indiana, Logan
Attorneys Knecht Filed 01/05/2011

Good info

 

[Peppery]

Can anyone post the link to property parcels?

 

[abstr]

Post #685

[FONT=&quot]In order for the State to convict someone of Operating a Vehicle While Intoxicated Endangering a Person, the State must prove:[/FONT]

1. that the driver
2. operated
3. a vehicle
4. while intoxicated and
5. in such a manner that a person was endangered.

[FONT=&quot]To further break down the elements of this offense, we will focus on intoxication and endangerment. The State has to prove that the driver was intoxicated while driving. “Intoxication” is defined under Indiana Code 9-13-2-86 asimpaired on a substance such as alcohol, drugs, or medication so that there is an impaired condition of thought and action and the loss of normal control of a person’s faculties. To prove intoxication, the State will use a combination of the driver’s performance on the standardized field sobriety tests, the officer’s observations, and blood or breath alcohol content. In addition to intoxication, the State will also have to prove that the intoxicated driver endangered a person. Indiana case law has held that a passenger, another motorist, or even the driver constitutes “a person” under the meaning of the statute. Endangerment can come in the form of swerving across lanes, speeding, or other traffic violations.
http://www.ctglaw.com/blog/why-am-i-charged-2-counts-operating-intoxicated-hamilton-county/

I think it was misinterpreted. Endangered person can be the driver or another driver in a different car. Or could be a passenger but we don't know for certain unless someone has transcripts from the court dates. [/FONT]

 

[Suglo]

Well, again it is very late for me so I am off to bed. I did not join in the conversation tonight (day for some of you!) as I need a break.

I just want to say, IMO only:

I don't know about RL's guilt or innocence but when deciphering his comments, I try to remember that he is privy to a lot of information because of the fact that the girls were found on his land and the subsequent searches thereafter. He will have been told a lot, whether officials told him or other LE entities or volunteers. He is going to say a lot of things that make it sound like something only the killer would know. I look at his comments as a clue to what he may know what happened, not what he did.

He has 40 acres, he does not "work" 40 acres. That distinction is important. If you look at an aerial shot you can see how much of the property is actually "worked." Sorry to say but 40 acres is not a lot of land. That does not mean he hasn't had help, lodgers, etc., on his property from time to time.

I find all these theories of RL being angry with the girls for trespassing, so he killed them, disturbing, with no sources to back the claim up. Some have not even tried to give the courtesy "IMO" or "MOO" or "WHAT IF" when putting that theory forward. What happened to the scenario of the well-planned, carefully crafted, serial killer type guy that was BG just a few days ago?

So, now we are to change our stance and go with RL conked them over the head and, what, "carried" them "down the hill?" If this last scenario turns out to be true then LE has a lot of explaining to do for putting those psycho serial killer imaginings in our heads. Drama to the max then. I know, I know, covering all the bases...

About the truck, I have only seen that truck parked near the "silo" across from RL's land. Do we know that it is his truck? Why does RL park it over there?

Another poster (sorry do not remember who) pointed out to me that when they watched the news footage of the search that there seems to be some building that looked to be a cottage of some sort on RL's property. I do not know that that is true but possible and would mean that someone else is possibly there and could be of interest. Somebody might take up that banner and check property records? It cannot be me, must. get. sleep.

I said I needed a break and this post probably proves that. Please don't be offended by anything I am saying here and please don't post all kinds of responses to my post "proving" I am wrong, pretty please?

One Day Closer...Nighty-night from France:bed:

Such a great post! Vive la France.


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[Burnt Toast]

If two young girls have just been found murdered I find it odd unless the police were very confident they knew who was responsible, not just thought it, & where the person or persons were every second.

what does LE mean by no "immediate" danger. I never thought about it until now.

 

[MLLS]

Can anyone post the link to property parcels?

https://beacon.schneidercorp.com/Ap...ageTypeID=1&KeyValue=08-06-27-000-001.000-006


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[Mcumings]

Is there a busy highway near RL's property?

25 runs right by the trail head but there is no direct access if in a vehicle. On foot however a hitchiker could simply walk up a steep incline from the highway and be on the trail.

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[smiley]

I Opus, n my opinion, the order is less important than the words themselves. He feels "violated" and then he says "raped". It just caught many people's attention here, and I concurred that it is worthy of looking at as an unconscious unintentional, but real, communication. Thank you for this respectful dialogue.

I was coming to post this same thing. I have heard many who have suffered home robberies, etc, say they felt violated in their own home. I think that is what RL was trying to say but got tripped up on his words

 

[Steleheart]

I would have thought that the search of RL'S home was a nice coincidence since he was already in custody, if they had not searched there, pretty much just across from his driveway, earlier the same day he was arrested. Too much coincidence for me.

I'm not so sure it's coincidence. By virtue of his guilty pleas and his probation , his sentencing stipulates that he waves his 4th amendment rights.

"The terms of probation are set forth in the Order on Probation and include the following: waiver of 4th amendment rights against search and seizure;"
https://public.courts.in.gov/mycase...yVXhOREl3TnpFd01qTXdPamN4TnpjME1UVXhZekU9In19

So with a probation violation and even without, his property can be searched any time, IMO

 

[Burnt Toast]

I may be totally wrong on it, but in the other case did the police have a "stuff of nightmares" video or audio?

LE never said "stuff of nightmares", i believe that was said by a reporter...probably to grab the attention of the listener or reader.

 

[GangaMa]

What is that hole in the back passengers window?


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The small black dot is a rubber piece that is connected to a metal joint (inside) that allows you to push open the window.