IN - New Albany: Mother, two children found dead in creek

[time]

I think it came down to actually proving "diminished capacity".

Also, I will always wonder why the (still unknown) witness who saw JC and her children that morning let them leave his/her home and go out into the freezing temperatures when admittedly they weren't prepared.

I think this case will never fully be resolved for me including your question. I would still really like to know who that witness is and what exactly friends and family said in interviews. It still doesn't make sense, but I am happy that the grand jury was held and they heard the evidence. I'm also happy that Jaime is not going down as a murderer.

I still wonder why she was out there that morning.

 

[time]

This article had much more in it than I had seen:

Henderson also said investigators know Jaime Clutter left her Sheffield Square apartment abruptly for some reason.

The bodies of the mother and two children were found naked in the water. Henderson said an expert has stated that a person can become very disoriented and in some cases feel hot and disrobe due to extreme hypothermia.

“Hypothermia played a major role in the actions of Jaime Clutter that morning,” Henderson said in Thursday’s press conference. “We believe the deaths were accidental. There was no evidence of any kind of struggle.”

In May, the New Albany Police Department released its findings that the three drowned, but that “mental illness was the underlying cause of these tragic events,” according to NAPD Chief Sherri Knight. NAPD Detective Carrie East said that Jaime Clutter’s behavior “was concerning” to some witnesses leading up to March 13. She said Clutter was incoherent and delusional. Both Knight and East said Clutter spoke of a “demonic presence.”

However, the grand jury found no evidence to blame mental illness as the reason for the deaths.

“We don’t know her state of confusion or disorientation. We know she went to a friend’s home around 7 a.m. and was not dressed properly for the cold,” Henderson said. “I think it’s speculation to make a mental health diagnosis on someone who is deceased.

“We have to protect the integrity of the deceased. There were no mental health records and none of her friends think they existed.”

http://newsandtribune.com/x1696742874/Deaths-of-mother-children-determined-to-be-an-accident

 

[time]

And, from the link above:

Jaime Clutter and her two children were last seen at about 7 a.m. March 13 by a friend who stated they were not properly dressed for the cold temperatures when they knocked on her door. Wind chills that day were in the teens, Henderson said.

 

[Reader]

And, from the link above:

What kind of friend was that, who showed absolutely no concern about this mother and 2 children, one a small baby, being outside in those conditions?

Why won't they identify this 'friend'.

My only satisfaction with this finding is that Jaime is no longer called a murderer or mentally ill.

Still, 3 people are dead and we still don't understand why.

This is one of those cases where I think more will come out down the road, even years from now, if the husband or 'friend' talk more.

 

[time]

Reader... I feel the same about it. I don't get it, why the friend didn't do anything. Why she isn't identified.

And, why did Jaime leave with the kids abruptly that morning.

I'm hoping more comes out along the road also.

 

[katydid23]

Reader... I feel the same about it. I don't get it, why the friend didn't do anything. Why she isn't identified.

And, why did Jaime leave with the kids abruptly that morning.

I'm hoping more comes out along the road also.

THose are my questions as well. Why would she take her kids out at such an early hour, in the cold, without proper clothing ? I understand what happened AFTER she became cold and disoriented, but not what happened BEFORE.

 

[ShyViolet]

Thank you for the heads up Shanhunter (and WELCOME!)

http://www.whas11.com/news/local/Grand-jury-says-Clutter--215075411.html



I'm not entirely sure what this means since they had no clothes on?

I may be misreading your question, so apologies in advance if I did and am telling you something you already know.

Paradoxical undressing is not uncommon in late stage hypothermia. I can't explain it in medical terms, but I imagine it is similar to when you have been in the cold for some time, and your extremities start to feel like they are burning, even though they are cold to the touch. People who are hypothermic feel as if they are overheating, so they undress, which sadly only hastens the lowering of the body temperature.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypothermia

If, in their confusion, they felt hot, it might also explain why they ended up in the water. Pure speculation on my part, of course.

 

[time]

Violet, thank you for the info. I thought that was the case.

My post wasn't very clear, probably because I was posting the gut reaction I had to the information. I can see where a person gets hypothermia and disrobes. Harder to understand they disrobe themselves and two children because they feel they are overheating. Plus, that takes a little time. And, then I'm assuming they were in the creek also because of ....? It would be even cooler? They tripped or just fell over or ? She encouraged them to get cooler?

