IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #16

[Alliecog]

walker quoted the following post but i don't know who the op is but i would also like a link to LE's statements. thanks, jade.

Wrong again.
If you've followed online or participated in any of the searches or spent any time at the search center then you would know that LE has extremely strong opinions about what happened based on evidence that they have collected.

Any word on what evidence this is?

 

[phantomthought]

Unless you've been living under a rock you know what a 20 year old, wealthy Northeastern student at a midwest Big Ten school means when she says "party" at 3:00am.

One of the few clear public statements the BPD has publicly made was that they have "absolutely" heard rumors of an OD and can't rule it out. Virtually every "reputable news organization that [does] have a reputation to protect" has reported on this, <modsnip>.

HT believes JR is your best point? She's been inconsistent throughout.

Excuse me but you are the one that used HT comment to support your point of view.If you consider her to be unreliable perhaps you should not.But hey we could go back and forth on this all day long and accomplish nothing.My point in my original comment is You,me and many other posters have advanced theories on less than the facts.Many times on mere speculation and that has been okay.Suddenly this one poster comes along with a POV that people do not seam to like and all of a sudden the rules change.Now suddenly he has to justify his position with "facts" something that has not been required of anyone else.Not content with holding him or her to this higher standard they then want to accuse him of stereotyping her because she is Jewish.Somehow I get the feeling that these same people would not accuse you of stereotyping her because she is a " 20 year old, wealthy Northeastern student at a midwest Big Ten school".

 

[GoodAim]

That is not the same BB!!! The kidnapping charge was in 2000 -- when our BB was 12 years old. This kind of speculation without checking makes me leery about posting in the future. Not to attack you Good, but you got to do a little checking before you post stuff like this.

Sorry about that big mistake. Don't let someone like me keep you from posting. I made a leap from one "comment" about his felonies, not your writing, and I was wrong, wrong, wrong.

 

[TonyGatto]

Sorry about that big mistake. Don't let someone like me keep you from posting. I made a leap from one "comment" about his felonies, not your writing, and I was wrong, wrong, wrong.

Nothing better than someone who can admit a mistake. We're all human.

 

[Jupiter812]

Sorry about that big mistake. Don't let someone like me keep you from posting. I made a leap from one "comment" about his felonies, not your writing, and I was wrong, wrong, wrong.

You can go back and edit that out of your post; otherwise, someone is sure to come along and take it out of context.

 

[Jupiter812]

Any word on what evidence this is?

The only thing the public knows is they have video evidence and found card/coin purse. Any evidence collected on searches by folks here (or anywhere for that matter) is not to be made public.

 

[Alliecog]

The only thing the public knows is they have video evidence and found card/coin purse. Any evidence collected on searches by folks here (or anywhere for that matter) is not to be made public.

Thank you! I was not aware of that

 

[Skigirl]

Sorry it's so long - Qaulters is wordier than Parker

----------------------------------------
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w7vKWlxwp9o&feature=related"]YouTube - &#x202a;110613 IU Presser for missing Lauren Spierer&#x202c;&rlm;[/ame]
Qualters
6/13 Press conference

First thing we’re going to talk about today, and I think some of you became aware of it and/or reported on it, uh is that yesterday we did do a flyover of various areas with a helicopter. We checked various waterways within the county as well as railroad tracks and that type of thing, pretty typical things you would fly over, we also checked rooftops and that type of thing. What we view this as is yet a secondary type search or yet another opportunity to make sure that we have covered all the bases and given a thorough examination to the best of our ability not only on foot by officers and searchers and that type of thing but also with you know, the other technology that’s out there and that would certainly include the helicopter.

The other thing it allows us to do, too, is to take some pictures and provide us with an aerial view of some of the locations that we’re talking about, as you can tell there’s a lot of construction and that type of thing going on in the downtown area, but we would like to do is try to preserve this particular area that we’ve focused on or become aware of, and we would just like to prefer that. So, we anticipate that there may very well be yet additional flyovers with the helicopter and so we’ll let you know when those take place.

We are entering the second week of the, full week if you will, of the investigation and we are going to expand those that we interview to include what we would consider maybe a secondary tier of individuals, and I think I spoke of this yesterday, which would include friends, associates, and that type of thing, in an effort to find out more information about Lauren or …any other folks that might be of interest to us. So that’s something we’re going to continue to focus on.

