Is TH Responsible in any way for the Disappearance of Kyron? **NO DISCUSSION**

[tlcya]

I have been very vocal about my position on the fence and my exit from the fencetop (my hiney was starting to get numb!) the other day to land on the Terri is responsible for whatever has happened to Kyron in some way side.

That being said I want to say IMO terms like narcisist, sociopath, psychopath, bi-polar, PPD, etc get thrown around an awful lot here at Websleuths. And there are such perps out there. But it has become way too predictible that no matter the case, no matter the thread, someone is gonna whip out the sociopath, (or any of the others listed above) card.

I myself have named one person in another case as a sociopath (ICA) IMOO and I feel very comfortable making that armchair diagnosis based on her very well documented behaviors and letters written in her own hand.

Quite frankly, I think sometimes it is easier for us to distance ourselves from perps and their bad behavior by deeming them sociopath (or any of the other disorders etc listed above). Not everyone who does something that is incomprehensible to us has any one of those mental health illnesses, conditions, or personailty disorders. Sometimes, crappy people just do crappy things.

Sorry, not trying to pick a fight but am a little tired of every single perp being "webdiagnosed" with some drastic mental issue.

 

[cypress]

I have serious doubts about Terri being involved in and responsible for Kyron's disappearance, and here are a few of the reasons why --

The more Desiree and Kaine talk, the more I believe LE probably has very little evidence against Terri and, in some cases, I wonder if the "evidence" was manipulated in a legal way by LE in an effort to extract a confession from Terri. I'm thinking specifically about the LDT, especially in light of LE's recent comments pointing out the LDTs are used as tools. There was an air of backtracking and distancing in their statement, IMHO. If Terri told LE she was driving baby K around Portland to soothe an earache, I admit the alibi sounds weak. The thing is, the alibi is plausible, IMHO. I know people who use rides in the car to soothe their children; it's a very popular way to soothe children in Hollywood films. It's not unheard of or all that unusual, IMHO. It's only weak because it's not verifiable, but it's still plausible. Perhaps LE was less than truthful about results of the LDT because they didn't believe her alibi. There are reasonable explanations for Terri's behavior that day, though, especially if you believe baby K is probably teething which explains why she'd drive around, not go to the doctor, and would go to the gym. Babies are amazingly resilient, and can go from fussy to fine and vice versa, very, very quickly.

If LE had a solid case, in the press conferences, Desiree wouldn't rely so much on her mothering instincts and what I believe are superficial inconsistencies. The more Desiree talks, the more apparent it becomes that she's held a grudge against Terri for years, and regardless of whether or not the grudge is warranted, it's going to influence and perhaps even shape her opinions about Terri's behavior. Desiree was very vocal about Kyron crying and wanting to live with her and Tony, and the inference was that Terri was somehow responsible for Kyron's unhappiness, but then we found out that Kyron cried when he went to Desiree's. DY and KH later admitted he was having difficulty transitioning. The facts present a completely different situation, but the press and a lot of the public will never read that Kyron cried when he left Terri and Kaine and had to visit Desiree, only that "missing boy cried when he had to go home to stepmother!" or whatever other salacious headline is used.

There are a lot of accusations, a lot of implications, that are slowly being clarified or eaten away at, IMHO. And, IMHO, when you get to the root of why Desiree believes Terri is responsible, it's because Desiree has instincts and Terri didn't behave and react in the way Desiree thought she should.

LE has no evidence of a murder scene. None. Terri is not some hardened criminal with years of experience in pulling off crimes such as this one. If Terri is responsible, she abducted and murdered a child she'd raised for most of his life. Her biological children were attached to this child. She was married to this child's father. Killing him, seeing his lifeless, perhaps bloody body, discarding him somehow, all with her daughter nearby, is unfathomable to me, especially since she then carried on in a completely normal fashion, totally calm, acting in character, for the rest of the day. And, then, there's no physical evidence. None in the truck. None on her clothes. None in the house. After forty years of living a normal life, she's able to pull off this crime leaving behind no physical evidence, carrying on about her day, going to the gym, arriving home, sending e-mails to Desiree, posting pictures on Facebook (and it's interesting to note that Terri didn't rush right home and post the pictures to establish some sort of alibi, she posted them hours later).

