GUILTY Italy - Ashley Olsen, 35, American, strangled in Florence, 9 Jan 2016

[Coquette]

When a person, think race car driver, chooses a dangerous occupation & dies because of it, I don't consider it victim bashing to point that out. Also, when a person partakes in risky behavior & pays the price for it, I don't think we have to ignore it. I think Ashley knew the dangers and was willing to accept the risk to enjoy the payoff. I'm not judging. Her choices would not have been mine. That doesn't make them wrong, only different.

The problem with this perspective is that you are functioning from an assumption. There is only one person stating that Ashley was seemingly taking a risk with her behavior, and he's the man in custody for killing her. Her prior drug use has no bearing on her murder. I think it is incredibly important to get this fact locked down. Did she do drugs the night she was killed? Perhaps. Did she invite a strange man into her home for sex? Perhaps. The facts of the case have not been clarified yet.

I see a picture forming of a woman still hurting badly from the breakup of her marriage (to a South African professional diver) who fled to Italy to then lose herself in the arms of another man and create a new persona. She apparently still had her ex-husband's name tattooed on her wrist. I find that telling. I think the partying lifestyle was an escape. Divorce can shatter people. I have nothing but compassion for her as I see her as a loving, delicate soul who was lost. I choose to view this through that lens. Did she make poor choices? Yes, she likely did. Who hasn't? MOO.

 

[jjenny]

When a person, think race car driver, chooses a dangerous occupation & dies because of it, I don't consider it victim bashing to point that out. Also, when a person partakes in risky behavior & pays the price for it, I don't think we have to ignore it. I think Ashley knew the dangers and was willing to accept the risk to enjoy the payoff. I'm not judging. Her choices would not have been mine. That doesn't make them wrong, only different.

If I want to judge, I will judge. Isn't it my prerogative? Some of the behavior alleged would not be even legal (alleged cocaine use). Of course it's alleged by the suspect and he could be lying. But tox screen will come back soon enough.
From what is being reported, she was engaging in high risk behavior.
Nobody here is saying she deserved to be killed for it.

 

[DeDee]

Respectfully, I posted the Daily Beast article. I managed to get who was who from the three photos posted, save for the casket photo, and I have not seen one news story that has posted the names of those who carried the coffin. That being said, it was the focus of the article that I appreciated.

Italy is a beautiful country. I have had the pleasure of spending periods of time in Florence and have always felt as safe if not safer there than any city in America. I have American friends who live in Italy and friends who were born and raised there. They all love it tremendously and enjoy very rich lives. It seems rather strange to write off an entire country because one doesn't agree with how one or perhaps two famous murder cases involving American women have been handled. Your choice, of course. I'll keep visiting, myself. And their legal system is not identical to ours. The mere fact that they already have this man in custody so quickly is rather amazing, IMO. While much of this case does not sit well with me, I am willing to wait to see how this plays out. It's only been a week, after all. MOO.

Greetings, Coquette.
I realize you posted the link. Who were the three main people in the first picture? If that was her dad he was wearing a wedding band. So was that his wife next to him? If not, who was she? Who was the young blonde lady wearing the fabulous black and white headband? Was her own mother in any of the photos?

You misunderstood what I wrote. Europe is grand or at least it was when I visited seven yrs ago. France was my favorite. I did not go to Italy and did not write that I would never visit. I simply stated that I would not live there. I would adore living in France even for a short while. My 8yo granddaughter is enrolled in a French school in America. Her mother tutors English at the same school. Therefore, if my gd attends a University in France, I will most likely move to France during that time.

I am outraged this man killed Ashley but all murders are outrageous, jmho. Ashley left a members only club well known for drugs and sex. That's a fact. It doesn't mean that I condone her behavior of that evening but it does seem it led to her ultimate death. OTOH, I read that she phoned her killer to meet her so she must have met him prior to or during that evening, if that is true.

Thank you for your time in answering my questions re the photos as it will be appreciated.

 

[Coquette]

Greetings, Coquette.
I realize you posted the link. Who were the three main people in the first picture? If that was her dad he was wearing a wedding band. So was that his wife next to him? If not, who was she? Who was the young blonde lady wearing the fabulous black and white headband? Was her own mother in any of the photos?

