Found Deceased KS - Lucas Hernandez, 5, Wichita, 17 Feb 2018 #19 *Arrest*

[Paddleboarder]

To me, her hands would have to be “holding, or clenching “ while dragging or pushing “into” something, possibly a concrete tube or structure. MOO


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That would make sense. The knuckles would be in the correct position.

I originally contributed the scratches to shrubbery or brush, but they could also comes from a rough concrete.

 

[perfectingpink]

Guys this sounds hoaky but I'm going to light some sage for us in here...the awful thoughts keeping us up at night, and thoughts of what Lucas may or may not have endured...let us all please hope that Lucas suffered as little as he possibly could have in his awful situation...

Eta: have a fresh beautiful stick of special white sage I'm burning now, over this device.

Is sage what we are calling it these days, Magz? :giggle::shush:

 

[Paddleboarder]

Very important post.

Thinking out loud...Brush. Woods. Trees. Bushes. Thorns. Branches...??

Defensive wounds?

I don’t think defensive wounds.

 

[AFTM]

I don’t think defensive wounds.

Defensive wounds are usually not on the tops of the hands. They are on the inside from shielding or grabbing.

My sisters fingers were almost cut off from them. She had to wear gloves in casket.
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[margarita25]

I don’t think defensive wounds.

Hi PB, scratches from the disposal terrain seems to be the obvious possibility; I was al though just pondering her possible history of strangulation ("bruises on neck") and was thinking why and how scratches, if defensive wounds, could and would appear on the top of the hands--this would/could be one way.).

With that being said, this could be important for a wooded location vs a field, water or building location, etc....I am reminded of a case I just saw where there was an examination of post mortem scratches on a victim...while she was running through a wooded area, thorny bushes iirc, and sustained many scratches this way, it was able to be determined that some specific scratches were not caused by those branches, etc, but rather by fingernails.

I would assume LE obviously aptly noticed these scratches and photographed them (Standard Procedure).

Word of these scratches is important insight, moo, and brings me back to the bird in my avatar and somewhere possiboy similar to this nature preserve, which LE seemed to focus much on, moo.

EG also had that tree screensaver, been thinking about that again...

 

[Paddleboarder]

Was there anything memorable in the way of flooding in the days following Lucas’ disappearance? Heavy rains, river overflow, dam breakage, water main break, clogged drainage system...anything?

 

[GigTu]

I just had a morbid thought but I believe she would be capable of it. The cadaver dogs they are saying did not hit on anything in home or car. I wonder if he was still alive when she disposed of him.

I've never seen the mention of cadaver dogs being used at all in the home or car. They said dogs, not what kind or what they detected, or exactly where they were used.

 

[margarita25]

Was there anything memorable in the way of flooding in the days following Lucas’ disappearance? Heavy rains, river overflow, dam breakage, water main break, clogged drainage system...anything?

I wonder if the city, public utilities, etc might have recollection/documentation of any such instances? I also posted some weather links above including specific rainfall totals, etc...

 

[n_6CC]

I just had a morbid thought but I believe she would be capable of it. The cadaver dogs they are saying did not hit on anything in home or car. I wonder if he was still alive when she disposed of him.



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Elaborate on any ideas your thinking of?


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[margarita25]

I just had a morbid thought but I believe she would be capable of it. The cadaver dogs they are saying did not hit on anything in home or car. I wonder if he was still alive when she disposed of him.



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I highly doubt (and hope) this, moo.
(Sage!!!)

 

[n_6CC]

God awful thought, but I did wonder if she took him some place first before killing him. I was thinking that she didn't want any evidence of blood or body fluids in her vehicle or home to point the finger at her.

Or what if he were so ill, she took him to a valued friend to see what his prognosis might be - or after another “accident “ he may have had.
Just thinking..........


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[margarita25]

Or what if he were so ill, she took him to a valued friend to see what his prognosis might be - or after another “accident “ he may have had.
Just thinking..........


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Hmmmmm...

 

[Steelslady]

There were shallow scratches on the top of her hands at the time of the arrest.

Good grief, how did I miss your confirmation of these scratches? I thought that they looked scratched and a bit bruised myself, but others convinced me that it was just shadows from the lighting and camera angle.

This changes a lot for me- things I suspected in the beginning make more sense now. Thanks for clearing this up, . :heartbeat:

 

[margarita25]

Elaborate on any ideas your thinking of?


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(Ugh, I haate this place sometimes, but it is what we do, this is a crime forum, and we are trying to help find this little guy. FLA did tell us early on to do what we do...)

 

[margarita25]

That would make sense. The knuckles would be in the correct position.

I originally contributed the scratches to shrubbery or brush, but they could also comes from a rough concrete.

A sandpaper abrasion type scratch from concrete would be different from a branch, etc type scratch, I would think as I'm no expert, but boy would I like to see Forensic Files get a hold of the pictures of the scratches...

 

[margarita25]

So, jumping off this, IF it's concrete scratches, many possibilities as you guys have been discussing (still catching up)...Marking to google "different ways one might sustain a concrete scratch."

*again scratches sustained via concrete vs branches, etc.: it is an important distinction and I wish we had more on this, such as the intake photos of the scratches...

*Eta: or is there an "other" source of the scratches?

I think we may have zoomed in pics of her hands way upstream?
:lookingitup:

Eta: Calling all image experts for your input on photogrphic/digital artifacts, shadows, etc!

 

[margarita25]

To me, her hands would have to be “holding, or clenching “ while dragging or pushing “into” something, possibly a concrete tube or structure. MOO


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Thinking about this, again reminded of Sherin, and the culvert where she was found...tubular and concrete...

 

[GigTu]

That would make sense. The knuckles would be in the correct position.

I originally contributed the scratches to shrubbery or brush, but they could also comes from a rough concrete.

I've tended a lot of burn piles in my days, burning slash after cutting down trees and thinning weedy bushes and such. When the fire gets going pretty good, the need for air gaps to keep the fire going is lessened, and that's when one typically compacts the burn pile. I wore gloves and used tools, but found that very often good ole muscle and rearranging worked best. I'd just get over there and press it down, wiggle and rearrange everything, push, squash and press.

There's a lot of tree lined roads throughout rural Wichita. I'm assuming they as well as the brush were not lush and green in February, but dry and brittle with the woodsy ends exposed - much like what I experience with the burn pile sticks. I can see on google earth street views that the ground cover brush is often dense, and also brittle. Just thinking...

 

[Horror]

That would make sense. The knuckles would be in the correct position.

I originally contributed the scratches to shrubbery or brush, but they could also comes from a rough concrete.

Just bouncing of this
It could be both. Let’s be hypothetical and say you try to lift something of rough concrete palms up, knuckles then would scrape along the surface as you manoeuvred your hands to the right spot for lifting. Then into some type of brush area causing the scratches. The spread of redness across the knuckles has my mind towards concrete but the shallow scratch sounds like trees or branches etc


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[GigTu]

Thinking about this, again reminded of Sherin, and the culvert where she was found...tubular and concrete...

*Heavy sigh*