IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #16

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OK, the same poster, SurlySasha, also said this:


This was Thread#4 post #226. I hope she logs on so we can clarify for sure - but she hasn't posted anything for awhile.

Btown, is there anything around the parking at 5 North that can be mistaken for a camera??

I *think* this is the parking area at 5 North. The lights above could probably be mistaken as cameras.

source: photosynth.net/view.aspx?cid=67760639-ac8b-4721-b752-58e0aa17640e (a bit tough to navigate unless you are pretty familiar with the area)
 

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I have been reading about LS here for a while. This is my first post.

The profile picture on the chickjustin twitter account is of ZO and AB. I believe these two are enjoying getting people worked up when they post useless and sometimes tasteless comments.

For example, they tweeted something about a person being seen with LS all over Bloomington the night she was last seen. The link was a youtube music video that ZO posted a year ago with his image. He was wanting people to retweet, I assume to get his music out there. (The music and the video are pretty bad, btw.)
snip

No - chickjustin (twitter) or clueful (a poster in comments section on certain blogs covering the case) or argylesandcigarettes (youtube) is the same person - a female who appears to believe that LS's disappearance is part of a greater nefarious conspiracy involving IU and BPD that has been going on for some years now. You can read her blog but be warned its, um, well, um, ... saying it is 'out there' is being charitable.
 
OK, so Clueful is just using ZO's and AB's pix? Is she a friend of theirs? I am not doubting what you say, I am just confused as to why their pix are the profile pix on her Twitter account.
 
What do you think LE is doing? If you don't feel you're getting YOUR moneys worth then by all means call BPD and tell them that.


Take a look at the news. These kinds of cases are not rare, Read back a couple threads, do a Google search, ask your local F.B.I. office.
These case are piling up all over the country.

No, you must have misunderstood. I didn't say that BPD wasn't doing their job. In fact, I am sure that they are doing an excellent job.


And, there is no evidence that she was doing hard drugs, or that her friends were dealers, or that they dumped her body. Given no evidence, why assume the most terrible possibility?

Not everyone does. Why so much protest you can always use that ignore button right?

Doesn't bother me when people disagree.


That statement would not necessarily mean that they know that LS is dead and that her death took place in Bloomington.

We only know that they are focusing the search locally and that includes fields, woods, and water. What do you think it proposes?

We don't know everything that is being done to find LS. LE and private investigators often choose not to reveal every detail of their inquiry to the MSM. For all we know, LE has already been in touch with Israeli police authorities. We do not know.



I did not deny that LS & her parents talked on the phone everyday, just that it seemed a bit much.

The context of your statement at the time implied that you thought it was not true.
This puts what you believe in direct conflict with what LS's mother says to be true.

You must have misread my post. Do the phone calls have something to do with the case?


What facts are being contradicted?


The fact that there is absolutely no indication of LS leaving the country.

Neither do we have any indication that she stayed in the US.

The fact that her family claims to have had daily contact with her. You cannot just disregard that.

In other words, if you talk to someone on the phone everyday, they cannot possibly run away? Why not?

The fact that the F.B.I. have not taken jurisdiction in this case meaning there is no indication that LS has left Indiana.

I called and spoke with F.B.I. in Bloomington three weeks ago and was told this fact over the phone...so no link.,..but you can call and verify it for yourself.

Sometimes they offer assistance, without taking over the case.




Suppose every poster on the board wrote the same post which said "her friends dumped her body." Hundreds and hundreds of posts all saying the same thing. Would that be useful to read? I don't think so.

No, it would be as useless as chasing non-existing leads out of country.
A much better scenario might consider LS alive and captive here in the states and/or in Indiana. This is still very possible imo.

You are exaggerating the importance of posts.

We do not control the investigation or its budget. We just make comments.


To the extent of my knowledge, LS did not travel to any of those places, nor did she have intense interest in those locations. But I have mentioned NY, LA, PA and esp. NYC and Westchester County. Israel was her most recent destination though.

All F.B.I. matters when and if necessary.

How do we know that the FBI has not looked into this possibility?


