JLM: What Do We Know About Him? - #2

[Spicer2000]

I truly do not think a close friend of his would want to speak to us WS'ers, or the media, about a lot of those personal details. As you and many of us have said, this whole situation with JM has got to be devastating to those who knew him and liked him- family and friends alike. I think it's very normal that they will handle the recent events differently. Some who would like time with the media, some who are denial, and some in between both spectrums. I'm not a psychologist, but I think all of those feelings would be considered normal, and I wouldn't want to pressure anyone to talk about things they find sensitive or upsetting. (Not saying you are, FindHG, just saying).

I can understand if some people close to him have been asked by counsel not to speak publicly. In that case, I would think it could have to do with potential witness testimony.

All JMO.

Exactly. Right now, many of his friends (close friends as well as acquaintances) are coming to grips with the reality and severity of the situation -- and most of us are doing it quietly, because the public doesn't want to hear what we have to say.

 

[Paulap]

I was just thinking about the two college rape accusations, but mostly the first since the theory keeps coming up that it was dropped due to claims of it being consensual, etc. We know the Fairfax rape was reportedly brutal with a beating. We've heard Morgan's death was supposedly brutal. It makes me wonder if JM escalated and there were no obvious signs of beatings in the college rapes. If there were bruises and black eyes, then it would be much harder for the school administration to just write it off as consensual.

there was a report that the liberty student did seek medical help after the "incident"...

 

[rtjedarling]

Yes, he likely displayed behavior and boundary issues throughout life- as one poster said "crime does no occur in a vacuum." His perceptions were likely out of the norm throughout his life, and while being accused of rape at LU may have fueled his frustration and anger, he would have likely ended up at the same place committing heinous crimes without some significant intervention even if the LU incident had not occurred. Screwed up perceptions, especially coupled with virility of youth (32 to me were still some good years feeling young wise) can mean prolific criminal acts. The guy recently arrested for serial killings appeared to going for those more easily accessed like calls girls, who were less likely to be viewed as missing really quickly and also easier to get to come to him, he is likely older. Jesse in older age may have resorted to the those easier to get also. The sexual deviance (lots of access these days to unspeakable sex crimes for the developing mind) coupled with an already perception that boundaries and rules are for fools is big problem.

Great sleuthing to you sleuthers!

 

[katinva]

Exactly. Right now, many of his friends (close friends as well as acquaintances) are coming to grips with the reality and severity of the situation -- and most of us are doing it quietly, because the public doesn't want to hear what we have to say.

we want to hear what you have to say!

 

[dda]

Virginia is not a place I would usually think of as having gang activity, what kind of gangs might be there?
Did JM show signs that gangs were something he might be interested in?



"At the end of the gravel country road, where signs posted to trees deliver a warning to trespassers, you'll find a small home where the man accused of abducting Graham once lived.

"He seemed to be a nice kid," said Cliff Hunt who lives two doors from the home where Jesse Leroy Matthew lived for a time with his parents and sister.

Hunt says Matthew's mother rented the home to get her kids out of the city and keep them from what she thought was gang activity.

He says she was always friendly and would speak to Hunt and his wife as she drove down the dirt path, which only has a handful of homes on it."

Read more: http://www.wtop.com/41/3726509/Former-neighbor-Jesse-Matthew-seemed-to-be-a-nice-kid#ixzz3Gmoc4Zdb
rbbm

The gang problem really made news around here earlier this year with the abduction and murder of Kevin Quick, a police reservist, by members of the Bloods gang operating in Cville and rural surrounding counties. In fact, because Mr. Quick was presumably abducted near Matthew's apartment, I wondered if there was any connection between those people and Matthew. I don't think so but the proximity made me pause for a moment and consider.
http://wtvr.com/2014/05/16/kevin-quick-murder-charges/

 

[Sin City]

I don't know if this has been posted before, as I'm still catching up.

