IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #75

[Daey34]

It was on federal land in Colorado. Pike's national forest.

You are absolutely right. Federal property would be a circumstance for a federal crime. I'm not sure exactly where the murders occurred on the trail, if it was private or state owned, or federal. I don't believe sexual assaults would be a federal offense unless they included kidnapping across state lines. From what I have read, the Monon Trail is owned by the state of Indiana, so it's still not a federal entity.

 

[kkdj]

You are absolutely right. Federal property would be a circumstance for a federal crime. I'm not sure exactly where the murders occurred on the trail, if it was private or state owned, or federal.

For some reason I think their bodies were found on RL's property, but the RR bridge was federal. If so, the commission of the kidnapping would have been on federal land. Anyway, I was just wondering about state or federal charges, jurisdiction, etc. So, I wonder if TW was murdered on federal land. Basic question I have is whether state of federal courts will try DN on the each of the murders (if charged) and how that all would play out.

 

[ocgrad]

You are absolutely right. Federal property would be a circumstance for a federal crime. I'm not sure exactly where the murders occurred on the trail, if it was private or state owned, or federal. I don't believe sexual assaults would be a federal offense unless they included kidnapping across state lines. From what I have read, the Monon Trail is owned by the state of Indiana, so it's still not a federal entity.

Murder committed in the sexual assault of a child is a federal crime.

 

[kkdj]

Murder committed in the sexual assault of a child is a federal crime.

This is what else I was referring to in my post #116. So, if there was a SA during the murder, it is federal charges. If the girls were kidnapped on the bridge, (which I think is federal land) it is federal charges, and TW was murdered on federal land which is a federal charge.

reposting re sexual assault

https://www.justice.gov/criminal-ceos/citizens-guide-us-federal-law-child-sexual-abuse

Under federal law, offenders convicted of sexually abusing a child face fines and imprisonment. Furthermore, an offender may face harsher penalties if the crime occurred in aggravated circumstances, which include, for example, the offender used force or threats, inflicted serious bodily injury or death, or kidnapped a child in the process of committing child sexual abuse.

 

[Area52]

It was on federal land in Colorado. Pike's national forest.

I was referring to the murders of Abby and Libby in Indiana . Sorry, I didn't know which post you were replying to.

 

[Daey34]

No one said the girls were SA'd. I have never believed they were. But with federal land and federal crimes, what I've read is that a defendant could be prosecuted federally but not necessarily.

This is what else I was referring to in my post #116. So, if there was a SA during the murder, it is federal charges. If the girls were kidnapped on the bridge, (which I think is federal land) it is federal charges, and TW was murdered on federal land which is a federal charge.

reposting re sexual assault

https://www.justice.gov/criminal-ceos/citizens-guide-us-federal-law-child-sexual-abuse

Under federal law, offenders convicted of sexually abusing a child face fines and imprisonment. Furthermore, an offender may face harsher penalties if the crime occurred in aggravated circumstances, which include, for example, the offender used force or threats, inflicted serious bodily injury or death, or kidnapped a child in the process of committing child sexual abuse.

 

[foxbluff]

JMO
I agree. They had little to no money and were homeless. And no job that we know of while in Colorado. I think burglary and theft was a big part of how they were making ends meet.

I think it is why DN tries to keep his face covered in some of the court appearance videos we see. I think people have got a glimpse of him in the act of bulglaries and he doesnt want more charges tacked on.

There also could be a very serious thing he did wrong that LE is not yet aware of like another murder or something. The way he tries to hide his face during some of the court appearances is telling me he is really trying to hide from someone that had seen him do something very wrong.

Burglary and theft at a minimum. I do think the rifle was most likely stolen. Colorado LE should ask the public that if anyone is missing a 22 rifle to contact them and see if its the same one they are missing. That may give LE some clues of what neighborhoods they would have been in and may generate another clue to help them solve the Colorado murder.

Ty Hatfield for such a well thought-out response and I think all the points you made are valid ones.

I hadn't heard that DN appears to try and hide his face, but imo it's in his best interest.

I'm a firm believer that for each crime he's been caught for, there are several more he got away with. In other words, imo, that staggering list of past crimes LE knows about are only the tip of the iceberg.

 

[Scarlett12]

I don't recall reading this, but I'll make the assumption this vehicle was impounded. Is it still?

KN said in her AG interview that LE had her car and possessions.


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[foxbluff]

I don't believe the girls were taken on the bridge, but rather near the bridge.

Also, wasn't it the RR Co. that deeded the bridge to the local ?preservation group that was formed? idk...

 

[Steleheart]

https://www.quora.com/Can-family-me...by-the-father-by-virtue-of-living-in-the-home


I think this is it. I've looked through sooo many this morning and, like you, I am a few cups light!!!!

