IN - Couple charged with abandonment of adopted child after legally changing her age, Sept 2019 #2 *not guilty*

[Meloni88]

How lovely is Cynthia though? When she was talking about why the Barnetts would do what they did and that they thought her a burden she stops herself quickly turns to Natalia and says "you're not a burden, baby." Just real no nonsense loving. I had a godmother like that, all kids need someone like that in their lives. I'm so glad Natalia has it now.

 

[Meloni88]

Don't forget, the stories about how Natalia kept throwing bloody sanitary napkins/whatever Kristine's precise words were, into closets (?) and things; which is what Kristine used as "proof" to say "oh yes, she is menstruating"... because nobody needs to do the things Natalia said Kristine did; and/yet I also firmly believe, as per my earlier post upthread, that Kristine did do them, because they are so bizarre that nobody would make them up.

Also, I agree with you that no way was KB's abusive behavior intended as "teaching someone what it means to have a menstrual cycle". There have got to be about a half dozen ways to illustrate to a female child; "inserting a tampon for show-and-tell" is miles away from any of them. My suspicion says KB was actually trying to stage a situation wherein she would claim that Natalia willingly seduced one of the males in the family, but thought better of it at a later date.

That was my thought as well! If someone in the family was sexually interfering with Natalia, Kristine would not want that ever getting out and there's absolutely no chance at all she would side with Natalia over her own blood. Natalia would become the enemy and Kristine would insist it was Natalia's own fault. The more I look at this the more it seems like a great big victim discrediting attempt. Get ahead of it, get her declared insane or better yet an insane adult so no one ever takes the girl's accusations seriously.

 

[Amonet]

The story has now made it to the front page of the BBC's UK news website. Unfortunately it's not very informative and just repeating stuff from the Dr Phil show and some things from the Daily Mail.

'I'm 16, not a 33-year-old scam artist'

 

[TTF14]

What's the deal with the family she lived with that had the son's arm that got broken?

 

[Meloni88]

What's the deal with the family she lived with that had the son's arm that got broken?

His arm didnt actually break. She said they were playing/wrestling and she landed on one of the Ciccone boys arms and Dyan got mad and said she was trying to break it.

 

[TTF14]

His arm didnt actually break. She said they were playing/wrestling and she landed on one of the Ciccone boys arms and Dyan got mad and said she was trying to break it.

And that was the only reason they had her leave their family?

 

[Meloni88]

And that was the only reason they had her leave their family?

No, the DePauls said it was because of how severe her disabilities were (apparently the Ciccones were only expecting her to have rickets - not sure I believe that but...) and they suffered some kind of loss. Idk if it was financial or a bereavement though.

 

[TTF14]

Has anyone made a timeline for this case?

 

[gitana1]

It seems like the second case was about guardianship and they couldn't, or the judge would be hesitant, to change her age back because that would be overturning another decision. Maybe the Mans thought they could get it resolved that way but couldn't. Maybe the court was stonewalling because they didnt want to acknowledge the colossal *advertiser censored** up they made but now a prosecutor from another county is involved. I'm pretty sure reinstating the original birth certificate will be one of the outcomes of the current case. @gitana1 ?

It won’t be an outcome in the criminal case but it will enable her to go back to civil court and fix the issue, if they’re found guilty.

 

[gitana1]

My mom always had the largest ones I couldn't get those in. I remember my friend having the teen ones. I don't remember seeing them after that.

Man they have all sorts of sizes from super slim to extra large. No kid should be using large!

 

[gitana1]

Would that kid even know what she was doing? She wasn’t even old enough to have had sex Ed class. I can’t imagine any mother handing one of those things to her daughter!

My mom bought them for me. I had to read the instructions. She might have told me to ask if I couldn’t figure it out. I think I was using them within a year. No issues. About 12 or so. Couldn’t stand the other stuff. Yucky.

I taught my little friend when she came of age, whose mom wasn’t much help with anything. (Taught her to shave her too and told her when she needed to start. She was growing pit hair and no one had told her what to do). I just showed her the box and told her how. Sat outside the bathroom and she got it pretty quick.