But it's not a zero-sum game. If someone were to write some media articles to gain publicity in Israel or conduct a volunteer search, nothing would be lost. Even if she were not to be found in Israel, the Israeli public would still benefit from the information gained.


I think it's a great idea...let us know how it's going and how we can help.

We can all help in whatever way we find possible.


Again the strawman: we can't even think about the "child" being in Israel, because then we would be required to spend hundreds of thousands to sent the entire BPD over there, and it would cost too much.

Already told you...Israel would be an F.B.I. matter...what makes you think BPD would go to Israel.

I was framing the other poster's "strawman" argument. She argued that there was not enough money available to consider Israel, so I assumed she was thinking about the local police budget.


We don't really know what LE thinks happened that morning; therefore, we cannot follow their lead, nor is it important for us to do so.

Wrong again.
If you've followed online or participated in any of the searches or spent any time at the search center then you would know that LE has extremely strong opinions about what happened based on evidence that they have collected.

Got a link?

Besides we are not under any obligation to follow LE's lead with regard to our opinions. The thought is absurd. Do you call the police to ask them who you should vote for, too? They do their job, and we can discuss it all we like. It's freedom of speech.
 
OK, so Clueful is just using ZO's and AB's pix? Is she a friend of theirs? I am not doubting what you say, I am just confused as to why their pix are the profile pix on her Twitter account.

why does anyone chose a pic of someone or something as their profile pic? who knows? maybe she thinks that are involved in the conspiracy? anyway, she changed her pic sometime after July 4th before that it was a photo of herself (i presume it was her photo)
 
New Spierer plea: "Don't be sorry, just start being honest" - With video
http://www.wthr.com/story/15049595/spierer-parents-dont-be-sorry-just-start-being-honest

Investigators say they've talked to many persons of interest, yet still are waiting to question others.

"We'll just see how the investigation plays out once we've had an opportunity not only to talk with them, but see how their version of events fits into the information that we have," Qualters said.

DOH!!! :doh:
 
I have a question, and I apologize if it has already been answered.

Why did LS's friends contact LE so fast? What did they learn, and from whom, that made them panic and go to the police? She could have been working out, having breakfast/lunch with a friend, sleeping at a friend's apt.

And, is this only on TV, or does a person need to be missing for 24 hours before police consider that person missing? But, in this case, the kids who went to LE told them or showed them something so compelling that LE reacted immediately.

Another thing: Was LS upset or distraught about the Smallwood altercation? She apparently saw CR get punched by ZO, got CR to his apt., then asked MB, CR's roommate, if he wanted to party.

Then she went to JR's apt. where there had been a party earlier in the evening. If JR fell asleep/passed out, and LS left, he wouldn't know what time she left or which direction she headed. Perhaps he said she left at 4:30 in order to explain the 4:15 phone call to DR.

If that is the case, the 3:38 sighting could fit into the timeline. Apparently, AB fits the description of the man the bar manager saw. He might have been goofing off, putting LS over his shoulder. Did he take LS to his apt. at 10th and College?

During the Smallwood altercation, did LS say something to ZO, after he hit CR, that offended him? It has been stated that ZO has anger issues.

Could ZO have run into LS when she was on her way back to Smallwood or could he have been in the apt. he shares with AB if AB brought LS there?

I cannot figure out a connection between JR and ZO and AB. Actually, I cannot figure a connection between ZO and AB with any of the other POI's.

And could whatever happened the night of June 2 have been a continuation of the fights at the Indy 500 four days before? What were those disagreements about?
 
New Spierer plea: "Don't be sorry, just start being honest" - With video
http://www.wthr.com/story/15049595/spierer-parents-dont-be-sorry-just-start-being-honest

Investigators say they've talked to many persons of interest, yet still are waiting to question others.

"We'll just see how the investigation plays out once we've had an opportunity not only to talk with them, but see how their version of events fits into the information that we have," Qualters said.

DOH!!! :doh:

still waiting to question persons of interest. hmmm interesting


it is possible that the "Don't be sorry, just start being honest" plea is directed at someone - CR did say in an interview "that's all I can say, I'm sorry. ... " Being sorry that he couldn't say more publicly to the press, is my interpretation.

it seems a stretch that is what the family is referring to but i guess it is possible. Or maybe someone has said privately that they were sorry but they didn't have knowledge and the family doesn't believe them.

