GUILTY IN - Shaylyn Ammerman, 14 mos, Spencer, 23 March 2016 #2

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I don't know if anyone has gone there, but the the reason the crib bashing is so horrifying to me is because it feels like an act of rage against Shaylyn herself. That's what I am feeling . jmo.

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I took it as rage and feeling inadequate or impotent. Anger that the baby had been taken in such an awful way. Better to rage at a crib than a human or living thing.

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Do you have a link for this? I don't recall this.

(with regard to the sheriff saying there were no further arrests forthcoming)

I saw it this morning. It was the last sentence in an article I am trying to find now. I will edit this post as soon as I track it down. Here is a different article with a little less conviction. http://www.spencereveningworld.com/...arged_With_Murder_Rape_In_Connection_Wit.html

“Although I do not anticipate any additional arrests regarding this case today, this case is still under investigation"
 
A state police spokesman says the investigation into the death of a 1-year-old Indiana girl isn't over despite charges being filed against a man who authorities say abducted her from her father's home and then raped and killed her.


Sgt. Curt Durnil said Monday that the circumstances of Shaylyn (SHAY'-lynn) Ammerman's death remained under investigation. He says detectives could take several days or weeks to complete interviews and review of evidence, but that more arrests aren't expected Monday.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/other...ddler-death-investigation-not-over/ar-BBr2eoL

not yet officially cleared but by no means a named suspect. Last termed a POI as were others in the household due to their presence the night of Shayln's disappearance. IME that is SOP.

I think LE have done an excellent job thus far and am not at all surprised they are taking their time now that charges have been filed against KP, to more fully investigate and wrap things up.
 
The same guy who grandma found holding Shaylyn in his lap when he was drunk, according to Adam.

Sorry to keep repeating that. I only blame the rapist and murderer for the crimes committed....but geez.

JMO.

http://www.reporter-times.com/it-s-...cle_84aeb2af-7ed6-547e-8786-21d63afe4b62.html

"Ammerman also told police that his mother, Tammy Morgan, had walked into their house one day and found Parker sitting in a rocking chair, intoxicated and holding Shaylyn in his lap."

Nothing indicates this was the same day.
 
I've seen some of the comments, and they're unbelievably hate-filled. I've said a million times and I'll say a million times more, FOLKS, put your social media pages on PRIVATE for friends and family only. I know we're all outraged and have opinions on what has happened and who is (ultimately and peripherally) to blame, but that doesn't mean we have the right to unleash venom on anyone. Rights to freedom of expression come with responsibility as well.

In *some* ways, this case is very similar to the Bella Grogan-Canella case. Her mother (while circumstances were a bit different) received the same kind of comments on her FB page. Same language, same hate, same condemnation. Social media has become a game-changer in what in society has become acceptable, and most definitely not for the better.

moo.

Its actually very common with all of the cases which have involved the kidnapping, rape, and murder of a child or children. Its been happening I know even before Jessica Lunsford was found murdered or even before little Danielle Van Dam was kidnapped, raped, and murdered by David Westerfield and has continued right on to the present date.

Social media can be a wonderful communication tool if used correctly but now for so many it seems to have become an outlet/platform where countless others find family members of the little murder victim guilty via the internet. In fact often there is so much effort in bashing, and accusing the parent/s that the real murderer is not mentioned as often as the parents are. I really don't know why this has happened in such great abundance but it seems it has become some type of blood sport for many on social media sites. Maybe its because they sit behind a monitor or put up FB fake names and thinks that protects them. This case sadly is no different than many others that have happened nor were the parent/s treated any differently. Its happened in many high profile cases before just like little Shaylyn's.

I am not going to sit here and pretend I think Shaylyn's family is 'family of the year' material, and much could have been done differently to make Shaylin have a safer place to stay inside of her father's home, imo. BUT at this time I have no reason to believe any of her family members knew about this or was involved. I have to realize if I make accusations I need to have supporting facts to support them. At this time, I do not have those facts so her family to me at this time are victims as well. I also have to realize even dysfunctional and highly imperfect families grieve the loss of their child or children.

Everyday across America at some time or the other a friend of a friend will bring another friend along to visit someone's home. The problem is predators really don't look like two headed monsters nor do they act like rabid monsters either. They look just like everyone else. How I wish they did come with a warning sign on their forehead that flashed "Beware, pedophile!!!" In reality I don't think anyone thinks someone they knew even casually would be capable of doing something this inhumane and horrific against a precious child. The brain isn't geared that way to be suspicious of everyone all the time.

Thank God, what happened to little Shaylyn is still very rare. Children who are grossly neglected, abused in everyway possible, including repeated rapes, and murders have to fear who they live with the most. The majority of time abused, incest raped, and murdered child/children are/were living inside the home with them and trapped with their very worst enemy of all. Their parents or a parent and a live in BF/GF are the ones who does the vast majority of neglect, abuse, and murders of defenseless little children.