That’s normal.

What’s not is forcing a baby to use a tampon. Kids that age even if they are on their period shouldn’t be using tampons. Too complicated and you have to have the maturity to know when to change it.

When kids start their period it’s usually pretty light and erratic. If a kid of mine had precocious puberty I would be alerting the teacher and school nurse to the situation and asking them to have her come to the school nurse twice a day to make sure she’s changing out a pad.

Poor babies. I think that’s far too young to deal with something like that. I think 8, 9 and 10 are too young frankly. Kids that age need so much help still with a lot of stuff including even hygiene, often.

And what about the court that increased her age by 13 years, made her legally an adult, and then refused to change it back? On what basis did this judge do it? The bone scans that have been reported showed her to be a child around the age her birth certificate says she is. Did Barnetts produce some other bone scan showing her to be older? I think she was locked up in a psychiatric institution during the first court ruling that she was an adult. Then sounds like Mans got a lawyer to try and change it back and the lawyer lost the case. The mind boggles that with a strike of a pen a child can be changed into a legal adult.

Someone posted in the last thread screen shots of the declaration she filed along with her emergency petition to change N’s age.

It referred to a letter and to Dr. MacLaren’s opinión and to an LSCW’s opinion. No reference to any actual medical or psych reports. And we’ve seen a letter from Dr. MacLaren which is nothing but speculation, lay (informal) opinion based on hearsay emotional bias.

The two bone scans/professional age assessments were not mentioned.

Interestingly, one of the nasty Barnett’s has later said they got a bone scan that showed her to be 14. I wonder if the assessments gave a range. Like “Between 6-9”. “Between 10-14”. Something like that.

But they changed it to 22. How indeed could a judge sign off on that particular age based on no age assessment coming close to that? The only thing said relating to that age was that was the age that would enable her to get certain services.

So it’s not a real age. It’s one they picked and was granted strategically.

That alone is shocking that a court did that. I mean I’ve said we have the benefit of hindsight but that’s an incredible age-jump with seemingly no evidence.

 

[gitana1]

What's the deal with the family she lived with that had the son's arm that got broken?

It sounds to me like a story Kristine told her that she now believes. It is NOT what the DuPaul’s day the Ciccones gave as the reason for the failed adoption.

They said that the Ciccones had a death in the family and possible financial issues, IIRC.

Sounds to me like more insanity from Kristine Barnett.

 

[squareandrabbet]

Man they have all sorts of sizes from super slim to extra large. No kid should be using large!

Also soft plastic applicators, which I should think would be easier for many, as they sort of mold and conform to the heat of the human body, like the type of plastic they use in the top of formal dresses to function as shapewear. I use the kind without applicators, which can indeed be tough to take if/when I'm just beginning or ending a cycle (sorry to all for TMI!).

I also can envision Kristine choosing the most painful option for Natalia, sad to say. I can picture the whole control-freaky conversation, with Natalia feebly trying to insist that she doesn't and has never had a menstrual cycle... and Kristine deciding from her god complex and peculiar bizarre non-logic that hey, a courtroom declared Natalia 22, she's got to be having her period, so she darned well better learn to use a tampon...!

 

[gitana1]

Has anyone made a timeline for this case?

I did earlier but it probably needs more work now due to new info we have. I will post it and anyone feel free to cut, paste, add and edit:

Possible Timeline:

9-4-2003 birth certificate date entry for Natalia's birth.

2008 - child is brought here from Ukraine through an adoption process.

2010- Endocrinologist estimates her age as @ 8 years old.

May 2010- child comes to the Barrett's. According to the birth certificate she would be almost 7. Sometimes internationally adopted kids are made to appear a year younger in paperwork. So if that happened she might have been almost 9. According to the Barrett's she would've been 20 year old. PHOTOS SHOULD BE INSERTED HERE.

