IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #82

[ocgrad]

Maybe this has been answered but with LE confirming there is more to the video and audio than what was shown, they’re not releasing it so it doesnt compromise any future trial.


Could someone tell me their opinion on that? How would releasing more bring harm to the court case when we have yet to see an arrest, let alone a suspect? How could it do more harm than good?

Two girls are dead and a year later, the public and LE have nothing to show or tell the public and it doesn’t seem like theyre making ANY progress other than hinting with wishy-washy statements that are as vague as possible.

During their investgation and questioning suspects they need to hold as much back as possible so that there are things only known by them and the killer(s). If they are able to get them talking they may say something about the the scene or the girls that has not been released to the public which would be used to convict them. The more they have to release the less cards they hold to trip someone up to admitting something they shouldn't otherwise know. Because even when someone identifies BG(s) that's when their work begins because in addition to finding him and bringing him in then they have to put it all together so it can be proven in court.

 

[kstephens98]

“He saw something. He could not figure out what it was. There were two deer standing up there. As he looked up to see what it was, that is when he saw them,” said Libby’s grandma, Becky Patty

https://www.google.com/amp/cbs4indy...-cbs4-through-abby-and-libbys-last-hours/amp/



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The girls were on the ground.

Literally the next paragraph of the article states, "It was a volunteer searcher who discovered the bodies of the Delphi teens, lying in the grass between a group of trees deep in the woods."


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[cluciano63]

Seems pointless to me to go on about the search now. And I feel 99.9% certain they had been killed within an hour or less of the video. When searching is suspended it is usually to prevent searchers getting injured, or lost themselves. Jmo

 

[ocgrad]

I am not suddenly "enraged" about it. That is not my point at all. My point is, WHY did they call it off so early (literally!), and WHAT were they thinking, (literally!) because I believe that line of thinking/reasoning/train of thought could lead us to understand the case better (EXAMPLE- 1 had recently run away overnight and had a particular reason ....or EXAMPLE there was a gathering of kids going on across town, girls had been forbidden to go... EXAMPLES ONLY) ... Understanding the WHAT&/WHY initial search was called off after only about 6 hrs with 2 very young girls might help shed some light on the circumstances in those early days. Not enraged. And not blaming, either. (!!!) Asking seriously. Seeking to understand!!!!

They said that the terrain is so rough and it was so dark they feared someone searching would be injured. Also Libby's phone was pinging around town so they did not fear foul play.

 

[Peterpaul]

You are 100% correct on that one! Hopefully with the DNA they can find this Creature!

 

[Ember123]

rsbm

Thank you especially for that paragraph. I've always thought there was at least another person involved and they were under the bridge.

Maybe there was a couple, 2 ppl (2 males??) under bridge arguing about whether to grab these 2 girls they saw approaching (one wanted to, other reluctant or didn't want to) .... maybe one is BG as photographed, the other was under the bridge waiting... girls fled, males caught up to them, fight ensued,now that 2nd person (non-BG) is the one LE is appealing to.

 

[kstephens98]

JMO, but second guessing and criticizing LE efforts and tactics contributes absolutely nothing to the solution of bringing this killer to justice.

Actually, I find it a little disturbing that some people are so appalled and offended at LE temporarily suspending the search @ midnight considering the Carroll County sheriffs office only has 11 deputies who serve over 20,000 citizens in 19 cities. There were still family members as well as others from the community that continued to search throughout the night.

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[Ember123]

I fear they weren’t on the ground... is that a possibility? I have no sources that lead me to this thought, which I’ve had for awhile.


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I recall (sorry no link) it being said they didn't realize it was a crime scene initially. This made me think hanging ... but i later thought buried well with leaves and branches maybe against an embankment. (Wish i had saved this... was from waaaaaaaaaay back, Feb or March 2017.)

 

[BIC]

If there was 2 people, and LE knows there were 2 people, is that something they would keep to themselves? I hope not, because if anybody who thinks they recognize BG, but knows he was with a friend that day, would not consider him as being BG since BG was alone on the bridge.
Personally I think he was a lone wolf. IMO


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[kat913]

Hi kat913,
Suppose someone tipped off LE to BG. LE contacts BG and right away BG contacts his lawyer. Lawyer then tells LE no way are you talking to my client. This gives LE ZERO probable cause for a search warrant for DNA or anything else. Remember there if there is DNA at the scene BG is not in CODIS. Suppose BG has no criminal record and is an upstanding citizen? A judge will never approve a search warrant for DNA because police say someone with no prior criminal record looks like a sketch. A lawyer can also appeal a search warrant. I think one of the biggest mistakes in this case was thinking BG was a homeless hobo. What if BG is a well thought of member of society with the means to hire attack dog defense attorneys? Sure would make it a lot more difficult for LE.

Thanks so much....my thoughts as well!! Which helps me feel hopeful about the lull in the case.

 

[Rott Mom]

All this bickering will lead to this thread shut down again

 

[Ember123]

Searchers went down behind RL's place. They knocked on his door about 6 or 6:30 pm and asked his permission.

IF bodies were hanging, searchers looking afoot with flashlights may have missed them that night.

 

[heartgoesout]

JMO, but second guessing and criticizing LE efforts and tactics contributes absolutely nothing to the solution of bringing this killer to justice.

Actually, I find it a little disturbing that some people are so appalled and offended at LE temporarily suspending the search @ midnight considering the Carroll County sheriffs office only has 11 deputies who serve over 20,000 citizens in 19 cities.

