IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #18

[AnalyticalExaminer]

JR wouldn't know any place to dispose of a body in Indy being from MI.

This may not be the case,given what has been said about certain frat hazing rituals, but you are probably correct. I am speculating that another party, who may have been a third party drug dealer (and/or, yes, ZO), was involved.

 

[Chris007]

Keep in mind that she would be captured on video entering 10th and College if this was the case.

I thought someone once posted that there is a few places in 10 & college where you can't be seen by camera. B-Town I think would know this. If I get time I will try to drive by to check it out on my way home. I don't think there are cameras everywhere there.

 

[Chris007]

This may not be the case,given what has been said about certain frat hazing rituals, but you are probably correct. I am speculating that another party, who may have been a third party drug dealer (and/or, yes, ZO), was involved.

OK yes I think that could also be totally correct. Just why the call to DR? That is still the weird thing.

Also for the people thinking that the truck is still in play I found a new pick on FB just put on there June 12 that has ZO in it and a truck just like the one the police was looking for.

 

[Pedrosmom]

I think we can assume she was shown JR, CR, MB and JW. Probably DR as well. Not HT, of course - she's female. That leaves at least one more POI. ZO is the best guess. Does the group include AB? KT (JR's neighbor who appears to have no involvement)?

I wondered about AB as well. Also, AA. AA was out that night in the vicinity as well (found the keys). Either way it was dark but a face is a face and you remember a face if it is shown to you. Perhaps this person is outside of this group, or inside and LE is not giving that out. How he managed to dodge cameras with a girl slung over his shoulder puzzles me. I'm not saying I buy this account but let's assume it's true, at least the witness says so. His lack of being on video makes me think she was quickly transferred to a car. I don't think the white pick up was the only car that LE was looking for. I think they were looking for any cars, driven by POIs or friends of POIs on the streets that night or in the wee hours of the morning.

 

[bx2]

I thought someone once posted that there is a few places in 10 & college where you can't be seen by camera. B-Town I think would know this. If I get time I will try to drive by to check it out on my way home. I don't think there are cameras everywhere there.

There's a bunch of places around the perimeter where you wouldn't necessarily be seen by video, but the entrances are covered.

 

[AnalyticalExaminer]

I wondered about AB as well. Also, AA. AA was out that night in the vicinity as well (found the keys)..

thanks, i forgot about AA. i'm not sure whether we know if the mystery witness interview preceded or followed AA's talking to LE (which was not earlier than 6/10 iirc).

 

[bessie]

Can I ask where you are getting what I bolded from? There is no indication at all that there is surveillance video that covers the area where she was reported to be seen.

Qualters addressed a blogger’s report of a “mysterious man” in the area of 10th and College at about 3:38 a.m. June 3. He said investigators have reviewed video evidence that does not support that either Spierer or anyone unknown to police was in that area at that time.

We have also reviewed it during the time period where it has been reported, essentially an hour later (at 3:38 a.m.), and we do not find any evidence that supports that information,” Qualters said.

http://www.heraldtimesonline.com/stories/2011/06/22/news.qp-4391232.sto

 

[Jupiter812]

Btown's photo sequence [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=140294"]IN IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 *PHOTOS & MAPS* - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame].

10th and College Apts. would be easier to enter off camera than 10th and College Village Apts which have a lot of cameras on Morton. I believe zo/ab/bb live in the former.

 

[imkeylime]

I just had a horrible "what if" (which someone else has surely had ...). So there are questions about how LS could have left her shoes and cell at the bar. What if someone wanted her to, as in moved or hid them? That would of course mean premeditation, which I seriously doubt ... but what if? Without a phone she couldn't contact anyone and w/o her shoes she couldn't run as well. What if, as suggested elsewhere, CR wasn't with her the entire time at Kilroy's but offered to walk with her home to get another pair of shoes or something?

I realize this is wildly speculative, but ... just brainstorming.

 

[AnalyticalExaminer]

I largely hadn't considered it until this time, probably because of the way the confrontation has been reported, but is it possible that JR and ZO are linked? They are both rumored to be involved in drugs, and both apparently black-sheep members (or former members) of the same frat. If so, and ZO is in fact the puncher, I'm not sure how to explain the confrontation.