Nov. 2010 - child is officially adopted by the Barrett's. This is months after that first bath where they claim they saw she had full pubic hair and was developed at supposedly age 6. So they went through with it anyhow.

Dec. 2010 - here she is supposed to be 7 per her birth certificate. They say she's 21 here. PHOTOS ARE SUPPOSED TO BE INSERTED HERE.

2012 - skeletal survey shows child's age to be 11. (This matches with the first doctor’s finding)

6-12-2012 - Barnetts legally change the child's age to 22 in a probate court process. EVIDENCE THEY USED FROM HER EMERGENCY PETITION SHOUOD BE ADDED HERE.

Sept. 2012 - Here she is supposed to be 9 per her born certificate. The Barrett's say she was 23 here. They haven't yet left her in this photo. They have changed her age and her clothing. PHOTO OF HER SITTING ON COUCH WITH SCARF SHOULD BE INSERTED HERE.

2013 - 4-9-13 The Spark memoir is published. (There is apparently no mention of the adopted daughter in the book but I have no idea what time range it spans). Mother immediately starts an intensive publicity tour.

7-2013 - the Barnetts rent an apartment in Laffayette for the child and leave her there. They move to Canada the same month. They pay the rent on the place but it's not sure for how long.

They claim alternatively for a year and for a few months. CITE. Child is evicted in ADD date for non payment of rent in the amount of $750.00.

2013 - Natalia hangs out with adults at a rehab center. She seems lost. She disappears at a certain point.

August 2013- the Manns take in Natalia.


2014 - February 2014, the Barrett's divorce.


2016 - 2-28-16, kid moves out of the county.


2016- @3-13-16, the Manns apply to be her guardian.

The Barnetts object to the petition citing an age issue. They claim she is an adult.


2018 - the Manns lose the guardianship case and Natalia's age as an adult is not overturned by the original court despite a request of some sort.

Mother claims Ukrainian adopted daughter, 9, was 22 and had dwarfism | Daily Mail Online

 

[Errrr]

My mom bought them for me. I had to read the instructions. She might have told me to ask if I couldn’t figure it out. I think I was using them within a year. No issues. About 12 or so. Couldn’t stand the other stuff. Yucky.

I taught my little friend when she came of age, whose mom wasn’t much help with anything. (Taught her to shave her too and told her when she needed to start. She was growing pit hair and no one had told her what to do). I just showed her the box and told her how. Sat outside the bathroom and she got it pretty quick.

That’s normal.

What’s not is forcing a baby to use a tampon. Kids that age even if they are on their period shouldn’t be using tampons. Too complicated and you have to have the maturity to know when to change it.

When kids start their period it’s usually pretty light and erratic. If a kid of mine had precocious puberty I would be alerting the teacher and school nurse to the situation and asking them to have her come to the school nurse twice a day to make sure she’s changing out a pad.

Poor babies. I think that’s far too young to deal with something like that. I think 8, 9 and 10 are too young frankly. Kids that age need so much help still with a lot of stuff including even hygiene, often.



Someone posted in the last thread screen shots of the declaration she filed along with her emergency petition to change N’s age.

It referred to a letter and to Dr. MacLaren’s opinión and to an LSCW’s opinion. No reference to any actual medical or psych reports. And we’ve seen a letter from Dr. MacLaren which is nothing but speculation, lay (informal) opinion based on hearsay emotional bias.

The two bone scans/professional age assessments were not mentioned.

Interestingly, one of the nasty Barnett’s has later said they got a bone scan that showed her to be 14. I wonder if the assessments gave a range. Like “Between 6-9”. “Between 10-14”. Something like that.

But they changed it to 22. How indeed could a judge sign off on that particular age based on no age assessment coming close to that? The only thing said relating to that age was that was the age that would enable her to get certain services.

So it’s not a real age. It’s one they picked and was granted strategically.

That alone is shocking that a court did that. I mean I’ve said we have the benefit of hindsight but that’s an incredible age-jump with seemingly no evidence.

Yeah, services like deportation.