You misunderstood what I wrote. Europe is grand or at least it was when I visited seven yrs ago. France was my favorite. I did not go to Italy and did not write that I would never visit. I simply stated that I would not live there. I would adore living in France even for a short while. My 8yo granddaughter is enrolled in a French school in America. Her mother tutors English at the same school. Therefore, if my gd attends a University in France, I will most likely move to France during that time.

I am outraged this man killed Ashley but all murders are outrageous, jmho. Ashley left a members only club well known for drugs and sex. That's a fact. It doesn't mean that I condone her behavior of that evening but it does seem it led to her ultimate death. OTOH, I read that she phoned her killer to meet her so she must have met him prior to or during that evening, if that is true.

Thank you for your time in answering my questions re the photos as it will be appreciated.

DeDee, the photo in question shows Ashley's father Walter and her mother Paula (the brunette in the white coat.) He is holding the hand of a tall brunette woman whom I believe might be his second wife? I have no idea who the blonde with the headband is standing behind them. She appears somewhat older to me. Perhaps an aunt? She has not been identified anywhere.

I love France, of course. I'll be in Paris this May. I understand your love for such a wonderful country. I happen to love Italy as well, especially Florence. Paris and Florence are in fact my two favorite cities. I hope you do move to France. Life is truly savored there.

And it is my pleasure to answer any question I can. I will post more detailed information if I come across it.

 

[Patagonia]

DeDee, the photo in question shows Ashley's father Walter and her mother Paula (the brunette in the white coat.) He is holding the hand of a tall brunette woman whom I believe might be his second wife? I have no idea who the blonde with the headband is standing behind them. She appears somewhat older to me. Perhaps an aunt? She has not been identified anywhere.

I think the blonde woman with the headband might be Jade Moss. I've seen her Instagram pictures earlier and remember the headband. She is one of Ashley's best friends from Florence, and she is also the one that was with her (in Montecarla club) that night, but unfortunately left earlier.

Here are more pictures from the Italian newspapers: http://www.lanazione.it/firenze/omicidio-ashley-olsen-1.1649558 (Jade is in picture no. 16/33, the one standing behind the parents.)

In picture 3/33 - the woman holding Scout is Ashley's older sister I believe.

And here are some more photos: http://firenze.repubblica.it/cronac...so_ashley-131376201/#gallery-slider=131332959

In the second slideshow (the one at the bottom of the page), the first photo (and also photo no. 5/11) shows a man (with a red tie) with Scout, who I think might be Ashley's ex husband, a professional diver named Grant Jankielsohn. It seems that Ashley moved to Italy (some 2 years ago), to start over after the break up of their marriage. (And since poor Scout is now 5 years old, I assume that for the first 3 years of its life, they all lived together in the US.)


I feel so deeply sorry for this family. This is a horrible tragedy.

And poor little Scout, that sweet dog will be heartbroken for such a long time. Ashley absolutely adored her little best friend, and she took him everywhere with her... you can literary feel the love they had for one another and all those Instagram photos of the two of them together are so utterly heartbraking to see...

But they also show what a kind and gentle soul Ashley was. And that is what's important, and what she should be remembered for, not her mistakes. Those mistakes serve as a lesson, certainly, but nobody has the right to cast stones at her, as nobody is perfect.

My heart goes out to this family, and I hope a loved one will take a great care of her beloved pet, and find a source of comfort in giving him all the love in the world, as I am sure that is what Ashley would have wanted.

 

[Coquette]

I think the blonde woman with the headband might be Jade Moss. I've seen her Instagram pictures earlier and remember the headband. She is one of Ashley's best friends from Florence, and she is also the one that was with her (in Montecarla club) that night, but unfortunately left earlier.

Here are more pictures from the Italian newspapers: http://www.lanazione.it/firenze/omicidio-ashley-olsen-1.1649558 (Jade is in picture no. 16/33, the one standing behind the parents.)

In picture 3/33 - the woman holding Scout is Ashley's older sister I believe.