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-...runkest-Girl-Regularly-at-Local-Bar-Last-Call

The gentleman with whom I spoke worked as a bouncer at a restaurant and bar where Jesse Matthew was a regular this past summer. And he told me, he said Coy, I had to ban him for about two months because I was concerned about the safety of the young women in the bar…” – Coy Barefoot to Wolf Blitzer, CNN

 

[RSC]

Thank you. This has bothered me so much that I had to step away from this board for awhile yesterday.

There were a lot of WS'ers throwing around opinions as to whether the 2002 act was consensual, simply because the woman dropped the charges.

Unless, in the process of dropping the RAPE allegations, the victim declared that she now considers the act consensual (and this was then released in MSM), there is NO reason for anyone on Websleuths to even play with the notion that an allegation of rape was anything but an allegation of rape.

This is a victim friendly forum, and there is no reason to believe that someone who reported a rape by Jesse Matthew in 2002 is anything other than a victim.

I have been very angry about these postings. Excuse my vent. And thank you for your input.

The speculation that the LU rape allegation may have been false and thus served as a catalyst for JM to continue raping and murdering really disturbs me. I'm not saying people shouldn't share their speculations and I appreciate all points of view. This one just gets to me because it takes the responsibility for JM's crimes away from him and puts the blame on the woman at LU who accused him of rape. Even if by a slim, statistically non-probable chance this LU accuser was not telling the truth, he still would be making the choice to take it all out in the most horrific ways on other people. There's no excuse for his alleged crimes. I get that it's probably easier to cope if there's some sort of logic. Maybe there is, but I'm so uncomfortable with the idea that his life was ruined by a false rape accusation so he became a serial rapist and murderer. It totally blames the victim.

 

[RSC]

i have to agree with you... the girl was reported to have gone to the hospital after the "alleged" rape but then decided not to press charges when lj indicated it was consentual

Where are you seeing this? Please provide a link if you are going to put in information like this.

 

[cady]

I don't know if this has been posted before, as I'm still catching up.

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-...runkest-Girl-Regularly-at-Local-Bar-Last-Call

The gentleman with whom I spoke worked as a bouncer at a restaurant and bar where Jesse Matthew was a regular this past summer. And he told me, he said Coy, I had to ban him for about two months because I was concerned about the safety of the young women in the bar…” – Coy Barefoot to Wolf Blitzer, CNN

But, why for only 2 months?? A predator is a predator...........JMO

 

[Spicer2000]

Thank you. This has bothered me so much that I had to step away from this board for awhile yesterday.

There were a lot of WS'ers throwing around opinions as to whether the 2002 act was consensual, simply because the woman dropped the charges.

Unless, in the process of dropping the RAPE allegations, the victim declared that she now considers the act consensual (and this was then released in MSM), there is NO reason for anyone on Websleuths to even play with the notion that an allegation of rape was anything but an allegation of rape.

This is a victim friendly forum, and there is no reason to believe that someone who reported a rape by Jesse Matthew in 2002 is anything other than a victim.

I have been very angry about these postings. Excuse my vent. And thank you for your input.

You are absolutely correct. Unfortunately, it being at Liberty makes everyone a bit more suspect on the "truth," but that's not the victim's fault at all. Either way (whether through consensual sex or rape), I think the point that was trying to be made was whether this was a "turning point" in JM's violence, which proceeded to escalate over the years to, possibly, murder. At no point did anyone say, "It was HER fault that he turned out like this." I think what people were trying to say (myself included) was that JM may have PERCEIVED it to be her fault...and he was the one that placed blame and acted out that blame throughout the years.

I can only speak for myself, but I apologize if anything I said was interpreted as blaming the victim. As a survivor of domestic violence myself, I'm well aware of how important it is for victims and perps of violence to understand that it's NEVER the victims' fault.

 

[wall0214]

Virginia is not a place I would usually think of as having gang activity, what kind of gangs might be there?
Did JM show signs that gangs were something he might be interested in?



