IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 #27

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The truck issue seems bungled. The only thing I can think of would be multiple investigators assigned to watch certain videos from selected cameras, make notes, and then ultimately compare notes. Maybe they saw the different timestamps on the notes and thought "AHA... circling the block" before anyone thought to wonder why it didn't appear twice in either camera's footage.

As for the timeline discrepancy not accounting for much time for a stop between Smallwood and 5N.... Maybe again it's a timestamp issue? If a timestamp was off by a scant 5 or 10 mins it could make a major difference in as far as what would be possible.

Check out the time Lauren was seen on cam here. The police seem to have made a correction. However, most papers failed to correct their timeline.
You were right and every clue we have is contradicted by other clues and accounts. http://whiteplains.dailyvoice.com/neighbors/polygraph-dna-tests-issued-lauren-spierer-case
 
I am Jill-Late-In-The-Game and I know it is annoying, but tell me about the white truck. Does it look like the truck in the BS Lavergne case in Louisiana? We have photos of that truck which was a 2011 Ford Extended Cab dually. I believe. What did the DWT in this case look like? Who is the POI? Just wondering if the cases are related as we believe he killed another person in Texas and -- if that is the case-- he may have killed anyone in the U.S.

Another come-lately, here.

Aviatrix is correct. If a white truck was ever on the table, please review the pics in the Mickey Shunick threads.

It might be worth a glance.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
His own lawyer Salzmann is claiming CR had 'amnesia'.

And CR certainly isn't denying it.

The main point, is he is hiding behind the story, IMO.

That's Salzmann's words, not CR's. Who knows what spin he was trying to put on it or how closely he was quoting CR?

Does it matter what technical or slang term you want to put on it if he's ultimately claiming he doesn't remember anything? You say if he'd said 'blackout' you're fine with that but 'amnesia' is raising red flags?

I'd agree that the 'don't remember anything' line is many times a sign of guilt. But then in this case the police know he was partaking in intoxicants, was punched because it's on tape, has a roommate that is alibiing him, and has another person (JR) that moves LS forward in the timeline and away from CR (which if to be believed means whether you believe CR's blackout or amnesia (whatever word you want to use) claim is true or not also means it doesn't matter because JR's statement has removed opportunity from CR's night).

If JR is lying then it leaves the sticky detail of figuring out why he'd lie and make himself an accessory to a crime if CR is the guilty party. Let alone why MB would as well.

....Unless they are all lying and all involved. But then that leaves another question- Why in the world would they allow CR to claim memory loss, amnesia, blackout, or whatever while they have to maintain a more coherent story. And one that must check out enough not to trip themselves up? Of course it's possible they decided that was their best option to minimize inconsistencies.

Unless whatever happened happened after CR went to bed and it's MB and/or JR who actually need the cover story.

Lots of possibilities but none of them line up perfectly without some holes. That's why I think people are starting to reach somewhat to fill those holes.
 
I am Jill-Late-In-The-Game and I know it is annoying, but tell me about the white truck. Does it look like the truck in the BS Lavergne case in Louisiana? We have photos of that truck which was a 2011 Ford Extended Cab dually. I believe. What did the DWT in this case look like? Who is the POI? Just wondering if the cases are related as we believe he killed another person in Texas and -- if that is the case-- he may have killed anyone in the U.S.

Another come-lately, here.

Aviatrix is correct. If a white truck was ever on the table, please review the pics in the Mickey Shunick threads.

It might be worth a glance.

Welcome all. The white truck in this case was ruled out by LE after the owner was located and questioned. Investigators from BPD in this case made contact with Lafayette PD during the first few days of the MS disappearance and it was reported that no connection between the two cases was found.
 
Well, you said it yourself even.

If he BLACKED OUT, why is he calling it amnesia? I could easily believe that CR blacked out. Easily.

I absolutley don't believe that he had a sudden convenient case of 'amnesia'. I think he has a penchant for lying and 'amnesia' sounded a lot better to him than 'blacked out', when being question by the authorities.

It's his lawyers wording.
 
:what:
His own lawyer Salzmann is claiming CR had 'amnesia'.

And CR certainly isn't denying it.

