IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #22

[elmomom]

I certainly haven't accepted it. Didn't it come from HT, on camera, when she said something to the affect of "he said he saw her walking and turn the corner and I believe him."

Tell you what - if I were HT and JR was my "very good friend" like she had said, I would have said "JR saw her turn the corner." PERIOD.

The lady doth protest too much, methinks. For her to say "and I believe him" at a time when the masses' attention was on CR seems a little defensive.

I'd bet money that JR hasn't said a word to police, and everything we know has come either from HT in haste, or through his lawyer.

There has been nothing to indicate that he has spoken to police at all. AT ALL.

That statement and polygraph that he "provided" ... how many questions do you really think it answered? Not enough to deflect LS's parents' attention, that's for sure.

How much money are we talking? :floorlaugh:

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6888582&postcount=34"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - IN IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #17[/ame]

 

[AnalyticalExaminer]

How much money are we talking? :floorlaugh:

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - IN IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #17

Are you privy to inside information re JR? We know that he has provided information to LE. I have yet to see anything satisfactorily indicating that he has spoken to them in person. If you have, I'd be interested in a link. (and I now see the one you provided above, but that does not indicate that they spoke to JR in person; one can also "speak" to someone through their counsel)

 

[AnalyticalExaminer]

What's euphemistic about him saying "Lauren helped" his client walk home? This communicates she was in command and he was not. There are no two ways about it: He later backpedaled and said something to the effect, "well maybe the walking wounded were helping each other." < < That is probably BS too.

When and where did LE identify the acquaintance in the video to 5 North as CR?

In general, I think he's being euphemistic in referring to what may be both of their drug use. A lawyer might characterize the facts, or say what the client said, but I would not cavalierly accuse him of "BS."

 

[Skigirl]

I certainly haven't accepted it. Didn't it come from HT, on camera, when she said something to the affect of "he said he saw her walking and turn the corner and I believe him."

Tell you what - if I were HT and JR was my "very good friend" like she had said, I would have said "JR saw her turn the corner." PERIOD.

The lady doth protest too much, methinks. For her to say "and I believe him" at a time when the masses' attention was on CR seems a little defensive.

It's pretty easy to take what someone says on camera out of context. Sometimes the questions are cut out or re-recorded after the fact. HT could have been responding to a question like, "What makes you so sure she left JR's?" or "Do you think it's possible that JR knows more than he's saying?" -- or maybe she'd been questioned by the police and they had really pushed the idea that JR's story is suspicious. HT may have enjoyed the attention, but if anything, I think she knew very little first-hand and instead had pieced everything she told the press together by making frantic phone calls and sending texts and emails in those hours when Lauren's friends first realized she was missing.

 

[AnalyticalExaminer]

I certainly haven't accepted it. Didn't it come from HT, on camera, when she said something to the affect of "he said he saw her walking and turn the corner and I believe him."

We are not privy to any statement from JR, who, unlike HT, has never spoken to the media. But, as I have already said recently (and more than once, I think) on this thread, it seems clear from LE statements that (whether or not JR has spoken in person or at all to LE, or instead simply "provided" them with information) JR has made this assertion directly to LE in one form or another.

 

[luna80]

LE stated an expectation of the landfill search taking two weeks to complete. Tomorrow is two weeks.

:dunno:

The search started on Tuesday Aug 16th; technically two weeks would run thru Monday Aug 29th

 

[luna80]

We don't know who that person is, but I can guarantee that the Spierers believe it is JR. They may be wrong. They may be jumping to conclusions. I don't blame them for focusing on JR though. If you had a daughter and she was last known to be seen with a man who later claims he let her walk home alone in the dark intoxicated and possibly shoeless and then that man disappears with his lawyer...well, where would your suspicions immediately fly?

Once again, their assumptions may be wrong, JR could be 100% innocent and guilty of nothing. I just do understand why some of their quotes seem to be speaking directly at him.