And I think what I’d like to touch on a little bit, too, is that early on this investigation, the number ten was floated as far as the folks or, I think they were labeled POIs, and things like that. I think what I’d like to do is maybe kind of reset our compass a little bit, in understanding that while that may have been an initial number of individuals that were immediately identified to us as those who had some contact with Lauren prior to her disappearance, keep in mind that that is a fluid number for us, that is simply a number that was thrown out early on during a press conference when Lt Parker was standing up here, and at that time that was an initial number he had of individuals that we may have needed to speak to simply because they came to our attention. But keep in mind that that is a number that changes every day because of the people that we do speak with and that we do interview; that number can change; the people can change, and that kind of thing. So, I’ve notice that there has been some focus on that number ten, and I just wanted to get it out there that while that may have been an initial number, keep in mind that that number changes on a daily basis as our interviews continue throughout this investigation.

The next thing that has happened over the last 24 hours would be there has been a national search expert that has arrived in Bloomington to assist us with the search effort. This individual is affiliated with the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children, and they will work in conjunction with and complement the other national search group that has arrived here in Bloomington.
And we are extremely pleased with and could not ask for better cooperation from members of this community who have come out on a daily basis to participate in the searches. What this does is simply allows us yet, we have stepped up to the next level in trying to gain and capitalize on the expertise of individuals who have had this on a national level and on a national scale. So if nothing else what this does is essentially allows us to get more information on how we can do things better and how we can best… find the best result… in our continuing effort to find Lauren. So that is something else that has taken place.

Yesterday there seemed to be some discussion about, I may have come off as appearing directionally challenged with one of the questions that came out and perhaps that was just a misunderstanding on my part of how the question was phrased, but I think in our effort to try to address what we’ve been speaking of over the last week about the area and that type of thing, once we get our video analysis completed we are contemplating trying to provide some type of mapping as well as a timeframe and we are hope to be able to do that in some type of a visual aid so that you folks will have a better understanding of what we’ve been talking about, and what we know about, related to the area that we’ve spoken of. So we hope to have that completed and perhaps we’ll have that available by tomorrow or Wednesday but that is something that we’re hoping to do to have you folks have a better understanding of what we’re… the area that we’re discussing and the timeframes and that type of thing simply because there seem to be a lot of discrepancies out there either because of my misunderstandings or information that’s been provided, but hopefully we can get that out there very soon so you’ll have an understanding and again, we’re hoping to do that as a visual aid.

Lastly on my list, would be the…another thing that we are working on is from that same video analysis would be video enhancement of a vehicle or a couple of vehicles that we may request information from the public.

And I’m not in a position, at this point, to tell you exactly what type of vehicle, what color or anything like that and please allow me to explain why. If we simply float a particular vehicle or a particular color of vehicle, the problem is is that our investigators will be inundated with probably what we would consider false information or we’d be chasing down a lot of leads, potentially unnecessarily. And I think what we’d like to do is to make sure that once that video is enhanced, and we’re hopeful that that will be coming very very soon, idealistically if there is any type of logo or writing or anything like that obviously we are going to be able to make that connection very quickly to place that for a particular business or an individual or something like that. So if we can do that, obviously we know exactly where to go.

Other than that, if we can get the best quality product out there from whatever enhancement is able to be done, then we are able to put a more specific type of vehicle out there and in essence minimize the number of phone calls that we get that will allow us to focus more specifically on the vehicle and/or the individual that may have been driving that.

Now again, what I want to caution against that is not meant to say that we have then made a leap that this person is responsible for anything related to Lauren’s disappearance. I think what we would like to present is that this is a person at this point that may very well have information for us that could lead us to you know, circumstances that may have lead to Lauren’s disappearance.

Again, this is not to be identified as a suspect vehicle, or a vehicle of interest or anything at this point, I don’t want us to make that leap. All I’m simply saying is that this is something that has caught our attention, we are working to enhance that video in an effort to put that out there. And once again, much like everything we’ve done, our only focus is to get information out there in an effort to generate tips from the public.

OK? Those are the five items I have on my list, I will open it up to a few questions.