The main point, is he is hiding behind the story, IMO.

CR most likely isn't denying it because his lawyer has instructed him not to speak to the media about the case.
 
:what:

CR most likely isn't denying it because his lawyer has instructed him not to speak to the media about the case.

Plus, what is there to deny? It would just be arguing semantics. No matter what name is put on it the claim is memory loss.
 
I am Jill-Late-In-The-Game and I know it is annoying, but tell me about the white truck. Does it look like the truck in the BS Lavergne case in Louisiana? We have photos of that truck which was a 2011 Ford Extended Cab dually. I believe. What did the DWT in this case look like? Who is the POI? Just wondering if the cases are related as we believe he killed another person in Texas and -- if that is the case-- he may have killed anyone in the U.S.

Welcome, aviatrix. Based on the alleged findings, it appears to be a popular style/color of truck ...
 
Another come-lately, here.

Aviatrix is correct. If a white truck was ever on the table, please review the pics in the Mickey Shunick threads.

It might be worth a glance.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Welcome, JurysOut ... and though this is somewhat OT, I love your avatar!
 
... I'd agree that the 'don't remember anything' line is many times a sign of guilt. But then in this case the police know he was partaking in intoxicants, was punched because it's on tape, has a roommate that is alibiing him, and has another person (JR) that moves LS forward in the timeline and away from CR (which if to be believed means whether you believe CR's blackout or amnesia (whatever word you want to use) claim is true or not also means it doesn't matter because JR's statement has removed opportunity from CR's night).

If JR is lying then it leaves the sticky detail of figuring out why he'd lie and make himself an accessory to a crime if CR is the guilty party. Let alone why MB would as well.

....Unless they are all lying and all involved. But then that leaves another question- Why in the world would they allow CR to claim memory loss, amnesia, blackout, or whatever while they have to maintain a more coherent story. And one that must check out enough not to trip themselves up? Of course it's possible they decided that was their best option to minimize inconsistencies.

Unless whatever happened happened after CR went to bed and it's MB and/or JR who actually need the cover story.

Lots of possibilities but none of them line up perfectly without some holes. That's why I think people are starting to reach somewhat to fill those holes.

Memory loss in itself is a tricky thing. There were some good discussions here awhile back (with PlainJaneDoe, I believe) about memory loss and even false memories. I can't recall all of the discussion (no pun intended), but if CR had any degree of blackout/amnesia, I'm sure his lawyer would advise him to not say a word. But not saying a word also makes him look more suspect ...
 
Does it matter what technical or slang term you want to put on it if he's ultimately claiming he doesn't remember anything? You say if he'd said 'blackout' you're fine with that but 'amnesia' is raising red flags?
yes and yes
 
This is the case that bothers me as much as the Katherine coffee murder which happened where I live. It keeps popping into my head, I just want to know what happened. So Bad. :maddening:
I hope that someone somewhere, gets a conscience and says something, anything that helps crack these cases!!! Gahhhh!!!
There seems to be me to be an evil, well , disturbing under current surrounding them.
 
To me, there is a huge difference between amnesia and a state of blackout.

If CR said that he was 'blacked out'... that would have been an admission, of sort, of drug and alcohol use.

By claiming amnesia from being punched by ZO, CR has not only completely absolved himself from having to take responsibility for has actions that evening regarding alcohol and substance use... but he has also turned himself too, into a 'victim' of the nights events.
 
And regarding his lawyer Salzmann, a former prosecuting attorney himself, he is bound as an officer of the court to disclose what CR said, exactly as it was said to him.

Salzmann saying that CR had 'amnesia' is JUST the same as if CR said it himself...
 
Good thinking. If she stayed there then what were the 4:15 calls about?
Do you think it was really LS making those calls?

And then regardless of time, when JR discovers that she is not alive, how does she get removed? Not sure how many hours before Mr. S and JW show up and confront JR? Were they allowed to search JR's?

What I like about this is that JR may not have had time to cultivate his story and may have come up with the watching her from the balcony thing on the fly. But then later he must stick to it or be caught changing his story.

Sure I would like to know exactly what JR said, and when it was said.
Anyone care to provide that information?