I DID read that thank you!.
I bookmarked it finally, LOL

 

[Boxer]

The only questions are:

Where was DN on the afternoon of 2/13?
Is there any way to develop good evidence to connect him to the crime scene.

So far the answer is 'no.' The CaCo DA has said so.
LE said there would be an answer about positive connection within a week, a month or more ago.

They need to keep the gas on their search of the haystack and keep sorting and reviewing, while keeping DN in the POI not excluded pile.

 

[Steleheart]

This is what else I was referring to in my post #116. So, if there was a SA during the murder, it is federal charges. If the girls were kidnapped on the bridge, (which I think is federal land) it is federal charges, and TW was murdered on federal land which is a federal charge.

reposting re sexual assault

https://www.justice.gov/criminal-ceos/citizens-guide-us-federal-law-child-sexual-abuse

Under federal law, offenders convicted of sexually abusing a child face fines and imprisonment. Furthermore, an offender may face harsher penalties if the crime occurred in aggravated circumstances, which include, for example, the offender used force or threats, inflicted serious bodily injury or death, or kidnapped a child in the process of committing child sexual abuse.

I do not believe that the bridge is federal. AFAIK it is still owned by CSX and all the land around it is private except the trail itself which does not include the bridge.

Indiana Landmarks announced today that it has scheduled predevelopment work on Delphi’s Monon High Bridge in preparation for taking ownership of the railroad span from CSX. The railroad requires the work before it will give the 1891 bridge to the nonprofit preservation organization. CSX vacated the span in 1987. Indiana Landmarks included the High Bridge on its annual 10 Most Endangered list in 2016.

This map shows all the properties and owners including RL and CSX, Mears, etc. Just zoom to Deer Creek and 300N

https://beacon.schneidercorp.com/Application.aspx?AppID=377&LayerID=5553&PageTypeID=1

 

[kkdj]

The only questions are:

Where was DN on the afternoon of 2/13?
Is there any way to develop good evidence to connect him to the crime scene.

So far the answer is 'no.' The CaCo DA has said so.
LE said there would be an answer about positive connection within a week, a month or more ago.

They need to keep the gas on their search of the haystack and keep sorting and reviewing, while keeping DN in the POI not excluded pile.

But, they didn't say they would release that information did they?
So, I believe they know, aren't releasing what they know, and also are not saying that DN is not a POI any longer. So, to me this is indicating that DN is indeed still of POI.

 

[Steleheart]

But, they didn't say they would release that information did they?
So, I believe they know, aren't releasing what they know, and also are not saying that DN is not a POI any longer. So, to me this is indicating that DN is indeed still of POI.

No, They said "they" will know by next week was the quote up thread. (prev thread?)

 

[Jerrod]

No, They said "they" will know by next week was the quote up thread. (prev thread?)

September 27th - “We will give the same attention to the person arrested in Colorado, but right now there is nothing that definitively connects this person to our investigation. If that should change — with this tip, or any other tip — rest assured we would be sharing such news with all media sources.”

​http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2017/09/27/break-in-new-delphi-ind-double-murder/

 

[Love Never Fails]

Do you mean in addition to DN (suggesting an accomplice?) or do you mean instead of DN??

In addition to....KN maybe?

 

[Steleheart]

September 27th - “We will give the same attention to the person arrested in Colorado, but right now there is nothing that definitively connects this person to our investigation. If that should change — with this tip, or any other tip — rest assured we would be sharing such news with all media sources.”

​http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2017/09/27/break-in-new-delphi-ind-double-murder/

Thank You!
I never saw that.

 

[BIC]

September 27th - “We will give the same attention to the person arrested in Colorado, but right now there is nothing that definitively connects this person to our investigation. If that should change — with this tip, or any other tip — rest assured we would be sharing such news with all media sources.”

​http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2017/09/27/break-in-new-delphi-ind-double-murder/

Now THIS is “very telling”. TYVM.


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[Krwiley60]

If this is true and he had this outstanding charge from Marion County, in November 2016 , how could he be registering as a homeless RSO in Morgan county only 3 months later and get away with it? Why don't these counties check with the prior jurisdictions?

If it turns out he murdered these girls whilst having an outstanding warrant from another county, there will certainly be questions asked about this RSO programme IMO.

Because it’s Marion County and driving without a license and having drug paraphernalia on you is not a priority.


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[Krwiley60]

Murder is not a federal charge unless it involves the murder of a federal office, terrorism, or interstate kidnapping. I believe each state would file their own charges of murder, with the state having him in custody being the one to take him to trial first. After being found guilty and serving his time, the other states could seek his extradition. MOO

Do you honestly think he would serve time and be released for murder?


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