IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #49

[Reluctant1]

I do find the lack of references to Abby slightly odd.

I often wondered the same thing. I speculated that perhaps Abby's family wanted details more private in their early stages of shock and grief. This is just pure speculation on my part, but that rationalization made most sense to me. Something about the differences in LE discussion of the girls stood out in those early press conferences. I did notice how Libby's grandfather clarified the hero talk for both of them. I thought that was also very touching.


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[Eileen730]

They still would have had him driving to the TS, and likely drinking at the Pizza King, too, IMO.

But the pizza king beer was what over a week later.

 

[Deleted member 155000]

I have also wondered where Abby was during the recording.

Here's the thing. We don't really know when the recording began. It could've begun two full minutes before they showed the still from the bridge...and it could've gone on another thirty. We just don't know.

The police may have much more information on the suspect based on other things that happen in the video and they may be able to match some of it against tips coming in. I'm not giving up hope.

As for those asking how anyone could suspect RL, I remain on the fence about whether he has any connection though I don't suspect he is BG at this time. But if you review previous threads, people posed many scenarios and theories to justify why they didn't feel they could exclude him. Tricia, the owner of WS, actually interjected and noted RL can be sleuthed bc of the probable cause search warrant. If you don't understand that line of thinking, I would suggest you go back. Rehashing it all will put us at risk of having the thread closed down again (like it was that night).

The long and short of it is we all have different opinions and there's not enough info being released to be 100% sure who is right or wrong.


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[Bemused]

Probably true, but I don't think it would've taken much to get the warrant. Someone who worked at the TS could have called saying, "RL was here the day those girls went missing", and without them necessarily remembering the exact time, etc, it would have probably been enough, IMO.

IMO, the LEOs didn't waste more than ten hours searching for nothing or some vague tip, nor put on a sideshow for the media when they have a double homicide to solve.

 

[MHCH]

Thanks for the link. But there was a mother one that said phones. Maybe later I will find it. But thank you!

Anna spoke that evening to WLFI as well. If that helps.

 

[Eileen730]

I often wondered the same thing. I speculated that perhaps Abby's family wanted details more private in their early stages of shock and grief. This is just pure speculation on my part, but that rationalization made most sense to me. Something about the differences in LE discussion of the girls stood out in those early press conferences. I did notice how Libby's grandfather clarified the hero talk for both of them. I thought that was also very touching.


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I don't think Abby was heard on the video.

 

[asyousay]

I think it also comes from the fact that Libby's family has been more open with the media. As Abby's mom, Anna, has been very reserved. Both reactions totally reasonable when dealing with grief, especially considering the circumstances.

Exactly , everybody handles grief differently - I'm naturally really shy so my worst nightmare would be talking to the media in any shape or form and I would probably come across very badly.

 

[Sir WiggleBottom III]

I think the voices on the video are Libby's and the monster on the bridge.
I do think it's possible he pushed Abby off the bridge.

While I respect your opinion, I can't see him willingly lose control of the situation. Pushing one off the bridge leaves far to much out of his immediate control.

 

[jillycat]

I am simply trying to make sense of this. This is only a theory but one that makes more sense to me than anything else I've read. (It doesn't mean my theory is correct but maybe one to consider for a bit.)

Recently on WS there was a lovely woman missing. Her car was left in the middle of the road with the engine running.

Our sluethers (some of them) directly went to abduction. But what it turned out to be was she was trying to catch a neighbor's deaf dog and in doing so, she and the dog fell into the river and drowned.

So, I guess what I'm saying is some things (even though bad) aren't what they seem. I'm by no means a pedophile expert or an expert in murder or sexual assault. But is that what we really have here? Murder.... yes, of two young women. We don't know that they were unclothed or sexually assaulted. We don't know their COD.

Do I know anything for sure? Heck no, but neither does anyone else.
So by logic and thinking a bit outside of the box, this is what
I've come up with.



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For me the difference is that the FBI and its BAU wasn't called in on the case you referenced.

 

[MHCH]

Exactly , everybody handles grief differently - I'm naturally really shy so my worst nightmare would be talking to the media in any shape or form and I would probably come across very badly.

Same.

 

[Burnt Toast]

IMO, the LEOs didn't waste more than ten hours searching for nothing or some vague tip, nor put on a sideshow for the media when they have a double homicide to solve.

and wasn't it 40 some LE and FBI that were at the search? That is some serious man power.

 

[Burnt Toast]

Let me try and clear this up for you.


Always remember hardly anything on Websleuths is Black and White. Websleuths has lots of gray areas.


Rarely do police ever say someone is a suspect unless it is obvious like Bridge Guy.


What we have to do in certain cases is use our common sense.


Why did the police get a search warrant for RL the land owner where Abby and Libby's bodies were found?


Why did the police violate his parole? If someone could find a link verifying this. I will retract if I am incorrect.


Why was RL given over three years in prison for driving convictions?

Didn't the police say he was not cooperating? You have to wonder if there is a deal to be made with RL if he cooperates.


Is there anyone else the police are looking into that has anything close to the connection to the case like RL other than BG?


