KC's Pregnancy/Denial (Merged Threads)

[panthera]

I agree. It is not uncommon for needy girls to have babies thinking the baby will fill the hole inside.

When it doesn't work the girl goes on to something else. People get cute puppies for the same reason. That is why so many dogs end up in pounds, unwanted and then destroyed.
JMO

So true. And didn't Casey have a friend who has a child? Maybe she thought of it as a "fun thing" to do and a way to snare JG. MOO

 

[kiki the parrot]

And...sad to think about it...was Caylee doomed to repeat the pattern?

Why sir, I perceive there is a prophet among us... :blowkiss: JMO2!

 

[Skully]

I had a friend who was a LSW, and he believed that families passed down traits and traditions of how to handle things. Like if the grandparents didn't talk about issues and just gave each other the silent treatment in an argument, the kids, now your parents at least one of them would likely do the same thing, and then you would learn this from them. Not that it is taught, but it is learned. I posted that "an apple doesn't fall far from the tree" on the Cindy thread and was called cruel for my remark. I was just saying that we tend to do what we learn or experience from our parents and grandparents. I don't think parents are to blame for our kids decisions, just we learn at home how to handle stress and conflict. JMO

 

[txsvicki]

Casey may have been lying to Kiomarie about Cindy, but who would want their grandchild to be adopted out to a single teenager. It's ridiculous. Cindy may have been insisting that Casey wasn't pregnant because she didn't want her elderly parents to find out and upset their health if Casey did adopt Caylee out. Casey probably even promised at times to let the Anthony's adopt Caylee then renigged.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

Guys bear with me, but I have been thinking for awhile that Casey never intended on bringing up Caylee or allowing her to live much past her first breath. I don't think we can ignore the pregnancy denial. Think of all those girls who hide their pregnancy, then deliver in secret and carry on as if nothing ever happened. If Rick hadn't intervened and forced Cindy and George to acknowledge the fact that Casey was pregnant, I think that Casey would have just had her somewhere, disposed of her then carried on with her life as if she had been some kind of benign tumor which had miraculously disappeared. Caylee's eventual murder was possibly an overdue event in Casey's mind if this theory is correct and she had been living on borrowed time. Do any of you think this scenario is possible?

This is from a story which wrapped up last week, which set me to thinking, would Casey have acted the same way towards Caylee as Keli Lane did towards Tegan if she had never been exposed at the wedding?

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/pregnancy-denial-linked-to-lifestyle-20101214-18wwg.html

 

[The World According]

Spot on. No question in my mind, she would have no problem giving the baby away or throwing the baby away. She is no better, nor does she have any more emotional intellegence than the other girls who have done so. She seems to be the epitome of a sociopath, devoid of a conscious. With a thoroughly flat affect she could have returned to the dance floor, figuratively. This is just my lay person's opinion. I have no specialized training in psychology.
The one sentence "All they care about is getting Caylee back" from Casey after she was jailed upon the conclusion of the wild goose chase she took LE on the night her mom reported the child had been missing for a month told me everything I need to know about who and what her priorities are.
Everything after that comment was just icing on the perjury for me. In that once sentence, Casey Anthony told us who and what she is.
The Untold Story of Casey Anthony here:
http://websleuths.com/forums/blog.php?b=812

"Casey Anthony, she is a habitual liar, a troubled human being", Pam Bondi opined.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

From the above linked article:

In the past it was considered that mothers who killed their newborns had to be either scared, ignorant teenagers or insane.

However, recent research showed an increasing number of women had killed their babies because they were ''focused on simply doing things to maintain their chosen lifestyle and cannot tolerate the idea of what a child would bring into their lives'', Dr Kaplan said. In cases of denied pregnancy, the failure of family, friends and colleagues to notice the pregnancy ''is the part that intrigues and fascinates observers of the condition - somehow the denial of the pregnant woman seems to have such a pervasive effect on those around them''.

What Caylee brought into Casey's life was competition for positive attention inside the family, a restriction of her social life, tethering Casey to the family unit, disallowing her to strike out on her own free from the control and domination of Cindy, and a new source for criticism. As Caylee grew she became a major threat, a threat that was increasing daily with her ability to understand the family, her ability to communicate, her ability to expose Casey and her lies, and her ability to compete with Casey for the spotlight.

