IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #77

[newredtabby]

Once I learned of the narrow time window 40 minutes or so it was chilling.

That he could encounter them on the bridge, murderer them, then run into a witness who saw him face to face well enough to know his eyes weren't blue and not give away a thing, seems chilling.

He's cold blooded, calm, adept as presenting himself as almost weak and soft, my impression of the sketch. I think when Abby and Libby neared the end of the bridge, he struck and threatened them as he planned, at that very moment, in that very spot, to not let get to where they had a better chance of getting away off the path.

But it all started going wrong for him from that point on too because his image and voice were captured.

The short 40ish minute window is just supposition at this point. We have no way of knowing the crime was over by then. The witness who spotted BG "leaving"???? could not have known where he was leaving to. BG could have been with the girls late into the next morning, for all we know.


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[FindHG]

I watched the Grey Hughes animation video and found it chilling. Those girls must have been so frightened to see a predator closing in on them.

In my mind I had assumed that the girls were side by side for much of their hike. I envisioned them mostly walking together down the trail and across the bridge, probably chatting and giggling. I figured they would have been together when approached by BG. But the video makes it appear that Libby had already made it across the bridge ahead of Abby and that BG closed in on Abby as she was reaching the SE end of the bridge (it was really interesting that the dark blur in one of the BG photos may actually have been Abby's clothing). I hadn't considered the possiblity that the girls were more than arms length apart, and that BG was that close to one of the girls when Libby got the video. I always thought they filmed him aprroaching from a distance.

Instead of filming, Libby could have possibly run away when she sensed danger and saw BG getting close to Abby, but she chose to stick with her friend who was trapped on the bridge. I think Libby captured the entire abduction on her phone. She really is a hero.

Hi Hockeymom!

Great post. Thank you for taking the time. So glad to have your eye on this. You put things so well for my jumbled mind. I agree.

 

[FindHG]

Definitely.

Wow! Amazing Jerrod.

Thank you very much for doing this.

Chilling.

 

[her]

The short 40ish minute window is just supposition at this point. We have no way of knowing the crime was over by then. The witness who spotted BG "leaving"???? could not have known where he was leaving to. BG could have been with the girls late into the next morning, for all we know.


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That likelihood is doubtful with everyone searching the area. The risk is too high and makes no sense for me whatsoever.

 

[FindHG]

The short 40ish minute window is just supposition at this point. We have no way of knowing the crime was over by then. The witness who spotted BG "leaving"???? could not have known where he was leaving to. BG could have been with the girls late into the next morning, for all we know.

Sorry, you're right. Not said the he was seen leaving, just seen face to face, and that how or when he left is not known.

 

[Bird of Paradise]

That likelihood is doubtful with everyone searching the area. The risk is too high and makes no sense for me whatsoever.

Agree with you Her.

This thread has morphed into not believing the statements LE has issued.

They said a witness helped with the creation of the sketch.
Someone posted a quote from Holeman up thread.

There are a number of facts that we DO know.

No need to create scenarios around those facts that aren't true.

 

[Shiressleuth]

I also think the whole thing was captured (recorded) on the mobile phone. Whether it be pictorial or verbal

KR
Reacher

I think she put it in her pocket just after the BG video and it continued recording audio. I think he pulled a gun and grabbed and threatened Abby, saying to Libby something like " your friend is dead unless you g' down the hill". We speculated whether that was A's top in the image thread and whether he grabbed her, so I think this is likely.
:cow:

 

[Jax49]

Sorry, you're right. Not said the he was seen leaving, just seen face to face, and that how or when he left is not known.

Hi FHG, IIRC on the Dr Phil show the grandfather specifically said the witness saw BG leaving the area. LE who participated didn't indicate that wasn't true.

Anyone else remember that? TIA.

moo

 

[RIP Meagan + Johnny]

How do we know it is not Abby or Libby who described the perpetrator via mobile phone. The only people I can think of that could have come close enough to say the eyes weren't blue are Abby or Libby. Whilst the mobile was still recording

IMHO
KR
Reacher

Hi Reacher,

The girls may very have done just that. But the long version of Officer Holman’s August interview states “more than a few” people saw him on the trails that day. Scroll to bottom of page for video.
http://fox59.com/2017/08/14/lead-de...ave-more-audio-from-teens-phone-dna-evidence/

 

[Shiressleuth]

I suppose the same question could be asked about any one of the hundred of other POIs. Too much time has already passed for a conviction based only on an eye witness ID imo.

Get all the poi mugs and let the witnesses pick one. See if they all pick the same guy. Pull that guy or the two or more they choose ( if they dont choose the same one) and set up an id parade. Hope they pick the same guy. Presumably none of these POI's have alibis or they would have already been excluded. How else are they going to reduce the number if DNA isn't doing it?

 

[Bird of Paradise]

Get all the poi mugs and let the witnesses pick one. See if they all pick the same guy. Pull that guy or the two or more they choose ( if they dont choose the same one) and set up an id parade. Hope they pick the same guy. Presumably none of these POI's have alibis or they would have already been excluded. How else are they going to reduce the number if DNA isn't doing it?

That's not the way the justice system works here.

 

[RIP Meagan + Johnny]

Does anyone have the link to the news video from last summer where the reporter said the BG video was taken on Libby’s selfie camera? I’m having a hard time finding it. TIA.