And here are some more photos: http://firenze.repubblica.it/cronac...so_ashley-131376201/#gallery-slider=131332959

In the second slideshow (the one at the bottom of the page), the first photo (and also photo no. 5/11) shows a man (with a red tie) with Scout, who I think might be Ashley's ex husband, a professional diver named Grant Jankielsohn. It seems that Ashley moved to Italy (some 2 years ago), to start over after the break up of their marriage. (And since poor Scout is now 5 years old, I assume that for the first 3 years of its life, they all lived together in the US.)


I feel so deeply sorry for this family. This is a horrible tragedy.

And poor little Scout, that sweet dog will be heartbroken for such a long time. Ashley absolutely adored her little best friend, and she took him everywhere with her... you can literary feel the love they had for one another and all those Instagram photos of the two of them together are so utterly heartbraking to see...

But they also show what a kind and gentle soul Ashley was. And that is what's important, and what she should be remembered for, not her mistakes. Those mistakes serve as a lesson, certainly, but nobody has the right to cast stones at her, as nobody is perfect.

My heart goes out to this family, and I hope a loved one will take a great care of her beloved pet, and find a source of comfort in giving him all the love in the world, as I am sure that is what Ashley would have wanted.

Thank you for posting the Italian news links. They have far better photos.

Ashley's ex-husband Grant has a very distinctive nose and his hair is a lighter sandy brown. I don't think the man in the red tie is Grant.

I would think Scout would stay in Florence with Federico (Ashley's boyfriend) or her father. He seems very happy there and it would be strange to take him away from the place he now knows so well and was his home with Ashley. The photos of Scout on Federico's lap at the funeral are particularly heartbreaking...

May there be justice for Ashley soon. She was clearly a sweet, gentle spirit and loved by many.

 

[Patagonia]

The Daily Beast did a lousy job of reporting. They did not even write captions under the pictures to inform readers who the people were.

I am so annoyed. The illegal immigrant murdered a beautiful American, Ashley Olsen, who was living in Italy. He gives the Police a statement admitting they scuffled, then, he shoved her and she landed on the hard floor, at which point, he lifted Ashley up, by her neck, to the mezzanine floor to place her on the bed. It sounds more like he treated her like a dog. He stayed long enough to steal her phone yet claims she was alive when he left Ashley. I want to scream.

If that is not horrific enough, here is the most annoying part. He has admitted to doing this deadly damage to her. He has been arrested but NOT charged with any crime.

Not that it matters to the Italians but I promise to never live in Italy. RIP Ashley :rose:

Regarding the part in bold:

He was not immediately charged because the judge has to uphold the charges, not the police. It had nothing to do with the police not collecting enough evidence against him, or anything like that, don't worry. He certainly will be charged, and will remain in police custody until then.

I can definitely understand the suspicion and people's worry, due to the botched job they did with Meredith Kercher's case, but I'm sure that the Italians are fully aware of it too, and will therefore be extra careful this time around. And I would say that their swift apprehension of the suspect (and one who was both undocumented and unknown priorly to the police) shows a reason for optimism in that regard.

As for the country, Italy is still very safe, overall much safer than the US. And the same certainly goes for Florence, it's actually a very safe place and something like this happens extremely rarely.

As for your thoughts regarding the suspect, I couldn't agree with you more. I don't believe half of what he says, it's preposterous to suggest that he was unaware he killed her (''and thought her injuries were not life threatening'') when he exited her house, since we know he took her phone. Which to me is a very disturbing proof of his utter lack of, not just remorse, but any human empathy, whatsoever. And it also shows that it couldn't have been ''just an accident'', like he and his lawyer are now claiming - where he ''just hit her'' and then she fell and fractured her cranium by accident - ''but he never intended to kill her.'' Well, unfortunately for him, the fact that he took her phone completely disproves this defence. Because otherwise he would have been utterly horrified by what had just occurred and he would certainly not be in a state of mind where he would want to steal her phone! And this is where his defence fails. Which is probably also why his lawyer is now claiming that he took her phone ''to call for help''. Yeah right. I wonder how exactly are they going to spin that. Because the fact that he was capable of stealing her phone after he killed her, shows that he is a cold blooded murderer. Who should get a maximum sentence. As there are only aggravating circumstances here.