As much as some are hopeful, I think most would admit it's unlikely Kyron is alive. Hell, I'm hopeful, but I believe it's highly improbable that Kyron is alive. If he's dead and Terri killed him, there should be evidence even without a body, IMHO.

 

[Emeralgem]

Thank you Kimster for this thread. I quote your opening post because I love it: "this thread is not for the meek"

I have never been sitting on the fence. I believe Terri did this and it was planned.

While not all of what leads me to believe the above comes directly from LE, I believe personally that things "leaked" to the media come from somewhere and so I take that information into account.

-my suspicion of TMH started on the day that I saw her picture on the LE flier

-my suspicion was further hammered home when I heard about the murder for hire plot. A human being who will stoop to that level is capable of anything.

-than a judge grants a restraining order against her and Kaine files for divorce. The reason: his wife was trying to kill him!

-than there were the polys

-and than she was sexting to Kaine's high school friend and sending sexually graphic photos of herself to him... and in court documents they were similar to those she sent the landscaper she tried to hire to kill her husband

-body language at the presser...

-LE telling the public nothing to fear at the school and that this is an isolated incident

-a judge than signs search warrants (probable cause needed for those!) for the homes of her friends.

-one of her friends has since lawyered up and has been to a GJ... and she didn't testify. I personally think she will testify later with transactional immunity

and gosh there is sooooo much more but these are just a few reasons why I am ever convinced that TMH is the person with the means to do this. After hearing in the audio interview about her problems with drugs, alcohol, and lying I am really starting to get a feel of her personality and think she seriously has a lot of personality issues.

note to the fence sitters: I respect your opinions and when this is all said and done if I am wrong I will be the first to admit that I was wrong.

At this time, I am convinced more than ever that Terri was responsible.
(((big fat mooo on top ))

nursebeeme, thank you for typing all that out..I am on the same page as to WHY I suspect her....
And like you, I am now convinced more than ever TMH is the one who is responsible for whatever it is that has happened to Kyron..JMO

 

[SusieMom]

I just don't know... What "evidence" there is so shaky.. its hardly enough to be confident about, most of it IS rumors, bits and pieces of facts tangled in web of assumptions.

But then I try to imagine myself in her shoes if they are the shoes of an innocent woman. Ok... so this weird thing happens.. I leave my kid at school, run some errands, drive around, go the gym, come home update my facebook, hang out the rest of the afternoon... (I mean what did she do? Fold some laundry? Watch a soap? organize the linen closet? ) then walk with my husband and kid down to the bus stop but the other kid doesn't get off, starting into motion this nightmare that only keeps getting worse and worse. I can't say for sure what I'd do in that situation, but only considering what we are confident is TRUE about what SHE'S done (or not done) there came a point where I KNOW that whatever I would do would be very different than what she's doing. I can't imagine even *thinking* about the gym right after a child who was in my care went missing. I CAN imagine failing a lie detector (b/c they are scary to me and I'm easily made anxious by scary things plus I know I would be over analyzing every single question, worrying that somehow maybe i was accidentally lying) but if I had, I am certain that no lawyer in the land could keep me from going before any media who would show up to hear me and BEGGING people on my hands and knees to keep looking for the real kidnapper. I would NEVER stop trying to somehow, some way convince people that it wasn't me and that focusing on me wasn't going to help the child AT ALL but instead be helping the real culprit possibly continue to harm that child. I can imagine saying I don't care what happens to me for doing this, I don't care how much I should just shut up and wait to see how much evidence they can collect.... no way no how would I stay sequestered away b/c truly.. at this point? If you were her and innocent, would you have any faith whatsoever in the ability of the police to find Kyron? Would you not think.. at this point the only way we're going to find him is if somebody else is looking for him and maybe I can motivate someone to at least try?