I don't know, it just doesn't quite make sense from one end to the other for me. The whole of it doesn't make sense so parsing out one thing from the other doesn't seem wise to come to an explanation.

I thought they were quite a ways from home so why were they that far in the first place? What made her leave home? How did they get that far, get undressed, and so on without anyone seeing them?

Except of course for the friend, and where did she live? Did she call anyone or go looking for them or phone Jaime to see if they got back home?

 

[fred&edna]

I understand privacy issues but the friend would supposedly be the last person to have seen JC and her children. Was it explained as to why and how this person was ruled out as possibly being involved. If not, it's easy come to the conclusion that there's a very odd secrecy involving the "friend".

 

[time]

A bit more - there's more in the article also.

Henderson said that sometime after Michael Clutter left the family's apartment for work around 5 that morning, Jaime and the children left the apartment in a rush. They didn't pull on coats or sweaters despite a wind chill of 18 degrees that morning, he said, and Jaime left without her eyeglasses.

The mother "appeared to be disturbed, looking around, concerned about something." They don't know the source of her distress but they are certain that "what happened that morning caused her great concern," he said.

About 7 a.m., the family knocked on the door of the neighbor, and they already appeared to be cold, Henderson said. He said that the neighbor recalled that it was dark outside and was confused about why the family had come to the door.

After a brief conversation, Jaime Clutter left with the two children. What transpired afterward isn't known.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/07/12/mom-2-kids-deaths-called-accident/2511493/

It now appears it was a neighbor (and a friend?).

The article also made it sound like part of the GJ hearing was to clear Michael once and for all...IDK

I can't for the life of me figure out why they just didn't call the case unsolved/undetermined as to whether it was an accident or something more.

 

[time]

Fromt he link above:

Cuts and abrasions on Jaime Clutter's body were consistent with being dragged in a creek bed, he [Henderson] said.

 

[katydid23]

Hypothermia may have been the end result, but it sounds like a 'mental break' was the beginning. According to the neighbor, the mother was confused, disoriented, when she knocked on the door.

 

[fred&edna]

A bit more - there's more in the article also.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/07/12/mom-2-kids-deaths-called-accident/2511493/

It now appears it was a neighbor (and a friend?).

The article also made it sound like part of the GJ hearing was to clear Michael once and for all...IDK

I can't for the life of me figure out why they just didn't call the case unsolved/undetermined as to whether it was an accident or something more.

Thanks for posting the article & video.

The DA's last words in the video (at least this is what I heard):

"The grand jury has spoken through their findings. They do not believe Jaime Clutter killed her two children nor do they believe Jaime Clutter drown her two children. Finally, they do not believe Jaime Clutter committed suicide."


What a bizarre case.

 

[txsvicki]

Dragged through the creek bed? I hope they could tell dragging herself from being dragged.

 

[Snoopster]

This case is so strange. So, the GJ rules that no one killed anyone yet we end up with three bodies naked in a creek? Did both mom and son take their own clothes off? If so, when? When they were at the creek?

I actually could have believed that Jamie killed them, or at least counseled her son to lie in the river. But the clothes off?...not that simply befuddles me.

 

[2Hip2BSquare]

Did Jaime have an EXTENSIVE history of mental health issues dating back to before she had her children and was married?

Did her children act strange or get sick often in the weeks before they all died?

What was Jaime's husbands occupation?

 

[2Hip2BSquare]

Could Jaime have actually felt rather hot? Was she on a type of drug that would make her blood run warm? Do we know if her toxicology results came back with anything disconcerting?

 

[2Hip2BSquare]

All these nude bodies being found in water with no signs of trauma that are *initially* ruled homicides and then switch to accidental due to diminished capacity of the victim or some other mitigating factor that seemingly can't be scientifically qualified/quantified in relation to the actual situation....Well they are becoming all too common IMHO.

 

[time]

Could Jaime have actually felt rather hot? Was she on a type of drug that would make her blood run warm? Do we know if her toxicology results came back with anything disconcerting?

No, nothing was found. I assume they did the typical tox screen though? IDK

 

[time]

Did Jaime have an EXTENSIVE history of mental health issues dating back to before she had her children and was married?

Did her children act strange or get sick often in the weeks before they all died?

What was Jaime's husbands occupation?

No history of mental issues or illness. I believe Michael worked for a printer/print company, but I'd have to double check.

BBM - not that we have heard.