I think the longer Caylee lived the more Casey regretted allowing her existence to occur and she felt well within her rights to undo what had happened. Caylee was never a person in Casey's mind, Caylee was her own personal error.

 

[patcorn]

This thought has run through my mind on numerous occasions also. Thanks for the thread. Parenthood is something you have to be mentally prepared for and I truly believe that she had it in her mind to begin with that there was no way she was going to have this baby. She even tried giving her up. But she got trapped by CA's controlling ways after she was outed by the brother. You're probably right. This was, sadly, just something she felt was long overdue.

 

[patcorn]

From the above linked article:

In the past it was considered that mothers who killed their newborns had to be either scared, ignorant teenagers or insane.

However, recent research showed an increasing number of women had killed their babies because they were ''focused on simply doing things to maintain their chosen lifestyle and cannot tolerate the idea of what a child would bring into their lives'', Dr Kaplan said. In cases of denied pregnancy, the failure of family, friends and colleagues to notice the pregnancy ''is the part that intrigues and fascinates observers of the condition - somehow the denial of the pregnant woman seems to have such a pervasive effect on those around them''.

What Caylee brought into Casey's life was competition for positive attention inside the family, a restriction of her social life, tethering Casey to the family unit, disallowing her to strike out on her own free from the control and domination of Cindy, and a new source for criticism. As Caylee grew she became a major threat, a threat that was increasing daily with her ability to understand the family, her ability to communicate, her ability to expose Casey and her lies, and her ability to compete with Casey for the spotlight.

I think the longer Caylee lived the more Casey regretted allowing her existence to occur and she felt well within her rights to undo what had happened. Caylee was never a person in Casey's mind, Caylee was her own personal error.

__________________________________

BBM
BRAVO!!!!!!!!!
:woohoo:

 

[krisskross]

Spot on. No question in my mind, she would have no problem giving the baby away or throwing the baby away. She is no better, nor does she have any more emotional intellegence than the other girls who have done so. She seems to be the epitome of a sociopath, devoid of a conscious. With a thoroughly flat affect she could have returned to the dance floor, figuratively. This is just my lay person's opinion. I have no specialized training in psychology.
The one sentence "All they care about is getting Caylee back" from Casey after she was jailed upon the conclusion of the wild goose chase she took LE on the night her mom reported the child had been missing for a month told me everything I need to know about who and what her priorities are.
Everything after that comment was just icing on the perjury for me. In that once sentence, Casey Anthony told us who and what she is.
The Untold Story of Casey Anthony here:
http://websleuths.com/forums/blog.php?b=812

"Casey Anthony, she is a habitual liar, a troubled human being", Pam Bondi opined.

Yep, for a mother to utter those words about her own child and in those circumstances.......... spoke volumes.

And later on, despite Cindy often leading the way, she just couldn't get her daughter to play the grieving mother role......which is another reason I believe Cindy knew the truth.........sooner rather than later .

50 days they spent under the same roof.....supposedly looking for Caylee.

 

[Cayleefan]

Mrs G Norris.

I have often thought the same thing, and still do. It popped into my mind when I first heard her brother say, that the night she told her Mom that the babysitting stole her, Casey told him that she is just a spiteful ***** (talking about herself), and that this should have happened a long time ago. I always wondered what she meant by that. What should have happened a long time ago? I've always believed she was talking about Caylee, and that she should have ended her life a long time ago. My thoughts exactly.

 

[Purple Iris]

Mrs. Norris ~
You could very well be correct ~ I personally could never figure out why she never had an abortion if she didn't want the child.
She could have easily gone to Planned Parenthood and had it taken care of on a sliding scale fee, I think. Money has never seen to be a problem for her, and, at the time she was working. Whoever she thought may have been the father, she could have approached for money for it also.

I don't know if Florida is a "Safe Haven" state or not, but if it is, she could have also left the baby at any hospital, fire station or police station with no questions asked.

