IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #54

[WebSight]

Hi WebSight. I noticed with Snapchat that in order to record video, you have to press and hold down on the screen, and when you lift your finger it stops recording. Whereas, if I go to my camera and press the video button once, it will continue to record after I take my finger off (and continues to record). My pics/videos are stored on the Cloud but aren't shared with anyone, however, if someone had access to my account (e.g. LE, family with access to account?) they could get that information from the Cloud. Just speculating but I think when Libby took the video/audio that includes the suspect she was using the regular video on her phone (not Snapchat) and that it's possible it was saved to the Cloud and retrieved later by LE/family.

Thoughts?

Hi, Cloudajo!

The reason I do not believe that it was stored on any kind of cloud is because of the timing.

IMO, if what you are saying about access is correct, the family and/or LE would have been able to get access to all that info the night of the 13th. I would certainly think that the family would be handing over any account info to LE voluntarily for them to look at, especially as the night wore on. If they did access that video per a cloud then they would have known exactly what danger those girls would have been in. I then cannot see how LE would have then made a statement saying they had no reason to suspect that the girls were in any danger other than exposure to the elements.

So, the question for me becomes, if LE does have Libby's phone, why not just play the video? Perhaps the phone was damaged to a degree that made the video not playable, so experts in the field of extraction were brought in to get the video footage.

This is just my working theory, of course, and like everything, open to a better idea. :fence: Your thoughts?

 

[Idareyato]

FBI was on the scene immediately. I am going to trust they had the skills/equipment to do the thorough searching.
IMO

One thing we must consider is LE has stressed the importance of keeping evidence closed. One searcher or two found the bodies. If they are professional they kept it secret. At first Le stated 'By the way the bodies were found we suspect foul play'. Then they upgraded it to double-homicide. If perchance a resident or local discovered A and L, it is possible they may have disclosed information beyond the limit, and had to recant what was spoken. How rumors get started and why verification is impossible. Surely the ones that located L and A were told to keep their mouths shut, but we are all human. See my point about remaining opinionated? We can prove nothing ourselves without LE's approval.

 

[Idareyato]

The reason I do not believe that it was stored on any kind of cloud is because of the timing.

IMO, if what you are saying about access is correct, the family and/or LE would have been able to get access to all that info the night of the 13th. I would certainly think that the family would be handing over any account info to LE voluntarily for them to look at, especially as the night wore on. If they did access that video per a cloud then they would have known exactly what danger those girls would have been in. I then cannot see how LE would have then made a statement saying they had no reason to suspect that the girls were in any danger other than exposure to the elements.

So, the question for me becomes, if LE does have Libby's phone, why not just play the video? Perhaps the phone was damaged to a degree that made the video not playable, so experts in the field of extraction were brought in to get the video footage.

This is just my working theory, of course, and like everything, open to a better idea. :fence: Your thoughts?

I believe the LE are covering that piece of evidence so it cannot be proven one way or the other. Yet I still feel they found the phone, but they don't want to clue how sloppy the killer was. Also the idea of losing a vital piece of evidence scared me from the beginning. What if they had the phone and it disappeared? What if the copy couldn't be played a second time? Protection of evidence is a qualifying theme either way one looks at it.

 

[michael.gartley]

Most people understand that images are displayed using 3 color bands, R (red), G(green), and B(blue). You can separate a color image into 3 grayscale images, one representing the brightness of each color. Example below shows each color intensity extracted from the original BG image from ISP.

However, the way MOST JPG images store the data is in an alternate color space called YCbCr. Extracting the image brightness in Y Cb and Cr looks like the image below

One of the reasons JPG images have small file sizes is because they purposely store the color information (Cb and Cr) at low spatial resolution than the pure brightness information (Y).

OPINION: My opinion is that it is not possible to know the color of BG's eyes from ISP supplied images of BG due to the low spatial resolution of the color information contained in both. However, I encourage you to think make up your own mind

I apologize for the 'instructional' nature of my posts, however I am trying to educate others as well as inform for future research investigations.

P.S. A nice, fully-featured (and free!) Windows program for extracting the color information is called Gimp and easy to find on the web, that is what I used to create above figures

 

[Burnt Toast]

I hate to say this but my teen daughter felt that the phone was meant to be found, as were the girls.

She also doesn't believe that they were even covered with leaves. Her theory is that you either leave them to be found or you bury them so that they are never found.

your daughter thinks he left both audio and video of himself behind on purpose? I think it more plausible that he either took the phone, or broke the phone not knowing that what was on it could be recovered.