I have learned a long time ago that in cases like this the majority is never satisfied by the behaviors of parents of murdered children even when they had no involvement in their child's murder. No matter who they are, they are simply torn to shreds one way or the other.

Perhaps it is done because the commenters believe those parents are so unlike them, and feel it could never happened to their child or children because they believe they have good parenting skills which will keep their children safe at all times. However; things like this have happened to the best of parents who loved and cared for their child with the child being raised in a good environment. That is scary, and very hard to digest for any parent because the reality is it has happened, and can happen to any parent (good or bad) with children.

I couldn't even post about this case for days. I just read. It is such an unimaginable horror to know a supposed human being could do such horrific and evil things to a little tiny 1 year old girl. How does one become this evil? I am not sure I want to even comprehend it. How could anyone be sexually attracted to a little baby? We truly have monsters walking among us. Its not only Shaylyn being raped and murdered but it has happened to little boys and other little infant/toddlers have also suffered the same fate from the monster who crossed their path. How in the hell have some in our society sunk so low making it feel as if they rose up out of the pits of hell?

God bless sweet Shaylin. Shaylyn your little beautiful face makes me breakdown and cry for you. I am so sorry this has happened to you sweetheart, you deserved so much better.

God please help all of our children who are in so much danger now who are crying out in the dark every night with no help in sight.:(

Please save the next little child who will face their own demon monster who wants to prey upon their innocence.
 
(with regard to the sheriff saying there were no further arrests forthcoming)

I saw it this morning. It was the last sentence in an article I am trying to find now. I will edit this post as soon as I track it down. Here is a different article with a little less conviction. http://www.spencereveningworld.com/...arged_With_Murder_Rape_In_Connection_Wit.html

“Although I do not anticipate any additional arrests regarding this case today, this case is still under investigation"
I read that to mean that he didn't expect any additional arrest that day, the day of his statement. I'm feel confident that LE will announce when there are no longer any other POI's and as I said before, I really hope Shaylyn's entire family is cleared.
 
I read that to mean that he didn't expect any additional arrest that day, the day of his statement. I'm feel confident that LE will announce when there are no longer any other POI's and as I said before, I really hope Shaylyn's entire family is cleared.

I read it to mean that as of that day, he doesn't anticipate any additional arrests.
 
I believe he claimed to have gone to bed around midnight while A and K continued to watch TV until A fell asleep.

Well, someone's lying. That much is clear:

Family members told The Herald-Times that on Tuesday night, the child’s uncle, grandfather and Parker drank whiskey and watched television. Parker left the house at about 2 a.m. Wednesday, said Adam Ammerman, the child’s uncle. Grandfather Daniel Morgan said he fixed the satellite television at about that time, checked on the baby and saw her in her crib.
http://www.heraldtimesonline.com/ne...cle_c70a95a2-f1d1-11e5-aa09-8b32ae4d2e7d.html

They were either lying then, or lying now.
 
http://www.reporter-times.com/it-s-...cle_84aeb2af-7ed6-547e-8786-21d63afe4b62.html

"Ammerman also told police that his mother, Tammy Morgan, had walked into their house one day and found Parker sitting in a rocking chair, intoxicated and holding Shaylyn in his lap."

Nothing indicates this was the same day.

I know it wasn't the same day. That's the point.

The family knew PRIOR to that night that Kyle held the child on his lap while he was drunk. Maybe some people see nothing wrong with a drunk acquaintance holding your infant family member, but I wouldn't like it...and I would make sure not to leave that child unattended around him.

But, even though they had some hints about him, I blame no one but him for the crime, while at the same time wishing they had been more careful in their childcare.
 
Quote Originally Posted by AmyPond View Post

I'm going to have to disagree. I wouldn't automatically think they people have some sort of mental health issues. Not a legitimate one, anyway. <modsnip>

Many times on this forum I have seen people who assume criminals/POI have a delay or disability. "Oh they must have a mental delay or disability" because they are "slow" or whatever. As someone with a son with delays, I find it highly offensive.



I agree that many people see evil, and it is so unbelievable to a 'normal' person, they think the person it somehow sick.
But evil exists, all around us. And seems to be growing every day.
 
http://www.reporter-times.com/it-s-...cle_84aeb2af-7ed6-547e-8786-21d63afe4b62.html

"Ammerman also told police that his mother, Tammy Morgan, had walked into their house one day and found Parker sitting in a rocking chair, intoxicated and holding Shaylyn in his lap."

Nothing indicates this was the same day.

Which is sure a far cry from this glowing character reference:

Tamera said every time Parker visited the home, he was always polite. &#8220;One morning I got up and he was sitting right here, rocking her to sleep, watching cartoons,&#8221; she recalled. &#8220;He was always friendly. One day he cleaned out from under the kitchen table for me and took the trash out.&#8221;
http://www.heraldtimesonline.com/ne...cle_c70a95a2-f1d1-11e5-aa09-8b32ae4d2e7d.html

Of course there's nothing to indicate cartoon day and drunk day were the SAME day, but there was NEVER any mention of the drunk/rocking of the baby until after the gory details came out. In fact, in a LOT of the earlier articles grandma had nothing but kind things to say about Parker and repeatedly told the same story about him being helpful and rocking Shaylyn to sleep, playing with her, etc.
 
