IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #70

[apples12]

Holding my breath here like a lot of you. At the same time I'm reminded of at least two prior possibilities that social media ran with, convinced that Libby and Abby's murderer had finally been identified.

While I wait, I have a question about the hatchet: Some of you feel that the hatchet is (possibly) involved in the murders in that DN (if he's the perp) may have used one on them. But if DN did murder Tim Watkins then he used a .22 cal rifle, not a hatchet.

How do y'all reconcile his use of a hatchet to threaten people to his using a rifle to actually kill someone? Again, that is assuming he killed TW. I'm just curious as I have no answers to there being two different weapons.

I've been following this case since the beginning and each time I log on I hope to see "arrest" in the title. It must be so hurtful and frustrating for Libby's and Abby's families to wake up each day not knowing what happened to these precious girls. For their sake I hope the case is about to blow open.

Being RSO convicted of exhibitionism, DN would likely use phallic aggressive methods against females and would use a different method for males. Exhibitionists target vulnerable, young women mainly...those who can be relegated to confusion, fear, regression...in the face of a "phallic" attack (in this case penis and axe/hatchet). Actually, he did not attack anyone with the hatchet...he "showed them his hatchet" and scared them.However, I'm not sure if the targets of the hatchet incident(s) in Colorado were female. I would guess so.

 

[margarita25]

There doesn't appear to be an Inwood Suites in Greenwood. There's an InTown Suites though.

(Sorry that's what I meant.)

 

[Bracondad]

I've often kept myself up trying to figure out this incomprehensible act.

I'm sure this is on the radar of law enforcement but I'm surprised no one in the public has mentioned it.

Compare these murders to your person of interest's timeline which has also been posted online.

https://www.google.com/amp/kdvr.com/...avits-say/amp/


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[margarita25]

I wasn't sure if I could post the miliary addresses from familytreenow.com. But since my earlier post hasn't been removed, I'll go ahead and post all of it. Disclaimer: this website gives addresses connected to the person. It doesn't mean they lived there the entire time or even at all. When we moved we had our mail forwarded to a relative's address. That address is on the website even though we never lived there. I removed the street address so current residents are protected.

Martinsville, IN 46151
Current Address
Camby, IN 46113
(Feb 2016 - Jul 2017)
Martinsville, IN 46151
(Mar 2014 - May 2015)
Chesnee, SC 29323
(Feb 2011 - Mar 2013)
Mooresville, IN 46158
(Jan 2013)
Saint Petersburg, FL 33705
(Dec 2012)
Saint Petersburg, FL 33705
(Sep 2012 - Oct 2012)
Chesnee, SC 29323
(Oct 2011 - Dec 2011)
General Address, Parris Island, SC 29905
(Aug 2007)
Spartanburg, SC 29301
(Jun 2007)
Jacksonville, NC 28540
(Feb 2007 - Feb 2007)
Jacksonville, NC 28546
(Dec 2005 - Jun 2006)
S 2nd Mar Dv, Camp Lejeune, NC 28542
(Jan 2005)
2nd Mar Dv, Camp Lejeune, NC 28542
(Jan 2005)
10 India Battery #2MAR, Camp Lejeune, NC 28542
(Jun 2004)

Anything between May 2015 and Feb 2016? :thinking:

*note this is the time in between SC and IN.

 

[SansSerif]

Welcome!

I think he might not have known his pic was taken and definitely didn't know the audio was on. He MAY have been smart enough to know, though, that if he took the phone(s), his movements could be tracked.

This is a great point. If BG is DN, then we know he has a smart phone and uses social media, so he's probably relatively privy to how phones can be tracked.

Another thought: do we know if there was reception there? I remember seeing (but could be wrong on this) that her snapchat post didn't post immediately Bc of poor reception. If that's the case, it would be surprising if her phone was able to upload to the cloud on its own (I have trouble with the cloud all the time). Granted, I'm sure the police have access to more advanced technology for file retrieval, but if they didn't have the phone, why would they go searching for a video they didn't know existed?

Just a thought, it's possible the reception was ok and it uploaded to the cloud on its own, too

Ps thank you for the welcoming, everyone!!

 

[NewMama]

Hi everyone! This is my first post here, although I've been a long time follower. I've always been impressed by the insightful dialogue on here, it's really helped me look at this case from angles I would've never considered otherwise.

I have been thinking about BG's motive... a number of people have suggestion that he might've spotted the girls filming him and 'snapped'. However, I remembered this article about some of the additional audio found on Libby's phone: http://www.wthr.com/article/police-...of-man-behind-them-in-audio-played-for-family, in particular, this quote:

//State police say more audio from Libby German's cell phone was played for the victims' families, including a mention of a man they noticed behind them.
Police say the girls mostly talk about "stuff girls talk about" in the recording, but they also mention the man.//

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I also feel like in the first presser the LE mentioned that Libby had the wherewithal to hit record on her phone and leave it on in her back pocket (does anyone else remember this?)

