Found Deceased Ks - Lucas Hernandez, 5, Wichita, 17 Feb 2018 #29

[hopingicanhelp]

I think we need to blame EG for all the lies she's told. It's got to be hard for reporters considering the little-verified info we do know.

jmo

I have to agree with this -- even though "facts" are supposed to be vetted, this case has shown us how much we cannot bank on. If EG is telling people lie after lie and they are basing their understanding of things on that, they will in turn tell reporters what they understand. If EG lied about small inconsequential things that most people wouldn't lie about, it just confuses things further.

 

[hopingicanhelp]

Omg I'm dying

I don't know whether to laugh or barf over it, but I could definitely picture her saying this.

O/T - completely silly, but I had to mention what was running through my head as I wrote the OP; I recently re-watched the original "Rocky Horror Picture Show" and a specific scene flashed in my mind as I was trying to imagine EG explaining the presence of strange man/men. [spoiler alert for those who haven't actually seen the movie] Frank 'n Furter has just killed Eddie and he tells Rocky, "Don't be upset..." and proceeds to explain why he killed Eddie while also complimenting Rocky-- and sho'nuff, Rocky forgives him instantly.

Weird, I know, but that scene just suddenly arrived in my mind when I was contemplating EG & JH -- despite that, I will NOT let this strange association ruin the movie for me.

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

A couple more things from JH’s interview that I took note of (bolding is by me for emphasis)

NG: Does the back door have any type of a latch on it, or a lock, that he, maybe, could not reach?

JH: Um, no it did not.

-Then a short time later...

NG: Did you believe her at the time.

JH: At the time, I did. Um, because we had just moved in to that residence, and we were having an issue with that back door closing and latching, especially if you didn’t lock the deadbolt, you would think the door was closed, and then you turn around and it would be open.



JH: I’ve been, you know, tirelessly trying to search for him in my own way, for 3 months, (SBM)


-Then...


NG: Did she.. try to help in the search, when you first arrived home.

JH: Uh, we, we, did not. I… I honestly didn’t even try to search only after speaking with the detectives and explained to them ‘I don’t think he would have wandered off’, so I don’t believe that he is wandering around, and also they had told me they hadn’t - the didn’t at the time have any leads as far as the tracking dogs

Whoa.

 

[losangeles24]

I don't know whether to laugh or barf over it, but I could definitely picture her saying this.

Right??? I can definitely picture him believing it!!

 

[kmartin96]

I agree that he knows more about something, but disagree that he knew what happened to Lucas.

I can't remember who now, but an earlier poster suggested that much of EG's story was for JH's benefit--more so than for LE's. I agree with this. She keeps throwing out her net at JH--she needs him on her side. She called him from jail to apologize for panicking and hiding Lucas.

JO wonders if EG has something on him per her podcast interview -- I agree it's possible that EG has held onto it in her pocket just in case, but I also think she played on his hopes and found ways to tell him what he needed to hear--much like her supporters did.

IMO, JH did not participate in searches because he was 1) dealing with investigation, arrangements to care for MH, and EG drama from the very beginning while others were out searching; and 2) he quickly saw how the public can treat parents of kidnapped children. JO was already being crucified all over the internet, and even if he wanted to physically search he wasn't going to put himself at the mercy of the public the way JO did. I believe he reasoned with himself that he had a job & JO did not--she could search, but he was going to keep working and try to get EG out of jail and MH back home while he tried to figure out how to get Lucas back home.

I can see what you are saying, but I guess we all have to ask ourselves what do we think we would do if our child was missing....and possibly couple that with seeing the variety of things other parents of missing kids have done to find their child - and I think you just know in your gut.

Several years back, I came home from work and my son (probably 6 at the time) was nowhere to be found. My parents were in visiting from FL and they were his babysitter for the week while mom was at work. I freaked! Where is he? Parents: He was out front playing with......So I RUN as fast as I can to that house "No, Liam is not here....haven't seen him in hours" WTF!!! Cue hyperventilating - cue extremities starting to tingle due to stress/anxiety.....I tried 2 other houses with kids.....nothing......and the last one I checked - HE WAS there! This all transpired in 10 minutes time. Another 60 seconds and it would be 911. And I know if he didn't turn up within the hour.....BOOM, I would be calling new stations, printing posters......ANYTHING I could do to bring my son home.

No way would I "be looking for him in my own way"......over my own dead body.

 

[hopingicanhelp]

I can see what you are saying, but I guess we all have to ask ourselves what do we think we would do if our child was missing....and possibly couple that with seeing the variety of things other parents of missing kids have done to find their child - and I think you just know in your gut.