"At the end of the gravel country road, where signs posted to trees deliver a warning to trespassers, you'll find a small home where the man accused of abducting Graham once lived.

"He seemed to be a nice kid," said Cliff Hunt who lives two doors from the home where Jesse Leroy Matthew lived for a time with his parents and sister.

Hunt says Matthew's mother rented the home to get her kids out of the city and keep them from what she thought was gang activity.

He says she was always friendly and would speak to Hunt and his wife as she drove down the dirt path, which only has a handful of homes on it."

Read more: http://www.wtop.com/41/3726509/Former-neighbor-Jesse-Matthew-seemed-to-be-a-nice-kid#ixzz3Gmoc4Zdb
rbbm

We actually just had a reserve police officer killed in a neighboring county (to Albemarle) that police attribute to "gang activity"
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/4-gang-members-charged-with-virginia-officers-slaying/

I haven't seen any indication that JM was interested in gangs.

 

[Paulap]

Where are you seeing this? Please provide a link if you are going to put in information like this.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...rty-University-girl-claimed-raped-campus.html

 

[Paulap]

You are absolutely correct. Unfortunately, it being at Liberty makes everyone a bit more suspect on the "truth," but that's not the victim's fault at all. Either way (whether through consensual sex or rape), I think the point that was trying to be made was whether this was a "turning point" in JM's violence, which proceeded to escalated over the years to, possibly, murder. At no point did anyone say, "It was HER fault that he turned out like this." I think what people were trying to say (myself included) was that JM may have PERCEIVED it to be her fault...and he was the one that placed blame and acted out that blame throughout the years.

I can only speak for myself, but I apologize if anything I said was interpreted as blaming the victim. As a survivor of domestic violence myself, I'm well aware of how important it is for victims and perps of violence to understand that it's NEVER the victims' fault.

it is almost a moot point at this time, isn't it? it no way can ever justify what has happened... i am still just stunned by this

 

[MtnLaur]

You are absolutely correct. Unfortunately, it being at Liberty makes everyone a bit more suspect on the "truth," but that's not the victim's fault at all. Either way (whether through consensual sex or rape), I think the point that was trying to be made was whether this was a "turning point" in JM's violence, which proceeded to escalated over the years to, possibly, murder. At no point did anyone say, "It was HER fault that he turned out like this." I think what people were trying to say (myself included) was that JM may have PERCEIVED it to be her fault...and he was the one that placed blame and acted out that blame throughout the years.

I can only speak for myself, but I apologize if anything I said was interpreted as blaming the victim. As a survivor of domestic violence myself, I'm well aware of how important it is for victims and perps of violence to understand that it's NEVER the victims' fault.

Well said, Spicer. I'm sorry if you, too, have been a victim of domestic violence.

 

[MJPeony]

Thank you. This has bothered me so much that I had to step away from this board for awhile yesterday.

There were a lot of WS'ers throwing around opinions as to whether the 2002 act was consensual, simply because the woman dropped the charges.

Unless, in the process of dropping the RAPE allegations, the victim declared that she now considers the act consensual (and this was then released in MSM), there is NO reason for anyone on Websleuths to even play with the notion that an allegation of rape was anything but an allegation of rape.

This is a victim friendly forum, and there is no reason to believe that someone who reported a rape by Jesse Matthew in 2002 is anything other than a victim.

I have been very angry about these postings. Excuse my vent. And thank you for your input.

RSC, I'm sorry you were so upset you felt the need to walk away over some of that discussion. I was part of that discussion, and I hope you read my post above (#706), as well as dda's post #705, and Mt.Laur's post #709 And then Spicer also gives an excellent answer right here above. Thank you Spicer.

No one has ever blamed the victim. Only sleuthed the rules/rule perceptions at LU with respect to the sex culture and ramifications and how JM might have reacted to all of it. And I stated as well that I have the personal belief she was indeed raped.

Sorry you got so upset by the conversation.

