IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #38

[BlueShoe]

I read some posts last night about RL's dog and then someone speculated that BG had a dog but I don't believe that at all.

Why were they talking about RL dog in relation to crime? Do you know?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not sure that I remember, but I think someone was wondering if RL's dog would bark if strangers were on his property.

 

[Tricia]

More than likely RL was transferred to another jail.

Please do not turn this into a big deal as to whether he is in jail or not.

Just because he is not listed in one jail does not mean he is not somewhere else.

Thanks,
Tricia

A couple days ago there was some confusion whether RL was still in the Carroll County Jail. When VINELink was checked, they were no longer offering you the option to register for notification for him if he was going to be released or transferred. I thought that was very strange because I am no stranger to VINELink because of some stuff that is happening in my personal life. My hinky meter was going off big time. Fox news checked on his status yesterday per a request....

Well I went ahead and checked this morning...........He is NOT in Carroll County jail any longer

Alias: LOGAN, RONALD E.
Offender Name: LOGAN, RONALD EUGENE
Custody Status: Transferred
Age: 77
Location: Unknown Agency
Race: White
Contact Facility: Carroll County Jail
Registration for notification is not currently available for this offender.
More Info
Offender Name: LOGAN, RONALD EUGENE
Custody Status: Transferred
Age: 77
Location: Unknown Agency
Race: White
Contact Facility: Carroll County Jail

 

[CoreyRocks]

That was my impression as well. There is a path through the woods coming down from the cemetery running north/south and there is a path that runs east/west above the path that leads down to where the girls were found.

There is another photo that was taken from down by the crime scene tape looking back up toward where the person that took this photo is standing that gives an idea where the east/west path crosses. While it is harder to see, that east/west path can be seen in LIDAR maps of that side of the creek.

From where that man is to the yellow tape is it straight up a hill? The crime scene yellow tapes appears very high unless of course it is uphill. ?? TIA.

 

[gitana1]

I think BG had previously confronted them and they wanted to record to prove it to their parents and/or police, but JMO.

If a stranger heads towards them in a menacing manner or they felt uncomfortable, why not head for the hills, start screaming, start dialing police? Instead they stay in place and record?

I think that may not be too unusual. Think about this, most adults are conditioned to not question authority. Remember the white coat brown coat test? Where adults were
told to press a button to shock a faceless person in another room who they could hear scream in pain and beg? People were more likely to continue on even into the "fatal" range when a person in a white coat gave the commands in an authrotative voice.

And its its kind of easy for and adult to get kids in general to do what they want. Because kids are raised for the most part to obey adults.

Then we have girls in particular. Females are taught all their lives to obey elders and authority, to not stand out or make scenes, to be polite, to be quiet, to not explore, to defer to males,etc. It is how females are socialized. Families can make that socialization better or worse.

But this generation has been raised recorded. They are the most recorded generation to date. They are raised with social media and digital recording devices. Their whole lives- every intimate aspect- is publicized via social media records. And, nowadays because of easily portable cell phones, we frequently see various crimes or tragedies or other things that were rare to capture on recordings, on tv or the internet.

So it makes perfect sense to me that teen girls this age would be unlikely to scream, fight or run in the face of a menacing threat, until it's much too late. But with little prompting those same girls would quickly record something that scares them, that they don't understand or that they feel threatened by.

 

[Pamela_Brewer]

I read some posts last night about RL's dog and then someone speculated that BG had a dog but I don't believe that at all.

Why were they talking about RL dog in relation to crime? Do you know?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I posted a question as to what breed it was.
Curiosity, I guess, as to what might link RL to the girls.(forensic evidence)
Perhaps one of the girls had dog hair on her clothes or had a dog bite?
I just wondered what breed the dog was.
Some dogs are "yappy" some are more prone to bite.
Obviously every dog is different regardless of the breed.
IMO (most) are protective of their owners especially on their own turf.
I never thought BG had a dog.
I got an answer about the possible breed.
NOTHING has been reported about a dog in MSM.
It was a only a question.
FWIW- MOO

 

[BoggLed in Ohio]

I read some posts last night about RL's dog and then someone speculated that BG had a dog but I don't believe that at all.

Why were they talking about RL dog in relation to crime? Do you know?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I can't answer for the other posters but all I mentioned was possibe scenario that maybe BG made up a lie that he lost a puppy and that he'd seen it run down the hill and then asked the girls to help find his puppy as a ruse to get them down there. ,, because to me that recording of him saying down the hill did not sound threatening or menacing to me and if someone had just played it to me without telling me ahead of time that it was related to this case or anything bad , I would not have ever guessed that's what it was... so I speculated that maybe it was extrapolated from something like him saying "my lost puppy ran down the hill " or something to that effect)

then later in my post I related a real-life story that happened to me that was sort of similarly related

 

[Elle*Bee]

I read some posts last night about RL's dog and then someone speculated that BG had a dog but I don't believe that at all.

