IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #56

[WebSight]

That could certainly fit the "supposed to be" angle imo.

In fact, the more I think about it, it makes sense although it is just speculation.

Mike Patty also said that if Libby agreed to be somewhere at a certain time, then she would be there.

LE stating that the family member was supposed to pick them up between 3-3:30 would be reiterating the original agreement, meaning Libby (and Abby) didn't show for a prearranged pick up time.

If LE believed that the girls never got a text that changed the meeting time then LE would fall back on what was supposed to take place, not what actually happened, and measure the girls actions by that.

Pure speculation again but it is working for me.:thinking:

 

[whiskers]

Can anyone refresh my memory about what date an officer was flagged down with a supposed tip? TIA

I believe it was in another town, but not too terribly far away. And I *think* it happened either last Friday or Saturday. It happened after an Indiana station aired a story about the girls.

 

[Bently]

Supposed to be picked up?

That's normal vernacular, for some of us who speak that way, saying there was an understanding she was to be picked up but was not.

:moo:

 

[Shiressleuth]

The girls were to be picked up by a sister between 3 or 330.

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Thanks Owl. Did the sister turn up at that time dyk?

 

[WebSight]

I see many are speculating about poor cell reception. Early on in the threads both #1nana and Illinoismissing I believe went out there and walked the bridge and trails and said that the cell reception was actually very good. So I think we can put that to rest moo


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Thanks, ab, I forgot. That's one hole in my theory.

Still there are other logical reasons to not answer a text right. this. minute.

If you have always lived a safe life and have no reason to think otherwise, not getting an answer right away may not concern you.

 

[Brighty]

Yes. Any cell phone regardless of whether it has an active account should be able to dial 911. 911 calls have priority so even in a situation where a cell tower is at capacity other calls will be dropped so that 911 call can go through.

If you are in a area with no cell coverage with no towers close enough or terrain blocks service no calls will go through, not even 911. You have to be in a service area. You are correct that the phone should allow 911 calls even if there is no active service account for the phone if you are in an area with service; though I have been told this is no longer true of some of the newer Iphones but don't know about that.

 

[WebSight]

The girls were to be picked up by a sister between 3 or 330.

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Hmmm, now I am getting mixed up because I thought that it was the sister that dropped them off and they were to supposed to be picked up by a "family member?"

Off to find some early news reports :findinglink: on the media thread.

 

[JudgeJudi]

Unfortunately I’m unable to Reply With Quote as I have many issues on WS at the moment, however I’d very much like to reply to Mtnslite’s post #296

RSBM
"In my experience, the less LE says and the fewer details about a case they offer, the more confident they are in solving it. I suppose that is why I am hesitantly optimistic about the solvability of this case. I am not in LE but for many years I was the ghost writer for a private detective that was frequently hired by both private citizens and LE for both missing persons' cases and murders so I've been around a lot. (Plus, I just flat out watch a lot of TV. ) I've seen MANY cases where LE has had a strong opinion about "who did it" and even had DNA, but there just wasn't enough to make them feel confident about going to trial so they spent years building a stronger case.I suppose that is why I haven't been too worried about wanting more details released. I mean, I want them released on a selfish level. I selfishly want to know more details because my sleuthing mind wants to put the case together and solve it. My logical mind knows that I have to be content in being satisfied with what I get and letting my imagination run freely.