Also, I have been under the impression from media reports and interviews with his lawyer that CR has been the most available and cooperative of known POIs and one of the last to leave town. He has been interviewed multiple times by BPD, house/car/phone records searched, submitted DNA, stuck around town long enough to get harangued by the media to the point of telling them to leave him alone. but of course we don't know what any of them have told or not told BPD or the family.

Anyway - CR comment to press is here:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mW_ySvDPnw"]YouTube - ‪Search for Spierer: Police collect DNA‬‏[/ame]

around the 2:10 mark
 
Fwiw the 2nd pic of truck has a "bas relief" effect. (I posted it a few wks ago.) I think LE mentioned possible painting supplies (?) in the back.
 

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Hey I don't remember anyone else mentioning it and I acknowledge that this "end the drug war" guy is possibly a bit of a nut. But some friends who are still in Bloomington said he is posting outside Kilroy's and other bars and interviewing students about LS when they leave/go to the bars. The videos he posted are interesting, albeit purely filled with drunk kids and conjecture. But the video was made quite a while ago and it's still interesting what LS's fellow students have to say about her/her friends etc... I didn't know her but I know kids like her and myself, who came from the Northeast, and it's possibly quite telling to hear what her peers have to say when they guess what happened that night. Not posting the link b/c I don't think it's allowed and the dude is clearly a zealot.
 
Makes sense to me, because not only drunk drivers would be familiar with the jail and liquor store, so would the drinking students, etc.

That is why i question being seen walking down college at 4-430am to get back to small-wood. At that time of morning it would seem there could have been LE patrolling on college. And she wanted to avoid that after being arrested last year for PI.
So since she was barefooted, she walked around the gravel and got on the sidewalk that is located in front of the railing that connects to the alley, and was going to walk back to the alley and then home to small-wood. Like she had done on several occasions i presumed.
But that would only be possible if this occurred on her way back.
And after coming out of the alley. Maybe coming out she was on the sidewalk and was taking where the key was found. If the story is true that someone came along around 3am and found the items. That is about a 9 minute window. Which would make me believe it occurred after she exited the alley and got on the sidewalk to walk around the gravel and towards 5 north.
The stranger abduction?
That is a small tight area. Access i believe on a one lane from east and west on 11th street between college on the east and the other street to the west connected by 11th. Or north and south in the alley. And the width of the alley is small. And i don't believe much traffic goes through there, except for locals whom have a residence there. I don't see why someone driving around looking for someone to abduct would be in that area around that time.
I still believe it was by someone whom was already in that area, around that time, for whatever reason.

Off topic......Just now on local news. The body found in fall-creek has been ID. and she is from Indianapolis and are trying to find family members.

THE ABOVE ALL MOO AND SPECULATION ON MY PART.
NOTHING POSTED AS BEING FACT.
UNLESS OTHERWISE KNOWN TO BE.
 
I have a question, and I apologize if it has already been answered.

Why did LS's friends contact LE so fast? What did they learn, and from whom, that made them panic and go to the police? She could have been working out, having breakfast/lunch with a friend, sleeping at a friend's apt.

And, is this only on TV, or does a person need to be missing for 24 hours before police consider that person missing? But, in this case, the kids who went to LE told them or showed them something so compelling that LE reacted immediately.

Another thing: Was LS upset or distraught about the Smallwood altercation? She apparently saw CR get punched by ZO, got CR to his apt., then asked MB, CR's roommate, if he wanted to party.

Then she went to JR's apt. where there had been a party earlier in the evening. If JR fell asleep/passed out, and LS left, he wouldn't know what time she left or which direction she headed. Perhaps he said she left at 4:30 in order to explain the 4:15 phone call to DR.

If that is the case, the 3:38 sighting could fit into the timeline. Apparently, AB fits the description of the man the bar manager saw. He might have been goofing off, putting LS over his shoulder. Did he take LS to his apt. at 10th and College?

During the Smallwood altercation, did LS say something to ZO, after he hit CR, that offended him? It has been stated that ZO has anger issues.