If this is the case, I feel like a natural string of events would be that they noticed him, felt a bit strange (but not seriously concerned) and briefly filmed him for a second to get a better look. As a precautionary measure, Libby then may have put her phone in her back pocket and continued walking and talking. It's possible she took her phone out again later to record him and he saw her and snapped, but like a lot of people on here have wondered, why, then, would he not destroy the evidence?

I think if he had exposed himself, the girls wouldn't have been able to continue talking casually. It's possible he still did it after they started recording, but I doubt the camera was out (and was thus his murder catalyst), since it sounded like the girl's recorded casual conversation continued AFTER Libby had put her phone in her pocket (implying that they weren't too alarmed at this point).

In the stills we have of him, he seems like what I imagined they saw him as... something definitively weird and creepy (a man trying very hard to look inconspicuous), but perhaps just a regular person whose been walking behind them a bit too long. He doesn't appear to be aware of them filming him (I also doubt they were being obvious, its very easy to fake taking a selfie and record someone).

If this is the case (and this all clearly speculation and opinion, as there isn't hard evidence to back all of this), I think he had these intentions very early on. If he was staying on RL's property, he may have just been a creep spending time in the woods, and noticed the girls headed to a vulnerable location, and decided to act, not necessarily a hair trigger response.

Does any one else feel like this is a possibility? Am I leaving out important pieces of information?

The questions you’ve raised are the very questions that have thrown kinks in my scenarios. I can’t commit to a “carefully planned” scenario because to me carefully means leaving as little evidence as possible. I am left with a crime of opportunity but remain puzzled about the phone. I have wondered if perhaps BG has poor eyesight & wasn’t aware Liberty had been taking pictures and eventually video.

 

[AskMeNoQuestions]

I wonder if the image of BG wasn't captured as the girls were feigning taking a selfie as they walked along, using the camera as a rear view mirror of sorts, to monitor his behavior without turning around...if they knew or suspected he was following them, not just another friendly hiker on the trail.

Sent from my SM-T377V using Tapatalk

 

[Stormy415]

Well, I’m all caught up again and now I have to go to sleep. So, I’ll wake up tomorrow and I’ll be behind again! :tantrum:
I so hope tomorrow or one day this week we will have an answer if he is linked to our girls.

 

[margarita25]

OT but would not be shocked if Mark Redwine's lawyer tries to point the finger at DN...mad hatchet man in the region.

OMG just saw this. Classic.

 

[margarita25]

View attachment 123964

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct....in.gov/porp&usg=AOvVaw0U7RbJtSRSG7DkomkLviUg

http://mycourts.in.gov/

These dates could be important. How yet? Not sure. Maybe just because that would likely put him out there drifting alone...

 

[TTF14]

This is a great point. If BG is DN, then we know he has a smart phone and uses social media, so he's probably relatively privy to how phones can be tracked.

Another thought: do we know if there was reception there? I remember seeing (but could be wrong on this) that her snapchat post didn't post immediately Bc of poor reception. If that's the case, it would be surprising if her phone was able to upload to the cloud on its own (I have trouble with the cloud all the time). Granted, I'm sure the police have access to more advanced technology for file retrieval, but if they didn't have the phone, why would they go searching for a video they didn't know existed?

Just a thought, it's possible the reception was ok and it uploaded to the cloud on its own, too

Ps thank you for the welcoming, everyone!!

I thought it had been confirmed that they do actually have the phone, and not just access to the cloud....someone please correct me if I'm wrong. This was talked to death way back in the beginning.

 

[Rossymom]

“Friends and fellow mountain bikers say there have been issues with people firing guns in the area where Watkins was found.”

I just KNEW that I read this somewhere. Finally found it! Makes me wonder if he target shot and bikers to pass the time (?)

http://www.9news.com/news/crime/cyclist-found-shot-to-death-near-popular-trail/477058538

 

[margarita25]

Qmfr

(par·a·phil·i·a

ˌperəˈfilēə/

noun

PSYCHIATRY

a condition characterized by abnormal sexual desires, typically involving extreme or dangerous activities.)

***********

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paraphilia

And as we all should know by now, (cough), not to be confused with our other main P word here, Pareidolia :wink:

Pareidolia
*(/pærɪˈdoʊliə/*parr-i-DOH-lee-&#601 is a psychological phenomenon in which the mind responds to *advertiser censored*stimulus, usually an image or a sound, by perceiving a familiar pattern where none exists (e.g., in random data).