Q: Would you tell us which video you are gathering this car information from …(inaudible)
A: Quite frankly I’m not sure that I’ve got an exact handle on which location or which video we may be speaking of specifically, but I know it’s from that area, say between you know 10th and 11th street. But again I’m not sure I can say which thoroughfare with any accuracy at this point that we’re talking of. All I know is that there is a vehicle that has come to our attention and that is something that we’re going to try to get enhanced in an effort to see if perhaps that person can be identified and maybe they have information that can be helpful for us.

Q: Was there one or two? (no answer)

Q: This is day 10, how long does the search continue before you decide to scale back?
A: There’s a lot of energy out there and we’re going to certainly continue to capitalize on that energy. That’s not only people in this community, but obviously now that we’ve reached out on a national level, we also know that that national level can bring resources to us that could be of value to us. And always the determination needs to be made, is how can those resources best be utilized? We’ve said all along you can’t just bring a group in here and say, “go do what you do.” What we need to do is try to create a little bit more focus so that we’re utilizing those resources to the best of our ability. But again, we feel pretty confident that the national expert that’s arrived here obviously has access to a lot of different groups that have been used before on a national scale, and a lot of talent that comes for the individual’s circumstances for which they might be utilized. So we think there’s a lot of energy out there. Again we very much appreciate the energy and cooperation from the part of the public, and we are very encouraged by that and we think it will continue.

Q: Who is the national expert?
A: An individual by the name of Lee Manning.

Q: What about the vehicle specifically stands out, where it was, what it was doing? Was there one or two?
A: We’re talking about potentially two, but that’s part of the enhancement aspect, and that is that we need to make sure, are we talking about one, or are we talking about two? I think what really comes to our attention is that if in fact it is the same vehicle, obviously we’re curious. Did that individual drive around the block because perhaps they saw something? Did that individual drive around the block because perhaps they were responsible for something? We don’t know. But again, I think what comes to our attention is primarily the timeframe. It’s not a heavily travelled street, at that particular time of morning, and that’s what kind of has brought it to our attention why we’re trying to get that information out there.

Q: I’m hearing rumors two different sets of rumors that Lauren may have overdosed on cocaine that the people she was with may have freaked out and gotten rid of her body. Have you heard anything or are you investigating anything along those lines?
A: What I can say is that there is a lot of information coming into the department, and we have kind of talked about all along how we are not going to lay out exactly what information we have. Have we heard information along those lines? Absolutely. We have also heard a lot of other types of information. And all I can say about the tips that are coming in, or the information that is coming in, is that it will be evaluated on its merits under the totality of the circumstances. And that is that we are not going to focus on one aspect of information that we get in until that information can be corroborated. But at this point much like I’ve said all weekend is that we are very much in the information gathering stage. Is that information that has come in? Absolutely, just like other pieces information. But we will continue to evaluate that as it relates to other information we get in.

Q: So the possibility of that has not been ruled out?
A: I don’t know of any possibility that’s been ruled out at this point and I think that we would be remiss in our responsibilities if we did so. It’s absolutely critical that you keep an open mind as you go through an investigation and if you focus on one aspect of it then you might miss completely another avenue that is being ignored that you probably should have pursued. So it’s absolutely critical for us to remain open-minded about what information we get in, how we treat that information, and how we pursue it.

One more.

Q: Are you concerned at all, we’re going into week 2, that this case might go cold? I know you were very optimistic, but it doesn’t seem like you guys have any tangible leads at this point.

A: Again, I don’t know that I’ve spoken about the number of leads that have come in. I spoke yesterday about the number of leads that came in related to AMW. I think I talked about somewhere between 30 and 40. Unfortunately, I was tied up for the morning and I was not able to get kind of an accurate count, if you would, as to how many have continued to come in. But I can tell you that there is no shortage of information coming in. And our task is to prioritize that information and determine which needs to get our quickest attention and pursued and, you know, obviously, part of that, too, would be to try to determine what information is irrelevant. That’s kind of our task at this point. But there is no shortage of information that’s coming in. And there is no shortage of information that’s being pursued. And I can assure you that there is no shortage of energy on the part of the investigators who are committed to doing what needs to be done here and that is in our continuing effort to find Lauren.