Why is it we're so quick to jump all over JR for letting LS leave his place alone & barefoot when MB did the exact same thing and it's highly likely that she was in even worse shape at that time. If MB had to put CR to bed & LS was in no better shape, what the heck was he thinking in letting her go. Why did he not intervene on her behalf? That's what friends do. As for his reference to her wanting to party more - I doubt she could hardly talk.

 

[luna80]

No, I mean that basically everyone, whether they think it is true or not, has accepted for purposes of discussion that JR told LE that he saw LS turn the corner at 4:30AM.

Yes, I believe JR did say that or he that concurred with HT's version. I also believe he may have recanted or changed his timeline. LE has done nothing to ensure what's been perceived as JR's final word is the same as what he expressed thru his lawyer, most importantly in regards to the timing of events.

 

[Jupiter812]

In general, I think he's being euphemistic in referring to what may be both of their drug use. A lawyer might characterize the facts, or say what the client said, but I would not cavalierly accuse him of "BS."

Re: My question above regarding the acquaintance. You didn't answer.

Also, What euphemism would you or an attorney use for a BSer? And for a backpeddler?

 

[Walker]

There has been nothing to indicate that he has spoken to police at all. AT ALL.

That statement and polygraph that he "provided" ... how many questions do you really think it answered? Not enough to deflect LS's parents' attention, that's for sure.

The LE timelines include the sighting at 11th & College Avenue. The witness is most likely JR. The police would not include that event if it were only hearsay from HT.

 

[bluebirdii]

THe more I think about these people that was "surrounding" her that night, these weren't friends. If you call yourself someone's friend, you stop them when they've gone too far (or at least try too), you stop them when they want to wander off by themselves or try and get behind the wheel of a car. These "friends" of Lauren, I'm sorry, I'm glad I got to skip "friends" like these. Sure everyone is also responsible for him / herself but when you see a friend going off the rocker a bit, you damn well do something.

I see a bunch of insecure cowards who was there for the going but oh dear when the going got tough.

 

[bluebirdii]

And yet it is so hard to know the difference. :twocents:

Exactly, because I assume Lauren trusted some of these people....

 

[Darcyline]

Why is it we're so quick to jump all over JR for letting LS leave his place alone & barefoot when MB did the exact same thing and it's highly likely that she was in even worse shape at that time. If MB had to put CR to bed & LS was in no better shape, what the heck was he thinking in letting her go. Why did he not intervene on her behalf? That's what friends do. As for his reference to her wanting to party more - I doubt she could hardly talk.

I will always, always be quick to "jump all over" any man who lets extremely intoxicated girls walk home barefoot late at night by themselves. Forever and always.

To me, walking a few doors down is very different than going outside and walking a few blocks. Maybe people disagree, but I would be much more likely to send a drunk friend down the hall to another friend rather than let them walk home several blocks. It isn't really highly likely that she was in terrible shape with MB, but sobered up with JR. To me, at least, we don't really know when and where she did whatever she did or when and where she may have crashed. The video at 251 would help clarify, but I haven't seen it yet.

I don't think any of the guys were really being gentleman though in any case.

 

[bloom54]

Channel 13 is reporting that there will be an update on the landfill search today.

 

[Jupiter812]

Channel 13 is reporting that there will be an update on the landfill search today.

http://www.wthr.com/

They are the best for covering Bloomington news. Angela Morehead is my fave.

 

[holly2325]

Yes, I believe JR did say that or he that concurred with HT's version. I also believe he may have recanted or changed his timeline. LE has done nothing to ensure what's been perceived as JR's final word is the same as what he expressed thru his lawyer, most importantly in regards to the timing of events.

Hi Luna
I can see that you question some interesting details.

Was the exit of LS from MB/CR as quick and clean as MB states?
In an earlier post you question MB's testimony exonerating CR. In two short sentences MB separates LS from CR, puts LS in JR's apartment, with the desire to "party". It sounds like a very strategic attempt to pass the hot potato to JR.

