IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #76

[Love Never Fails]

It should of been top priority without a doubt, but as impossibly ridiculous as it may sound I believe embarrassment and feeling like a fool played a big factor in the time gap.
Personal example: When my property was vandalize I literally passed the two people on our rural gravel road and said to myself "they looked familiar, but haven't ever seen them this far out before". So I stupidly never put them into the equation until the Duh Bell went off. Well I was embarrassed and felt like a total fool, especially with my training.

Hope that made sense.

Hi Don,
i am a member. Rarely post but always read. You sound very educated and/or employed in LE. I have a question. If the dad or anyone familiar to LE or the family is BG, do you believe they actually know the killer and are just waiting for the right tip? Because for me, if I knew the killer of a human being and had to wait months or years on the right tip, he or she would be dead already and I would likely be in jail. But no way would the freak be walking around so he or she could kill again. So I don’t understand the part of the dad having passed the killer in the woods. Am I missing something? Also, do you believe from reaction of LE to date that DN is definitely NOT the killer? I believe he is a possibility.

also, do you believe as most of us do that BG is a serial killer? Timeline sounds like he had no time for a SA which I felt was his reasoning. His voice on the tape sounds so calm, not like he is in a hurry. With DN as a POI I began to think this was a rage killing.

 

[Love Never Fails]

Hi, Shire!

I completely agree. If the girls knew him and were frightened or creeped out by him, one or both would have mentioned his name while the phone was recording.

Maybe they did mention his name and still no one knows who he is.

 

[Don Frye]

Hi, Shire!


I completely agree. If the girls knew him and were frightened or creeped out by him, one or both would have mentioned his name while the phone was recording.

I thought the recording said "He is following us or something to that effect, didn't know they said "stranger or strange man". I apologize in advance if I'm wrong.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

I watched the show but may have missed a few minutes. I don't recall seeing these mentioned at all can anyone confirm 1. Any reference at all to DNA. 2. The reward offered. 3. The country wide net originally cast via all those billboards. Thanks


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I want to say something re Carter and his "wide opened eyes" and the reward:
When I saw the announcement per Pat McA. of the donation the NFL (owner Irsay) had done to the reward I wondered about the critical countenance by Carter. He should have looked relaxed and pleased but IMO was looking in a way like quite the opposite (on TV/video, standing to the left side watching the speaker). I noticed this and was thinking about this a long time (!!). I admit I even played around with Gimp and put a baseball hat and a beard on a suitable pic I found of the speaker. All for nothing, but months ago I was indeed thinking partially along this line. Carter's wide opened eyes and serious facial expression are making me confused, it seems. :blushing:

 

[MistyWaters]

LE let the families listen to some more of the audio and said that the girls were talking about what girls talk about and mentioned the strange man behind them so I don't believe the girls knew him at all.

I wasn't aware there was discussion about a "strange man"? Was there a different report than this one?

...."Sgt. Holeman tells us investigators recovered more audio from Libby’s phone, which was found with the girls at the crime scene.

“It does not appear to be anything more than some discussion between the girls. We have only released a portion of it. There are some others we think could help us but again protecting the integrity of the investigation is key so we cannot release everything because there are certain people that know the details and if we release it all then we get into false confessions,” said Sgt. Holeman..."
https://www.indystar.com/story/news...recovered-slain-delphi-teens-phone/566691001/

Adding this link. But it still doesn't refer to the man as " strange".

".....Police say the girls mostly talk about "stuff girls talk about" in the recording, but they also mention the man. The only audio that has been released to the public from the phone is that of a man's voice ordering German and her friend, Abby Williams, "down the hill."......
https://www.wthr.com/article/police...of-man-behind-them-in-audio-played-for-family

 

[kkdj]

I'm going to try and answer all these questions on one post. Not saying he is a member here but sick individuals like him do follow these site's and therefore so do LE as they should.
I never said he was or is a close family member or known member of the community. I said he has ties to the community. Could of been when he was a child or has passed away relatives that lived there, somehow he is familiar with the community and it's surroundings.
As far as being involved in atleast one of the searches, he obviously didn't wave his arms and say "Its me, I'm over here!". He was far enough away to be apart of the search and not be recognized, but yes I believe he was present and was seen, but obviously not recognized. And yes, I'm dead serious.

He could have been in plain site during the searches. We (and he) didn't know at that time of the pics that were taken. And quite honestly his get up in the pic pretty much hides what he really looks like. Why do you not think it is DN? He was found to be driving around the search for TW in CO so I believe it is part of how he operates.

 

[Love Never Fails]

I wasn't aware there was discussion about a "strange man"? Was there a different report than this one?

