Landscaper says Terri Horman wanted him to kill her husband!

[BeanE]

So then, the RO didn't include Terri's older son, only baby K and Kyron? I'm sorry, I wasn't able to find that document but I know it was discussed ad nauseum.

There's a Documents thread in the Reference Forum. I put all the legal documents to date in there just yesterday.

The RO refers to the Petitioner's children. The Petitioner is Kaine. His children are Kyron and the baby. Not J.

 

[Kat010]

(see ETA, below)
Brilliant post, GrainneDhu. Thank you.

I also have issues with the clamoring for TH to take to the media for other reasons. Key among them: this case is not a reality show. It's not American Idol. We all don't get to punch in an 800 number and vote as to her innocence/guilt.

If she's charged, she will be fighting for her life in court. If she's innocent, the thought of that is just...horrendous. So far, we don't even know who the accuser in the MFH plot is, as you pointed out. There's so much we don't know.

Most of TH's public persona has been crafted by KH & DY via the media, via leaks (the huge Source family, and in this case I believe that many of the leaks came from LE, deliberately placed), and then the rumor mills, including the internet. While we do know some things about her--i.e. the drunken driving with her child in the car--we don't really know much at all about the whole person. We've seen FB pages filled with photos of happy family stuff. But even that rebounds on her--I've read sites where, while she was busy coordinating fliers and working with people who wanted to help, people condemned her for not reorganizing her FB pictures the way the thought she should have, immediately. Then others criticized her fro being on FB at all. Damned if do, damned if don't seems to be the rule for her.

Somehow, in a marriage that involves two people, one person has been anointed as a hero who does no wrong, and the other as a Jezebel who's a monster around children. In this environment, I think it will be impossible to get a non-tainted jury pool close to home.

If she were to say anything, the attacks would start--from how she was dressed to how her hair looked to obviously, if she cried, she was faking it. I honestly have come to believe that demands that she hold a press conference are just blood lust for an opportunity to hurl stones at her. That's JMO, of course.

I think her attorney has done very well in keeping her out of the media. I think he realized early on that she would be baited in ever so many ways to speak out, with every word, every breath then used against her. Silence was her best option, and it's to her credit that she's followed her attorney's advice.

I'm still awaiting actual evidence of what happened to Kyron, and then actual evidence of who the perp might be. I can't make a judgment based on an unknown accuser, a soon-to-be-ex-husband, his first ex-wife, and internet rumors. I just can't. I know that position is not popular, but in matters of life and death, IMHO, more than mob popularity count. Unless we intend to just return to burnings and lynchings because enough people decide those actions are warranted. And I don't wanna go there.

ETA: for some reason my quoting of GrainneDhub's post, using the "Quote" function didn't make it clear which was GD's and which was the prior posters. I apologize if I did something wrong. So rather than create confusion, I just deleted GD's post, which appears above.

 

[grandmaj]

This thread has gone way off topic......get back to the title of this thread please.

 

[Donjeta]

Without the chance to assess the LS's credibility, I really have no opinion on whether the MFH plot is true or not. Just the facts that have been released make me skeptical: he didn't come forward at the time, he didn't come forward at all, he was found as part of the investigation and the sting failed.

We don't know if he has past legal troubles, current legal problems, a motive to wish ill on TMH, mistook a joke for a serious proposition or any number of things relevant to the issue of credibility.

JMO but I think that whether the MFH story is true or not the landscaper is perhaps more likely than not to have some legal problems.

In the event that he made the MFH story up he is the sort of dishonest person who thinks it is okay to lie to the police and that is a personality trait that can get you in legal trouble. He might have been persuaded to take part in the MFH sting if the authorities promised to get rid of some of his legal troubles for him.

In the event that the MFH story is true, again it wouldn't surprise me in the least to find out that he has some legal troubles because if I was out searching for someone who would kill my husband for me I wouldn't approach a pillar of society, I would reason that someone with a criminal past is a better bet. A church elder would turn me down and turn me in.

So hearing that he's got legal troubles wouldn't really tell me anything about his credibility as a putative murderer-for-hire.