 

[RandomCo-Ed]

Excuse me but you are the one that used HT comment to support your point of view.If you consider her to be unreliable perhaps you should not.But hey we could go back and forth on this all day long and accomplish nothing.My point in my original comment is You,me and many other posters have advanced theories on less than the facts.Many times on mere speculation and that has been okay.Suddenly this one poster comes along with a POV that people do not seam to like and all of a sudden the rules change.Now suddenly he has to justify his position with "facts" something that has not been required of anyone else.Not content with holding him or her to this higher standard they then want to accuse him of stereotyping her because she is Jewish.Somehow I get the feeling that these same people would not accuse you of stereotyping her because she is a " 20 year old, wealthy Northeastern student at a midwest Big Ten school".

Well allow ME to stereotype MYSELF and my friends, as someone from the Northeast who very recently graduated from a Big 10 Party School. We got stupid drunk and combined drugs in a way that makes me shudder, looking back on it all. And this was all while we were under 21 years old. To be honest, I cannot believe something like this never happened to us. There were plenty of nights when we would wake up shocked that we had all made it home safely. I am not saying for sure what these kids were doing, but I know the kind of extremely foolish things my group of friends did, and not long ago. I just know, from an experience strikingly similar to LS's, what "party" meant to us at 3am- usually more alcohol and drugs (what drug depended on the group of kids and the personal preference of that night). We all grew out of this and are adults now- it's just sad LS will never get that chance.

 

[Skigirl]

Thanks, Jupiter, I feel quite humiliated. After your suggestion, I tried to edit my post to remove the incorrect part but the edit function for my post is disabled right now. I looked at Websleuths' FAQ and found this:

[/I]I hope someone can get the mods to just get rid of the whole post. I suppose that if the mods don't delete it or enable editing for me, at least it might serve as a warning for others to be more careful! That might be valuable for maintaining the integrity of this site.

Going to hide under a quilt now.

I think you're being a little too hard on yourself, GoodAim - I've seen a lot more serious errors here.

 

[kissdegirl]

Thanks, Jupiter, I feel quite humiliated. After your suggestion, I tried to edit my post to remove the incorrect part but the edit function for my post is disabled right now. I looked at Websleuths' FAQ and found this:

If you have registered, you will be able to edit and delete your posts. Note that the administrator can disable this ability as he desires. Your ability to edit your posts may also be time-limited, depending on how the administrator has set up the forum.

I hope someone can get the mods to just get rid of the whole post. I suppose that if the mods don't delete it or enable editing for me, at least it might serve as a warning for others to be more careful! That might be valuable for maintaining the integrity of this site.

Going to hide under a quilt now.

We all make mistakes, sorry you feel so badly about it. I don't think anyone should be scolded for mistakes when a gentle message can be sent giving the poster the correct information. :blowkiss:

 

[Jupiter812]

You're awesome Skigirl!

 

[Carmen101]

Correction.

Back to the keys...

Q:
"Q: Have you found her keys?
A: We found keys, that were…actually, friends first found keys turned them over to us, but we found keys in the small card purse or coin purse in the alley. The same place we where last saw her on video."​

I believe LE is saying that someone’s friends found keys that were not LE’s.

In an early TV interview in NY, LS’s roommate BW said LS kept her credit cards, key card to her apt. and her id in the small card purse. I believe the keys were inside the purse because the Smallwood “key” is actually a key card.

CR might have gotten punched at Smallwood, but I think his lack of memory was not caused by that punch.

Perhaps he was not in such bad shape after the punch. LS was barefoot. When she and CR got to the gravel, perhaps he hoisted her onto his back so she would not have to walk on the gravel. When he did, maybe she dropped her little purse and did not realize it.

If you look at Btown's aerial, the intersection of the blue line and the red line appears to be where the gravel starts. If the purse was dropped there, would that qualify as being in the gravel and in the alley?​

 

[dodie20]

Thanks, Jupiter, I feel quite humiliated. After your suggestion, I tried to edit my post to remove the incorrect part but the edit function for my post is disabled right now. I looked at Websleuths' FAQ and found this:

If you have registered, you will be able to edit and delete your posts. Note that the administrator can disable this ability as he desires. Your ability to edit your posts may also be time-limited, depending on how the administrator has set up the forum.

I hope someone can get the mods to just get rid of the whole post. I suppose that if the mods don't delete it or enable editing for me, at least it might serve as a warning for others to be more careful! That might be valuable for maintaining the integrity of this site.