 

[Burnt Toast]

That is true. But on that afternoon/early evening, one of the officers on scanner stated last seen at the High Bridge.

Also, it could possibly mean a generic name for that genera area, trails included.

Perhaps the audio or video ended at the end of the bridge..."down the hill". that would make their last known location as the bridge.

 

[otto]

It cannot be ruled out. My opinion is they were found where they were left, and the perpetrator got scared off before he could finish all he wanted to do. But the area was searched that first night by flashlight, at least cursorily. People were beginning to doubt and have fears by midnight. The killer holds a trump card and can laugh by saying, 'No it wasn't hat way at all.' when one small detail could be astray. Therefore let us consider everything.

BBM

The girls were found 50 feet from the creek less than 24 hours after the abduction. The suspect had the girls under his control at 2:30, and there was no official search until 5:30. If searchers were in the area near the girls bodies (which we don't know), it was after 5:30.

Two to three hours is probably all the suspect wanted, and he was probably gone before the sun set on Feb 13. I doubt that anything scared him off.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Most people understand that images are displayed using 3 color bands, R (red), G(green), and B(blue). You can separate a color image into 3 grayscale images, one representing the brightness of each color. Example below shows each color intensity extracted from the original BG image from ISP.

However, the way MOST JPG images store the data is in an alternate color space called YCbCr. Extracting the image brightness in Y Cb and Cr looks like the image below

One of the reasons JPG images have small file sizes is because they purposely store the color information (Cb and Cr) at low spatial resolution than the pure brightness information (Y).

OPINION: My opinion is that it is not possible to know the color of BG's eyes from ISP supplied images of BG due to the low spatial resolution of the color information contained in both. However, I encourage you to think make up your own mind

I apologize for the 'instructional' nature of my posts, however I am trying to educate others as well as inform for future research investigations.

P.S. A nice, fully-featured (and free!) Windows program for extracting the color information is called Gimp and easy to find on the web, that is what I used to create above figures

If possible I would like to hear in short form how to create a full pic of 2 layers. I have one layer with the brighter half of BG's face and a second layer with the mirrored half face. I want to join the halfs to get a full face. But I'm too stupid and don't find the function on Gimp. (Have played around several hours already.)
I think it will originate some monster face though I would like to try.

 

[otto]

Most people understand that images are displayed using 3 color bands, R (red), G(green), and B(blue). You can separate a color image into 3 grayscale images, one representing the brightness of each color. Example below shows each color intensity extracted from the original BG image from ISP.


However, the way MOST JPG images store the data is in an alternate color space called YCbCr. Extracting the image brightness in Y Cb and Cr looks like the image below


One of the reasons JPG images have small file sizes is because they purposely store the color information (Cb and Cr) at low spatial resolution than the pure brightness information (Y).

OPINION: My opinion is that it is not possible to know the color of BG's eyes from ISP supplied images of BG due to the low spatial resolution of the color information contained in both. However, I encourage you to think make up your own mind

I apologize for the 'instructional' nature of my posts, however I am trying to educate others as well as inform for future research investigations.

P.S. A nice, fully-featured (and free!) Windows program for extracting the color information is called Gimp and easy to find on the web, that is what I used to create above figures

Thanks! Interesting. The original police photo is CMYK mode.

 

[otto]

If possible I would like to hear in short form how to create a full pic of 2 layers. I have one layer with the brighter half of BG's face and a second layer with the mirrored half face. I want to join the halfs to get a full face. But I'm too stupid and don't find the function on Gimp. (Have played around several hours already.)
I think it will originate some monster face though I would like to try.

In Photoshop you would use a mask ... does your software have that feature?

 

[BoggLed in Ohio]

BBM

The girls were found 50 feet from the creek less than 24 hours after the abduction. The suspect had the girls under his control at 2:30, and there was no official search until 5:30. If searchers were in the area near the girls bodies (which we don't know), it was after 5:30.

Two to three hours is probably all the suspect wanted, and he was probably gone before the sun set on Feb 13. I doubt that anything scared him off.

I respectfully disagree..we have no way of knowing. And it could have been something as simple as a deer or other wildlife making noise that made BG startle and flee, thinking it was people approaching.

