IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #58

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MOTORUNNER said:
I know there's thousands of tips and so many people living in Flora, but the tip i sent in about a man I saw who had a likeness to BG lives in Flora... I know it's a long shot of having anything to do with it, but i'm interested...
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I sent in a similar tip with the Flora connection 6 weeks ago. You just never know.
 
mtnlites said:
I sent in a similar tip with the Flora connection 6 weeks ago. You just never know.
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After seeing some pictures of the locals at the reclaiming of the bridge walk, I've decided that a lot of locals look like BG. That could complicate things in my opinion because they can't just get DNA from every Joe on the street unless they volunteer. When someone doesn't volunteer I wonder if it makes LE look sideways?

At any rate some posted up thread that a cheek swab was done from a local Flora guy so LE clearly hasn't ruled out locals it seems (if that was done recently).

ETA - and have the similar jackets.
 
LaneGirl said:
After seeing some pictures of the locals at the reclaiming of the bridge walk, I've decided that a lot of locals look like BG. That could complicate things in my opinion because they can't just get DNA from every Joe on the street unless they volunteer. When someone doesn't volunteer I wonder if it makes LE look sideways?

At any rate some posted up thread that a cheek swab was done from a local Flora guy so LE clearly hasn't ruled out locals it seems (if that was done recently).

ETA - and have the similar jackets.
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JMO I think this swab cheek person is a POI
 
asyousay said:
I can not see a professional hitman leaving the phones behind imo
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I have a hunch that he left the phone/s there intentionally. I have no reason to feel this other than the fact that he could not have overlooked that since cell phones are so ubiquitous these days, particularly for kids that age. No doubt Libby was on the bridge filming quite a bit, so he knew about the phone. I think he left it or them behind as a message.

The above is just my opinion.
 
Confusion said:
I've probably just been spending too much time in the image thread, but something new came to mind today. I wonder if Libby took a lot of pictures with people in the background, or if she stuck to mainly photographing nature and people she knew. Is it possible that she may have taken a picture of him at some point in the past that might be clearer than the stills from the video? Whether he's a local or not, he almost has to have spent some time there in order to navigate well enough to get to the bridge, get the girls to where they were found, murder them and get out of there without being seen and/or leaving anything that obviously points to him.

Of course, even if she did take one or more picture of him, he may look nothing like those we have if he's in different clothes and/or a different location. I just thought if they found a photo of him on her camera or Cloud, someone else might remember when it was taken and be able to say who was there. Another long shot, but I'm trying not to just keep repeating the same ideas over and over.

MOO
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What a great idea!
 
LaneGirl said:
After seeing some pictures of the locals at the reclaiming of the bridge walk, I've decided that a lot of locals look like BG. That could complicate things in my opinion because they can't just get DNA from every Joe on the street unless they volunteer. When someone doesn't volunteer I wonder if it makes LE look sideways?

At any rate some posted up thread that a cheek swab was done from a local Flora guy so LE clearly hasn't ruled out locals it seems (if that was done recently).

ETA - and have the similar jackets.
Click to expand...

RBBM

The article was from February.
 
I'd like to see the actual mathematical probability of them NOT being related. If you look further, aside from the things that are commonly stated about these cases( the dates, 2 young female victims at same time, location where bodies were found, etc), there are also details NOT so well publicized, if you take the time to dig into things. My opinion is that a)there may not have been enough available evidence in the Iowa case to determine numerous aspects of the crime(due to state of decomposition), and b) I also don't believe LE(especially FBI) would say even if they felt fairly certain that there was a connection. They wouldn't want to spark hysteria(especially when already contending with various witch hunts wrt the Delphi case), and they wouldn't want the suspect to know what they know. JMO
JLSChook said:
Let me try this again....

Great post, Ellie. I agree.
Although LE says there is no evidence between this crime and the Iowa cousins, doesn't mean they're not connected. I think there's a big possibility that is so.

I also believe this is the very reason BG hasn't been identified/arrested yet.
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<modsnip>


I'm sorry, maybe I was misunderstood. Maybe I worded it wrong. I don't typically follow crimes that happen on the other side of the country. That's all that I meant by saying that I have taken an unusual interest in this case.

You're right, there's nothing "usual" or "typical" about this case. I would say that going back to very first thread on WS, a month after it happened and reading every single post, which took hours and hours BTW, is taking an unusual interest.