 

[Just K]

The gang problem really made news around here earlier this year with the abduction and murder of Kevin Quick, a police reservist, by members of the Bloods gang operating in Cville and rural surrounding counties. In fact, because Mr. Quick was presumably abducted near Matthew's apartment, I wondered if there was any connection between those people and Matthew. I don't think so but the proximity made me pause for a moment and consider.
http://wtvr.com/2014/05/16/kevin-quick-murder-charges/

I wondered too.

 

[jamicat]

i have to agree with you... the girl was reported to have gone to the hospital after the "alleged" rape but then decided not to press charges when lj indicated it was consentual

Whether this happened in the LU case with JM or not, we don't t know. However, it would not surprise me if that were the case. A major problem with rape cases is proving whether is was consensual sex or not. Without a camera right there or a witness or if the other party does not 'fess up, it becomes very difficult to prove that, especially if actions before the encounter appear as though the two parties are moving towards sex, and if the victim doesn't come running out immediately thereafter. The presumption of innocense in the courts make it difficult to secure a conviction just on a "he said, she said" situation.

Also many rape victims when told what the process will be for them, simply do not want to go through it even when the rape is a clear cut case. THey don't want to be identified, they want to move on.

In the LU case, it seems to me that if the woman in the case were "roughed up", assault charges could have been levied, and would have bolstered the rape charge, but we have no idea what pressures the victim was undergoing even from her own family, maybe. For whatever reasons, she did not press charges. I am glad she at least reported the incident to the university, because it then became a documented incident, and we now have some info on JM He could have backed off after this and been more careful, and then if named as a suspect more than 10 years later on such a case, it might not have carried the same weight. But what did he do? Went to another school, and did the same thing again. Kudos again to that victim who told the university. Again a record, and even if none of such reports made it to the court, they start to tell a story, show a pattern that as an isolated report they would not, but are so important because without them, we do not see some important things.

 

[jamicat]

You are absolutely correct. Unfortunately, it being at Liberty makes everyone a bit more suspect on the "truth," but that's not the victim's fault at all. Either way (whether through consensual sex or rape), I think the point that was trying to be made was whether this was a "turning point" in JM's violence, which proceeded to escalate over the years to, possibly, murder. At no point did anyone say, "It was HER fault that he turned out like this." I think what people were trying to say (myself included) was that JM may have PERCEIVED it to be her fault...and he was the one that placed blame and acted out that blame throughout the years.

I can only speak for myself, but I apologize if anything I said was interpreted as blaming the victim. As a survivor of domestic violence myself, I'm well aware of how important it is for victims and perps of violence to understand that it's NEVER the victims' fault.

Well,whatever the percepion or even possible issues with the Liberty case, it's not as though JM, said, "gee, I'd better be more careful and not be so pushy with women and sex. I got kicked out of college, lost my football scholarship and got charged with some serious stuff here. " Nope. Did it again. That is a problem. Not only that, the talk out there is that he is too pushy, too forward with women and on the make. Not the sort of thing someone who gets into trouble because of missing some signals, was too drunk and got into trouble should be doing. Not at all.

Then the Fairfax rape. What to say about that? Straightforward dangerous assailant rape. No excuses, explanations,misunderstandings there Can't say this is a guy who goes out with a woman, drinks too much, and then gets confused about the signals. Not at all. He assaulted someone walking with a bag of groceries, someone he did not know, just saw that no one was around, and he might get away with a rape, and did so.

I had thought that rape was possibly not one he did as it involved no consensual interatiction with the victim at all. It's a clear sign of what JM's problem. Not that he doesnt get the limits but that he doesn not have them

 

[4 Free Speech]

http://www.examiner.com/article/two...als-have-confirmed-the-death-of-hannah-graham

Just posted today at 10:41 MST

 

[HartsX3]

"A person close to Jesse Matthew's father says the man is struggling with the new developments about his son, charged with abducting Hannah Graham and now indicted in Fairfax on a rape charge."

http://www.nbc12.com/story/26833711...elopments-difficult-for-jesse-matthews-father