Could ZO have run into LS when she was on her way back to Smallwood or could he have been in the apt. he shares with AB if AB brought LS there?

I cannot figure out a connection between JR and ZO and AB. Actually, I cannot figure a connection between ZO and AB with any of the other POI's.

And could whatever happened the night of June 2 have been a continuation of the fights at the Indy 500 four days before? What were those disagreements about?

We're thinking alike on a possible scenario.
I'm not convinced JR got the time right either.
This scenario brings some loose ends together such as the 3:38 witness sighting.
But then, there is that darn 4:15 call to DR that JR says was LS calling?
 
Good morning! Ive been lurking here since thread 1 and finally was just able to become 1 of the team. This is most def the best site to come to to discuss LS and what may have happened to her. I just wanted to introduce myself and say hello! I lurk no more! I very much look forward to joining in the discussion! Have a blessed day!
 
Welcome to WebSleuths, Carmen101 and cspring!! Look forward to reading your posts.
 
I've been really interested in knowing what the police knew and revealed when, partly because I feel like some of the press reports I'm relying on were somewhat sloppy in their reporting of the details. I also feel like the police were a little less guarded with information earlier on than they are now, as they are developing a theory and changing their minds about what might be sensitive/significant.

I spent a little time last night this morning listening to and transcribing the first couple press conferences I ran across. For what they're worth to others, I'll post. I haven't been doing them in any particular order - just as the uncut conferences popped up on google. 6/10 was a bit easier than 6/7 because 6/7 is longer and the questions were more jumbled, so I've finished 6/10 first. I'll paste in 6/10 in my next post. Apologies in advance for its length.

If anyone knows of a place where transcriptions are already published feel free to point me (and others) to the location and I'll remove mine.
 
6/10 Press Conference
http://www.theindychannel.com/video/28197690/index.html

We’ll be transitioning to regular public information officer.
To address a couple things you’re probably wondering about: The dive team search based on tip we got about a specific location we should search. They did not get finished, so they did go back out and finish that up. Didn’t get it covered in one afternoon, so went back to finish. Negative result.

We did a checkpoint this morning. Not a traffic checkpoint or for drunk driving. 11th and College about same timeframe and of course we’re talking about the same day of the week to see if anybody is someone who comes through regularly to see if they saw anything. Made contact with 135 cars. Spoke with everybody, passed a flier and asked if anyone saw anything. That did not provide any results. May be looking at doing that again, particularly at select times and date we may get someone who does go through there occasionally.

Additional canine searches last night, negative result.

I’d like to put out a little bit of a plea. We very much appreciate the businesses that provided us with video footage. Some we knew had video footage and we solicited it and received it from them, we may have missed some businesses that have video, so if there are businesses that think they have it, just reach out to us, we’ll come take a look and see if we can find out anything from that. Between Smallwood and Apartment on 11th either on Morton or College or the alley between them.

We know that AMW is getting ready to run the Lauren’s case on their program this Sat. night, so we have some things set up, FBI helping, tip management program capable of maintaining information on a large number of tips.

Any Q’s?

Q: It’s been a week now. Are you losing hope, how are you feeling about the search and the investigation?
A: We are not losing hope. We are concentrating completely on this case, and finding Lauren, and we certainly want to find her alive and hope that’s the case.

Q: Do you believe she’s alive?
A: I believe she certainly may be, and I hope she is.

Have you checked dumpsters, landfills, waste facilities?
A: We have checked that with negative results.

Q: What type of questions did you ask at the traffic stop last night?
A: We basically asked is this someplace you normally go through at this time and day? And, did you see anything, were you here last week at this time of day? That kind of thing.

Q: Aside from the search warrant to get the surveillance video, have any other search warrants been executed?
A: Yes, many search warrants have been executed.

Q: What did you find in CR’s apartment? (other question at same time, not answered)
Q: Dive teams, and various checkpoints you’ve mentioned, they’ve all within this area at the last week, what does it tell you about this area? The searches have all come up negative? (question inaudible)
A: We want to cover very thoroughly but we also gradually are spreading out. Mr. Spierer will mention a couple things about that in just a minute.