And if that isn't enough strange choices that she's been making, the "sexting" thing with this guy she supposedly only just met is beyond bizarre and inappropriate on so many levels.... I can't even fathom why an innocent woman, who would presumably be trapped in this nightmare and wracked with guilt, consumed with worry, if not for Kyron, then surely for herself and for Baby K (I mean, seriously can you imagine how anguished you'd be?) would find time to take explicit pictures of herself to send to this new guy friend. There is just no way to find any decency or logic or any kind of justification for that. A new relationship.. sure I can see that... he's there with a hug, holding her hand, being her friend... I can see how things might progress down a romantic path.. even possibly to include getting physical, but not to include the sexting... that is just not something a person in severe emotional distress would do... its something you do when you are infatuated, in the grip of lust towards someone, which is much more closely associated with feelings of happiness rather than what I think an innocent woman in this situation would be feeling.

so... really I think it comes down to this: if it looks,walks, & quacks like a duck, its probably a duck but if its not, its the weirdest non-duck ever, some sort of creature that nobody's ever seen before.... and really, what are the chances of that?

 

[Cheewawa007]

I'm still sitting pretty on the fence, cheering each side on (GO TEAMS!!!!) because I honestly cannot make up my mind - guilty or innocent. With that being said, TH is either the luckiest human being on the face of this earth by not leaving a shred of evidence behind to link her in some way, or the most unlucky human being on the face of this earth with the coincidences and tongue wagging stories/rumors, etc.
I have been thinking - could she and KH have been "swingers"????

 

[tiredblondy]

But what did Terri have to gain from a kidnapping or disappearance of Kyron??

 

[nursebeeme]

:woohoo:

But what did Terri have to gain from a kidnapping or disappearance of Kyron??

I think it somehow relates to the same motive she had (((whatever that could be)))) for trying to hire someone to kill her husband.

She wants to ultimately hurt him (Kaine).

MOO

eta: I don't know HOW that woooohoooo man got at the top of my post! I didn't put him there~ really I dint~

 

[cindysue]

IMO I think that if she had an accomplice sooner or later the info comes out, friendships deteriorate , maybe they want money to keep quiet or favors etc. And under the constant eye of the law that will be eternally on them. They might crack. I think it's would a lot easier to get away with crime if you were in it alone and I don't think that's the case

 

[tehcloser]

But what did Terri have to gain from a kidnapping or disappearance of Kyron??

Attention? Hurting DY and KH? Money? I have no clue. :banghead:

 

[tiredblondy]

Don't get me wrong I'm sure she is involved and probably orchestrated the whole thing I just don't get why??? Of course I never get people who think like that!

 

[kant]

Thank you for posting this. It supports my opinion that I have no idea if TH is responsible or not because all we have heard are allegations. This motion is nothing but allegations. I have NEVER seen a motion that is all allegations without even one piece of supporting evidence. Just because an attorney says it, does not make it true.

After their allegations their should be a reference to the supporting documentation being attached as an exhibit. I can see if they had to keep the "evidence" sealed because of the LE investigation. But they have to "provide" the court with the evidence for the Judge to determine if the evidence supports the allegations. There should be references to attached exhibits and/or exhibit list but there is not.

IMO, when is this case going to be about Kyron. As it is, the focus has been placed on TH as a result of the divorce case that questions are not being asked. The media just sits there and reports whatever they are told to report.

IMO, As far as suspicious behavior of TH outside of allegations in the divorce papers, she has not done anything that others have not done. TH is not the only one who went to the gym although she no longer can. TH is not the only one who was not out searching for Kyron. TH was not the only one who refused to do interviews. Once TH was contained so she could not talk, is when interviews started.

IMO, the information we are receiving is being controlled to the point that we only hear what people want us to hear. The amount of control in this case regarding the media has caused me to have more questions and suspicions. Until I hear more, I cannot determine who is involved. The only ones I can rule out are the Mom and Step-Dad.

So I'll stay on the fence with my opinions that the media needs to start asking questions just like they would in any missing child case instead of accepting everything they are being told as true.