 

[Donjeta]

"Bunch said Terri called 911 when Sanchez showed up at her house wired "trying to talk to about something". He also said Rudy Sanchez is an AKA (alias)."

http://www.katu.com/news/local/104507829.html

Can we discuss this?

I am just reminded that Terri and her friends have aliases as well...they bought the bat phones giving fake names.

 

[Billylee]

Peter Bunch said he's asked for Terri Horman calls to 9-1-1, back to Dec 26th [Note: the Decemeber request my have been mispoken]. But was denied by Sheriff's office saying it's part of "ongoing Investigation." He's tried to serve the landscaper, Rudy Sanchez with subpoena for deposition, but prosecutors wouldn't give him contact information because of the "ongoing investigation." Bunch said Terri called 911 when Sanchez showed up at her house wired "trying to talk to about something". He also said Rudy Sanchez is an AKA (alias).

http://www.katu.com/news/104507829.html

Why would LE hold 911 calls made by TH about the landscaper as part of the ongoing case. I seriously doubt that those tapes incriminate Terri. I am wondering if they might just lead toward exonerating her of the MFH.

If she really did ask this guy, whatever his name is, to off her husband, would she call 911? Wouldn't she just tell him to get the heck out of here. Instead, she calls 911. Since Bunch & Houze seem to want this tapes, I'm now wondering if she said she had no idea who this guy was and never hired a landscaper. That would explain why Kaine never knew about a landscaper too.

On the other hand, I find it really hard to believe that LE would just take some guys word for it without something to back it up, like a check from TH. But if that's the case, and they have that kind of info, why are these tapes so important?

I

 

[grandmaj]

Peter Bunch said he's asked for Terri Horman calls to 9-1-1, back to Dec 26th [Note: the Decemeber request my have been mispoken]. But was denied by Sheriff's office saying it's part of "ongoing Investigation." He's tried to serve the landscaper, Rudy Sanchez with subpoena for deposition, but prosecutors wouldn't give him contact information because of the "ongoing investigation." Bunch said Terri called 911 when Sanchez showed up at her house wired "trying to talk to about something". He also said Rudy Sanchez is an AKA (alias).

http://www.katu.com/news/104507829.html

Why would LE hold 911 calls made by TH about the landscaper as part of the ongoing case. I seriously doubt that those tapes incriminate Terri. I am wondering if they might just lead toward exonerating her of the MFH.

ETA so my opinion is that yes they may want some of part of this information for the divorce case but in reality it is for any future possible criminal case. They want to know what LE has so they can form strategy.

If she really did ask this guy, whatever his name is, to off her husband, would she call 911? Wouldn't she just tell him to get the heck out of here. Instead, she calls 911. Since Bunch & Houze seem to want this tapes, I'm now wondering if she said she had no idea who this guy was and never hired a landscaper. That would explain why Kaine never knew about a landscaper too.

On the other hand, I find it really hard to believe that LE would just take some guys word for it without something to back it up, like a check from TH. But if that's the case, and they have that kind of info, why are these tapes so important?

I

Truth be told there have been many talking heads discussing that the civil matters are just a method to extract information about the criminal matter. It has been discussed here.

I think what we may be seeing here is a testing of the waters from Houze. While it was Bunch who asked for the tapes, it is truly in the best interests of both attorneys to try to, or cry foul if they cannot, obtain discovery before they would be entitled to it because there has been no arrest.

ETA....forgot to save. LOL

So in my opinion they are trying to see what evidence LE has. They can't formulate strategy of defense until they know what true evidence LE has. MOO

 

[Paulette]

Peter Bunch said he's asked for Terri Horman calls to 9-1-1, back to Dec 26th [Note: the Decemeber request my have been mispoken]. But was denied by Sheriff's office saying it's part of "ongoing Investigation." He's tried to serve the landscaper, Rudy Sanchez with subpoena for deposition, but prosecutors wouldn't give him contact information because of the "ongoing investigation." Bunch said Terri called 911 when Sanchez showed up at her house wired "trying to talk to about something". He also said Rudy Sanchez is an AKA (alias).

http://www.katu.com/news/104507829.html

Why would LE hold 911 calls made by TH about the landscaper as part of the ongoing case. I seriously doubt that those tapes incriminate Terri. I am wondering if they might just lead toward exonerating her of the MFH.