Several years back, I came home from work and my son (probably 6 at the time) was nowhere to be found. My parents were in visiting from FL and they were his babysitter for the week while mom was at work. I freaked! Where is he? Parents: He was out front playing with......So I RUN as fast as I can to that house "No, Liam is not here....haven't seen him in hours" WTF!!! Cue hyperventilating - cue extremities starting to tingle due to stress/anxiety.....I tried 2 other houses with kids.....nothing......and the last one I checked - HE WAS there! This all transpired in 10 minutes time. Another 60 seconds and it would be 911. And I know if he didn't turn up within the hour.....BOOM, I would be calling new stations, printing posters......ANYTHING I could do to bring my son home.

No way would I "be looking for him in my own way"......over my own dead body.

I'm so glad you found him -- and I am the exact same way! I guess I'm thinking of other factors as well in this particular case. In JO's interview, she mentions that JH seemed upset that LE called her first to discuss Lucas missing; JH also wouldn't pick her up and she had to get a ride from a guy on Craigslist. Both parents arrived to the scene hours after Lucas was reported missing while searching was already underway and both had to be interrogated. JO further states that during the first 72 hours following EG's arrest, she & JH seemed to be seeing the situation similarly -- it was after EG was able to contact JH that he separated himself again from JO. I believe EG was able to make JH question everything he'd discussed with JO up until that point because she pointed to JO as suspect and played on his hope -- now he believed there was no way Lucas was going to be found by these searchers looking in fields and parks. JO had him hidden somewhere, alive, and now EG was in jail and MH had been taken -- he had to work, get his family together, and get Lucas. It may not have been what was in his gut, but it was what he held on to. IMO.

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

I can see what you are saying, but I guess we all have to ask ourselves what do we think we would do if our child was missing....and possibly couple that with seeing the variety of things other parents of missing kids have done to find their child - and I think you just know in your gut.

Several years back, I came home from work and my son (probably 6 at the time) was nowhere to be found. My parents were in visiting from FL and they were his babysitter for the week while mom was at work. I freaked! Where is he? Parents: He was out front playing with......So I RUN as fast as I can to that house "No, Liam is not here....haven't seen him in hours" WTF!!! Cue hyperventilating - cue extremities starting to tingle due to stress/anxiety.....I tried 2 other houses with kids.....nothing......and the last one I checked - HE WAS there! This all transpired in 10 minutes time. Another 60 seconds and it would be 911. And I know if he didn't turn up within the hour.....BOOM, I would be calling new stations, printing posters......ANYTHING I could do to bring my son home.

No way would I "be looking for him in my own way"......over my own dead body.

Exactly.
I know. When my now 20 year old went 'missing'. I was frantic. Constant communication with police, family,friends. It was the worst night of my life.
Thankfully it was a miss communication with his brothers. He was with his oldest brother hanging with his girlfriend,and younger sister.
I was so relieved,and POed at his brothers at the same time.
But I was on it like white on rice Frantically do everything I could to find him.

 

[AlwaysHopeToHelp]

I’m curious if anyone believes DM’s tape would be admitted in court. I know we’re a long way off from a trial but I’ve been thinking about this aspect. Can a Defense Atty successfully argue to keep it out?

I did a recording confronting my ex about the sexual abuse of daughter and it was allowed in court. I don’t think it will be a problem getting it allowed for this case either.
Only thing they did NOT allow in his trial was the part where I offered a polygraph and he refused. The rest of the recording was allowed. So they may find certain parts that cannot be admitted but without having heard it, I don’t know what could be fought and disallowed.

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

I'm so glad you found him -- and I am the exact same way! I guess I'm thinking of other factors as well in this particular case. In JO's interview, she mentions that JH seemed upset that LE called her first to discuss Lucas missing; JH also wouldn't pick her up and she had to get a ride from a guy on Craigslist. Both parents arrived to the scene hours after Lucas was reported missing while searching was already underway and both had to be interrogated. JO further states that during the first 72 hours following EG's arrest, she & JH seemed to be seeing the situation similarly -- it was after EG was able to contact JH that he separated himself again from JO. I believe EG was able to make JH question everything he'd discussed with JO up until that point because she pointed to JO as suspect and played on his hope -- now he believed there was no way Lucas was going to be found by these searchers looking in fields and parks. JO had him hidden somewhere, alive, and now EG was in jail and MH had been taken -- he had to work, get his family together, and get Lucas. It may not have been what was in his gut, but it was what he held on to. IMO.

Could be, but why would he say he face timed with Lucas? If he in fact had not?

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

I did a recording confronting my ex about the sexual abuse of daughter and it was allowed in court. I don’t think it will be a problem getting it allowed for this case either.
Only thing they did NOT allow in his trial was the part where I offered a polygraph and he refused. The rest of the recording was allowed. So they may find certain parts that cannot be admitted but without having heard it, I don’t know what could be fought and disallowed.

Wow. I'm sorry you and your daughter had to go through that.
Polygraphs aren't admissable because they are not reliable. Gary Ridgeway the Green River Killer here in King County passed two Polygraphs.

 

[Kadoober]

At this point, I am waiting for a report to come out he was in the cat bed. Is this just God awful reporting/proofreading/editing?

