Israel - Palestinian militants launch massive attack, 7 Oct 2023 #10

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GazaCNN —
Multiple militants from Gaza have entered Israeli territory, the Israel Defense Forces (IDF) said Saturday, shortly after a barrage of rockets left one person dead and at least three injured.

Palestinian militant group Hamas claimed responsibility for the rocket attack.

Hamas military commander Muhammad Al-Deif released a recorded message, announcing operation “Al-Aqsa Storm” and saying the Palestinian militant group “targeted the enemy positions, airports and military positions with 5,000 rockets.”

The IDF has warned Israelis who live near Gaza to stay in their homes.

The rockets, which were witnessed by a CNN producer in Gaza, prompted sirens as far north as the Tel Aviv area, east to Beer Sheva, and many other locations in between.


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Hey everyone,

Websleuths does not have enough staff, time, or specific knowledge of all Israel/Palestine/Middle Eastern affairs to be able to vet / research all the background of the various publications that members are sending us for approval. Chances are, we don't know any more than you do about a particular source.

Members are going to have to do their own due diligence by thoroughly checking out the background and credibility of the sources they are reading. If you are convinced that a source is legitimate, go ahead and link to it. If your post gets Reported by other members with an explanation as to any concern, WS staff will review it at that time.

Also, as Websleuths is located in the USA, linked articles need to be from MSM, government or other well recognized agencies or individuals, and articles need to be in English or with English translation.

Thanks to all for your cooperation.

SB :)
 
www.theguardian.com

Israel to start ‘pauses’ in fighting – as it happened

This blog is now closed
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
Nov 9 2023
''The Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, has repeatedly said there will be no ceasefire in Gaza until hostages – of which there are believed to be more than 240 – are released. Hamas says hostages will not be released until a ceasefire is agreed.

Netanyahu said on Wednesday night: “I want to put to the side all sorts of idle rumours that we are hearing from all sorts of directions, and repeat one clear thing: there will be no ceasefire without the release of our hostages.”
Qatar has been mediating between Israel and Hamas.''

Response to @margarita25 from last thread regarding messages on weapons..
www.websleuths.com

Israel - Palestinian militants launch massive attack, 7 Oct 2023 #9

4 hours ago: (I’ve seen this before, handwritten message on the weapons, trying to remember when/where). Maybe previous Israel? 8 hours ago: — 10 hours ago:
www.websleuths.com www.websleuths.com

Americans are paying for slogans on bombs aimed at ...​

https://www.washingtonpost.com › world › 2022/08/17
''Aug 17, 2022 — Ukrainians are offering to write personal messages on a growing arsenal of weapons. Westerners are opening their wallets.''
 
About 500 trucks per day were crossing into Gaza before the hostilities began. In recent days, an average of only 12 trucks per day have entered, despite needs being far greater than at any time before.

Humanitarian System for More than 2 Million Civilians in Gaza Facing Total Collapse, Secretary-General Warns, Once Again Urging Ceasefire, Aid Delivery at Scale Needed | Meetings Coverage and Press Releases

The following statement by UN Secretary-General António Guterres was issued today:
press.un.org press.un.org
 
Wishbone said:
About 500 trucks per day were crossing into Gaza before the hostilities began. In recent days, an average of only 12 trucks per day have entered, despite needs being far greater than at any time before.

Humanitarian System for More than 2 Million Civilians in Gaza Facing Total Collapse, Secretary-General Warns, Once Again Urging Ceasefire, Aid Delivery at Scale Needed | Meetings Coverage and Press Releases

The following statement by UN Secretary-General António Guterres was issued today:
press.un.org press.un.org
Click to expand...
I'm glad the trucks (in  any number) are still being let in, but are the supplies reaching the intended recipients (as opposed to being stockpiled in warehouses or snatched by Hamas)?
 
What if- no, when the Israelis capture all of Gaza and search it top to bottom, they realize that not all the hostages are still in Gaza?

