JLM: Morgan Harrington/Fairfax Rape Victim - *Forensic Link* to MH #3

[ksj3]

But who has an alibi between 1am and whenever? Not saying I believe JM is not the perp, as he certainly appears to be, but I know I am alone at night from 7pm-4am most night since my husband works nights and never have a solid alibi, or "proof" of anything and my family certainly wouldn't have it for me.

Lots of people these days, even night owls. Texting, phone calls, posting on facebook - anything to show where you were. Heck, even checking facebook when he got home for the night would give him an alibi if that were 15 minutes after he left Tempo. I bet LE knows he didn't do any of that. IMO, of course.

 

[otto]

We aren't that far apart. Most of us agree with you except for the word "FACT" in there. As a matter of fact, facts can be true or untrue. Opinions until they are facts are not either.

Hopefully, all of this will be presented and the courts rule on it. However, they make wrong decisions too. People have been let go though they absolutely have done something due to technicalities and other issues. And people have been wrongfully convicted. But that is the standard we hold to.

BBM
Facts cannot be untrue. Fact is synonymous with reality, actuality, certainty.

 

[CoolJ]

Wow, this guy was so slick that not only did he have people in his life believing he could never commit such heinous crimes, but he also has people who have never even laid eyes on him fighting for his innocence.
Folks, it is as clear day that he was in the very least heavily involved in these murders and rapes. This is the court of public opinion where anyone with a sniff of intuition knows that this clown is a monster who will never again see the outside of a prison cell. Also, it has been reported numerous times in MSM(the standard here at WS) that the forensic link between MH and the Fairfax rape was indeed a DNA link. It has also been reported in MSM that JM was linked to MH, HG and Fairfax victim. That is more then a coincidence.
Having said all that I do believe there is a chance JM was not operating alone and possibly may not even be the main perp. But without a doubt I would bet everything I have that he was heavily involved. IMO, JMO, IMOO

 

[Evie Ivy Over]

I know. I'm sure his very well respected defense attorney has told them all to zip it. (As we know the interview given by his grandmother didn't exactly do him any favors.) I just speak with the emotions of a mother and if I knew my child was innocent, I don't know that I have the restraint to watch LE line up their perfect case while I sat in silence.

I hate to sound repetitious, but do we know his family is not talking to LE? Would we know if they did? I'm sure they've asked them not to speak to the media, if they even have anything of use to contribute. I feel sorry for them.

 

[otto]

Probable cause is not that difficult to ascertain pressing charges, but the prove that charge is (or should be). Said so and assumptions are a slippery slope; put yourself in JM's parents' shoes for a moment. What happens if he tells you he is innocent? You would then believe your son raped MH because her mother said it happened?

As for evidence, we are all only seeing the case LE is building against JM. Their job is to not objectively present facts; they select to pursue and reveal only what supports their case. Anything that weakens it does not get reported. We have heard nothing of the other side; for all we know JM could have an air tight alibi. If you want to blame someone for a lack of "cooperation", look to LE. "You have the right to remain silent; everything you say will be used against you in a court of law." Many, many people who have talked end up coerced into a confession, or end up convicted of a crime they did not commit because they thought they were "helping" LE. Not saying JM is innocent, but it is really naive to think that LE is completely neutral and infallible.

There is no way to "sleuth" without seeing how it is connected to the law, IMO. Also, it is the hallmark of good sleuthing to consider evidence that may not fit into the case or may weaken it. To confront how defense might use holes in the case and account for those only makes prosecutor's case stronger in the end.

If Jesse claims that he is innocent, then he has some questions to answer. His behaviour has been anything but "innocent" in appearance.
If there is a reasonable explanation, why haven't his parents and siblings broadcast this reasonable explanation from the tree tops?

Poor Jesse Matthew, "an airtight alibi", and police still won't let him go. Ya think?
Has he confessed?
Is there any chance that he will be convicted of a crime that he did not commit because he made a false confession ... but the false confession hasn't happened yet?
Perhaps it's naïve to think the above.
Investigators needed five years to solve Morgan Harrington's murder. They were very neutral for five years. There were no arrests.

There's no point in mentioning the law if we're imagining hypotheticals such as "an airtight alibi" and "a false confession". The Law does not apply to hypotheticals. People are arrested on the basis of evidence. Sometimes there's a problem with the application of the law, and people are found not guilty. Usually it goes the other way, that police got it right.

 

[Soulmagent]

No problem. In short, I am on the fence. I think it doesn't look good for him so far, but I also have some skepticism toward LE. Without knowing that forensic link/DNA the evidence is circumstantial. People keep saying that stuff is too coincidental, but that applies to LE too. It is too convenient how every piece of media "reporting"; LE "breakthrough", and "link" just locks together so neatly; it too seems too good to be true, IMO.