 

[Jupiter812]

I'm not sure how the phone call to DR fits in with scenario 4 - if others are present or JR has been threatened not to talk, presumably he isn't calling anyone. Maybe he wanted DR to get him out of town?

The 4:15 phone call could just be an attempt to say she was still alive at that time. Or to ask if DR had a vehicle. Maybe that vehicle is a white truck that would show up on tape at 4:24. JR then closes the loop to say she left at 4:30.

I know, I know. This scenario assumes LE's intentional misinformation to public and JR being smarter than most people give him credit for.

Let's say she was real close to OD at 3:38. The bang on her head seals it. This leaves approx. 30-35 minutes for panic and recovery of senses. They don't even have to take her inside the apartment. They can put her directly in a vehicle.

 

[elmomom]

I largely hadn't considered it until this time, probably because of the way the confrontation has been reported, but is it possible that JR and ZO are linked? They are both rumored to be involved in drugs, and both apparently black-sheep members (or former members) of the same frat. If so, and ZO is in fact the puncher, I'm not sure how to explain the confrontation.

I think the info that Zo is linked to Aepi or Apes is wrong.
[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6849464&postcount=627"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - IN IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #15[/ame]

Pretty sure the timing is off and he may not be Jewish

 

[Barry]

I largely hadn't considered it until this time, probably because of the way the confrontation has been reported, but is it possible that JR and ZO are linked? They are both rumored to be involved in drugs, and both apparently black-sheep members (or former members) of the same frat. If so, and ZO is in fact the puncher, I'm not sure how to explain the confrontation.

General assumption has been that the confrontation was between ZO and CR. What if it wasn't. Maybe ZO was getting in LS's face about something, and CR got punched stepping in on that. Could LS have owed money on drugs?

 

[bx2]

http://www.heraldtimesonline.com/stories/2011/06/22/news.qp-4391232.sto

I guess I'm trying to ask how could they have video evidence to support the witness account if none is possible? Of course what they currently have does not confirm the witness account, because its not on the location from which that was reported.

Or are they saying that the video evidence that they do have expressly makes the witness account not possible?

 

[elmomom]

I guess I'm trying to ask how could they have video evidence to support the witness account if none is possible? Of course what they currently have does not confirm the witness account, because its not on the location from which that was reported.

Or are they saying that the video evidence that they do have expressly makes the witness account not possible?

Since Qualters is the head SPOKESperson for the BPD we know he knows how to speak. He also knows how to obfuscate. I am thoroughly convinced that whatever he was saying, it was intentionally not informational.

 

[AnalyticalExaminer]

I think the info that Zo is linked to Aepi or Apes is wrong.
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - IN IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #15

Pretty sure the timing is off and he may not be Jewish

Interesting. That's right that O is not a Jewish surname - http://www.houseofnames.com/oakes-family-crest - though there are Jews whose family names were changed a century or more ago, often during the immigration process (mine is an example).

While I'm not sure that Apes in particular would not admit someone who is not Jewish, in my experience all AEPi members are Jewish.

 

[AnalyticalExaminer]

The 4:15 phone call could just be an attempt to say she was still alive at that time. Or to ask if DR had a vehicle. Maybe that vehicle is a white truck that would show up on tape at 4:24. JR then closes the loop to say she left at 4:30.

But presumably DR's phone records indicate that he did not answer the call, and if he had left Smallwood, presumably that would have been recorded on camera or at least perhaps reflected in his subsequent keycard reentry.

 

[elmomom]

You know what I am wondering about more and more frequently?
What was the tip to lead LE to search the lake (Morton?) so early, and who was the tipster?

 

[AnalyticalExaminer]

"O" may also be the product of intermarriage.

 

[wisco23]

FWIW, I was in a jewish fraternity and each year there was about 1 "token" non-jew in each pledge class. Having said that, I'm pretty certain (no links, sorry) that I read on multiple boards that ZO (and AB for that matter) had no affiliation with AEPi