IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #76

[MistyWaters]

The Dr Phil interview has really helped get more discussion on this case and at least for me I am learning new details by going back through articles.

One is the cell phone appears to have been definitely found near the bodies where they were killed. I was not sure about that till I saw this.

"Sgt. Holeman tells us investigators recovered more audio from Libby’s phone, which was found with the girls at the crime scene."

https://www.indystar.com/story/news...recovered-slain-delphi-teens-phone/566691001/

And if we take this part literally then it appears the sketch was developed by multiple witnesses of the perp. So more than one person saw him that day.

"Sgt. Holeman tells us several people have come forward and said they saw the killer walking on the trails the day Abby and Libby were killed. Those people helped develop a composite sketch that was released last month."

I still disagree with them that they cant release more info and there are people that are waiting to come rushing to them with false confessions though. I mean really, how often does that really happen. Is that a valid fear or just following standard procedures. I just dont buy that. I think benefits far outweigh negatives in releasing whatever they can to help get this guy off the streets.
More lives are in danger until he is arrested.

This part below really does not make much sense to me. What is he referring to when he says "There are some others we think could help us“. Who are these others? Or is he referring to other Audio parts of tape.

And "certain people that know the details". What does that mean? If they know the details then why would it matter if more is release because those people already know the more. I dont get it. More double speak IMO. We have had way too much of that IMO.

"“It does not appear to be anything more than some discussion between the girls. We have only released a portion of it. There are some others we think could help us but again protecting the integrity of the investigation is key so we cannot release everything because there are certain people that know the details and if we release it all then we get into false confessions,” said Sgt. Holeman."

Excellent summary! My best guess is because none of us here personally know someone whom we might suspect (or speaking for myself at least), LE's statements appear confusing. But maybe not to somebody who possesses the sort of information that LE is seeking? One of the things they've stressed from early on is that they want to talk to somebody who knows this guy.

As far as internet sleuthing in order to solve this case, imo it's no better than a guessing game because we don't have a lot of facts to go by. Saying that however, the wide range of speculation that has overtaken this case is rather fascinating. If nothing else, the family deserves for Libby and Abby not be forgotten so that justice will eventually be served.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

They weren't really trapped. Abbey's house was down that private road about 3/4 of a mile or so. Correct me if I am wrong about the distance.

Why, on a sunny day in February, A+L had to be transported to this place (not so far away) in a hurry so-to-say, searching for someone who would them pick up a rather short time later (DG) before they got permission to go (by Becky)? Why had this excursion been so urgent and important? Certainly it wasn't important enough only to have a nice pic of the bridge which was known to them (A/L) for some time already and nothing irretrievable. If the girls didn't know BG, whom did they know who was also involved?

 

[Jax49]

Latest news regarding DN's Court Appearance today.
http://gazette.com/el-paso-prosecutors-consider-plea-deal-in-daniel-nations-case/article/1617288

Thank you. Any indication what the deal might be?

"The hearing offered no indication that authorities are preparing charges against Nations in any other crimes, including the shooting death of Timothy Watkins of Palmer Lake, whose body was found Sept. 17 just off a popular hiking trail on Mt. Herman."

 

[Deleted member 196796]

He couldn't have, that's a fact!

I've got a question regarding DN's limp. I know it has been asked before but not sure I saw an answer.

How could he serve in the Marines if he had a leg that was shorter and caused a noticeable limp?

I found it on this list of disqualifiers.

https://www.military.com/join-armed-forces/disqualifiers-medical-conditions.html

"Shortening of a lower extremity resulting in a noticeable limp or scoliosis."

moo

Correct, just leaves one answer IMO and that something happened after his discharge. For example, an accident involving a fractured leg. If I understand correctly, he wouldn't have received a dishonorable discharge for getting a fractured leg unless it was an alcohol related incident or something else as undesirable behavior.

 

[Jax49]

Correct, just leaves one answer IMO and that something happened after his discharge. For example, an accident involving a fractured leg. If I understand correctly, he wouldn't have received a dishonorable discharge for getting a fractured leg unless it was an alcohol related incident or something else as undesirable behavior.