Why were they talking about RL dog in relation to crime? Do you know?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Someone (on the last thread, I believe) theorized that perhaps BG had a hunting dog, specifically a beagle, that he would give the command to run and then attempt to lure Abby and Libby into helping him "find" his dog (which, if trained as a hunting dog, would return when signaled).

IMHO as a former beagle owner (RIP Scout), there's no way a full grown beagle could have been concealed under BG's jacket.

 

[Jax49]

O/T I've found this to be useful advice:

If you find that there is a fellow poster whose thoughts you find you are unable to even read without losing your composure, your "Ignore List" is your friend. When you put a poster on this list, the following will happen:

• You will not see their posts;
• They will not be able to send you PMs;
• They will not be able to send you email vial the Board links;
• They will not be able to leave you visitor messages.

 

[tokyorose]

A few days ago, I brought up this IN case on the TN thread.
Imo the picture of the perp from the TN case fits well with the image from the IN case.

Immediately, on the other case thread, the mention of the two being connected was shot down by other posters.

Still, I'd be interested in seeing side-by-sides of the two images.

JMO but I don't think these 2 cases have anything to do with each other. The perp from TN has spent a lot of time grooming this girl and was way to busy with her to have decided to go to Delphi to murder Abbey and Libby.. JMO

 

[tokyorose]

I read some posts last night about RL's dog and then someone speculated that BG had a dog but I don't believe that at all.

Why were they talking about RL dog in relation to crime? Do you know?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes, people were speculating about whether or not the dog alerted or barked the night the girls disappeared, whether the dog knew something was going on. Of course only RL would know that..IMO.

 

[atmh]

I don't think "conditioning" of females accounts for these girls not running, especially not YOUNGER generation females, who are finally getting the message that they are to view themselves as equals, able, competent to do what they set their minds to, empowered with a voice, and so on. I'm not convinced that L and A's generation are taught to respect authority any more than boys would be.
IMO...I think we don't always go with our gut, period. I know that I get a "sixth sense" feeling about people, especially on first impressions. I repeatedly, over the years, have dismissed it, I hate feeling cynical. But I share observations with people close to me, dismiss, and then later I hear, "You were right about that." Example: saw our new neighbor (whom I had not formally met yet) on the side of his house one day, on his cell phone. It was mid afternoon, and I was passing my landing window as I turned and finished going upstairs. Saw him as I passed. Dh came home from work and I said, "The new neighbors are getting a divorce." He asked how I knew and I told him what I saw. He responded with dismissal, a bit of a snarky laugh, and I was left feeling cynical again. And then 2 months later, she told another neighbor she had filed for divorce. Sure, it could well be coincidence (I tell myself all the time, but then my hunches are accurate.)
My (sorry) long point is, I think we tend to naturally dismiss fear when we should be fully tapping into it. The book, "Protecting the Gift" (highly suggest reading it if you have kids) talks about this, not ignoring our inner voice regarding danger and fear. I think there is MORE to why they "didn't" run (has LE even stated that they know they tried/didn't try?) Everyone wants answers, no one more than the family. And we ALL want justice. And it's coming. I believe it will definitely be served.

 

[ceylon]

I think BG had previously confronted them and they wanted to record to prove it to their parents and/or police, but JMO.

If a stranger heads towards them in a menacing manner or they felt uncomfortable, why not head for the hills, start screaming, start dialing police? Instead they stay in place and record?

I just learned about this case this week and my first impression from the two photos is that this guy just looks awkward - the posture, the stuffed and puckering jacket, whatever is on his head just strikes me as odd. The first time I saw it my thought was "did this guy try to look like Elmer Fudd?". I work with youth in the same age range as Abby and Libby and it's very common for these kids to record and document whatever odd things they see throughout the day to share with friends.

As for not running off, I think the outcome of this incident would have unfortunately been different if they weren't on a bridge where they would have to avoid the open spaces between ties and the fact it appears they stopped to let him pass and lost their lead on him.

 

[No it's not]

This I grabbed from one of the early threads.. I know it came from either the FB, Twitter, or web site of WLFI channel 18 and if I am not mistaken I took it from a skibaboo post. I know that there is another photo - I haven't had time to go back through all of the earlier threads that has a photo taken from down near the crime scene tape looking back up towards where this photo was taken and you can see vehicles there of some sort.

This is one posted previously and taken by RVW from WTHR:

 

[mtnlites]

I think BG had previously confronted them and they wanted to record to prove it to their parents and/or police, but JMO.

If a stranger heads towards them in a menacing manner or they felt uncomfortable, why not head for the hills, start screaming, start dialing police? Instead they stay in place and record?

I think something happened minutes before the recording started. He might have already ordered them to march across the bridge or whatever it was he wanted. I believe that she was walking in front and stealthily turned and started videotaping. I don't believe that what we are seeing is the first interaction of the moment; I think there were several unaccounted for minutes before she started filming. And, heck, what we've seen might even be 5 minutes into the recording. We have no real context of when that video was shot.

 

[azshadowwalker]

Whether BG is or is not RL, people are assuming no one recognized BG and have reported it to the police. I don't think that's a fair or accurate assumption because the police haven't said no one recognized BG. Maybe no one did or maybe 390 did. We don't know because they have not said. Because they're still looking for tips doesn't mean no one recognized BG.