He did intend to kill her. His immature ego was so insulted that she wanted him out of the house, that it enraged him to the level of using absolutely appallingly brutal force and aggression against her. A girl that was more than half of his size. And while her poor little beagle was there whining, in what must have been a scene of utter horrors, this ''person'' was thinking about stealing her phone. (And not to cover his tracks either, as he turned out to be much too stupid in any such attempts, but simply to steal it for his personal use. And all while he just took someone's LIFE. Wow. To me, that is just beyond... any redemption ever.

 

[Patagonia]

Thank you for posting the Italian news links. They have far better photos.

Ashley's ex-husband Grant has a very distinctive nose and his hair is a lighter sandy brown. I don't think the man in the red tie is Grant.

I would think Scout would stay in Florence with Federico (Ashley's boyfriend) or her father. He seems very happy there and it would be strange to take him away from the place he now knows so well and was his home with Ashley. The photos of Scout on Federico's lap at the funeral are particularly heartbreaking...

May there be justice for Ashley soon. She was clearly a sweet, gentle spirit and loved by many.

I don't know, to me it still looks like it might be her ex husband. He has a distinctive chin also, exactly the same as the man on the pictures. I'm not sure, but it would make sense that he would go to her funeral, it seems they were not on a bad terms and she still had pictures of him on her Instagram (while he still has a picture with her on his Myspace profile picture), and it wasn't so long ago since they were married.

And this man arrived in the same car with her family and is the one leading Scout, which also makes sense if it's Grant as he would be very close to the doggy, if they were all living together in the US prior to her moving to Italy. (Which means that for more than half of Scout's life, all three of them lived together. It was only for the past two years that it was just Scout and Ashley, as I understand.)

Anyway, that was my line of thinking, although it's just a speculation. Perhaps there will be some more news in the Italian press, I would also like to know who is going to give little Scout a new home. Ashley would be heartbroken for him too..

But in any case, I am sure it will be the person Ashley would want it to be. Her family knows how much she adored him and they will want to honour that, so whoever takes him, I am sure will love and cherish him very much.


On another note, I wish that English speaking press would find someone to translate from Italian, there is a lot of information in Italian newspapers that I can't find anywhere in English.

 

[cluciano63]

Hoping her father has her dog...

 

[jjenny]

I don't believe the story he is spinning either. I think it's pretty clear he knew she was dead, or he wouldn't have taken her phone. If he took it to "call for help" why didn't he call for help? I think he slammed her head into something (twice) then strangled her to make sure she was dead. I mean, who is going to pick somebody up by their neck (which is what he is claiming happened to cause her neck injuries).

 

[Coquette]

The suspect claims he dragged Ashley up that very steep ladder (pictured on her Instagram) to put her to bed? He'd have left her on the couch downstairs. Logistically this is the only reasonable option. There would be no need to drag her (by her neck, no less) upstairs to bed.

I suspect he drugged her and then had sex with her. I suspect that he then strangled her with a cord or something close by as she came to and started to react, simultaneously banging her head on the floor to silence her. He then doodled on her computer until what, noon? All the while Ashley lay there dead with her beloved dog watching in terror. And finally, he took her cell phone, switched out the SIM cards, and went on his merry way. Heartless and chilling. MOO.

 

[bwt42]

I don't think he drugged her. I think she brought him to her home for sex & he got upset when she wanted to kick him out when she got what she wanted. Of topic, but I love my dog & would never compromise her safety by bringing an unpredictable stranger into my home. Don't they have hotels or motels in Italy. Why would she want him to know where she lived? Makes no sense.

 

[jjenny]

I don't think he drugged her. I think she brought him to her home for sex & he got upset when she wanted to kick him out when she got what she wanted. Of topic, but I love my dog & would never compromise her safety by bringing an unpredictable stranger into my home. Don't they have hotels or motels in Italy. Why would she want him to know where she lived? Makes no sense.

Alcohol lowers inhibitions. Which is why drunk people might do things they wouldn't do while sober. Sounds like she had a fight with her boyfriend, was upset, picked up this suspect, then perhaps regretted it soon afterwards and asked him to leave (assuming there is any truth to what the suspect claims).

 

[Patagonia]

I don't think he drugged her. I think she brought him to her home for sex & he got upset when she wanted to kick him out when she got what she wanted. Of topic, but I love my dog & would never compromise her safety by bringing an unpredictable stranger into my home. Don't they have hotels or motels in Italy. Why would she want him to know where she lived? Makes no sense.