To get a search warrant for his house police needed probable cause.


As the owner of Websleuths, it is up to me to make these decisions about who can be discussed and who can't. I do so by following the Websleuths guidelines along with discussing among the mods and using common sense.


Here is another good example. The murder of Dr. Teresa Sievers.


Her husband Mark wasn't ever pointed out as a suspect until shortly before he was arrested. However, his behavior made it obvious he was hiding something. This is why early on Websleuths allowed Mark Sievers to be discussed as a suspect. Same with his friend Wayne.


We take each case on its merits.


In this case, because the police had probable cause for a search warrant members can sleuth RL ONLY. Not his family, not his friends. Also, we have stated over and over no one is saying he is guilty. If someone calls him a murderer please alert and we will remove.


So when a member feels like a guy that used to date Abby or Libby's mom kind of looks like BG and wants to sleuth him we say absolutely not.


RL owned the land the bodies were found on. We did not allow sleuthing him at this point at all. It was only when the police served the search warrant did we allow members to sleuth.


Police have said he is not a suspect. They said this before, during, and after the search warrant of RL's home.


You have to use common sense and go by what police have done in the past to make these decisions.


One more thing, we only allow the initials of RL. Why? So when someone Googles his name Websleuths won't come up.


However, you go to all the other sites on the Internet, and they are tearing RL apart, using his real name and sleuthing God knows what about his past.


At Websleuths we do our best to balance between letting you discuss and being sensitive to people's situations.


You will not find any other forum on the Internet that works harder than we do to be as fair as possible.


Remember, if it too much for you and you feel it's wrong no one is forcing you to stay.


Thank you,
Tricia

bumping

 

[Matlacha]

I am simply trying to make sense of this. This is only a theory but one that makes more sense to me than anything else I've read. (It doesn't mean my theory is correct but maybe one to consider for a bit.)

Recently on WS there was a lovely woman missing. Her car was left in the middle of the road with the engine running.

Our sluethers (some of them) directly went to abduction. But what it turned out to be was she was trying to catch a neighbor's deaf dog and in doing so, she and the dog fell into the river and drowned.

So, I guess what I'm saying is some things (even though bad) aren't what they seem. I'm by no means a pedophile expert or an expert in murder or sexual assault. But is that what we really have here? Murder.... yes, of two young women. We don't know that they were unclothed or sexually assaulted. We don't know their COD.

Do I know anything for sure? Heck no, but neither does anyone else.
So by logic and thinking a bit outside of the box, this is what
I've come up with.



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You make a good case about the woman who drowned trying to save the dog. But what makes something less sinister seem unlikely here is (1) clothes in the creek as reported by a local news photographer, (2) the items mentioned in the scanner thread, (3) the audio and or visuals from the phone that LE has reported, and most of all (4) LE saying that the officers who have seen/heard the phone evidence will never be able to get it out of their minds. There are rumors, supposedly from people with local knowledge, you can read about on other sites, but just the four things mentioned indicate something much worse than an accidental fall (or even intentional push) from the bridge.

 

[Deleted member 155000]

I don't think Abby was heard on the video.

Did you read this somewhere?


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[Bemused]

But the pizza king beer was what over a week later.

The murders on 2/13 and PK incident on 2/27.

 

[Sir WiggleBottom III]

You make a good case about the woman who drowned trying to save the dog. But what makes something less sinister seem unlikely here is (1) clothes in the creek as reported by a local news photographer, (2) the items mentioned in the scanner thread, (3) the audio and or visuals from the phone that LE has reported, and most of all (4) LE saying that the officers who have seen/heard the phone evidence will never be able to get it out of their minds. There are rumors, supposedly from people with local knowledge, you can read about on other sites, but just the four things mentioned indicate something much worse than an accidental fall (or even intentional push) from the bridge.

That blogger has zero inside information, I have read his tripe. Utter waste of time.

 

[Eileen730]

While I respect your opinion, I can't see him willingly lose control of the situation. Pushing one off the bridge leaves far to much out of his immediate control.

It looks like it's a long way down.

 

[asyousay]

I don't think Abby was heard on the video.

I was only 14 years of age 15 years ago so I can't Imagine either girls not talking to each other as big scary guy is coming toward them.

Add in the fact LE have said there had already been a interaction before that as well.

I am actually amazed that they didn't just run instead of recording him as why record when you can run.

 

[Elley Mae]

what makes you think that the "probable cause" search at his home, and the arrest for violating his probabtion was because he talked to media?

Him talking to media and saying where is was, driving.
As far as i am concerned the PC was/is bull pucky. They have run out of clues and searched his home as a last resort. Jmo

He told media he was gone the day they disappeared
He told media he was out the dY they were found.
LE knows he went to the dump and went out and had a beer at a pizza joint. Jmo

You never did say what lie he told.

 

[Sir WiggleBottom III]

Oh I agree, it's just leaving a lot to chance. BG couldn't know how either girl would react to other going over the bridge, run to her friend? run for help? freeze? Certainly scream. This seems meticulous to me, and there are a lot of variables in said situation. Sadly tho we have no idea yet.