 

[michael.gartley]

If possible I would like to hear in short form how to create a full pic of 2 layers. I have one layer with the brighter half of BG's face and a second layer with the mirrored half face. I want to join the halfs to get a full face. But I'm too stupid and don't find the function on Gimp. (Have played around several hours already.)
I think it will originate some monster face though I would like to try.

Ha. It does create a strange looking face, therefore I won't share mine.

Here's what you could do:
1) R-key (to draw a rectangular selection of left side of face)
2) Edit->Copy (copy selection to clipboard)
3) Edit->Paste (paste selection onto current image, keeping it selected)
4) Drag the new selection to the other side of the face
5) Shift-F (to flip horizontal) and click inside selection once cursor shows double sided horiz. arrow

Looks weird though ;-) cause the face of looking down at an angle and the brightness differences etc.

Warning, I am not much of an artist when it comes to editing stuff like you asked, so there are likely many better ways to do a better job than what I layed out

 

[Ember123]

They also searched inside the home ijn BBR. They can be seen taking photos inside the in the news reel.

did bbroad have something delivered feb 13 and called LE?

 

[Deleted member 102539]

BBM

The girls were found 50 feet from the creek less than 24 hours after the abduction. The suspect had the girls under his control at 2:30, and there was no official search until 5:30. If searchers were in the area near the girls bodies (which we don't know), it was after 5:30.

Two to three hours is probably all the suspect wanted, and he was probably gone before the sun set on Feb 13. I doubt that anything scared him off.

Maybe, he only wanted a warmer place at a day in February and maybe, he wanted more time to spend with his victims than only a few hours until dawn? If his car or a known shed (or both) were nearby he didn't need to hurry with the ultimate goal (to have no witnesses).

 

[michael.gartley]

Thanks! Interesting. The original police photo is CMYK mode.

Yeah! Even more interesting is that different software programs convert the CMYK into RGB differently. Notably for me, the color temperature and contrast varies significantly between importing into MS PowerPoint, displaying in Google Chrome and loading into Gimp!

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Ha. It does create a strange looking face, therefore I won't share mine.

Here's what you could do:
1) R-key (to draw a rectangular selection of left side of face)
2) Edit->Copy (copy selection to clipboard)
3) Edit->Paste (paste selection onto current image, keeping it selected)
4) Drag the new selection to the other side of the face
5) Shift-F (to flip horizontal) and click inside selection once cursor shows double sided horiz. arrow

Looks weird though ;-) cause the face of looking down at an angle and the brightness differences etc.

Warning, I am not much of an artist when it comes to editing stuff like you asked, so there are likely many better ways to do a better job than what I layed out

Thank you so much, I will try! Yes, my half face already doesn't look very advantageous in the sense of beauty.

 

[2Hope4]

CATCH THE KILLER NOW PLEASE!!!!!!!!! :tantrum: Whether targeted or not, there is at least one person that is capable of murder running loose!

 

[Matlacha]

You and idareyato are probably right. I gave Getty too much credit in thinking it was something more than just another interesting photo.

(Quote concerned a broken stick and footprint in the Getty video).

Yes, the credits for the Getty video show it was recorded by Ana Burkart, WXIN (which is Fox59 or part of it). So almost certainly this was shot for local news, then uploaded to Getty (along with numerous other Burkart videos on many subjects) as part of regular stock footage arrangement. Doesn't make it less interesting (it shows the steep terrain and relatively heavy flow of the creek at that time, which makes wading the creek seem less likely to me), but it isn't a forensic video.

 

[otto]

I respectfully disagree..we have no way of knowing. And it could have been something as simple as a deer or other wildlife making noise that made BG startle and flee, thinking it was people approaching.

He took the girls to a quiet isolated location to ensure that he wouldn't be disturbed. He had a minimum of 3 hours before the search started at the North end of the park and more time before searchers were looking in the creek area. We don't know when he committed the second murder and left the area, but given that he has not been arrested it's a safe bet that he had time to scan the area to ensure that nothing was left behind.

My understanding is that most victims of this type of abduction are murdered within two hours of abduction. This suspect had at least three hours before the alarm was sounded, suggesting that he was not rushed by anyone for any reason.

 

[otto]

Yeah! Even more interesting is that different software programs convert the CMYK into RGB differently. Notably for me, the color temperature and contrast varies significantly between importing into MS PowerPoint, displaying in Google Chrome and loading into Gimp!

The software program should have options to choose color settings. In Photoshop, the color setting is applied based on intended use.