Going to hide under a quilt now.

Don't be so hard on yourself. My biggest fear on here, is being the spreader of misinformation. I once wrote a long, rambling 'rough draft' post on another topic, and accidentally posted it. By the time I realized it, it was too late to delete. I had written it like a 1940's gumshoe, lol. I was so embarrassed and what made it worse, was my 'final draft' was right under it. Blahh.

 

[pinkinablueworld]

I think you have some of the best theories I have read so far.

I think this is one of the few key elements of the case. The police had mentioned that there was "some activity" in the video, but they did not say what. Her keys are found in that location.

I think her "disappearance" starts at that point. Here are 2 possibilities:

1. The "activity" is cocaine use. LS collapses after that, her keys fall down and whoever was with her (one of the main POIs), carries her on his shoulder to 5 north town homes in Bloomington.

2. There is some sort of sexual attempt (attack?), with LS maybe rejecting (or not rejecting) the advances. During that time her keys fall on the ground. It is also possible that she loses consciousness at that point.


In such a scenario, assuming that LS loses conscience there or she is incoherent and barely alert, the POI carries her to 5 North and then informs other POIs already there that she passed out from drugs (or passes completely out upon her arrival). They are waiting for her to recover, but she does not and around 4 - 4.15 AM they think she may not be alive. They panic, and one POI tries to call someone else who was with them earlier that night for advise, but that person is sleeping and does not answer the call (4. 15 AM call). From then on, at least 2-3 POIs conspire on how to cover-up.

This theory, is also consistent with the account of the witness about the "mystery man" at 3.38 AM.

As you had reported (http://tonygatto.wordpress.com/2011...n-spierer-mystery-encounter-with-unknown-man/)

"According to the witness, who works as a manager at a local bar, Lauren Speirer was incoherent, her eyes nearly closed and at one point she fell and banged her head."

As there is no video activity at 3.38 AM, the witness may well be mistaken about the time and it was simply earlier that night as per the video.

In any case, I think that based on what is publicly known, this is the most likely theory for what might have happened. JMO.

 

[cluciano63]

If it is true that LE sees on video Lauren being carried to JR's building, then it would certainly explain their focusing on the group she was with that night. They may well have some "activity" on tape that incriminates someone more than just "walking with Lauren" for example. And that would have made them doubt her ability to walk home alone an hour later...

 

[pinkinablueworld]

I think WS is the best forum out there! When the discussions started getting,IMO,a little far fetched, I started searching around the internet for other discussions. I came right back! WS is still the most professional! I'm impressed that a journalist like Tony Gatto chooses to throw ideas around here on Websleuths. Keep at it Tony. I can only imagine how appreciative the Spierer family would/will be when you crack this case. Somehow your blog really gets some people stirred up & I think it might just help!

 

[Tr.]

"According to the witness, who works as a manager at a local bar, Lauren Speirer was incoherent, her eyes nearly closed and at one point she fell and banged her head."

As there is no video activity at 3.38 AM, the witness may well be mistaken about the time and it was simply earlier that night as per the video.

Sounds pretty good.
The witness was adamant about the time being 3:38. In initial news reports (no link) I recall that she (the witness) stated that she double checked the time on her cell and it was 3:38am.

 

[:+:MrTT:+:]

Yes, its an alley. It runs between Morton St. and College Ave.
The 10th - 11th St. alley intersects the Morton - College alley at the corner of the building that has the camera where she was seen at 2:51.

There are no cameras at the grave lot.
There are 3 cameras alongside the gravel lot.

The cameras in the center are the 2 that show her at 2:48 - 2:51. The POV is facing the direction she traveled. The farthest camera in center is the one that is at the 10th - 11th St. & Morton - College Ave intersection, (to be specific, a few feet south of the intersection). Thats the one that shows her exiting the alley at 2:51.

Morton to College alley

​

Camera that shows Lauren at 2:51 in this image of the intersection of the alleys.
There are 2 cameras in the circle. Its the one on the right in the rectangle.

Thank-you for posting that top picture showing the sidewalk between the railing and the grass then gravel. I was hoping you had a picture of that so we could see up close what it looked like after she exited the alley way.
​

 

[PlainJaneDoe]

I didn't catch the "banged her head" part before. I wonder how bad it was.