I agree. IDK either what TH may have done or not done. There is just something that is bugging me that feels like a "there's more to this" kind of thing.

Also, was TH the last person to see Kyron? How is that possible if he was "last seen," according to TH (and others,) at the school? walking to (into?) class? Or did I misunderstand something?

moo
.

 

[tiredblondy]

Ok thanks guys, and of course
She who has controlled and manipulated everyone from day one never considered the consequences if her plan didn't work. Just wondered if someone had ideas I hadn't considered . Thanks again for your input.

 

[debs]

........or why she didn't go back to get the project since she had the truck.

Thanks for your whole post, but addressing this point only:

In the beginning, I can imagine she told a lie about where she was for the unverified time, and based upon her proclivity to have inappropriate emotional attachments to others (the LS and DC), it is more than likely there was yet another person who she was involved with, and in order to not be found out about THAT, she lied. Whether we worry about ourselves in a missing person's case or not, the fact remains people lie to cover their own *advertiser censored*. This lie does not effect the outcome that Kyron is missing and perhaps by now she did come clean with the information. What we don't know is whether she has divulged to LE that she was out having a nooner with someone. Now her marriage is down around her ankles, we can see that IF that's the truth, it won't do anything more than add to Kaine's defense in the divorce case. But maybe that's why she lied about that time, and why, when driving the truck in order to pick up the tree frog diorama, she didn't in fact pick it up. Perhaps she thought they'd just get it later. Maybe time got away from her and she made the decision to get baby K home and wait for Kaine and then just swing by the school and grab it on their way out of town. But maybe she didn't want to add to the whole horrible mess by admitting to an affair that same day.

It is plausible, and therefore, without Terri's defense of her actions that day, remains as likely as anything else, which even in the court of public opinion, results in reasonable doubt that she had anything to do with Kyron's disappearance.

 

[BeanE]

I believe Terri's text messages or at least phone calls are what led police to this landscaper guy. They didn't know about him before looking at her cellphone - they went to him, not the other way around. And then they found Michael Cook, and she's doing the same behavior with him - it shows a pattern, which I believe is their point in the court papers.

Also, she waited just a few days after leaving home before she actually got into a sexual relationship with Michael Cook. I believe that is by his admission - plus the hundreds of text messages and photographs of people in "undress."

Hundreds of text messages - not smoke signals. Was her mind on these kids while she was writing hundreds of text messages to a man who is not her husband? The texting happened while the search for Kyron was going on!

I think you may have misunderstood me. I absolutely agree that the sexting between MC & Terri occurred, and that the document supports that. I said nothing about what happened between MC & Terri in my post. I was referring solely to the landscaper.

 

[cakegirl0905]

I am 99.9% sure she is responsible.

The FB posts made me uncomfortable, but I ignored that.
The presser and her body language set off every hinky sensor I have.
The doctor's appointment
Driving the truck.
The MFH plot also makes me think she hates Kaine so much she wanted to hurt him.
Sauvie island (I know not confirmed, but still.)
The sexting while a child is missing.
DeDe.

There are too many weird things. I know this is all circumstantial, but I truly believe it's her.

 

[Snowball58]

Terri sticks out like a sore thumb to me, even if I remove everything DY and KH have ever said about her. If I look at the direction of the police investigation, her odd behavior at the presser, her timeline, DS's timeline, the sexting, MFH sting, court documents (RO, etc.), lack of any public pleas for Kyron or even statements to defend herself, her not contesting the RO, DS appearing at grand jury, what her friend and father have said in interviews, hiring a criminal defense attorney, etc. And if I also take into account all of the coincidences that would have had to take place in order for Kyron to disappear that particular day makes Terri unlucky to the point of disbelief, if we are to think she's uninvolved (CSI shirt, science fair day, vehicle change, confusion about doctor's appointment, sketchy timeline/alibi that day, etc.)