Common examples are perceived images of animals, faces, or objects in cloud formations, the*Man in the Moon, the*Moon rabbit,*hidden messages*within recorded music played in reverse or at higher- or lower-than-normal speeds, and hearing indistinct voices in random noise such as that produced by air conditioners or fans.[1]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pareidolia

 

[SansSerif]

The questions you’ve raised are the very questions that have thrown kinks in my scenarios. I can’t commit to a “carefully planned” scenario because to me carefully means leaving as little evidence as possible. I am left with a crime of opportunity but remain puzzled about the phone. I have wondered if perhaps BG has poor eyesight & wasn’t aware Liberty had been taking pictures and eventually video.

Good point on the vision... if BG is DN I believe there was evidence he had glasses at one time, but he doesn't appear to be wearing them on the bridge (as someone pointed out, probably couldn't afford to have them repaired or replaced), which could answer a question or two (yet still leave very many unanswered!)

 

[margarita25]

“Friends and fellow mountain bikers say there have been issues with people firing guns in the area where Watkins was found.”

I just KNEW that I read this somewhere. Finally found it! Makes me wonder if he target shot and bikers to pass the time (?)

http://www.9news.com/news/crime/cyclist-found-shot-to-death-near-popular-trail/477058538

"The El Paso County Sheriff’s Office is asking residents near this Palmer Lake open space to be careful."

This is a very direct statement from LE.

FTR, iirc, Jacoby was shot near a lake too, Boyd Lake, I think?

 

[justbetweenus]

They may have been from time to time over the many months. They could have even been searching to see if a new member popped up and had information that no one else knew thinking it may even be BG himself.

One never knows for sure who reads here, but I don't think they are reading here now since finding out that possibly DN could be BG. They are wrapped up in their own emotions I am sure, and gathered together with their families and friends waiting to find out if Abby and Libby's murderer has bee

I think the families have already been told a lot more details than any of us know. Even intricate details about how their children died.
.
IMO

I know from many other cases there are members that invite family to read, and keep them updated

 

[margarita25]

Those monitors are for house arrest/probation periods, not long term sex offender monitoring. If they put those on for sex offender monitoring, there wouldn't be any need for them to register...they'd be able to be tracked anywhere.

"The justices gave a North Carolina*sex offender*another chance to prove in state court that being forced to wear a GPS*monitoring bracelet*for life could be unconstitutional. ... It requires him to wear an*ankle bracelet*around the clock so that all his movements are transmitted to state officials.Mar 30, 2015"

*********

"WASHINGTON -- State programs that use GPS systems to monitor sex offenders could eventually be jeopardized based on a preliminary Supreme Court ruling Monday.

The justices gave a North Carolina sex offender another chance to prove in state court that being forced to wear a GPS monitoring bracelet for life could be unconstitutional.

More than 40 states have passed laws in the last decade that call for some type of GPS monitoring of sex offenders, including eight states that monitor them for life. Some states have expanded their programs to include other crimes; California, for instance, monitors gang members along with more than 9,000 sex offenders. At least 13 states monitor domestic abusers."

*more at link
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2015/03/30/supreme-court-sex-offender-gps/70544348/

*******

February 3, 2016
Lifetime GPS Ankle Monitor Is Constitutional
https://www.bna.com/lifetime-gps-ankle-n57982066905/

"Feb. 1 — Requiring sex offenders to wear satellite-based tracking devices as a condition of their release from civil commitment doesn't violate the Fourth Amendment and may be imposed on offenders whose crimes occurred years before the monitoring law was enacted, the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Seventh Circuit ruled Jan. 29.

The decision is the latest word on an issue that has divided state and federal courts and attracted the attention of privacy advocates."

*******

Missouri to Remove Hundreds of GPS Monitoring Devices Recently Put on Sex OffendersThe Department of Corrections Board of Probation and Parole installed 364 GPS ankle monitors on sex offenders in April because of new security requirements.
http://www.govtech.com/public-safet...ng-Devices-Recently-Put-on-Sex-Offenders.html

*****

 

[IceIce9]

No, road 25 is not an interstate going through Delphi. The closest interstate is I-65.

 

[franci]

Agree. I'm hopeful for this as well and understand it would be important to keep this close to the vest. I was just commenting that we do not have confirmation.

Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk

If dna from under the fingernails does exist then I think this is where the explosive anger would really have come from . If he set out to flash and maybe SA a few innocent girls on a lonely trail he clearly didnt know what he was dealing with. I think these girls were Delphi smart and tough. .DN if it is him, seems to be both instinctive and reactive. The immediate plan was instant gratification and I doubt he thought beyond that but he took on more than he could handle and hopefully, in the process bought about his own demise jmo

 

[margarita25]

Well, for one:
The address listed for Feb 2011 - Mar 2013 is Chesnee, NC.
However, it also states that during that time frame, he lived in Mooresville, In (Jan 2013), St. Petersburg, FL (Sept -Oct 2012 & Dec 2012), and so forth. So I wonder, which is it? How can he be living in two locations during the same time period?

:waitasec:

****

Anything interesting around St. Pete in Oct through Dec 2012 I wonder.