If she really did ask this guy, whatever his name is, to off her husband, would she call 911? Wouldn't she just tell him to get the heck out of here. Instead, she calls 911. Since Bunch & Houze seem to want this tapes, I'm now wondering if she said she had no idea who this guy was and never hired a landscaper. That would explain why Kaine never knew about a landscaper too.

On the other hand, I find it really hard to believe that LE would just take some guys word for it without something to back it up, like a check from TH. But if that's the case, and they have that kind of info, why are these tapes so important?

I

LE doesn't want his name released.

 

[Donjeta]

On the other hand, I find it really hard to believe that LE would just take some guys word for it without something to back it up, like a check from TH. But if that's the case, and they have that kind of info, why are these tapes so important?

sbm

I don't think that there is a check because it was said that the MFH plan never went beyond words and a payment would be more than words.

If there was a payment it was probably in cash and neither of them is willing to admit it because it would incriminate them both.

 

[Billylee]

sbm

I don't think that there is a check because it was said that the MFH plan never went beyond words and a payment would be more than words.

If there was a payment it was probably in cash and neither of them is willing to admit it because it would incriminate them both.

What I meant was a check for being a landscaper, not a hit man. LOL

And what I mean is why would LE not release the tapes. It's TH making the phone call, what's on them that's part of the criminal investigation? That's what I'm wondering. 911 calls are usually public record aren't they?

 

[gwenabob]

What I meant was a check for being a landscaper, not a hit man. LOL

And what I mean is why would LE not release the tapes. It's TH making the phone call, what's on them that's part of the criminal investigation? That's what I'm wondering. 911 calls are usually public record aren't they?

There could be evidence. I don't know what exactly Terri told the 911 operator. What if she said, "There are two strange men here I have never seen before demanding money! Send the police right away!"

Yet, one of the men has texts from her and pictures of her naked. Don't you think it would be suspicious that Terri is lying about not knowing him? This is just conjecture as to why the contents of her call might be part of the investigation.

 

[Billylee]

Gotcha, but that's what I mean, would she be so stupid as to call 911, if she actually had done something illegal (or almost did something illegal) with this man? That's like calling the police on yourself. IDK just more that makes no sense to me.

 

[gwenabob]

Terri thinks she can talk herself out of anything. "Who are they going to believe? A beautiful middle class white woman or an uneducated, foreign landscaper?" she thinks, and takes the risk.

 

[scotslass]

Terri thinks she can talk herself out of anything. "Who are they going to believe? A beautiful middle class white woman or an uneducated, foreign landscaper?" she thinks, and takes the risk.

Perhaps but only if the landscaper is foreign and not only foreign but uneducated.. How would we know that from an alias? Also for this statement to be accurate we would have to assume Th has a stereotypical, prejudicial thought process. Which i'm not sure we can claim to know.


JMO

 

[Donjeta]

Gotcha, but that's what I mean, would she be so stupid as to call 911, if she actually had done something illegal (or almost did something illegal) with this man? That's like calling the police on yourself. IDK just more that makes no sense to me.

If she had an inkling that the guy showing up with a stranger might be a LE set up to get her she would have been smart to call 911 IMO because an innocent person would do so if suspicious people turned up and started talking about murder and demanding money. So she can say later, "Why would I have called LE if I was guilty". If the stranger was LE she wouldn't be telling 911 anything LE don't already know.

 

[Marcusdog]

I am wondering if the 911 call was at all related to Terri's teenage son moving out of the family home. Not that I am suggesting anyone sleuth that person as that is strictly against TOS.

My point is, there were reports that the young man was moved because he and Kaine were "butting heads" as is sometimes common with a teenage boy and a stepfather.

Perhaps a 911 call in december has nothing at all to do with Kyron, MFH, LSers or anything else other than an argument between a stepparent and a teenage boy that someone was concerned was about to get physical.

Having raised a teenage son and having witnessed my brother and our stepfather go at it during my youth, testosterone and stepfather issues can comine to make for some ugly family arguments at times.

I may be way off base, but a 911 call from the Horman home in December doesn't automatically set off my alarm bells or lead me to believe "something" was going on in that house or further that Terri is a "drama Queen".