Does that mean she's for sure guilty? Nope, but just like with Scott Peterson and the Cumming/Croslin crew (among others), Terri sticks out to me (and has from day 1) and I believe she is either directly or indirectly responsible for whatever has happened to precious Kyron.

Now, off to go research the two reported white truck sightings (one the morning of the disappearance near Logie Trail, IIRC, and the other ones by Jim Kelley, to see how they might fit into Terri and DS's reported timelines for that day.)

 

[cluciano63]

One thing I don't agree with several posters on is that if Terri is guilty of trying to have Kaine killed, she would be capable of anything. Wanting and even trying to arrange to have a spouse removed/erased is not the same kind of mindset, to me, as killing a child, even one belonging to that spouse. I have heard of cases of battling spouses killing a child to prevent the other one from having custody, but I do not believe this was an issue here as Terri was never in line for custody of Kyron. And what would be the point of "stashing" him? The only good reason I can think of is if Kaine were to be the immediate suspect and there was no way that way going to happen with this "plan."

So at this point I am not convinced Terri is involved with Kyron's disappearance. I will be convinced if Dede or someone else, either a nuetral party of a friend of Terri's, indicates that they have knowledge of her being involved or if LE finds a witness who can swear she left the school with Kyron.

 

[Emma Peel]

Thanks for your whole post, but addressing this point only:

In the beginning, I can imagine she told a lie about where she was for the unverified time, and based upon her proclivity to have inappropriate emotional attachments to others (the LS and DC), it is more than likely there was yet another person who she was involved with, and in order to not be found out about THAT, she lied. Whether we worry about ourselves in a missing person's case or not, the fact remains people lie to cover their own *advertiser censored*. This lie does not effect the outcome that Kyron is missing and perhaps by now she did come clean with the information. What we don't know is whether she has divulged to LE that she was out having a nooner with someone. Now her marriage is down around her ankles, we can see that IF that's the truth, it won't do anything more than add to Kaine's defense in the divorce case. But maybe that's why she lied about that time, and why, when driving the truck in order to pick up the tree frog diorama, she didn't in fact pick it up. Perhaps she thought they'd just get it later. Maybe time got away from her and she made the decision to get baby K home and wait for Kaine and then just swing by the school and grab it on their way out of town. But maybe she didn't want to add to the whole horrible mess by admitting to an affair that same day.

It is plausible, and therefore, without Terri's defense of her actions that day, remains as likely as anything else, which even in the court of public opinion, results in reasonable doubt that she had anything to do with Kyron's disappearance.

I don't understand. Are you also proposing Terri simply does not know the name or how to contact her nooner amour? And said Nooner-amour would not go to LE?

Or are you saying it's better to pay Houze $350,000 than to give LE the name of her Nooner?

Well, that might be better for Houze, but I mean what's better for Terri now?

To clear herself of these charges and get on with her inevitable divorce or to preserve the secrecy of her Nooner that day?

IMO, were this the case, LE would have her Nooner truth and would have alibied her by now. I bet she'd be quite thrilled if she actually had a Nooner-amour that would vouch for her at this point. The GJ is in session, after all.

I'm thinking I don't understand your entire thought process here...are you speculating that she arranged for the kidnapping of Kyron and then had a Nooner whilst celebrating said kidnapping, so she still needs Houze?

Because if that's the case, I actually could run with you on that theory.

 

[tiredblondy]

OH my goodness...I just thought of something. If Terri's purpose was to hurt and cause pain to Kaine and Desiree for a long long time she is still in control and manipulating! (This would also cover a ransom plan gone wrong.)

 

[cakegirl0905]

Attention? Hurting DY and KH? Money? I have no clue. :banghead:

Maybe...this thought just occurred to me...maybe she believed Kaine and Desiree were having an affair. I don't believe they were, but maybe TH was so delusional she believed it.

Desiree is beautiful and the exwife whose husband she stole. Maybe she could never live up to Desiree? And as her looks faded and she gained all the weight she became more and more jealous. A cheating husband is motive for MFH and when that fell through, what else could she do to hurt them? Nothing worse in the world than taking someone's child.