IIRC, the DD was based on the sex charges. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

The only other answer would be he doesn't have a noticeable limp?

moo

 

[MistyWaters]

:smile: a duck's a duck.

Seems LE doesn't rank him highly within the flock.

“So, is Daniel Nations our big top number? No, he’s just another one in the field that we’re still looking at,” said Indiana State Police Sgt. Kim Riley.
http://denver.cbslocal.com/2017/12/13/daniel-nations-murder-indiana/

 

[sumzero]

http://www.wlfi.com/content/news/463888223.html

this article quotes Indiana State Police Sgt. Riley regarding the Dr Phil show specifically, and the fact that Nations is still a POI, one of many who will be questioned again.

Still seems like they’re at square one, hoping to get a tip which leads to the real killer. Could be someone they’ve already talked to; could be someone not yet on their radar. What the prosecutor said in announcing his retirement indicates they’re not even close to zeroing-in on someone. The Dr. Phil show might be the last big effort we’ll see to generate new interest and perhaps a lead before this case grows cold.

 

[Don Frye]

Correct, just leaves one answer IMO and that something happened after his discharge. For example, an accident involving a fractured leg. If I understand correctly, he wouldn't have received a dishonorable discharge for getting a fractured leg unless it was an alcohol related incident or something else as undesirable behavior.

Correct

 

[Shiressleuth]

I've got a question regarding DN's limp. I know it has been asked before but not sure I saw an answer.

How could he serve in the Marines if he had a leg that was shorter and caused a noticeable limp?

I found it on this list of disqualifiers.

https://www.military.com/join-armed-forces/disqualifiers-medical-conditions.html

"Shortening of a lower extremity resulting in a noticeable limp or scoliosis."

moo

It was discussed previously it could have been an injury incurred while serving. I mentioned at the time, I think, I now have one leg slightly shorter, likely due to a bad ankle fracture I incurred about 20 years ago. When a limb fracture mends it can sometimes shorten that limb apparently, my doctor told me.

 

[Shiressleuth]

Yes the order is known using the boards. It was simple enough and a fact without a doubt.

Do you mean it's fact BG has a limp?

 

[MistyWaters]

Thank you. Any indication what the deal might be?

"The hearing offered no indication that authorities are preparing charges against Nations in any other crimes, including the shooting death of Timothy Watkins of Palmer Lake, whose body was found Sept. 17 just off a popular hiking trail on Mt. Herman."

In September, when the news first came out about DN, I recall there was heavy speculation that DN was the alleged killer who arose yet again and was likely responsible for the murder of Timothy Watkins. That he appeared to be lurking during the search, that he had access to his wife's rifle in the trunk and so forth, all things that made him appear responsible.

That occured almost three months ago, yet no murder charges have been laid relating to his death. Wouldn't it be a simple matter of ballistic forensics to match the rifle to the bullet by now?

I have to admit if not that, I've gotten lost as to what even remotely connects DN to Delphi other than creative speculation, if not the multiple murder aspect.

 

[Shiressleuth]

Seems LE doesn't rank him highly within the flock.

“So, is Daniel Nations our big top number? No, he’s just another one in the field that we’re still looking at,” said Indiana State Police Sgt. Kim Riley.
http://denver.cbslocal.com/2017/12/13/daniel-nations-murder-indiana/

That's only because LE haven't yet got their raft of ducks in a row. :smile:

 

[Hatfield]

In September, when the news first came out about DN, I recall there was heavy speculation that DN was the alleged killer who arose yet again and was likely responsible for the murder of Timothy Watkins. That he appeared to be lurking during the search, that he had access to his wife's rifle in the trunk and so forth, all things that made him appear responsible.

That occured almost three months ago, yet no murder charges have been laid relating to his death. Wouldn't it be a simple matter of ballistic forensics to match the rifle to the bullet by now?