...."Sgt. Holeman tells us investigators recovered more audio from Libby’s phone, which was found with the girls at the crime scene.

“It does not appear to be anything more than some discussion between the girls. We have only released a portion of it. There are some others we think could help us but again protecting the integrity of the investigation is key so we cannot release everything because there are certain people that know the details and if we release it all then we get into false confessions,” said Sgt. Holeman..."
https://www.indystar.com/story/news...recovered-slain-delphi-teens-phone/566691001/

Adding this link. But it still doesn't refer to the man as " strange".

".....Police say the girls mostly talk about "stuff girls talk about" in the recording, but they also mention the man. The only audio that has been released to the public from the phone is that of a man's voice ordering German and her friend, Abby Williams, "down the hill."......
https://www.wthr.com/article/police...of-man-behind-them-in-audio-played-for-family

While they are protecting the “integrity” of their investigation, I pray a killer isn’t out killing again. Seems killers have more rights than the innocents!

 

[MistyWaters]

I'm going to respectfully disagree with that line of thought. The sketch wasn't released till 5 months later. This is the reason LE gave:

Dated July 17th:
"Riley said the witness who saw the suspect was close enough to him to say that he did not have blue eyes, but was uncertain of his eye color. Riley said fear may have played a role in the witness' decision not to come forward sooner with a description of the suspect. "People are scared. They're scared to be recognized by the subject. It just takes a while for these things to happen," he said."
Source: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/07/17/indiana-police-to-release-new-evidence-in-killing-2-teens.html

Also, in a press conference when the sketch was released, ISP Riley slipped a couple times and said "she" before correcting himself when referring to the witness. Video below is not full press conference, but it includes these 'slips'. He does it 3 times between 1:07 and 1:15 mark.
http://abcnews.go.com/US/video/composite-sketch-released-killings-indiana-teens-48683961

In this clip from Dr. Phil, beginning 1:28 mark, MP refers to a single eyewitness, one person, who saw him "leaving that area around that time that day".
https://www.drphil.com/videos/murde...arch-efforts-the-day-their-teens-disappeared/

I always concluded the "she" witness was an adult female. I also was under the impression the trail was fairly quiet that day, making it feel more isolated. However, after watching Dr Phil and hearing Abby's mom say that there were a lot of kids on the trail that day (but Libby & Abby were there in a lull) and that they had spoken to many of them, I'm wondering if this female witness was another teen and because of what happened to the girls she was terrified to speak up. I can envision this much more readily now vs an adult female witness holding out so long. MOO

Bumping this well researched post for the benefit of those who may have only began recently following the case.

That Libby's father was the source of the sketch a long five months later seems really out there to me, given his immediate concern and action after Libby didn't answer her cellphone as he arrived to pick up the girls.

 

[kkdj]

I'm going to try and answer all these questions on one post. Not saying he is a member here but sick individuals like him do follow these site's and therefore so do LE as they should.
I never said he was or is a close family member or known member of the community. I said he has ties to the community. Could of been when he was a child or has passed away relatives that lived there, somehow he is familiar with the community and it's surroundings.
As far as being involved in atleast one of the searches, he obviously didn't wave his arms and say "Its me, I'm over here!". He was far enough away to be apart of the search and not be recognized, but yes I believe he was present and was seen, but obviously not recognized. And yes, I'm dead serious.

Don, I see you are from Iowa. Any thoughts of the Iowa and Delphi cases being related?

 

[MistyWaters]

While they are protecting the “integrity” of their investigation, I pray a killer isn’t out killing again. Seems killers have more rights than the innocents!

I think LE has already released everything they have into the media realm which they believe will eventually lead to someone coming forward who knows this killer. The photo, the voice, the sketch, an association to Delphi on the afternoon of Feb 13th is far more information than what leads to an arrest in most other solved cases.

It's truly a mystery.....

 

[minazoe]

DN's letter is a CROCK. He is still my number one and my best guess is he is being protected by someone who was unwittingly an accessory to this crime..someone who helped him get away...drove him..cleaned him up...hid or destroyed evidence..

and what about KN? can she prove her whereabouts for the entire day? after her ultrasound appointment?

Did DN have a phone? if not, why would KN reach out to him on facebook ?


It would take about an hour for her to get to him..so what time might she have gotten to Delphi?

LE needs to really go over their photos and videos of the search. MOO

 

[IceIce9]

DN's letter is a CROCK. He is still my number one and my best guess is he is being protected by someone who was unwittingly an accessory to this crime..someone who helped him get away...drove him..cleaned him up...hid or destroyed evidence..

and what about KN? can she prove her whereabouts for the entire day? after her ultrasound appointment?