These statistics are so sad, as a parent scare the living day lights out of me. You never know who is lurking around waiting for their opportunity to strike. I really hope that parents in general will start taking even more notice in who their children are around. We have to protect our babies!!!
2ab87184ebba70a5d4a3c481a4e327ab.jpg
 
I know it wasn't the same day. That's the point.

The family know PRIOR to that night that Kyle held the child on his lap while he was drunk. Maybe some people see nothing wrong with a drunk acquaintance holding your infant family member, but I wouldn't like it...and I would make sure not to leave that child unattended around him.

But, even though they have some hints about him, I blame no one but him for the crime, while at the same time wishing they had been more careful in their childcare.

Did that actually happen though? I know this is what AA has told the media his mother told him, allegedly, but did it actually happen and she neglected to mention that in ALL the other interviews she gave about him being such a helpful young man who rocked her grandbaby to sleep?
 
Did that actually happen though? I know this is what AA has told the media his mother told him, allegedly, but did it actually happen and she neglected to mention that in ALL the other interviews she gave about him being such a helpful young man who rocked her grandbaby to sleep?

Good point. It's incredibly hard to determine accuracy in this case.

I personally think it happened and that it didn't raise a red flag for Grandma like it does to most of us here. Trying to figure out why it didn't raise a flag would spiral us into a never-ending discussion, imo. (I'm on the fence whether it raised a red flag for Uncle, to be honest.)

It happened. It didn't cause concern. It was allowed to happen again in a hugely tragic way.
 
Good point. It's incredibly hard to determine accuracy in this case.

I personally think it happened and that it didn't raise a red flag for Grandma like it does to most of us here. Trying to figure out why it didn't raise a flag would spiral us into a never-ended discussion, imo. (I'm on the fence whether it raised a red flag for Uncle, to be honest.)

It happened. It didn't cause concern. It was allowed to happen again in a hugely tragic way.

We don't know the context of this event though, do we? Was it the middle of the night? The afternoon? Was KP falling over drunk? Just a little tipsy? Maybe KP was over and there was drinking. JA went to the bathroom, Shaylyn started crying and KP picked her up to rock her until dad got back? Knowing what we now know, yeah, it looks like a huge warning sign. But without knowing more about what grandma actually walked in on, I can't condemn her too much for not seeing it as a warning sign. To her, it may very well have looked like a guy who's great with kids helping settle down a baby while dad was fixing the antenna...
 
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Originally Posted by LisaB
I believe he claimed to have gone to bed around midnight while A and K continued to watch TV until A fell asleep.
Well, someone's lying. That much is clear:
Family members told The Herald-Times that on Tuesday night, the child&#8217;s uncle, grandfather and Parker drank whiskey and watched television. Parker left the house at about 2 a.m. Wednesday, said Adam Ammerman, the child&#8217;s uncle. Grandfather Daniel Morgan said he fixed the satellite television at about that time, checked on the baby and saw her in her crib.
http://www.heraldtimesonline.com/ne...cle_c70a95a2-f1d1-11e5-aa09-8b32ae4d2e7d.html

They were either lying then, or lying now.
I can see how both things can be true, at first GM drank whiskey and watched tv with Parker and AA in AA:s room until midnight, after that he went to his own bedroom to continue watching tv there for a while, later he went and fixed the satellite tv and checked on the baby at about 2 a.m., shortly before Parker left. Have anyone claimed that GM stayed in AA:s room until Parker left?
 
I took it as rage and feeling inadequate or impotent. Anger that the baby had been taken in such an awful way. Better to rage at a crib than a human or living thing.

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Thanks for your perspective. I can see that way as well. Sigh, I don't want to let my opinion of these people color my thinking. I was actually appalled at the posters on the Father's FB page. I think it was sad. Personally getting a vibe that dad is uninvolved (although negligent, along with grandma), but the uncle I believe is in it up to his hairy ears. Jmo of course.

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Good point. It's incredibly hard to determine accuracy in this case.

I personally think it happened and that it didn't raise a red flag for Grandma like it does to most of us here. Trying to figure out why it didn't raise a flag would spiral us into a never-ending discussion, imo. (I'm on the fence whether it raised a red flag for Uncle, to be honest.)

It happened. It didn't cause concern. It was allowed to happen again in a hugely tragic way.

We know what DID happen the last time KP was near Shaylyn and that's horrifying enough. As for the other stuff, all we have to go on is AA's word, and he's the same guy who said at first, that he did NOT see Parker carrying anything when he left, but then later said that mess about a dangling foot. Yet another detail to come out after the fact. Put me down on the list of not taking AA's statements as gospel.
 
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