Probably!

 

[LietKynes]

I still am thinking there are some secrets that cause them to stand by one another. I don't think he knew she had killed Lucas, but c'mon, he had to have suspected it. This thing about him trusting her so much is bunk. No way did he not know she was doing drugs, no way did he not know she was smacking Lucas around a bit. He would have to be a complete idiot. And apparently he thinks others are. Something is being hidden here.

bbm

 

[PommyMommy]

Could be, but why would he say he face timed with Lucas? If he in fact had not?

I'm not sure if this is going to work - it is the first time I've tried to bring a post forward from another thread. But, to my knowledge, this is the only source we have for the face time call on 2/15. I hope someone will correct me if I'm wrong. KS - Lucas Hernandez, 5, Wichita, 17 Feb 2018 #19 *Arrest*

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

I'm not sure if this is going to work - it is the first time I've tried to bring a post forward from another thread. But, to my knowledge, this is the only source we have for the face time call on 2/15. I hope someone will correct me if I'm wrong. KS - Lucas Hernandez, 5, Wichita, 17 Feb 2018 #19 *Arrest*

Yes it does. Thank you.

 

[Seattle1]

Moving forward....scientific facts to note: Postmortem Changes

Common Misconceptions
One of the most common misconceptions in forensic pathology concerns the ability to specify an exact time of death. There have been numerous cases in which postmortem changes taken out of context confounded PMI estimates. More than anything, environmental conditions alter the decomposition process. One decedent who was preserved in a chest freezer for 1 year showed minimal signs of decomposition. Another individual found in a field in the southeastern United States during summer showed advanced decomposition, yet all investigative information, including a receipt on his possession, indicated that he died within 24 hours of last being seen alive. Interpretation of physical, microscopic, and biochemical postmortem changes without correlation with the circumstances of death may result in significantly erroneous PMI estimates.

Other misconceptions revolve around the presumed ability of the forensic pathologist to definitively differentiate between antemortem injuries and postmortem changes in a body showing significant decomposition. Depending on the degree of decomposition and character of the postmortem artifacts, such differentiation may not be possible. Wounds inflicted immediately before or immediately after death (the "perimortem" interval) are particularly problematic.

Another common myth involves loss of bowel and bladder control at the time of death. Although this may occur, it is in no way a universal phenomenon. In most cases, urine can be recovered from the bladder at the time of autopsy and the rectum often contains fecal material.

Perhaps the greatest misconception revolves around the utility and usefulness of performing an autopsy on a decomposed body. As a general rule, information can be obtained from every autopsy, though putrefaction, skeletonization, or predation may limit the ability of the pathologist to draw definitive conclusions.
Postmortem Changes: Overview, Definitions, Scene Findings

 

[PommyMommy]

Yes it does. Thank you.

Yay! Love it when I learn something new. And, you're welcome. Do you know of another source for the face time call? Just curious, because I've been looking everywhere.

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

Whoa.

SMH.
I would leave no stone unturned, on the police so much they would not be able shut me up.literally Hunting,and tracking every last lead.
No way anyone is going to blah blah, nonchalant, non committal.
When their child is missing. No Way.
My blood is going to boil.

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

Yay! Love it when I learn something new. And, you're welcome. Do you know of another source for the face time call? Just curious, because I've been looking everywhere.

No sorry.

 

[ILikeToBendPages]

I've been reading off and on, but one thing made me think of my ex daughter in law and how she would manipulate my son making him leave work and come home to protect her from men that were hanging around outside of their apartment and how scared she was . He'd tell her to call LE for help while took off work and drive an hour to go keep her safe. It stll burns my biscuits . Later on we had custody of our granrchildren and our grandson would come back with bruises and it was always he tripped and fell or it was someone else that did it. And the tattoos . .. been there done that .When the ex dil moved on to another man and had a baby with him she'd hurt his little girl that he had with ex wife. She was always falling and have brusies . One time when picking up our grandkids for her vistataton she had her new boyfriend tell me that she had a terrible rash and wanted me to look at it,and as I started to remove her diaper she was covered in Destin cream and our ex said there was an odd looking rash and held up her hands in a circle . I immediately put her diaper back on and told them to take her to the dr or er. . I was pretty sure she had hit her with something round when she had to change her after she'd had an accident and I wasn't going to be put in the middle of that and get blamed for anything

 

[nyvictoria]

I did a recording confronting my ex about the sexual abuse of daughter and it was allowed in court. I don’t think it will be a problem getting it allowed for this case either.
Only thing they did NOT allow in his trial was the part where I offered a polygraph and he refused. The rest of the recording was allowed. So they may find certain parts that cannot be admitted but without having heard it, I don’t know what could be fought and disallowed.

That makes me feel better about DM’s recording. I’m so sorry your knowledge about admissibility of recordings comes from such an awful personal experience. I’m sorry you had to go through that.