There is a network on tunnels that connects northern Gaza to the Egyptian side. My guess is that the Egyptian police know where the tunnels are and have a good idea- at least most of the time, what goes into, and what comes out of those tunnels.

Armed Palestinians wore out their welcome in Egypt years ago teaming up with Egyptian terrorists and far more secular pursuits of say, driving by the rival Egyptian drug gang with rocket launchers. Egypt is also wary of Israeli military strength.

I don't think the Egyptians would normally let HAMAS move hostages through a Gaza tunnel. But.... HAMAS called their terror attack "Al Aqsa Storm" for a reason. Netanyahu might of went too far by letting Gvir "Terror is cool- with the right victims" and a stream of other far right Israelis tour around and make inspections of Islam's second holiest site.

In short, the Egyptians may look the other way regarding hostages being moved out. If they make a left turn in Cairo, HAMAS and some hostages could be in North and South Sudan- huge countries with huge areas where there is no government control. This could make good hiding places.
 
Cryptic said:
What if- no, when the Israelis capture all of Gaza and search it top to bottom, they realize that not all the hostages are still in Gaza?

There is a network on tunnels that connects northern Gaza to the Egyptian side. My guess is that the Egyptian police know where the tunnels are and have a good idea- at least most of the time, what goes into, and what comes out of those tunnels.

Armed Palestinians wore out their welcome in Egypt years ago teaming up with Egyptian terrorists and far more secular pursuits of say, driving by the rival Egyptian drug gang with rocket launchers. Egypt is also wary of Israeli military strength.

I don't think the Egyptians would normally let HAMAS move hostages through a Gaza tunnel. But.... HAMAS called their terror attack "Al Aqsa Storm" for a reason. Netanyahu might of went too far by letting Gvir "Terror is cool- with the right victims" and a stream of other far right Israelis tour around and make inspections of Islam's second holiest site.

In short, the Egyptians may look the other way regarding hostages being moved out. If they make a left turn in Cairo, HAMAS and some hostages could be in North and South Sudan- huge countries with huge areas where there is no government control. This could make good hiding places.
Click to expand...
Sadly, you may be right. I'm sure not all the hostages are in Gaza. Hamas is smarter than that. They've had a  month to move people and weaponry around.
ETA: Hamas anticipated Israel's response, I'm sure, and planned accordingly.
 
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For those who've been concerned about the physical wellbeing of hostages (acute medical needs, etc), at least  some of them are being cared for, per the reports from those who were released. Hamas apparently has/had access to medications (possibly through the hospitals they're hiding in/under).
 
Cryptic said:
What if- no, when the Israelis capture all of Gaza and search it top to bottom, they realize that not all the hostages are still in Gaza?

There is a network on tunnels that connects northern Gaza to the Egyptian side. My guess is that the Egyptian police know where the tunnels are and have a good idea- at least most of the time, what goes into, and what comes out of those tunnels.

Armed Palestinians wore out their welcome in Egypt years ago teaming up with Egyptian terrorists and far more secular pursuits of say, driving by the rival Egyptian drug gang with rocket launchers. Egypt is also wary of Israeli military strength.

I don't think the Egyptians would normally let HAMAS move hostages through a Gaza tunnel. But.... HAMAS called their terror attack "Al Aqsa Storm" for a reason. Netanyahu might of went too far by letting Gvir "Terror is cool- with the right victims" and a stream of other far right Israelis tour around and make inspections of Islam's second holiest site.

In short, the Egyptians may look the other way regarding hostages being moved out. If they make a left turn in Cairo, HAMAS and some hostages could be in North and South Sudan- huge countries with huge areas where there is no government control. This could make good hiding places.
Click to expand...
Exactly!
You read my mind ;)
 
If there truly are Gazan civilians who don’t lust for the murder of all Jews, then my heart is with them.

Frankly, though, this is not what I see.