I would need more details before I could even decide whether I think such a call is relevant to anything.

Hi, I'm new here but was just wondering if Ths lawyer wanted this proof of this call to show the court that KH was no better father than KH is saying TH is a mother. If the 911 call was in regards to J, and KH butting heads then Ths lawyer could say just look at the way he and J. got along, not good at all. Just my own thoughts on the Dec. 911 call.

 

[liz b.]

JMO but I think that whether the MFH story is true or not the landscaper is perhaps more likely than not to have some legal problems.

In the event that he made the MFH story up he is the sort of dishonest person who thinks it is okay to lie to the police and that is a personality trait that can get you in legal trouble. He might have been persuaded to take part in the MFH sting if the authorities promised to get rid of some of his legal troubles for him.

In the event that the MFH story is true, again it wouldn't surprise me in the least to find out that he has some legal troubles because if I was out searching for someone who would kill my husband for me I wouldn't approach a pillar of society, I would reason that someone with a criminal past is a better bet. A church elder would turn me down and turn me in.

So hearing that he's got legal troubles wouldn't really tell me anything about his credibility as a putative murderer-for-hire.

Interesting post... For me, hearing that the landscaper had some serious legal trouble, or maybe even not so serious legal trouble, would make me wonder about any statements he supposedly made to LE... And especially so if it turned out that he was : a) in this country ilegally, or b) using someone else's identity ... MOO

All JMO

 

[tlcya]

Hi, I'm new here but was just wondering if Ths lawyer wanted this proof of this call to show the court that KH was no better father than KH is saying TH is a mother. If the 911 call was in regards to J, and KH butting heads then Ths lawyer could say just look at the way he and J. got along, not good at all. Just my own thoughts on the Dec. 911 call.

Thanks, and welcome to Webseluths!

We are not even sure a 911 call in Decembere exists, It may have been that the attorney misspoke and meant to reference the June 911 call. But if such a call did take place in December I was trying to figure out what relevance it would have to the current divorce and ongoing criminal investigation into the murder for hire plot.

You raised an excellent possibility. I look forward to reading more of your thoughts in the days to come.

 

[overtherainbow]

By the time the sting took place and TH called 911 KH had been gone with k for almost four hours. According to TH email she sent him he was "upset" when he left.

IMO, Kaine's leaving was a red flag. She knew when the LS came a knocking she was being set up. Calling LE was her way of protecting herself and effectively ends the sting. She knows what the LS had on her and it wasn't much, texts and revealing pics. Nothing on paper, no evidence, just his words and Th being a good reader of people knew his words would not stand up court.

She never expected KH to leave her and take K, so she calls 911 again only this time according to her email to a friend she was directed to a non-emergency dispatcher in her email she writes

"Guess what? Since we are married we have joint custody and he can do that. Gee, too bad I didn't know that."

IMO, Losing K was not part of her well thought out plan (if she is guilty), out of desperation she acts carelessly and reverts to behaviors that have worked for her before, sexting with MC.

June 26th was not the first time TH called LE for help when she felt she was being threatened. In 2003 she called the Washington County sheriff’s office after RE had requested TH give him a break on the child support payments that she had gotten raised and told them he was harassing (taking $ away from her/J=harassment/threat). He continued to pay child support just like, IMO she knew he would (at this time she had known him for 15 years). I am basing this on what was reported in the contradictions article. TH has not told her side of the story.

IMO, LE does not have enough to charge TH for the MFH if Rudy Sanchez is all they have. Doesn't mean they didn't talk about it, but unless there are other LS or whatever that can testify that she wanted to put a hit out on Kaine, I don't see this going to court for the MFH. IMO, Bunch put the alias out there so the public would question his credibility. As has been pointed out having an alias can be completely innocent, but for the general public it conjures up thoughts of illegals, criminals and most wanted pics.

I'm a newby here. I'm here because of Kyron. I appreciate WS and all the folks here that seek justice for thousands of victims. I especially appreciate the mods here for without them WS would not be the place it is. A place to find accurate (or as accurate as MSM) information.

 

[tlcya]

Glad to have you hear overtherainbow