I have to admit if not that, I've gotten lost as to what even remotely connects DN to Delphi other than creative speculation, if not the multiple murder aspect.

I have wondered about the TW ballistic testing too. The thing that could make testing not work for LE would be if the bullet fragmented or deformed too much after penetrating bone and tissue. They would have had to have found a fairly good intact bullet and they may not have been able to get one from the victim.

Or if bullet passed clean through and it traveled a great distance and they just could not find it.

There is no guarantee they were able to get a bullet to compare from a shot victim.

The only other good way is if the perp left one of the 22 shell casings on the ground. Again they may not have been able to find the casing though. Like if the shot was taken from within the car and the perp ejected the casings right in the car and picked them up afterwards and threw them away somewhere else.

 

[Daey34]

If Nations is charged with TW's murder, it wasn't going to be today at some random disposition hearing. The last sealed indictments in ElPaso county came out in November. Thus, the next round of sealed indictments (which this would be) would not happen until late February. I can't speak for Carroll County, though.

But I do think it's unlikely anyone else killed TW, and I expect to see those charges in late Winter if they ever happen.

My opinion only. No this isn't tunnel vision. I don't know if he is guilty of anything. But the speculation that because he hasn't yet been charged in TW's murder means he will not be charged, is sort of off. I believe strongly in that charge. His weapon matched, everything else lined up, he was circling the area looking at the search party. LE in EL Paso county haven't really asked for anymore info on that case. It would be crazy not to keep speculating that he killed TW in my opinion.

 

[M. Kay]

In September, when the news first came out about DN, I recall there was heavy speculation that DN was the alleged killer who arose yet again and was likely responsible for the murder of Timothy Watkins. That he appeared to be lurking during the search, that he had access to his wife's rifle in the trunk and so forth, all things that made him appear responsible.
That occured almost three months ago, yet no murder charges have been laid relating to his death. Wouldn't it be a simple matter of ballistic forensics to match the rifle to the bullet by now?

I agree that ballistic tests would quickly rule DN out regarding any bullet fired in Colorado from that gun in his trunk . What lingers for me is the repeated drives around the scene of the Colorado crime by DN. So, he aroused suspicion enough that a photo of him showing his license plate number was taken. His wife made many comments, some of which have been linked here on Websleuths. Not once has she said he didn't commit the crimes in Indiana, or that he isn't capable of such acts. I don't want to accuse him, and hope it wasn't him, since his formative years were tragic. However, the mind can be kept open pro or con.

 

[Jax49]

Do you mean it's fact BG has a limp?

I'm not Her but I believe she meant the order of the pics, based on comparing the boards. It should be in the old image discussion thread.

moo

 

[Shiressleuth]

I'm not Her but I believe she meant the order of the pics, based on comparing the boards. It should be in the old image discussion thread.

moo

I agree. It's just no one agreed when I said it so I am just wanting to make sure I understand her properly, that all.

 

[Jax49]

I agree. It's just no one agreed when I said it so I am just wanting to make sure I understand her properly, that all.

When you said BG had a limp? That's never been proven, as far as I know. moo

 

[Shiressleuth]

If Nations is charged with TW's murder, it wasn't going to be today at some random disposition hearing. The last sealed indictments in ElPaso county came out in November. Thus, the next round of sealed indictments (which this would be) would not happen until late February. I can't speak for Carroll County, though.

But I do think it's unlikely anyone else killed TW, and I expect to see those charges in late Winter if they ever happen.

My opinion only. No this isn't tunnel vision. I don't know if he is guilty of anything. But the speculation that because he hasn't yet been charged in TW's murder means he will not be charged, is sort of off. I believe strongly in that charge. His weapon matched, everything else lined up, he was circling the area looking at the search party. LE in EL Paso county haven't really asked for anymore info on that case. It would be crazy not to keep speculating that he killed TW in my opinion.

I agree. And I am still keeping in mind missing Micah Lambert, who has a thread on WS.

 

[Jax49]

Per mods first post:

Do not sleuth family, PERIOD.


This hasn't changed as far as I know.