 

[relentless.]

Please let me add my welcome to gregjrich's so kindness.

Thank you for joining WS and taking the time to share thoughts, LaurelTedytamer.

:welcome6:​

Relentless! Thank you for joining WS! For taking the time to pitch in and I hope you continue! Great nickname too.

:welcome4:​

Thank you! it has long been my business and racing nickname down in florida.

 

[Yellow Rose]

I watched the Grey Hughes animation video and found it chilling. Those girls must have been so frightened to see a predator closing in on them.

In my mind I had assumed that the girls were side by side for much of their hike. I envisioned them mostly walking together down the trail and across the bridge, probably chatting and giggling. I figured they would have been together when approached by BG. But the video makes it appear that Libby had already made it across the bridge ahead of Abby and that BG closed in on Abby as she was reaching the SE end of the bridge (it was really interesting that the dark blur in one of the BG photos may actually have been Abby's clothing). I hadn't considered the possiblity that the girls were more than arms length apart, and that BG was that close to one of the girls when Libby got the video. I always thought they filmed him aprroaching from a distance.

Instead of filming, Libby could have possibly run away when she sensed danger and saw BG getting close to Abby, but she chose to stick with her friend who was trapped on the bridge. I think Libby captured the entire abduction on her phone. She really is a hero.

I actually even way back when the pic was first realeased thought the police had edited out Abby’s arm from the picture and that was the reason it was so blurred in that one area. But the video makes it even more intensely scary

 

[newredtabby]

Just re-watching the Dr Phil show again. It is clearly stated that when the pickup person (Dad) called twice and the girls didn't pickup, he immediately headed down the trail to the Monon High Bridge. So, either the girls typically went to the bridge, or people knew that that's where they went THAT day. Either way, people knew they would be at the bridge that day. Not walking through the woods, not just hanging out at the drop off spot, not walking any of the other trails that spider off multiple directions, but AT THE BRIDGE. So, who else knew this?


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[RIP Meagan + Johnny]

Agree with you Her.

This thread has morphed into not believing the statements LE has issued.

They said a witness helped with the creation of the sketch.
Someone posted a quote from Holeman up thread.

There are a number of facts that we DO know.

No need to create scenarios around those facts that aren't true.

Hi BoP,

I couldn’t agree with you more.

I’m working on additions to my “Just the Facts” post from the previous thread. I should have it up later this afternoon.

 

[cluciano63]

So I wonder why he hasnt been excluded yet?

Why haven't many others, according to LE? Who knows? Maybe they don't have the perp's DNA after all.

 

[Mamamerced]

Just re-watching the Dr Phil show again. It is clearly stated that when the pickup person (Dad) called twice and the girls didn't pickup, he immediately headed down the trail to the Monon High Bridge. So, either the girls typically went to the bridge, or people knew that that's where they went THAT day. Either way, people knew they would be at the bridge that day. Not walking through the woods, not just hanging out at the drop off spot, not walking any of the other trails that spider off multiple directions, but AT THE BRIDGE. So, who else knew this?


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Well, someone called the dad to ask if he could pick up the girls. I have no idea where he was when he received the call, but possibly someone heard then. Or perhaps the person that dropped off the girls mentioned it in passing and was overheard.

 

[relentless.]

Just re-watching the Dr Phil show again. It is clearly stated that when the pickup person (Dad) called twice and the girls didn't pickup, he immediately headed down the trail to the Monon High Bridge. So, either the girls typically went to the bridge, or people knew that that's where they went THAT day. Either way, people knew they would be at the bridge that day. Not walking through the woods, not just hanging out at the drop off spot, not walking any of the other trails that spider off multiple directions, but AT THE BRIDGE. So, who else knew this?


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I believe they were close knit as friends and family , adding to that their young age, and it isn't surprising family knew. But, and this is my biggest point, Libby was a SM user, and in a small town its easy to identify a spot like that. Someone could have easily made a fake SC account and friended her, then located her within the ~ 15 to 20 minutes after the picture of Abby was posted. That is, if they were being electronically stalked rather than physically in person. The other thing to consider, though a minor detail, is that the picture was posted at 2:07 p.m., but it most likely was taken somewhere around 2 to 5 minutes before that, as Libby used a filter, and most likely had to select which friends she was going to send the photo too, as well as selected to post it to her story. It is a possibility that BG could have crossed nearly the entire Bridge simply in the time between the time the photo was first taken, and the time the photo uploaded.

Add to this that they were clearly taking their time that day, we need to consider how many filters she scrolled through. They didn't seem to be in a rush before they encountered BG.

MOO

 

[MistyWaters]

Agree with you Her.

This thread has morphed into not believing the statements LE has issued.

They said a witness helped with the creation of the sketch.
Someone posted a quote from Holeman up thread.

There are a number of facts that we DO know.

No need to create scenarios around those facts that aren't true.

I absolutely agree. It's rather ironic - to want more information from LE while ignoring information that has already been provided by LE.

Aside from GH's theories demonstrated by his videos, he seems to have good insight about how far out of the realm of reality some have driven this case. It must be deeply frustrating for the family to observe the murder of their children become a twisted form of entertainment on SM. JMO