GUILTY KS - Andrew Finch, 28, killed by LE in 'swatting' prank, Wichita, 28 Dec 2017 *civil trial 2022*

[Jennifer17]

BBM

It really is hard to say what LE did since i wasn't there, there is no way for me to know what exactly went on.

But I will say this. I would never just walk outside when I saw a large number of police cars. What if police are chasing an active shooter that ran down your street? That's a good way to get yourself taken hostage for real. Or what if there is a shoot out between police and your neighbor? Or just some random occupants of a car driving past your house?

Or if police are in an active chase what if one of the drivers, suspect or officer loses control of the car and runs up on your porch?

I feel like I should insert one thing here. Bullets have no eyes. So if a bullet is intended for a police officer or a suspect and you are standing on your porch out of curiosity what makes you think that bullet won't hit you?

JMO

There are people here who say that they would, so it can't be such an unusual occurrence.

 

[Tawny]

Actually, the man killed was not involved in online gaming whatsoever. He didn't even know those who were involved.

Ah damn, I missed that. My apologies for skimming.

 

[JaxFlaGal]

I will apologize in advance for this expression of frustration, and admins, please feel free to remove it but I have to get this off my chest. I am so frustrated with the generalized cop-bashing occurring on this thread. My apologies (and thanks) to those who are attempting to have a rational, fact-based discourse here. The thread (MOO) seems to have descended into unproductive generalizations despite the cautions of our mods.

I read WS cases like this in the hopes of learning and influencing change for the better in the future - specifics that can help us all evaluate what went wrong in this tragedy and what can be done to reduce its risk of happening in the future to anyone else. The generalized bashing on this thread doesn't seem to provide that value at the present moment. I'm hopeful that after the holiday there is actual news and objective content available to be communicated and mulled over. Until then, I'm taking a break. Prayers for a more objective discourse later

MOO, have a Happy New Year, and my prayers to ALL victimized by everything that SWATting cases like this represent.

 

[Tawny]

I will apologize in advance for this expression of frustration, and admins, please feel free to remove it but I have to get this off my chest. I am so frustrated with the generalized cop-bashing occurring on this thread. My apologies (and thanks) to those who are attempting to have a rational, fact-based discourse here. The thread (MOO) seems to have descended into unproductive generalizations despite the cautions of our mods.

I read WS cases like this in the hopes of learning and influencing change for the better in the future - specifics that can help us all evaluate what went wrong in this tragedy and what can be done to reduce its risk of happening in the future to anyone else. The generalized bashing on this thread doesn't seem to provide that value at the present moment. I'm hopeful that after the holiday there is actual news and objective content available to be communicated and mulled over. Until then, I'm taking a break. Prayers for a more objective discourse later

MOO, have a Happy New Year, and my prayers to ALL victimized by everything that SWATting cases like this represent.

That's fair. I'm personally frustrated with the blatant victim blaming.

 

[Deleted member 158085]

There are people here who say that they would, so it can't be such an unusual occurrence.

When I lived on a main street, everyone did it. What you expect is that either a neighbor's house was burglarized, their wild teens have done something stupid, or maybe two people are in a fist fight. You don't expect your neighbors to be ax murderers or coke dealers or something serious.

But also, if you have old neighbors like I did, or other neighbors who are friends, who you watch out for, your immediate instinct is to go outside and make sure they are OK. It's human nature, not just to be curious, but to look out for one another. None of us believes we are living in a potential war zone.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

 

[animlzrule]

I will apologize in advance for this expression of frustration, and admins, please feel free to remove it but I have to get this off my chest. I am so frustrated with the generalized cop-bashing occurring on this thread. My apologies (and thanks) to those who are attempting to have a rational, fact-based discourse here. The thread (MOO) seems to have descended into unproductive generalizations despite the cautions of our mods.

I read WS cases like this in the hopes of learning and influencing change for the better in the future - specifics that can help us all evaluate what went wrong in this tragedy and what can be done to reduce its risk of happening in the future to anyone else. The generalized bashing on this thread doesn't seem to provide that value at the present moment. I'm hopeful that after the holiday there is actual news and objective content available to be communicated and mulled over. Until then, I'm taking a break. Prayers for a more objective discourse later

MOO, have a Happy New Year, and my prayers to ALL victimized by everything that SWATting cases like this represent.