 

[gitana1]

His arm didnt actually break. She said they were playing/wrestling and she landed on one of the Ciccone boys arms and Dyan got mad and said she was trying to break it.

As if a disabled child that size could break another kid’s arm by wrestling.

 

[Meloni88]

I did earlier but it probably needs more work now due to new info we have. I will post it and anyone feel free to cut, paste, add and edit:

Possible Timeline:

9-4-2003 birth certificate date entry for Natalia's birth.

2008 - child is brought here from Ukraine through an adoption process.

2010- Endocrinologist estimates her age as @ 8 years old.

May 2010- child comes to the Barrett's. According to the birth certificate she would be almost 7. Sometimes internationally adopted kids are made to appear a year younger in paperwork. So if that happened she might have been almost 9. According to the Barrett's she would've been 20 year old. PHOTOS SHOULD BE INSERTED HERE.

Nov. 2010 - child is officially adopted by the Barrett's. This is months after that first bath where they claim they saw she had full pubic hair and was developed at supposedly age 6. So they went through with it anyhow.

Dec. 2010 - here she is supposed to be 7 per her birth certificate. They say she's 21 here. PHOTOS ARE SUPPOSED TO BE INSERTED HERE.

2012 - skeletal survey shows child's age to be 11. (This matches with the first doctor’s finding)

6-12-2012 - Barnetts legally change the child's age to 22 in a probate court process. EVIDENCE THEY USED FROM HER EMERGENCY PETITION SHOUOD BE ADDED HERE.

Sept. 2012 - Here she is supposed to be 9 per her born certificate. The Barrett's say she was 23 here. They haven't yet left her in this photo. They have changed her age and her clothing. PHOTO OF HER SITTING ON COUCH WITH SCARF SHOULD BE INSERTED HERE.

2013 - 4-9-13 The Spark memoir is published. (There is apparently no mention of the adopted daughter in the book but I have no idea what time range it spans). Mother immediately starts an intensive publicity tour.

7-2013 - the Barnetts rent an apartment in Laffayette for the child and leave her there. They move to Canada the same month. They pay the rent on the place but it's not sure for how long.

They claim alternatively for a year and for a few months. CITE. Child is evicted in ADD date for non payment of rent in the amount of $750.00.

2013 - Natalia hangs out with adults at a rehab center. She seems lost. She disappears at a certain point.

August 2013- the Manns take in Natalia.


2014 - February 2014, the Barrett's divorce.


2016 - 2-28-16, kid moves out of the county.


2016- @3-13-16, the Manns apply to be her guardian.

The Barnetts object to the petition citing an age issue. They claim she is an adult.


2018 - the Manns lose the guardianship case and Natalia's age as an adult is not overturned by the original court despite a request of some sort.

Mother claims Ukrainian adopted daughter, 9, was 22 and had dwarfism | Daily Mail Online

I'll work on a new one later today unless someone else wants to do it

 

[mickey2942]

Yeah, services like deportation.

No, like Social Security benefits, food stamps. Entitlement programs.

Adopted children who come to the United States, to simplify it, because there are a multitude of "exceptions". Anyway, come as "Legal Permanent Residents" and are not deported. And usually are eligible for citizenship as soon as the paperwork is completed.

 

[Meloni88]

No, like Social Security benefits, food stamps. Entitlement programs.

Adopted children who come to the United States, to simplify it, because there are a multitude of "exceptions". Anyway, come as "Legal Permanent Residents" and are not deported. And usually are eligible for citizenship as soon as the paperwork is completed.

Sure but the Barnetts probably thought if they made her 22 that would make her 18 when she got here and would invalidate her citizenship (which she got on the basis of being an adopted child). Kristine even made a point of saying in her Facebook live that Natalia was investigated by ICE. No one is gonna convince me this wasnt something they were at least hoping would happen to her.

 

[Meloni88]

Oh sorry "Homeland Security". Who wants to bet if Natalia was investigated by anyone it was Kristine who was the anonymous tipper?