Did DN have a phone? if not, why would KN reach out to him on facebook ?


It would take about an hour for her to get to him..so what time might she have gotten to Delphi?

LE needs to really go over their photos and videos of the search. MOO

DN is my #1 suspect. There has to be a reason that LE hustled out to CO to interview him. My guess is something to do with COD, especially since they have released absolutely no information about that.

I am guessing (MOO) that a similar weapon was used in both Delphi and CO and it was distinctive or unusual enough that it threw up a red flag. If that was the case I don’t think the weapon was something common like a gun or knife.

LE has been so tight lipped about COD and other details that I am guessing they are waiting for a POI to slip up during an interview and say, “I don’t even OWN a ________”

 

[Yellow Rose]

He could have been in plain site during the searches. We (and he) didn't know at that time of the pics that were taken. And quite honestly his get up in the pic pretty much hides what he really looks like. Why do you not think it is DN? He was found to be driving around the search for TW in CO so I believe it is part of how he operates.

Personally I don't think he participated in the search. I say that because there were reporters and cameras INSTANTLY when the search began. If he was in the same clothes LE would have recognized him when reviewing the video of the searches.

 

[Jax49]

Revisiting article linked earlier:

http://denver.cbslocal.com/2017/12/13/daniel-nations-murder-indiana/

“So, is Daniel Nations our big top number? No, he’s just another one in the field that we’re still looking at,” said Indiana State Police Sgt. Kim Riley.

A shame we don't know other names on their list. moo

 

[Shiressleuth]

I wasn't aware there was discussion about a "strange man"? Was there a different report than this one?

...."Sgt. Holeman tells us investigators recovered more audio from Libby’s phone, which was found with the girls at the crime scene.

“It does not appear to be anything more than some discussion between the girls. We have only released a portion of it. There are some others we think could help us but again protecting the integrity of the investigation is key so we cannot release everything because there are certain people that know the details and if we release it all then we get into false confessions,” said Sgt. Holeman..."
https://www.indystar.com/story/news...recovered-slain-delphi-teens-phone/566691001/

Adding this link. But it still doesn't refer to the man as " strange".

".....Police say the girls mostly talk about "stuff girls talk about" in the recording, but they also mention the man. The only audio that has been released to the public from the phone is that of a man's voice ordering German and her friend, Abby Williams, "down the hill."......
https://www.wthr.com/article/police...of-man-behind-them-in-audio-played-for-family

Its right at the end of the big interview that Holeman did. He says that both girls felt uncomfortable and that was why Libby started recording. I can only find that ATM. If they felt uncomfortable I don't think they would know him. If I find another source I'll post it. It was probably a MSM commenting about Holeman's "uncomforable" comments.

 

[The Farm]

LE let the families listen to some more of the audio and said that the girls were talking about what girls talk about and mentioned the strange man behind them so I don't believe the girls knew him at all.

I check in here every now and then and yesterday I was able to catch most of Dr. Phil but missed about 20 minutes in the middle.
Did I miss this about the girls talking about a stranger on the cell recording?
I have always wondered how much was said and when did Libby start actually recording?

 

[Shiressleuth]

Revisiting article linked earlier:

http://denver.cbslocal.com/2017/12/13/daniel-nations-murder-indiana/


A shame we don't know other names on their list. moo

Yes, we'd have loads to talk about then. I think DN must be their number 1, otherwise why even name him?
Eta I just saw your post where they are denying he's their number 1. So why was he named? It doesn't make sense to me they are now saying he isn't.

 

[Jax49]

Regarding DNA, my best guess is they have good DNA but because of where it was found it may or may not belong to the killer. Meaning, it wasn't found on the girls but near by (such as a cigarette butt, saliva, etc.).

If my guess is correct, LE would be trying to match suspect DNA to that recovered at the crime scene. If it doesn't match that still wouldn't rule them out.

If they get a match, it wouldn't rule someone in but they would be all over that person looking for other evidence.

moo, of course

 

[Jax49]

Yes, we'd have loads to talk about then. I think DN must be their number 1, otherwise why even name him?

Do you (or anyone) remember how we first heard DN's name? Did it come from social media, press or LE? I'm following too many cases and drawing a total blank. TIA

 

[BIC]

Yes, we'd have loads to talk about then. I think DN must be their number 1, otherwise why even name him?

According to this quote from the article he is just another poi.

So, is Daniel Nations our big top number? No, he’s just another one in the field that we’re still looking at,” said Indiana State Police Sgt. Kim Riley.

I believe he was only named a poi publicly because the CO crimes were in the news and LE was asked if he was a poi in IN, unlike the rest of the poi’s. IMO