Did JR recant his statement about watching LS walk to the corner?
Like you, I am curious about this, but I think he did not. LS maintains the 4:30 sighting at the corner of College and 11th which suggests to me that JR is staying with the story that he watched LS walk to the corner.
It would be interesting to know if JR alleges that LS came over the second time alone. IMO LE has never shared whether JR admits to being alone with LS the whole time or implicates someone else.

 

[Jupiter812]

Disclaimer: If you don't like cavalier or candid comments, don't read this post. :rocker:

I&#8217;m tired of reading over and over again all the crap from the boys and Salzmann and their apologists.

I&#8217;m thinking about the observations of people who said they saw her night&#8212;comments that CONTRADICT the boys and Salzmann. I don&#8217;t care that LE has not verified these sightings. Their info provides a level of information that is probably much closer to the truth than what the boys and Salzmann have said.

The anonymous sources:
She was foaming at the mouth at Kilroys
She stumbled out of the elevator and fell against a wall in the Smallwood lobby
She was seen at 3:38 incoherent and carried like a gunnysack over the shoulder of a man

The boys and Salzmann:
She helped walk CR back to his apartment
She wanted to party
She walked out of 5 North without stumbling

^ Riiight ^

There now. Glad I got that off my chest!:crazy:

 

[British]

Disclaimer: If you don't like cavalier or candid comments, don't read this post. :rocker:

I’m tired of reading over and over again all the crap from the boys and Salzmann and their apologists.

I’m thinking about the observations of people who said they saw her night—comments that CONTRADICT the boys and Salzmann. I don’t care that LE has not verified these sightings. Their info provides a level of information that is probably much closer to the truth than what the boys and Salzmann have said.

The anonymous sources:
She was foaming at the mouth at Kilroys
She stumbled out of the elevator and fell against a wall in the Smallwood lobby
She was seen at 3:38 incoherent and carried like a gunnysack over the shoulder of a man

The boys and Salzmann:
She helped walk CR back to his apartment
She wanted to party
She walked out of 5 North without stumbling

^ Riiight ^

There now. Glad I got that off my chest!:crazy:

Good post. The claimed "memory loss" is also a major red flag.

 

[LongTallTexan]

I've posted a few times, but I've read every post, to the point of confusion. This is a frustrating case because of the number of events and situation that led up to Lauren's disappearing. I've opted to stay out of some of the arguementative banter, especially when it seems more biased and directed toward another, rather than a discussion of facts or theories...whether allowable on WS or not, I don't opt to participate. I will say that I noticed an increaced number of new members that joined in June with very strong feelings toward a particular POI, but I think WS and us members have done a good job moderating.

The facts are few, and the assumptions, accusations and guesses are too many. There is so much that could've taken place just in conversation that we'll never know that would all be pieces to the puzzle. Not knowing what LE and the Spierers know, we will continue our frustration with this case. Hell, I think some of are here just for that reason, we are empethic or sympathic and want to help or show we care....so essentially this forum is actually theraputic for us, but the therapy is wearing off with out any answers about that evening. Most of probably won't even be settled if we find Lauren at this point, we're going to want to know what happened....to prevent it, to make sense of it and to come to grips....if any of that will even be possible.

What I 'm saying is that I'm frustrated too....but this a great forum, let's keep it that way and keep our eyes on the prize....finding Lauren and prosecuting whoever is responsible. Let's hope our work here assists the family or LE in some small fashion.

Someone stated up thread with much more eloquence, that some of the anonymous source information may be more substantial and relevant that some fo the original statements, by POIs or lawyers. I couldn't agree more. There are many NON-POIs that have nothing to lose that could help mold the story....while circumstantial, some of the info will end up being some of the glue that hold the pieces of the story together and maybe tells the WHY.....of what happened that night.

I'm praying they only find clues in the landfill search today, and NOT Lauren. Until proven otherwise, I assume is alive.

Musings....are JMO.

 

[Btown]

Its official. The NY, NJ crowd are back. Their cars are being delivered.