And I am frustrated by the insistence that we revere LE on this forum despite the very obvious negative contribution that LE make in incidences like these. How do we discuss the killing of this victim without talking about the circumstances and individuals who are responsible for his death, the gamer, and the LE officer? To ignore the failure of LE in this case would be ridiculous. Two tragic, avoidable things happened: a man caused another man's death by sending LE to his door, and LE caused his death via negligence of duty. I don't think we can honestly discuss one without the other. Having blind faith and insistence of the infallibility of LE is insulting to the 1000s of people who have been their victims through no fault of their own. I'm sorry if people have a blind allegiance to LE d/t person relationships with them, but that is not a reason to not be able to openly discuss problems inherent in the occupation and with the power dynamic they possess. It's insulting and disingenuous to censor discussion of a huge aspect of this case.

 

[Tricia]

Happy New Year Everyone!

This is such an upsetting case. So many unanswered questions.

If you could please stop with name calling and diagnosing of the police I would appreciate it.

We can discuss this case without violating our Terms of Service

Thank you

 

[KaaBoom]

Is it legal --if such a situation unfolds like the one that resulted in Andrew's death -- to NOT go outside your house immediately, but to call 911 and ask what is going on ... and see if you can explain there's not a threat; and that you'll come outside peacefully, arms in the air, etc. ???

The problem I have experienced with calling 911, is that the operators seemed to be trained not to give out any information. 911 is for reporting emergencies, not for getting information. Which I can understand, but it makes it difficult to get any information about what is happening. For example they will tell you "officers are on the scene" and that is the only thing they will tell you. Which might not help much in a situation like this.

 

[KaaBoom]

RSBM

Certainly this TB should never get out of prison. My .02 is that if he ever does go free (which is likely) he'd be a danger to the public.
After the fact..... but his photo looks somewhat deranged.
:moo:

I'd be happy to never see him get out of prison, as long as the cop who fired the shot also never gets out of prison. Because the cop is at least as much a danger to the public, if not more. I can't think of anything more dangerous than a trigger happy cop.

 

[KaaBoom]

BBM

It really is hard to say what LE did since i wasn't there, there is no way for me to know what exactly went on.

But I will say this. I would never just walk outside when I saw a large number of police cars. What if police are chasing an active shooter that ran down your street? That's a good way to get yourself taken hostage for real. Or what if there is a shoot out between police and your neighbor? Or just some random occupants of a car driving past your house?

Or if police are in an active chase what if one of the drivers, suspect or officer loses control of the car and runs up on your porch?

I feel like I should insert one thing here. Bullets have no eyes. So if a bullet is intended for a police officer or a suspect and you are standing on your porch out of curiosity what makes you think that bullet won't hit you?

Most, probably 99%, of people want to find out what is going on, so they can evaluate the situation. The examples you gave could affect you, even if you don't go outside. Bullets can come through windows, an out of control car can crash through a wall. It's good to know what's going on, so you can protect yourself. In that recent situation in Colorado, I believe one bystander was shot through the wall of their apartment. So staying inside will not protect you from those things.

As a matter of fact the situation could have been a lot worse, if he didn't go outside. They would have probably ordered him outside anyway. If not they would have busted down the door, and they might have ended up shooting the entire family.

 

[KaaBoom]

LE is trained to kill. A lot of LE is made up of ex-military, who are also trained to kill. Of course they can live with themselves, it's what they're trained to do. People who can't live with killing another human being don't go in to LE or the military. I don't understand how this argument can possibly be made in good faith.

Exactly, there have been some cases where the cops laughed about it, after killing somebody. Victim blaming is messed up. The shooters are not victims. If they are then, then guy who shot those cops in Colorado, is also a victim.

 

[rosemadderlake]

I work in a job that I sometimes get members of the public screaming and angry. When that happens I can’t really hear them, my brain freezes. I imagine if I was on that porch I might not understand immediately what’s happening. He suffered a death sentence and is being blamed for it because he may have panicked. Shouldn’t police training include handling extremely frightened innocent people that are not armed?

Totally agree. But what makes this so tragic is the cops were pranked, set up.

I am thinking this unfortunate victim may have been scared s***less, literally, and was pulling up his pants.

This unfortunate officer was operating under completely false pretenses, too. And not just some domestic violence situation, a murder/hostage situation. How is his life ever going to be the same when he learns the truth?

I have a Q about this swatter, what is the difference between him and a hit man? Hit men work in chain of commands. Also, I listened to the interview and this swatter said he got paid to do this? Did I hear this right?

LE deals with suicide by cop, too. This feels like murder by cop.
How on earth is someone to get away with that?

There is a level of sinister here, and one may not be able to prevent all tragedies but I hope in this investigation they find the markers, from dispatch, to the handling of swat, to finding and arresting whatever Internet gaming networks are responsible. No difference between them and a premeditated terrorist organization.

 

[perfectingpink]

What’s next for swatting suspect Tyler Barriss

Tyler R. Barriss — the man accused of making a swatting call in Wichita that left a 28-year-old man dead by police gunfire — is expected to appear in a California courtroom sometime this week in connection with the case.