I don't think they were complete strangers, I read a statement from someone in the Italian press that they weren't friends, but that they knew each other from around the town. He was known as a small time drug dealer, and he also worked for his brother (Abraham Diaw), who is a known club promoter in Florence. And it was he who introduced him into the nightlife scene there. So she probably knew him from around, or knew his brother, and maybe that gave her the false sense of security.

 

[gia2]

I don't think he drugged her. I think she brought him to her home for sex & he got upset when she wanted to kick him out when she got what she wanted. Of topic, but I love my dog & would never compromise her safety by bringing an unpredictable stranger into my home. Don't they have hotels or motels in Italy. Why would she want him to know where she lived? Makes no sense.

What doesn't make sense? Go to any club on a Saturday night and you'll find people doing just this, meeting someone they find attractive and taking them home at the end of the night. Very few people go to the trouble of booking a hotel for this purpose if they live nearby after a nightout. Often taking someone home is a spur of the moment decision.

Let's face it when chatting to an attractive/charming guy at a club, no one really believes that the guy will end up killing them in the next few hours. If they did it wouldn't happen.

I agree though, I don't think he drugged her.



I think there is some truth to the story the suspect told. I think Ashley was upset and emotional that night, hence the fight with her friends. She met a man who took her mind off it and made her feel better. She decided to do what so many people do, take some a stranger home to feel a sense of comfort and to not be alone for the night.

I believe Ashley told him that her boyfriend was coming home that night but don't believe that is what started the violence. I think Ashley told him her boyfriend was coming home BECAUSE she already felt threatened. It's possible she said that after he had already become violent in a desperate attempt to make him leave. The suspect has tried to deflect blame from himself and on to Ashley which is just horrible. It just doesn't add up!

I wonder if the sex game we heard about in early articles was the reason for the fight. I've read a few reports about the club they were in that night and it sounds like it attracted some people who were 'open to experimentation' shall we say. Due to attending the club, he may have expected Ashely to be into more alternative sexual activities. Once they began having consensual sex he may have started to engage in things Ashley wasn't happy with, She objected and he got angry.

All JMO and speculation.

 

[Patagonia]

Alcohol lowers inhibitions. Which is why drunk people might do things they wouldn't do while sober. Sounds like she had a fight with her boyfriend, was upset, picked up this suspect, then perhaps regretted it soon afterwards and asked him to leave (assuming there is any truth to what the suspect claims).

That's how I see it, too.


Here is a reconstruction of events (from the Italian newspapers), and a sequence of events according to Diaw:

- around 4 am: the suspect (Cheik Diaw) leaves the 'Sweet Sugar' and takes a cab/taxi to 'Montecarla' club. He is ''already drunk'' (so he said to the police). Ashley Olsen also arrives in 'Montecarla', with her friends Jade Moss and James Bateman. There they meet with some other friends and acquaintances.

Cheik (according to his statement to the police) meets three girls (in Montecarla club), one speaks Italian, the other two speak English. He offers them a drink and starts talking to the girl that speaks Italian. That one is Ashley. They are later joined by the other two girls and an Albanian: "He has delivered cocaine to the girl who spoke Italian and whose name was Ashley and she offered me some coke".
Jade Moss sees her friend talking to the black guy and warns her that he is "a bad person." They start fighting. Moss goes away by taxi.

6 AM: (according to Cheik) Ashley invites him to go to her place. "I didn't want to go, I was sick. She insisted." (By 'sick' he means he wasn't feeling well due to all the alcohol)

6.30 AM: Cheik and Ashley leave Montecarla together. The bouncer of the club, Issa Diuf, corroborates this. "Statements and photo recognition - says the police - are extremely reliable. Diuf knows Cheik, and is able to recognise him without any problems."

6-7 AM: street camera images viewed by police show Ashley and Diaw walking down 'Via dei Serragli' towards the intersection with St. Augustine street and into S. Monaca street where the Olsen house is".

7.15 AM: (witness) sees Olsen enter her apartment "with a very tall black boy." Statements that are corroborated by the images of street surveillance. The young man with Ashley wears a jacket, jeans or dark pants, black trainers with white soles: the same are seized by the police in the search of the house where the Senegalese lives with his brother (via Andrea del Castagno 41.)