Also, I'm not at all "blaming" locals per se, I just think this is a local issue, meaning that it's a small town problem that was ultimately the cause of their deaths.

I appreciate that you disagree with my theory. But afterall, it's my theory. Either you sign on or don't. I just wanted to share what I thought.

Thanks,
 
GMF3 said:
I'm sorry, maybe I was misunderstood. Maybe I worded it wrong. I don't typically follow crimes that happen on the other side of the country. That's all that I meant by saying that I have taken an unusual interest in this case.

You're right, there's nothing "usual" or "typical" about this case. I would say that going back to very first thread on WS, a month after it happened and reading every single post, which took hours and hours BTW, is taking an unusual interest.

Also, I'm not at all "blaming" locals per se, I just think this is a local issue, meaning that it's a small town problem that was ultimately the cause of their deaths.

I appreciate that you disagree with my theory. But afterall, it's my theory. Either you sign on or don't. I just wanted to share what I thought.

Thanks,
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Im so glad ur here and enjoy reading ur theories it's a breath of fresh air
 
tuffgongc9 said:
First post and just my opinion with a couple things to think about. IMO this was a SK or at least a random professional opportunity kill. Random. He could have been familiar with the area, but I am 99.99% positive that BG is not anywhere near local. He would have been found immediately. He was unknowingly recorded in video and audio and even if the photos are grainy there is a lot of information. His physical appearance & size, his clothes, his posture, his gait, his voice, etc. The FBI have unbelievable technological resources. Probably tech that isn't even available to the public. I believe investigators ruled out the likelihood of him being local within a few days. If they suspected he was local would the FBI have launched 6000 digital billboards in 46 states 10 days after the killings? I wonder if they have ever taken such broad action when the suspect ended up being local? Maybe it's protocol for all murders or abductions with certain criteria. Perhaps this could be figured out with some appropriate research. Unless it was a massive diversionary tactic to make a potential local suspect feel more at ease or had no credible leads at the time then I think they realized they guy was probably long gone before the bodies were even found.

I really want to to know the answer to one question. Was the area where the bodies were found searched on 2/13 or very early 2/14? I realize we probably don't have this info, but it seems improbable to me that they didn't find the bodies initially. Where the bodies were found from where the BG photo was taken was not far at all. It seems like less than 1000 feet. At the end of this bridge is the short but steep embankment on the left that leads to the private road where 'down the hill' was very likely recorded. Once down here the bridge is up to the left and the creek is straight ahead. Once you get up to the creek you can literally see the area where they were found across the way although it is upstream maybe a couple hundred feet. The searchers knew where they were initially headed via at least one snapchat image. If I were a searcher, one the first plausible scenarios would have been an accident and possible fall off the bridge. I think searchers were probably at the SW end where the abduction took place immediately. Once you're here you're very close to the bodies and if they were there all along, but weren't across the stream, they would have been found immediately. You would think there would be evidence of a struggle or maybe a foot print in the mud once they were here. I don't know, it just seems unlikely that they weren't found if there all along. I realize they may have been hidden or camouflaged and the perp could have covered his tracks. Still, if we knew for sure that area was searched and they were not there then that opens up a huge can of worms.
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This is the first crude drawing I made, on my cell phone, of the possible path taken. From the opposite, NW end of the bridge, to the crime scene (around bends in the creek) is about a 1400 foot or so walk. The distance from the SE end (the red line I drew on the Google satellite map) is only 600 feet, give or take. The CS cannot be easily seen from the bridge, in fact the topography might help to obscure it some, although according to a MSM video from early on the bridge can be seen from the edge of the creek, below where the girls were found. It appears to me a section of the bridge could have been easily seen from the general area of the CS that day.

Far as the search, early on virtually nobody believed they were in danger, according to MSM reports and searchers. So after darkness fell, nobody thought, or very few people may have thought, they were in danger. So there was no urgency.

From the area of the bridge that crosses the creek, they could not have been seen, according to maps shared here since the beginning, MSM videos, etc. MOO is the searchers were looking around the area of the bridge, initially. By the time they got to RL's place darkness had fallen.