My own personal theory is that this case is probably much less complicated than I originally thought it to be. I believe it was random only in who the victims were. I think it was planned in some sense, but perhaps only in that BG became unhinged and was out that day to relieve his frustration. I think he might have been capable of hurting just about anyone and, unfortunately, Abby and Libby got in his path. I think he either lives in the Delphi area or he used to live there and was visiting. I believe he knew the park, knew the trails, and had walked on the bridge in the past. I think it's possible he has a history of violence but not necessarily a record of such. And I believe the crime happened very quickly. My opinion is that one of the girls (probably Libby) was killed almost right away. Perhaps he meant to take Abby with him but they put up a much bigger fight than he was expecting so he killed her there as well.I don't know about SA, but I think it's possible. It doesn't actually take much time to commit SA. I know from personal experience. I can see and understand the theory of taking them away and bringing them back to the place where their bodies were found, but I honestly believe that is too complicated a theory. I think they were simply missed on the 13th. I know there are lots of other theories out there about the girls being removed, one still living until the 14th, etc. but I am not putting stock into any of those until I see information straight from a reputable source (reputable meaning either LE or a parent/grandparent's mouth)”.

Thank you for your excellent post mtnlites and I agree with much of what you say, in particular the first paragraph. I spent almost half my working life with a secretive law enforcement agency and I’m familiar with a lot of what goes on in a big investigation. I can understand why everyone wants LE to give out more information and that’s a normal reaction, especially in a case like this. But like you and everyone else here, I too would like to know more, but I am prepared to wait.

On the subject of DNA testing, perhaps people don’t appreciate that it actually rules possible suspects out far more than nailing a person.

Because DNA testing isn't the exact science most people think it is, e.g. 1 in untold hundreds of millions, it is usually used in conjunction with other corroborating evidence in criminal trials.

DNA samples are easily contaminated both prior to and during testing. Here's an easy to read article and excellent video regarding DNA and criminal trials that explains this further.

https://phys.org/news/2015-10-easy-d...ime-scene.html

It’s always possible that LE don’t have a suspect in mind, but if they do, LE are behaving exactly as I would expect them to.

 

[Shiressleuth]

That's normal vernacular, for some of us who speak that way, saying there was an understanding she was to be picked up but was not.

:moo:

Thanks for that. I'm getting there. By she do you mean they?

 

[MistyWaters]

I don't know her initials, but that's probably her. Yes, I'd like to know if any of the people she saw that day have actually come forward or been identified. I don't blame her either for keeping a low profile. However, as a whole, Delphi has been incredibly quiet.

They have been very quiet but I'm willing to bet it's a very serious topic amongst themselves. My experience in having lived in various small communities is that a large percentage are closely connected either through blood, marriage, work or school even though it may not appear so to the casual eye. If the perpetrator was local, I believe he'd be arrested by now. Another thing, the reward keeps growing. That suggests to me it's someone from the outside, although possibly one who had previous connections.

That local people haven't been successful in providing information that's been successful in leading to an arrest by now, in my opinion, is not a good indication that an arrest is looming, considering the high level LE involvement as well.


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[DeDee]

Not that I've heard of honestly. Nevermind, probably just got carried away hunting for something new. I will say that the search warrant is sealed, the local police have been shut out of the investigation and the residents of the city have been told absolutely nothing. Again, probably zero connection to Abbey and Libby and more likely an embezzlement of funds sort of thing. Back to pictures of BG I guess.

I've been in dark rabbit holes for days. Climbing out for fresh air.
What is this about embezzlement? TIA
What is this about local police being shut out of the investigation? What investigation? TIA

Will leave this here and let members decide its importance or lack thereof.

The local news ran the story on the biker fundraising ride. There is a video tribute to Abigail but not for Liberty. http://www.clintoncountydailynews.co...bby-and-libby/

http://kokomoperspective.com/kp/new...cle_73b7f32c-2f56-11e7-a9c1-537b21a4ae7c.html
^^^ From the article: "As the police worked the investigation, thousands of tips have come in relating to the case as police searched for a man depicted in a photograph taken by Libby with her cellphone the day she died." [she not they]

 

[MistyWaters]

And the girls didn't show up but the pick up did.. Yep that would work too.

The missing persons call went in at 5:30pm iirc. That the families reported their disappearance within only 2 hours, in my opinion, demonstrates an extremely conscientious concern.

Many of us who have lived with teenagers know all too well that many of them don't run by the clock if they happen to get together with friends.