Fact is that JR admits to being the last person to see Lauren ALIVE.
A lot of the threads leading to her demise also are linked to JR.
Just because people are legally innocent until proven guilty does not mean that you wait for proof to fall from a tree.

I have a feeling the calls went something along the lines of "DUDE! You've got to get over here and check out what's going down with this drunk chick that CR brought home tonight, She's totally wasted and naked". Or something like that anyway.
 
And regarding his lawyer Salzmann, a former prosecuting attorney himself, he is bound as an officer of the court to disclose what CR said, exactly as it was said to him.

Salzmann saying that CR had 'amnesia' is JUST the same as if CR said it himself...

Sorry but this couldn't be any more inaccurate. For one thing, he wasn't in court when he said it. For another thing he's not tied exactly to the words CR used. If CR told him "Dude, I was totally wasted that night. I don't remember s--t" Salzmann can paraphrase that (read: spin) into whatever nice soundbite he prefers for public consumption. Or he can not say anything at all. Salzman saying "amnesia" to a reporter is certainly NOT the same as if CR said it himself.

So, Salzmann said "amnesia"... who knows what CR said? You and I sure don't. And ultimately it does not matter because we're talking memory loss and you're getting nowhere arguing the point because 99% of the population isn't going to get hung up on whether CR is claiming 'amnesia' or 'blackout' as to whether they believe he had memory loss. It all adds up to the same thing. It's a meaningless distraction.

I can almost guarantee you Salzmann would've used the word 'amnesia' regardless of what CR used simply because it's a clean word to describe memory loss and in most people's mind it doesn't potentially leave the same immediate negative impression as saying he "blacked out". Plus, IIRC Salzmann was also trying to imply that the punch was the cause of the memory loss. Which again, was to put his client in a better light for the court of public opinion than to say he was "p-ss drunk, blacked out, and passed out".

I feel confident in saying that CR's attorney using the word "amnesia", regardless of whether that is a direct CR quote or not, is NOT the smoking gun in this case.

Memory loss very well could be a lie, but it's not been shown to be a lie just because Salzmann (or CR) used the word "amnesia" to describe it.
 
Well, you said it yourself even.

If he BLACKED OUT, why is he calling it amnesia? I could easily believe that CR blacked out. Easily.

I absolutley don't believe that he had a sudden convenient case of 'amnesia'. I think he has a penchant for lying and 'amnesia' sounded a lot better to him than 'blacked out', when being question by the authorities.


And if CR was in fact blacked out then he very well may have done very bad things. How can even HE know what happened? He couldn't know if he was blacked out. If he's lying about it, he's playing a dangerous game because it puts him at the mercy of others indictments which he can not refute without exposing himself as a liar.
 
I am Jill-Late-In-The-Game and I know it is annoying, but tell me about the white truck. Does it look like the truck in the BS Lavergne case in Louisiana? We have photos of that truck which was a 2011 Ford Extended Cab dually. I believe. What did the DWT in this case look like? Who is the POI? Just wondering if the cases are related as we believe he killed another person in Texas and -- if that is the case-- he may have killed anyone in the U.S.

Another come-lately, here.

Aviatrix is correct. If a white truck was ever on the table, please review the pics in the Mickey Shunick threads.

It might be worth a glance.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

A white Chevrolet pickup truck captured on videotape near where the 20-year-old may have last been seen has been ruled out as being involved in the case of the missing student.

http://www.heraldtimesonline.com/stories/2011/06/20/news.qp-1784939.sto


[Police said the white truck seen on surveillance video has been ruled out. They said the owner was just picking up one of his workers.

http://www.fox59.com/news/wxin-laur...-lauren-spierer-case-20110621,0,4021895.story
 
An injury to the head can cause memory loss. So can taking alcohol with certain medications/drugs. If CR does have memory loss, he isn't going to know what caused it, is he? Obviously his lawyer is going to present it in a best possible light for CR.
It's not like it can be proven one way or the other.
And if LS didn't go missing and said the next morning that she doesn't remember anything she was doing during the night, would anyone question it? Memory loss is certainly possible considering the alleged behavior. Whether CR actually doesn't remember anything-only CR knows that.
 
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