Q: Do you now feel this area locally is completely covered?
A: Absolutely not. I’ll never feel it’s completely covered, could always be a searcher that missed something or something like that. That’s why we continue to go over it

Q: Can you tell us if there’s anyone who’s a suspect? Anyone who’s suspected in this at all?
A: We do not have anybody that we characterize as a suspect at this time.

Q: Have you looked into any of that surveillance video from the apartment.
A: At this point we are not releasing any of it. We are still discussing it.

Q: Do you think you might be?
A: We are discussing that.

Q: Why have you asked for US Marshalls downtown today?
A: They are helping us with a particular type of search. We don’t want to go into any more detail on that. We have investigative reasons we don’t want to go into detail on that.

Q: Sex offenders? That possibility?
A: We’re not going to go into more detail on that.

Q: There’s multiple construction sites between 11th street and LS’s building at Smallwood, have you talked with construction workers people who may have missed work or who may have developed an interest in her?
A: We have spoken with many construction workers like that, yes.

Q: You spoke about 10 POIs in the beginning of the week, is that number still the case? Is it less than that?
A: We are not prepared to __ anybody and so yes, anyone who’s a POI remains so.

Q: Do you have more than that now?
A: No, I would say that that’s our group of POI that we’re looking at.

Q: The businesses along there on 11 and College that do have surveillance video set up, and I understand that you’re looking at some of that, do you have cars or something that you’re looking at that were going down the street at 4:30 in the morning?
A: We’ve seen some vehicles in those videos that we are working to ID by video enhanced because typically surveillance video like that does not show… you know it’s hard to tell the specifics, so we’re working on that.

Q: How confident are you that she really was at 11th and College around 4:30 in the morning?
A: Well, the last place that we can be totally confident she was was further south. So, you know, we’re just going again on various statements to place her at the more northern part.

Q: Is the Monroe reservoir search completely over, completely done?
A: Absolutely not. We searched a particular part of that, based on the information we got, naming a particular part. As we get any info like that we will do the same thing.

Q: Can you comment on Mr. Saltzman’s statements that there were perhaps 2-4 individuals who may have seen LS after she left the apartment?
A: I don’t want to comment on Mr. Saltzman’s statement.

Q: Out of the 10 POIs, are all of them known to Lauren’s group?
A: Not necessarily.

Q: Smallwood apt complex just turned in 200 pages of data log, card swipes in and out of the building for a 36 hour period at the time when she disappeared. How useful could something like that be to this investigation?
A: As you say they just turned it in. So we need to look and see what information was included there. So we can can track when POIs when they came in and out. We have not actually seen it, it just got turned over to us.

Q: Can you be more specific when you say the last place you can be totally confident where she was further south?
A: Well, she was depicted on video between 10th and 11th.

Q: Was that on College?
A: No, that’s in between the buildings on 10th and 11th.

Q: Heading toward her apartment?
A: Heading toward the apartment on 11th.

Q: Have all 10 of the POIs now been interviewed? You said yesterday that you were still arranging interviews?
A: There are still some that have not been interviewed.

Q: Is that because they are not cooperating or just because they can’t be reached?
A: No, I can’t characterize it like that. To some extent it’s just that we haven’t received return phone calls from a couple people.

Q: Have you found her keys?
A: We found keys, that were…actually, friends first found keys turned them over to us, but we found keys in the small card purse or coin purse in the alley. The same place we where last saw her on video.

Q: What’s going to happen this weekend?
A: Basically, we&#8217;re getting ready for the&#8230; we&#8217;re setting up this new tip procedure&#8230;Reminds me, I&#8217;d like to put out an email address, policetips@bloomingtonpolice.com. <more about email address> &#8230; I&#8217;m sorry, I&#8217;ve lost track&#8230;what was the&#8230;?

Q: So what are you doing this weekend?
A: We are getting ready to set up that&#8230; we&#8217;ll actually have an investigator go out, two waiting for tips that need immediate attention, mean time our personnel are set up to take tips the whole weekend, we&#8217;ll be meeting with the family, we&#8217;ll have investigators ready to act on any information we get.

Q: Regarding the Smallwood data you got today, did you request that previously?
A: We had asked for, and they told us they would give it to us that they did bring it over today. My Sargent just told me that they brought it over before the meeting.