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I have the utmost respect for all law enforcement. And I can't imagine what that night was like. I don't mean to come across as criticizing towards LE, and I so sorry if it seemed that way!

I am seeking answers. I think BG is local. We don't know who the heck he is. My questioning is more along the lines of was there someone that went home that maybe shouldn't have? Someone that stayed that seemed out of place? went there own way? What info made calling off the search acceptable at that point?
I haven't heard what else was done that night. Does anything stand out as unusual?

I truly don't want to beat a dead horse but I can't help going back to I would have walked the hills with broken ankles searching...for any child for that matter not just my own.

 

[kkdj]

Have we looked thru court cases that happened that morning? Maybe this was someone who lost custody of his children and wanted to get back at someone for it. I know it sounds wild but whatever reason BG had for doing this is going to sound wild!

 

[IceIce9]

Sorry but I still think it totally INSANE the search was called off around midnight! WTH??? I don't understand. Where did they think these girls were??? What were they thinking at that time??? Not seeking to blame any one but - I have never understood this at all. Seriously. What if the girls had been taken into a building in the vicinity and were being molested? Just call it off for the night? Whaaaaaattttttt??? WHY?????

Hardly a week goes by without at least one alert on Indianapolis news channels regarding a missing teen, usually a girl, usually age 13 to 15. In nearly every case it turns out to be a runaway, or maybe a girl who spent the night at a friend’s home. Miscommunication so that parents didn’t know, or teen was angry about something and didn’t inform them. Or two young girls wanted to go to a movie they weren’t allowed to see and snuck out.

Abby and Libby definitely were in the age group for this kind of scenario. I know that most people were thinking runaways or at least the type of “mini runaway” that young teen girls often do where they just go hide out overnight at a friend’s home without permission because of a disagreement with parents.

This is small town Indiana. The thought of two girls being murdered would have been on no one’s radar.

When we heard that the search had been called off that night we just assumed that LE had pretty well figured out that the girls had run away to another friend’s home and they would go home in the morning. Because in small town Indiana that is the way these things turn out.

 

[soonersleuther]

If what LE releases isn't getting results, and they have more video or audio-- its time to release more. Doesn't do any good to hold back and go cold.

 

[minazoe]

i think its obvious the girls didn't know this guy, it's interesting to me that the phone started recording when it did and I wonder if they even knew the were inadvertently recording... to me this is an amazing aspect to this case.
I think he was there in that park waiting for the girls.

not just there to do evil but there to do evil to Libby and Abby..he found them somehow, was stalking them somehow..maybe he was in the lot with his vehicle and saw them get dropped off..he could have moved the vehicle and then descended on the park..

or he could have stashed his vehicle somewhere and been out on the trails earlier waiting.

again I feel like something in this crime scene . shows intent, shows planning and preparedness, or then again maybe the crime scene shows ( experience, cunning and artistry) with sadism and ritual cruelty, think BTK with his horrific displays of carnage and depravity.

it's so bizarre that you cannot discern this man from this photo, that nothing is distinct or identifiable.
if it's intentional he did a good job. MOO

 

[carbuff]

Just checking in...

 

[Ember123]

Hi everyone. Here’s an animated gif I did for another site. I thought it would be good to share to get more eyes and ideas.

Instead of cropping BG onto a static backdrop, I’ve stitched the two frames together using his right foot as the anchor point. I think this method does a pretty decent job of recreating a video-ish appearance.

Seeing the changes in frames repeatedly should help with our ability to notice any features/clues we might have missed otherwise. Please take a look and comment if anything stands out.

My observations:
1. Libby is moving to her right as she is filming. You can see the tracks rotate (yaw) between the two frames.
2. BG indeed casts shadows. I think this faintly – yet clearly – shows shadows by his legs, which fade as his left leg moves up.
3. I think the bright blue blob hanging on his left thigh (Frame #2) is merely lighting. I don’t think it’s an object nor any type of censoring. It comes into view as his thigh hits the light. It looks so low-res because it was blurry video taken on a digital camera. Digital cameras have improved greatly over the years, but still struggle with imperfect lighting. I can see a similar light blue blur on his lower left calf in Frame #1.

Looks like his R arm pulls up a bit as if he is beginning to pull something from his pocket?

 

[IceIce9]

Maybe there was a couple, 2 ppl (2 males??) under bridge arguing about whether to grab these 2 girls they saw approaching (one wanted to, other reluctant or didn't want to) .... maybe one is BG as photographed, the other was under the bridge waiting... girls fled, males caught up to them, fight ensued,now that 2nd person (non-BG) is the one LE is appealing to.

I was thinking something very close to this.i think we have picked up on several clues that indicate there could have been two people involved, Or maybe the 2nd person was not actually a participant in the crime but saw BG heading toward the girls, then heard the girls were missing, then found murdered, and put two and two together. Maybe BG and another guy were under the bridge smoking weed, they caught sight of the girls, BG said, “Watch this” or something similar, then left and followed the girls.

Maybe the guy doesn’t want to report this because he is afraid of getting charged. Or maybe he has outstanding warrants himself and is afraid of going back to prison. Or maybe it is so awful for him thinking that he could have prevented the crime from happening if he would have grabbed BG’s arm and said, “Knock it off” or “Let’s get out of here.”

My opinion only! Just some random thoughts.
And I mentioned smoking weed because I am a regular trail walker and it is not uncommon to smell pot while walking a trail.