For her to not have wanted to have a baby, why she let it progress like it did is beyond me ~
But, we've all tried to figure out what goes through that head of her's, as well as her parents to no avail ~

 

[essies]

ICA and CA were doing a "dance" for years-with ICA leading and CA following (cleaning up her messes and covering for her misteps (mistruths). When CA decided to take the lead (Control) away from ICA-the dance ended. To ICA that meant Caylee ended-there was no more need for Caylee-she no longer served a purpose in ICA's life.IMO:furious:
However, what has always fascinated me was how ICA dressed for Uncle Ricks wedding. I mean-if you want to disguise a pregnancy you don't wear a belly bearing dress with a tight midriff length sweater. I've often wondered who decided on that outfit-ICA or CA?:waitasec:
Was CA using Rick and his wedding to force the truth out of ICA the same way CA was using the 911 call to force the truth out of ICA? Was CA trying to force Rick and the rest of the family to believe ICA wasn't pregnant-but still a virginal girl incapable of being pregnant just like she is trying to force us to believe ICA is actually a victim and really MOTY?:snooty:
IMO-If Caylee had lived and ICA had found another man to go off with and bear children with-Caylee would have been treated very different from those children. Caylee would have always represented ICA's "mistake"!:twocents:

 

[my_tee_mouse]

Mrs. Norris ~
You could very well be correct ~ I personally could never figure out why she never had an abortion if she didn't want the child.
She could have easily gone to Planned Parenthood and had it taken care of on a sliding scale fee, I think. Money has never seen to be a problem for her, and, at the time she was working. Whoever she thought may have been the father, she could have approached for money for it also.

I don't know if Florida is a "Safe Haven" state or not, but if it is, she could have also left the baby at any hospital, fire station or police station with no questions asked.

For her to not have wanted to have a baby, why she let it progress like it did is beyond me ~
But, we've all tried to figure out what goes through that head of her's, as well as her parents to no avail ~

But this would have required planning and action on her part, and that is not her MO. This girl was raised to believe that if she just put things off long enough, they would be overlooked or mommy would fix them. Only this time, mommy put a cog in the works by insisting she keep the baby. Yes, she resented Caylee from the start. She did not acknowledge her while carrying her, she got no prenatal care on her own, and I have no doubt that had she been "allowed" to go through with her "unnoticed" pregnancy to term, a newborn Caylee would have wound up exactly where she did.

Sadly, this scenario has been repeated for years and years with countless women, and I'm afraid we would be shocked and saddened to know the present-day statistics, even in an era when abortion is an option.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

Cindy must have been covertly complicit in the pregnancy denial for it to be successful for the full 7 months ... What's up with that? The pic of Cindy standing next to Casey is so odd, the look in Cindy's eyes...

She must have known the entire farce was ridiculous.

 

[essies]

Cindy must have been covertly complicit in the pregnancy denial for it to be successful for the full 7 months ... What's up with that? The pic of Cindy standing next to Casey is so odd, the look in Cindy's eyes...

She must have known the entire farce was ridiculous.

Ya know the A's are a piece of work aren't they? George writes to ICA in jail that he has noticed she picked up alittle weight -so be careful. But, alarm bells aren't ringing in his head when ICA tells them she hasn't had sex and can't be pregnant-but looks like this at the wedding? My gosh-if Cindy REALLY thought ICA had some kind of "tumor" or female problem-she (as an RN and a MOTHER) would have rushed her to a doctor ASAP!!
Why didn't anyone in the media during one of the A's MANY interviews ever show those pictures and ask them "What were you two thinking?:banghead:

 

[Just Jayla]

Thank you much for making this idea its own thread-I read an article similar to the one you linked and it prompted me to Google the subject, which turned out some interesting info.
I always believed that Caylee would have been bound for a prom-night trash can scenario, had KC been in H.S...If you remember, there were several stories shortly before the time that Caylee would have been born, where teenage girls around the country were "dumping" their babies, no one even knowing they were pregnant to begin with.

Abortion is not a cheap option for someone that age. I figured maybe KC could not afford it, because I do not believe she could be pro-life...clearly. So the pregnancy rapidly flew by the first trimester restriction that Florida has.