We have all viewed endless videos of the civilians in Gaza rejoicing, cheering, participating in abuse of the dead and the living who were dragged into Gaza. We have all watched Gazan civilians praising their god as they crowd together to watch the heinous footage that Hamas PROUDLY displayed from their GoPros. We have all seen Gazans flood over the border, post-attacks, to rampage and loot the homes of dead Jews.

We have all seen parents who were thrilled if their terrorist sons died, as long as they had killed Jews, thereby earning themselves the titles of Glorious Martyrs.

We have all witnessed the schoolchildren whose aim, they’ve declared, is to themselves become martyrs by killing all Jews. This is the indoctrination by teachers in UNWRA and the madrasas, but these children are absolutely determined ALREADY to extinguish Jews, and they will if they can.

This recent news with “journalists” who were already at the border BEFORE the attack, and then filmed the infiltration and subsequent atrocities but did nothing to stop it….in fact that one guy being hugged and kissed by Sinwar, PRIOR to October 7th, is informative in that so many in Gaza are deeply invested in the dissolution of Israel and the extermination of all Jews.

Just like Hitler’s ”Final Solution.”

I don’t believe in a ceasefire UNLESS all hostages are FIRST released unharmed.

IMO it is foolish to believe in Hamas’ promises. Whether the hostages are dead or alive, the fact that they are hidden in Gaza…so helpless… babies, the elderly, the infirm, women…is the greatest bargaining chip the terrorists have. Sort of like when someone is kidnapped and their family receives a ransom note demanding money for the safe return of their loved one, the money drop is made, but the victim is already dead. But times 240.

I‘m not a fan of Machiavelli because I’m not a nihilist and usually am very empathetic, but his words in the “Art of War“ ring true to me now, 500 years later.

He is often quoted as having declared “Never attempt to win by force what can be won by deception.”

What he actually said, and I’m quoting now from Book 7 of “The Art of War,” is the following, which IMO Israel and the West would do well to heed:

“Those who are besieged must also guard themselves from the deceit and cunning of the enemy, and therefore, the besieged should not trust anything which they see the enemy doing continuously, but always believe they are being done by deceit, and can change to injure them.”

I believe that Israel and the U.S. had a dreadful failure in remembering this before October 7th. But I also believe Israel knows the price it paid for some laxity in their otherwise eternal vigilance. It is MY OPINION that they CANNOT give Hamas any kind of pause or ceasefire with the implication that a handful of hostages MAY thus be freed.

EVERY hostage must be freed, FIRST.

All IMO.
 
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Why is the U.S. government putting out this news about the daily 4-hour humanitarian pauses when we haven't heard yet from the Israeli government on this development. Of course I could have missed seeing Israel's announcement. Protocol would normally be Israel announcement first and then U.S. and/or other entitites closely involved with the decision.

Hope this is clarified soon by Israel.
 
Brightchaser47 said:
I'm glad the trucks (in  any number) are still being let in, but are the supplies reaching the intended recipients (as opposed to being stockpiled in warehouses or snatched by Hamas)?
Click to expand...
www.reuters.com

Gaza aid distribution struggles amid overcrowding, debris, lack of fuel

Distribution of food and medical supplies is faltering in Gaza due to a chronic lack of fuel, looting of stores, the choking of streets with rubble from Israeli shelling and overcrowding caused by displacement of civilians.
www.reuters.com www.reuters.com
 
Sundog said:
Waiting to hear from the Israeli government on this for more details - a four-hour humanitarian pause, daily.
Click to expand...
The Isaeali's having been doing these windows for days now on their own without 'convincing'. If Hamas is acting up, they are going to close that window else innocent Palestinians walking through the corridor are put at risk of being harmed by Hamas just as they were shot & mortared by them on day 1 crossing window.

This is 'normal' for the IDF (and any conventional army) - I precited they would do just this back in here before they had even completed their cutting-off of the east/west of the Gaza Strip. Conventional Armies do conventional things to assist humanitarian movement IAW IHL, LoAC and Geneva Conventions without "needing convincing".

That's what makes them differnt (one of the many things) than terrorists.
 
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