7:30 AM (from Cheik's statement) "We drank and snorted coke that she had in the house. Then I went to buy cigarettes. I came back. Then we had sex, after which I went to the bathroom and threw away condoms and a cigarette butt. Then she told me to 'go away' because her boyfriend will come. She treated me like a dog. She pushed me and hit me on the side. I pushed her back and punched her. She fell, got up, started to push me again. Again I pushed her, she fell to her back and banged her head on the floor. I took her by the neck and pulled her up. Then I carried her over to the bed in the loft. She said she wasn't feeling well. I was drunk and had taken cocaine, but I didn't strangle her."

8.30 AM: Cheik exits Ashley's house (so he claims)

9-11 AM: the neighbour of the victim hears "muffled screams"

9.20 AM: Ashley's phone dials 11 ("perhaps one last effort - say the investigators - to contact 112, 113, or 118 - probably the last and desperate attempt to call one of the emergency numbers)

14.31 PM (and up to 23.31): the police, through phone records, found out that for nine hours Diaw's SIM card has been inserted in the phone of the victim.



I wish that the English speaking newspapers would translate more from the Italian press. My Italian is much worse than my English so I'm having difficulties following this case in Italian. If someone is better at it, please do translate it for us, when you come across any new info

 

[Elley Mae]

Prosecutors said surveillance video cameras along the route showed the two walked together toward her apartment. They also told reporters that Olsen and Diaw weren't very lucid since they had consumed alcohol and likely other substances. Investigators said the woman was slain after the two had sex, which the prosecutors described as consensual. Lab analyses following last week's autopsy are expected to determine exactly what substances Olsen had consumed.

Voce said Diaw has told investigators that he and Olsen consumed "a lot of cocaine and a lot of alcohol."

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/suspect...g-of-ashley-olsen-to-stay-jailed-lawyer-says/

Olsen spent most of Friday night in the Montecarla nightclub, a Florence hot spot that had a history of problems with drug dealing and other public order offences.



.....................................................

Ashley Olsen, the 35-year-old American woman found strangled to death in Florence, Italy, was last seen alive inside a seedy club known for drugs, sex and violence, Daily Mail Online can reveal.

On Thursday night, after an evening of hard drinking in various bars in Oltre Arno – one of Florence's trendiest districts – Olsen headed to the Montecarla club, an insalubrious members-only establishment owned by Jovo Vukelic, a Serbian known for his long, dark hair and white jackets.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...en-alive-seedy-club-known-drugs-violence.html



If I read the above correctly what I said is correct, sorry if the truth offended some. I never said that Ashley deserved what happened to her.

 

[Patagonia]

I wonder if the sex game we heard about in early articles was the reason for the fight. I've read a few reports about the club they were in that night and it sounds like it attracted some people who were 'open to experimentation' shall we say. Due to attending the club, he may have expected Ashely to be into more alternative sexual activities. Once they began having consensual sex he may have started to engage in things Ashley wasn't happy with, She objected and he got angry.

All JMO and speculation.

Sex game theory emerged because of the strangulation marks, but the investigators later said there was no indication of any 'sex games'.

I think that the sex was consensual and 'normal' but that he got offended when she wanted him to leave abruptly after sex. She probably felt bad and guilty and just wanted him out of the house. (I agree that's probably why she told him her boyfriend is coming.) But then he felt mistreated and flipped and killed her. Cocaine can make people nervous and aggressive, especially people who are not very stable emotionally anyway.


p.s. I also read that, after the first interview with the police (where he presented them with a false alibi and claimed he never even met Ashley) and after which he was released (but put under surveillance), that he actually called a sorcerer in Senegal and paid him 20 Euro for some kind of ''black magic service'' in order to throw the police off track.

Guess it didn't work.


He also has a girlfriend, btw, actually fiancee, an Italian girl. Whom he apparently refused to see after he was first questioned by the police. After that, he completely stopped leaving his house, up until he was arrested.

 

[bwt42]

Ashley was warned by her friend that he was a bad person to the point they argued about it & the friend left.

 

[Patagonia]

Ashley was warned by her friend that he was a bad person to the point they argued about it & the friend left.

Poor friend is never going to forgive herself for that.