LE handpicks what it wants us to see as evidence and factual to build their case, which is normal, but just condemning him based on what LE wants us to believe? Should not happen in a democratic, open society. JM has a right to tell his side of the story. I have a little boy and can't help think "what if"? No one raises their kid to be a serial killer, so I imagine his family and friends are struggling and in pain now too. It is sad for all involved, and I try to keep that in perspective.

I have some personal sleuthing theories, but it would be looking at other scenarios besides JM, and no one supports that, so I instead am more trying to play devil's advocate for now.

JM does have the right to tell his side of the story. Except he chose to envoke the 5th amendment right ,not to incriminate himself?

JM seemed to hand pick his victims, so I dont mind if LE hand picks the evidence he left behind.

I am sure if you started a thread about things that conflict LE's fact findings that you would have a place to post those things ,I do not think there would be much to post about at this point as I have yet to see them say anything questionable or even disputable at this point. Your skepticism toward LE does not seem to be based off the facts LE has presented us with about JM and alot of the released info such as the on duty cab driving the night Morgan went missing, was directly related to us by a cab driver who is an american of the same race as JM ,which conflicts other statement you have made.

I get it , LE is LE and they build there cases for a jury to convict yet what I see so far is JM has made his caseS <= line up in the beautiful little straight line for conviction.

JMO.

The JM is smart enough to do this is not a fact that points to his innocence and I have a feeling he isnt a slow as everyone would have us believe.

 

[littlemaybaby]

I hate to sound repetitious, but do we know his family is not talking to LE? Would we know if they did? I'm sure they've asked them not to speak to the media, if they even have anything of use to contribute. I feel sorry for them.

I certainly don't know that. I was referring to getting facts leaked to MSM. It would be hard for me to let the court of public opinion string my child up for all these crimes without getting information to the media that could possibly change opinions.

I would absolutely without a doubt get any facts I had to the defense attorney!

But no, I have no idea who his family is and isn't talking to.

 

[otto]

I've read that before. The police have said that she was in fact drinking - I don't know if that's from her friends' eyewitness accounts or toxicology tests done at the time of autopsy. A concussion may make sense for her erratic behavior, but since the above is from one of Morgan's college professors, I don't know how much credence it has.

http://www.wsls.com/story/20834527/...arringtons-disappearance-was-against-her-will

She was acting drunk, but it's not unusual for a mother to deny that fact. Other mom's have done the same thing (Alabama/Aruba case). Morgan was too decomposed for alcohol and drug tests, but it's possible that the friends covered up the car party prior to the concert:

"A man who had been waiting for friends near the arena entrance that night told police he overheard Morgan arguing with officials to let her back in. She then came up to him, as though to walk arm in arm, and said, "Let's go." When he declined, she cursed and kicked him — something so uncharacteristic of the person her friends describe that it suggests Morgan may well have been drunk. Other witnesses spotted her walking away from the arena, through two parking lots. Then police heard from people who had seen her attempting to hitchhike across Copeley Road Bridge, a quarter-mile south of the arena, at around 9:30 p.m. but hadn't witnessed her getting into a car. From there, the trail went cold.

http://www.cosmopolitan.com/lifestyle/advice/a3534/morgan-harrington-disappearance/

 

[HokieBird]

If JM is not guilty then he is the unluckiest person that has ever lived. First he was unlucky that he was captured on video pursuing then catching up to HG on the Mall. Then the unlucky SOB was seen leaving Tempo with a very intoxicated HG and was the last person seen with her. Then to top it off there is evidence that led them to his car and then to charge him with abduction and intent to defile. And how unlucky was he to take off to Texas at the same time he was being investigated! What luck! And then to be the one person on earth that is tied forensically (DNA) to MH and the lady in NOVA. Wow, how unlucky. And its just a coincidence that he has a history of sexual assaults. Again beating the odds! Never mind that he resembles the sketch. If I was him I would be expecting a meteorite to strike me on the head with all the bad luck he has been having.

 

[human]

My question is why people are so anxious to jump on the bandwagon to presume guilt before they know all the facts! There's a lot going against JLM as far as "what we know", but for me, I would rather look for explanations for things that might look really bad on the surface but aren't, and to exhaust all possibilities that someone else wasn't involved. I guess I've read too many Innocence Project success stories... I'd really rather go the route of presuming innocence before a conviction rather than have to clean up the pieces of incarceration that possibly occurred as a result of an incomplete or flawed investigation--I don't think you really can go back and clean up that damage. My sentiments on this are not applicable to only this case, I find myself reacting the same way in all true crime cases I've followed.