I don't think the girls would have been seen, early on, considering where they were found. There was no urgency, and there was no way to determine which direction they went in. I highly doubt any searchers thought early on they came off the SE end, down the hill, across the road and somewhat wooded area, and across the creek. From the SE end, despite the close proximity to where they were found, the scene is obscured, and the hill/embankment between the CS and the cemetery would have provided more concealment, it messes with the line-of-sight. In low light the searchers may have been able to see something from an area 100 feet or so off and below the bridge, with binoculars, but that might even be a stretch.

The SnapChat image of Abby was shared on SM quite a few hours after last contact was made with them, so during that time there was no frame of reference as to where they went or were heading towards, at any time they were out there. Did the searchers know there was a picture of Abby from 2:07 PM on the bridge? We don't know.

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GMF3 said:
I'm sorry, maybe I was misunderstood. Maybe I worded it wrong. I don't typically follow crimes that happen on the other side of the country. That's all that I meant by saying that I have taken an unusual interest in this case.

You're right, there's nothing "usual" or "typical" about this case. I would say that going back to very first thread on WS, a month after it happened and reading every single post, which took hours and hours BTW, is taking an unusual interest.

Also, I'm not at all "blaming" locals per se, I just think this is a local issue, meaning that it's a small town problem that was ultimately the cause of their deaths.

I appreciate that you disagree with my theory. But afterall, it's my theory. Either you sign on or don't. I just wanted to share what I thought.

Thanks,
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No problem. We all want the same thing for the families. I hope they can find some peace after this case is resolved. Sorry for the mental gymnastics but there is a lot of passion for justice and I know you have that too!
 
mtnlites said:
Are we allowed to post links to the basement? I don't mind sharing, I just don't want to get in trouble.
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Yes, you can post a link to the scanner thread to help another poster find that thread. Just remember that all scanner thread discussion needs to stay in the scanner thread and cannot be discussed in this thread.
 
liltexans said:
Yes, you can post a link to the scanner thread to help another poster find that thread. Just remember that all scanner thread discussion needs to stay in the scanner thread and cannot be discussed in this thread.
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sorry but I'm new.. what is the scanner thread??
 
GMF3 said:
<modsnip>


I'm sorry, maybe I was misunderstood. Maybe I worded it wrong. I don't typically follow crimes that happen on the other side of the country. That's all that I meant by saying that I have taken an unusual interest in this case.

You're right, there's nothing "usual" or "typical" about this case. I would say that going back to very first thread on WS, a month after it happened and reading every single post, which took hours and hours BTW, is taking an unusual interest.

Also, I'm not at all "blaming" locals per se, I just think this is a local issue, meaning that it's a small town problem that was ultimately the cause of their deaths.

I appreciate that you disagree with my theory. But afterall, it's my theory. Either you sign on or don't. I just wanted to share what I thought.

Thanks,
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I agree with your theory and have been following this thread from Day 1. I came to WS bc a high school alum was a POI in the murder of his stepdaughter and this is the only other case I have followed. Why? No clue? Did I spend three plus hours today sleuthing SM rumors and POIs? ...Yes. Perhaps it's the loss of innocence of this case. Who knows what draws us...

I think the KISS theory could very well apply to this case. We're all just going around and around, grasping at straws and trying to find anything that will bring this case to conclusion and give these girls and their families justice.

Thank you for your post and I hope you'll stay on and continue giving your opinion!
 
mtnlites said:
For anyone else interested in the fire, take a trip to the basement and scanner feed from posts made about a month ago. Just don't discuss your findings up here.
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Which scanner thread? and in Libby and Abby's there is a ref to a JW, oddly there is a JW that was photo'd in relation to the Flora fire....Not accusing, not pointing fingers, just an odd coincidence, and this case seems to reek of 'em. Is there a thread for Ms. Rose and the loss of her girls?
 
liltexans said:
Yes, you can post a link to the scanner thread to help another poster find that thread. Just remember that all scanner thread discussion needs to stay in the scanner thread and cannot be discussed in this thread.
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O/T--I know I said it privately already, but CONGRATS, liltexans! They couldn't have made a better choice. :)
 
Spiritecho said:
You can go downstairs and see what others are posting in relation to police scanners. We can not discuss them up here.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...KING-NEWS!!!-Current-Scanner-Alerts-7/page956

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...ty-German-and-Abigail-Williams-Scanner-Thread
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Because I want to learn, and be a good citizen here, I would like to ask what the reasoning is for not being able to discuss here what is said there. TIA!


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