Q: Why did it take them a week?
A: I&#8217;m not sure.

Q: The video you say that caught her was 10th toward 11th, can you give us the time exactly?
A: I don&#8217;t have it in front of me, I don&#8217;t have the exact time, but it was after the video depicts her leaving Smallwood.

Q: Oh, so she was not alone?
A: No.

Q: So she was with this other gentleman? You believe, right?
A: One of the acquaintances, yes.

Q: And Nothing after that?
A: Right

Q: After that - so we&#8217;re talking roughly 3?
A: Yes, a little after 3

Q: Do you believe her boyfriend was with her at any point during that night or in the early morning hours?
A: That&#8217;s information that I just don&#8217;t want to go into&#8230; the specifics on that yet.

Q: Have you spoken with her boyfriend?
A: Yes.

Q: And what&#8217;s the situation there?
A: We continue to speak with him, he&#8217;s cooperative.

Q: Is he one of the POI?
A: Certainly.

Q: Has he helped at all with the search?
A: I don&#8217;t know if&#8230; I think he&#8217;s participated with the volunteer searches.

Ended Q&A, turned over to the family.
 

Q: Can you be more specific when you say the last place you can be totally confident where she was further south?
A: She was depicted on video between 10th and 11th.

Q: Was that on college
In between the buildings on 10th and 11th.

Q: Have you found her keys?
A: We found keys, actually, friends first found keys turned them over to us, we found keys in the small card purse or coin purse in the alley. The same place we last saw her on video.
OK So the keys were found in the alley at the same spot where the video was taken. That's not by the gravel lot.


Q: Have you spoken with her boyfriend?
A: Yes.

Q: And what’s the situation there?
We continue to speak with him, he’s cooperative.
JW is cooperative. More than we can say about JR.
 
Q: Can you be more specific when you say the last place you can be totally confident where she was further south?
A: She was depicted on video between 10th and 11th.

Q: Was that on college
In between the buildings on 10th and 11th.

Q: Have you found her keys?
A: We found keys, actually, friends first found keys turned them over to us, we found keys in the small card purse or coin purse in the alley. The same place we last saw her on video.
OK So the keys were found in the alley at the same spot where the video was taken. That's not by the gravel lot.


Q: Have you spoken with her boyfriend?
A: Yes.

Q: And what&#8217;s the situation there?
We continue to speak with him, he&#8217;s cooperative.
JW is cooperative. More than we can say about JR.

Q: Have you found her keys?
A: We found keys, actually, friends first found keys turned them over to us, we found keys in the small card purse or coin purse in the alley. The same place we last saw her on video.

!!FRUSTRATING!!

Makes absolutely no sense.
Something so simple.
Where were the keys found.
Has turned into something so complex-ed.

It was my impression those keys were found on the sidewalk
in front of the railing and they picked them up from there and lay them on the railing
or on the cement the railing is attached to where someone lived/lives
in-case they belonged to someone living in that apartment.

LE SHOULD RELEASE SOME VIDEO.
THEY ALREADY TALKED ABOUT IT.
SO RELEASING IT SHOULD NOT INTERFERE
WITH THE INVESTIGATION.

She was taking either after coming out of the alley.
Or on her way back to the alley to go home to southwood/smallwood.
And that depends on the timeline of the people finding the items
around 3am. After she was seen coming out of the alley at 251am!

She was on that sidewalk that connects the alley to prevent
herself from walking on the gravel because she was not wearing any shoes.

No cell, no shoes, no key, no card Nothing.

I would dragged that boy into headquarters.
And question him for several hours with wires attached.
But that's not going to happen right now.
Because hes got the Mike Tyson attorney
the parents are paying thousands for.
To keep there son directly separated from LE.

They want the DNA.
So when they find her body.
With unknown DNA they can do an immediately test
to determine if it belongs to any of the POI.
Because the chances are hi, any unknown DNA found on her, that DNA wont be in any database.

That statement given about seeing her turn the corner at 4 430am whatever
is bull-crap!!!!!!!...........Can i prove it no.
But after going there myself and looking i say it is bull-crap.

 
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