The court appearance, which a Los Angeles, Calif., police officer said might happen as early as Tuesday, would be the first step in bringing 25-year-old Barriss to Kansas to face criminal charges. He is accused of reporting a fake killing and hostage situation in Wichita just after 6:15 p.m. Thursday.

[....]

The process of transferring a fugitive or wanted person from one state to another to face charges is called extradition. Barriss will be taken to a courtroom in California, served a copy of the arrest warrant issued by the Sedgwick County District Attorney’s Office and given the chance to apply for a court-appointed attorney. He’ll then have two options — waive extradition and come back to Kansas without a fight, or contest it.

If Barriss waives extradition, he’ll be brought to Kansas as soon as his transportation can be arranged - likely within days, Bennett said.

If he fights it, the Kansas governor’s office will send additional paperwork to California, and Barriss’ arrival in Wichita could take weeks.

[....]

http://www.kansas.com/news/local/article192404474.html

 

[katydid23]

Exactly, there have been some cases where the cops laughed about it, after killing somebody. Victim blaming is messed up. The shooters are not victims. If they are then, then guy who shot those cops in Colorado, is also a victim.

You don't think there is a difference between someone standing up in a movie theatre and blowing people away---and an officer answering a 911 dispatch, and being told a murderer just shot someone in the head, has poured gasoline throughout the home and is holding his family hostage?

They are just the same to you?

The police were victimized by that swatting call, in my opinion.

 

[rsd1200]

That would be the best thing you could do. But given the curiosity of most people I don't know how many would do that.

Personally if a large number of police showed up at my house I would call the police station and ask what the heck is going on. But most people do not take the time to memorize the non emergency phone numbers of the police station and fire departments close to them. But they should, because telling a dispatcher at the station that there is no hostage at your address can defuse the whole situation a lot faster.

JMO

I have them posted on my fridge.

ETA: However, would they believe me if I called and said everything is hunky dory? I know some of LE, and based on some of the stuff they get called out to, idk if they'd believe me, b/c what if I was the hostage, and the person controlling me made me call? Then they just turn around and go home on my say so. These swatters (and no-knock warrants) are pretty scary.

 

[KaaBoom]

You don't think there is a difference between someone standing up in a movie theatre and blowing people away---and an officer answering a 911 dispatch, and being told a murderer just shot someone in the head, has poured gasoline throughout the home and is holding his family hostage?

They are just the same to you?

The police were victimized by that swatting call, in my opinion.

A person who kills an innocent person is not a victim, whether they have a badge or not. Calling someone who shoots an innocent person a victim is an insult to victim they killed, aka victim blaming.

 

[FunkyMonkey]

People who kill people are not victims, whether they have a badge or not. Calling someone who shoots someone a victim is an insult to victim they killed.

With that logic, if someone breaks into my home to harm me and I shoot them as a last resort, I am no longer a victim???? Pshhhht


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[katydid23]

A person who kills an innocent person is not a victim, whether they have a badge or not. Calling someone who shoots an innocent person a victim is an insult to victim they killed, aka victim blaming.

Yes, they can be a victim, if they are the victim of a criminal action, like swatting, which created the false sense of danger which they responded to.

That officer was a victim of that swatting crime, and that brought him to that home, and created the tense and dangerous situation.

He made a very poor decision to shoot. But it was not a malicious or violent or evil decision. It was a tragic decision.

 

[MzOpinion8d]

Yes, they can be a victim, if they are the victim of a criminal action, like swatting, which created the false sense of danger which they responded to.

That officer was a victim of that swatting crime, and that brought him to that home, and created the tense and dangerous situation.

He made a very poor decision to shoot. But it was not a malicious or violent or evil decision. It was a tragic decision.

The officer was not a victim. He was a public official, sworn to protect and serve, who got an itchy trigger finger and killed someone - the *real* victim - the DEAD guy.

 

[katydid23]

The officer was not a victim. He was a public official, sworn to protect and serve, who got an itchy trigger finger and killed someone - the *real* victim - the DEAD guy.

He was protecting and serving. What do you think he was doing by answering that dispatch?

Things went sideways and he totally screwed up, big time. But none of us were there or know exactly what happened. It probably did look to him like the guy was pulling a weapon.

Cops do not want to shoot people. It is the biggest nightmare in the world and one of their biggest fears, to shoot and kill an innocent person.

7 people were just shot in another call, that was very much like this one. But they were ambushed by one guy, who shot off 100 rounds. That is the kind of scenario that is constantly in the back of their minds when they go to these volatile calls.

Of course the main victim is the dead guy, and his grieving family. But I believe the cops were victims too because they were sent into a dangerous situation , purposely, by this criminal swatter.