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[Shiressleuth]

Thanks, ab, I forgot. That's one hole in my theory.

Still there are other logical reasons to not answer a text right. this. minute.

If you have always lived a safe life and have no reason to think otherwise, not getting an answer right away may not concern you.

And getting abducted is one good reason you may not be able to answer texts - a horrifying thought.

 

[Brighty]

If we knew for sure that LE recovered DNA from both cases, then we would know if they were committed by the same person. LE knows if they're connected, if they have that DNA. If one case is missing DNA evidence, then it would be difficult to connect them, until there's a suspect in one that could be placed in the area of the other at the right time.


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I have been kicking around the idea there were 2 murderers in the case in Iowa, am wondering if one of them decided to act again on his own this time? Then the DNA may not match if not from the same person at each scene. I know it sounds like I am reaching.

 

[Shiressleuth]

The missing persons call went in at 5:30pm iirc. That the families reported their disappearance within only 2 hours, in my opinion, demonstrates an extremely conscientious concern.

Many of us who have lived with teenagers know all too well that many of them don't run by the clock if they happen to get together with friends.


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Not just teenagers either I would add. It does seem to me the hours between 2 and 3.30 hold the key assuming texts went unanswered after that time if our speculations are correct imo.

 

[jillybean51]

I read early on who specifically was picking them up. Looking for a link for you, but having a hard time....

ETA: I can't find a link, may have read it on SM. Sorry.

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I remember seeing it as well. Will do some digging.....


Always my opinion only [emoji230]

 

[Brighty]

I think from the early references to Delphi Investigators talking to Iowa Detectives and the subsequent nationwide billboards it is apparent that they have been looking for a serial killer from the beginning. Jmo

I agree, and I seem to remember one LE saying this was really different or something like that. Alarm bells went off for me then for sure.

 

[tokyorose]

I've been in dark rabbit holes for days. Climbing out for fresh air.
What is this about embezzlement? TIA
What is this about local police being shut out of the investigation? What investigation? TIA

Will leave this here and let members decide its importance or lack thereof.

There was a fire chief in South Dakota abruptly fired less than a month after announcing his retirement. His home has been searched ( warrant is sealed) the local police have been shut out of the investigation, he has not been arrested, and residents of the city have been told absolutely nothing. Investigation is being handles by DCI. I will probably get in trouble for not having a link but story is widely searchable. Zero evidence he has any ties to Indiana, as I said probably an embezzlement issue but I am tired of pictures of BG ( I know scroll and roll)

 

[BoggLed in Ohio]

There was a fire chief in South Dakota abruptly fired less than a month after announcing his retirement. His home has been searched ( warrant is sealed) the local police have been shut out of the investigation, he has not been arrested, and residents of the city have been told absolutely nothing. Investigation is being handles by DCI. I will probably get in trouble for not having a link but story is widely searchable. Zero evidence he has any ties to Indiana, as I said probably an embezzlement issue but I am tired of pictures of BG ( I know scroll and roll)

http://www.ksfy.com/content/news/Se...home-of-Sioux-Falls-fire-chief-421068233.html

 

[BoggLed in Ohio]

There was a fire chief in South Dakota abruptly fired less than a month after announcing his retirement. His home has been searched ( warrant is sealed) the local police have been shut out of the investigation, he has not been arrested, and residents of the city have been told absolutely nothing. Investigation is being handles by DCI. I will probably get in trouble for not having a link but story is widely searchable. Zero evidence he has any ties to Indiana, as I said probably an embezzlement issue but I am tired of pictures of BG ( I know scroll and roll)

Link here for this story, i dont see anything pointing towards any connection, and jeebus please i hope this doesnt mean we will start seeing fire fighting apparatuses as part of BGs attire in pics now :gasp:

http://www.ksfy.com/content/news/Se...home-of-Sioux-Falls-fire-chief-421068233.html