Denial and concealing of pregnancy cannot be definitively linked to filicide, IIRC, but there are more and more social studies that are correlating the two for comparison.

Once Caylee was there, KC faced (apparently) three options-

-Adoption. Not even considered, IMO, because it takes a certain kind of selflessness to do that-Writing from experience, I kept my daughter, who I had at 19, and considered myself able, and, if I am 1000% honest, would have had too much pride to even consider "letting someone else raise my baby." KC/CA figured (begrudgingly on KC's part), while it would be hard, they could do it, they could raise Caylee.

-Leave Caylee with Cindy. :rolling: Do we seriously think, for one hot second, that CA would not make sure KC was CONSTANTLY reminded of her failure, her inability? Nope-I think KC liked option 3 better because she would still have had to deal with Caylee if CA kept her.....

-Option 3 is the option KC took, and it's disgusting that it is even an option.


This also explains KC's mental status between the time of Caylee's birth and her murder, and the "change" that some who have known her described. She felt she was in the twilight zone, she was not supposed to have Caylee there, she writhed in her own skin about not being able to escape this situation she wanted so badly to never have. Sometimes it was okay that Caylee was there, she was even cute and fun on occasion-But most days it was distorted, not right for KC, she started to get away geographically, but CA would keep calling KC home. One cannot say aloud that they don't want their child anymore, it's shameful and she would carry guilt for ever saying that. Nope, guilt sucks, don't want that.

Here is another link:
http://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/cgi/content/full/162/9/1578

"Neonaticide
The three administrative record sample studies of neonaticide in the United States revealed that maternal perpetrators were likely to be unmarried, to have a mean and modal age in the late teenage years, to have low socioeconomic status, and to reside with parents or other relatives. The perpetrators had high rates of denied or concealed pregnancy and a relative lack of prenatal care. In the single U.S. study of a psychiatric population of women who committed neonaticide (49), the mothers had an older mean age (24 years) and middle to low socioeconomic status. The subjects in this study exhibited denial of pregnancy and frequently reported depersonalization, dissociative hallucinations, and intermittent amnesia. "

As we know, KC could not commit neonaticide because her family caught on that she was pregnant. I think it took her three years because she, for lack of a better phrase, wanted to give it a shot with keeping Caylee.

 

[Holly Oakes]

Guys bear with me, but I have been thinking for awhile that Casey never intended on bringing up Caylee or allowing her to live much past her first breath. I don't think we can ignore the pregnancy denial. Think of all those girls who hide their pregnancy, then deliver in secret and carry on as if nothing ever happened. If Rick hadn't intervened and forced Cindy and George to acknowledge the fact that Casey was pregnant, I think that Casey would have just had her somewhere, disposed of her then carried on with her life as if she had been some kind of benign tumor which had miraculously disappeared. Caylee's eventual murder was possibly an overdue event in Casey's mind if this theory is correct and she had been living on borrowed time. Do any of you think this scenario is possible?

This is from a story which wrapped up last week, which set me to thinking, would Casey have acted the same way towards Caylee as Keli Lane did towards Tegan if she had never been exposed at the wedding?

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/pregnancy-denial-linked-to-lifestyle-20101214-18wwg.html

Wow. Was thinking similar thing as the Keli Lane case played out.
Then I noticed you listed your address as the Cross. I'm opposite Rushcutters ... neighbour.
Will PM you when the trials starts and see if you're interested in catching up for a coffee in the park.

I wonder how many other Sydney-siders are following the case?

 

[Mrs G Norris]

Oh goodie! An equally obsessed neighbor There are a few Sydneysiders, we shall have to catch a few hearings together...mine for tea and cake?

 

[Melanie]

I agree with you, and IMHO Caysey never bonded with Caylee. Cindy was the first to hold Caylee, thus in Caysey's mind it was Cindy's baby. When push came to shove, the ultimate betrayal was to take away what was most loved in Cindy's life - Caylee. IMHO Caysey did so with little remorse or regret. Caylee was disposable and now Cindy will suffer for the rest of her life -- which, IMHO, was Caysey's intent.

Just my thoughts only.

Mel