I understand the sentiment, but how does one deal with things such as the video, the rapes, the forensic evidence, the comments that HG could not even hardly walk when she left Tempo, for instance. How does one counter those issues?

For instance, how about the Fairfax rape. How does one counter that? Maybe he was unlucky in love with the college girls and he did not really rape them. And how dows one counter the DNA found with MH?

 

[human]

I know. I'm sure his very well respected defense attorney has told them all to zip it. (As we know the interview given by his grandmother didn't exactly do him any favors.) I just speak with the emotions of a mother and if I knew my child was innocent, I don't know that I have the restraint to watch LE line up their perfect case while I sat in silence.

Did the Harringtons staynsilent about their daughter inspite of the stuff being said about them?

 

[otto]

Gil Harrington, left, is supported by her husband, Dan Harrington, while visiting the site where their daughter Morgan Harrington's remains were discovered in January 2011 in Charlottesville, Virginia.

Friday, on the fifth anniversary of Morgan Harrington's death, her family will gather for a memorial service on the Copeley Bridge in Charlottesville, where she was last seen alive. In a past ceremony, her brother Alex arranged flowers there.

2 4 1 is the Harrington's family's code for, "I love you too much, forever, and once more."

http://www.cnn.com/2014/10/17/us/virginia-girl-anniversary-harrington-death/index.html?hpt=hp_c2

Great photos!
Thanks for posting.
I wonder how her brother is doing now, as opposed to if she were alive.

 

[otto]

We actually have a lot more info in this case than in many cases, both the MH and Hannah's case, in part because of the Harringtons and because of the urgency of finding Hannah's body and the need for LE to get public help. In many cases, there is a near complete shutdown in info. One of the reasons, I am interested in this case is because so much info is given here so that we have something that we can speculate on. That also makes it important to stipulate what is truly fact as LE has out and out said and what we are getting from other sources and are coming to conclusions.

I do wish we had more specifics in the DNA info and forensic links. Given that LE was not so fast in letting people know that they got a link between the Fairfax victim and MH, it was very fast that we got news of a link found between MH and Hannah.

Another significant difference here is that both Morgan and Hannah were anything but average young adults. They had every opportunity in the world; bright, healthy, happy lives. When two female adults, not just one, but two go missing ... it looks more like the man responsible has something against privileged females. It is in part because he chose two similar victims that the connection became high profile. A similar aged female with a questionable past could go missing and no one hears the family.

In the first instance, the connection between Morgan and the 2005 case, there was no arrest. In the connection between Morgan and Hannah there has been an arrest, and the cat was out of the bag about the arrest. Police are probably still looking into other cases to see how prolific Jesse has been since 2002.

 

[Heroine]

"The formula is y=1285/x (where y is the number of days it takes to become skeletonized or mummified and x is the average temperature in Centigrade during the decomposition process)."

http://www.archeo.uw.edu.pl/zalaczniki/upload617.pdf

Morgan Harrington missing: Oct 17, 2009
Remains found: Jan 26, 2010

Average Temp Oct 17-31, 2009 = 13C
Average Temp Nov 2009 = 10.8C
Average Temp Dec 2009 = 2.35C
Average Temp Jan 1-26, 2010 = 1.15
(link)

Average Temp during Decomposition Process = 6.75C

x=average temp in C
y=number of days until completely skeletonized
y=1285/x

y=1285/6.75 = 190 = the number of days it takes for a body to become skeletonized in Charlottesville VA at the time that Morgan's body was in the field.
There are 101 days between Oct 17, 2009 and Jan 26, 2010.

I think it's fairly safe to say that Morgan was not completely skeletonized, and that she would not have been completely skeletonized for another couple of months.

Therefore, there must have been tissue found with her remains. Therefore, it is very likely that the DNA came from a rape kit type of test.

* Please check my numbers and let me know if there's an error.

Thank you very much! That's what I thought all along. I live in VA I remember the weather that year. I followed the MH case all the way. I have my hands full these days though with 2 little girls and I just don't have time to do a lot of research, not like I would like to. But once again, thank you so much for that. Smart thinking! I took chemistry and algebra and know all these things yet didn't think to do that. Very clever!

 

[littlemaybaby]

Did the Harringtons staynsilent about their daughter inspite of the stuff being said about them?

No, but it's a slightly different scenario for a victims's family to speak out and a suspect's family. In theory the victims family and LE are working towards a common goal. A suspect's family who wants to share proof of innocence when LE wants to share proof of guilt is definitely a more complicated situation.