Remember the post a couple of weeks ago by an online friend of one of the girls' family members? I am not going to search to link to it, because Tapatalk is so crash-happy when I try to view too many pages. However, she said the family member had been told that LE had their eye on someone, and it would be brought to a close soon. They were just gathering evidence. If that's true (BIG "if"), it would support your contention that people might have recognized him in Delphi.

No, but doubt all communications happened over open channels.

I understand you can't quote or paraphrase what leads you to your conclusion. Thanks for explaining. Wasn't trying to be argumentative.

Doesn't matter, anyway. Most of the relevant comments have been removed and discussion halted. There's little reason to check that thread right now. It's 25+ pages of people trying to download and play files, but unable to say anything about what they heard. Will likely be that way until at least Monday.

 

[Jax49]

I found it on one of the Abby & Libby FB sites. I only assume it is an ISP pic because it says INDIANA STATE POLICE on the bottom of it but you never know I guess because someone could have easily edited the pic and added ISP on it. I guess the WS mods don't want it on the site so that's why I only posted the one I changed the color to black & white on there...

It doesn't appear to be legit...MOO

 

[Yvettea]

The author claims in his post he altered the picture so it wasn't allowed per TOS. I apologize for quoting his post.

 

[Tricia]

Originally Posted by Fishtail115
I found it on one of the Abby & Libby FB sites. I only assume it is an ISP pic because it says INDIANA STATE POLICE on the bottom of it but you never know I guess because someone could have easily edited the pic and added ISP on it. I guess the WS mods don't want it on the site so that's why I only posted the one I changed the color to black & white on there...

This is why we do not allow pictures from other sites. It's been manipulated.

PLEASE EVERYONE IF YOU SEE A PICTURE NOT FROM A SOURCE APPROVED BY WEBSLEUTHS DO NOT RESPOND ONLY ALERT.

Thank you,
Tricia

 

[Bemused]

I think something happened minutes before the recording started. He might have already ordered them to march across the bridge or whatever it was he wanted. I believe that she was walking in front and stealthily turned and started videotaping. I don't believe that what we are seeing is the first interaction of the moment; I think there were several unaccounted for minutes before she started filming. And, heck, what we've seen might even be 5 minutes into the recording. We have no real context of when that video was shot.

I agree. We do not know many facts at all, and the wild speculation is not just how my brain is wired. I may be absolutely incorrect and am OK with saying so. I just can't dismiss the facts we do know.

 

[gitana1]

JMO but I don't think these 2 cases have anything to do with each other. The perp from TN has spent a lot of time grooming this girl and was way to busy with her to have decided to go to Delphi to murder Abbey and Libby.. JMO

Agreed. The type of predator who grooms a young girl he is in charge of and takes off is typically different from the kind who assaults and murders kidsnhe may not know.

I don't think "conditioning" of females accounts for these girls not running, especially not YOUNGER generation females, who are finally getting the message that they are to view themselves as equals, able, competent to do what they set their minds to, empowered with a voice, and so on. I'm not convinced that L and A's generation are taught to respect authority any more than boys would be.
IMO...I think we don't always go with our gut, period. I know that I get a "sixth sense" feeling about people, especially on first impressions. I repeatedly, over the years, have dismissed it, I hate feeling cynical. But I share observations with people close to me, dismiss, and then later I hear, "You were right about that." Example: saw our new neighbor (whom I had not formally met yet) on the side of his house one day, on his cell phone. It was mid afternoon, and I was passing my landing window as I turned and finished going upstairs. Saw him as I passed. Dh came home from work and I said, "The new neighbors are getting a divorce." He asked how I knew and I told him what I saw. He responded with dismissal, a bit of a snarky laugh, and I was left feeling cynical again. And then 2 months later, she told another neighbor she had filed for divorce. Sure, it could well be coincidence (I tell myself all the time, but then my hunches are accurate.)
My (sorry) long point is, I think we tend to naturally dismiss fear when we should be fully tapping into it. The book, "Protecting the Gift" (highly suggest reading it if you have kids) talks about this, not ignoring our inner voice regarding danger and fear. I think there is MORE to why they "didn't" run (has LE even stated that they know they tried/didn't try?) Everyone wants answers, no one more than the family. And we ALL want justice. And it's coming. I believe it will definitely be served.

I would love to see any evidence- not anecdote- that gender socialization has radically changed for the younger generation from earlier generations. Besides articles in Slate or Buzzfeed about mansaimimg and manspreading, what evidence is there that gender stratified socialization has changed?

I think about the recent all-female Ghost busters cast and how the venom and outrage from males were so threatened by the concept of females being heroes resulted in some of the worst threats of gender violence this nation has seen and actually effectively shut down the box office success of the film. An anecdote that supports the studies about gender socialization that continues today.

The whole point is that children are less likely to listen to their inner voice and respond appropriately, women are also less likely and female
children are the most least likely.