 

[Heroine]

If JM is not guilty then he is the unluckiest person that has ever lived. First he was unlucky that he was captured on video pursuing then catching up to HG on the Mall. Then the unlucky SOB was seen leaving Tempo with a very intoxicated HG and was the last person seen with her. Then to top it off there is evidence that led them to his car and then to charge him with abduction and intent to defile. And how unlucky was he to take off to Texas at the same time he was being investigated! What luck! And then to be the one person on earth that is tied forensically (DNA) to MH and the lady in NOVA. Wow, how unlucky. And its just a coincidence that he has a history of sexual assaults. Again beating the odds! Never mind that he resembles the sketch. If I was him I would be expecting a meteorite to strike me on the head with all the bad luck he has been having.

Luck my tush....lmao...somebody put a curse on this guy!!!!

 

[otto]

No problem. In short, I am on the fence. I think it doesn't look good for him so far, but I also have some skepticism toward LE. Without knowing that forensic link/DNA the evidence is circumstantial. People keep saying that stuff is too coincidental, but that applies to LE too. It is too convenient how every piece of media "reporting"; LE "breakthrough", and "link" just locks together so neatly; it too seems too good to be true, IMO.

LE handpicks what it wants us to see as evidence and factual to build their case, which is normal, but just condemning him based on what LE wants us to believe? Should not happen in a democratic, open society. JM has a right to tell his side of the story. I have a little boy and can't help think "what if"? No one raises their kid to be a serial killer, so I imagine his family and friends are struggling and in pain now too. It is sad for all involved, and I try to keep that in perspective.

I have some personal sleuthing theories, but it would be looking at other scenarios besides JM, and no one supports that, so I instead am more trying to play devil's advocate for now.

There's nothing wrong with being on the fence, but supposing that Jesse Matthews may accidentally confess to a rape, murder, and abduction with intent to defile, and so he may be falsely convicted, even though none of this has happened, we should assume that facts can be untruths. Isn't that different than "sitting on the fence".

 

[Heroine]

Another significant difference here is that both Morgan and Hannah were anything but average young adults. They had every opportunity in the world; bright, healthy, happy lives. When two female adults, not just one, but two go missing ... it looks more like the man responsible has something against privileged females. It is in part because he chose two similar victims that the connection became high profile. A similar aged female with a questionable past could go missing and no one hears the family.

In the first instance, the connection between Morgan and the 2005 case, there was no arrest. In the connection between Morgan and Hannah there has been an arrest, and the cat was out of the bag about the arrest. Police are probably still looking into other cases to see how prolific Jesse has been since 2002.

Exactly! Everything was exactly the same! The way they look, the scenario where they became alone at some point after partying, the time of year, the way they just vanished into thin air. There wasn't a single thing different about HG case vs MH. Not one thing!!!!! Think about it!

 

[Soulmagent]

"The formula is y=1285/x (where y is the number of days it takes to become skeletonized or mummified and x is the average temperature in Centigrade during the decomposition process)."

http://www.archeo.uw.edu.pl/zalaczniki/upload617.pdf

Morgan Harrington missing: Oct 17, 2009
Remains found: Jan 26, 2010

Average Temp Oct 17-31, 2009 = 13C
Average Temp Nov 2009 = 10.8C
Average Temp Dec 2009 = 2.35C
Average Temp Jan 1-26, 2010 = 1.15
(link)

Average Temp during Decomposition Process = 6.75C

x=average temp in C
y=number of days until completely skeletonized
y=1285/x

y=1285/6.75 = 190 = the number of days it takes for a body to become skeletonized in Charlottesville VA at the time that Morgan's body was in the field.
There are 101 days between Oct 17, 2009 and Jan 26, 2010.

I think it's fairly safe to say that Morgan was not completely skeletonized, and that she would not have been completely skeletonized for another couple of months.

Therefore, there must have been tissue found with her remains. Therefore, it is very likely that the DNA came from a rape kit type of test.

* Please check my numbers and let me know if there's an error.

I dont know how you would account for animal activity ,in addition soft tissue damage would create a fast decomposition rate as would the moisture level.
I really do not see Gill stating that if it were untrue. The event made a huge impact on her.

 

[human]

No, but it's a slightly different scenario for a victims's family to speak out and a suspect's family. In theory the victims family and LE are working towards a common goal. A suspect's family who wants to share proof of innocence when LE wants to share proof of guilt is definitely a more complicated situation.

Probably not the best example.

But there have bern parents of missing children who were suspects and had horrible things said about them.

They did not stay silent. They fought for justice for their child.

They did not care what anyone thought of them. All they were thinking about was their child.