Laura Babcock: Dellen Millard & Mark Smich charged w/Murder in the First Degree #1

[Snoofo]

Your feelings are valid. But what if SL was really late and DM just had to go? We'll never know for sure Silly Billy.

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[matou]

JMO but I found meeting at a Starbucks at Chapters to discuss a missing friend strange. For some reason, I kept thinking they met at an outdoor patio. BTW, I remember seeing some photos of that Chapters in his friend's fb photos. I think there was drag racing going on on the Queensway.

ETA: Not sure if the Starbucks at Square One in Mississauga has a patio. The one in Etobicoke does, but that's not where DM and SL met, oops.

 

[Variant]

Your feelings are valid. But what if SL was really late and DM just had to go? We'll never know for sure Silly Billy.

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Someone could ask SL; he's not locked away or choosing to remain silent. You can choose whether you want to believe him or not; I find him much more credible than DM.

 

[Snoofo]

Since he was "clearly in a hurry" and their conversation lasted less than 5 minutes, I guess he didn't plan on spending too much time doing damage control or manipulating or talking about lifestyle choices.

I'm not sure why some are trying to compare the two DM cases. If I'm not mistaken, I believe Snoofo's comment was more directed to the belief that, if someone is charged, there must be ample proof of guilt, which simply is just not always the case.

JMO

Thanks Alethea Dice, glad someone got the point.

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[Snoofo]

Someone could ask SL; he's not locked away or choosing to remain silent. You can choose whether you want to believe him or not; I find him much more credible than DM.

Perhaps you can ask him for me. ;-)

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[Alethea Dice]

JMO but I found meeting at a Starbucks at Chapters to discuss a missing friend strange. For some reason, I kept thinking they met at an outdoor patio. BTW, I remember seeing some photos of that Chapters in his friend's fb photos. I think there was drag racing going on on the Queensway.

ETA: Not sure if the Starbucks at Square One in Mississauga has a patio. The one in Etobicoke does, but that's not where DM and SL met, oops.

Mr. Millard was waiting on the patio when Mr. Lerner arrived at the Starbucks in a Chapters across from Square One mall in Mississauga on July 27, 2012.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/what-if-game-haunts-babcock-friend/article18832997/

You can see the small patio at that Starbucks on Google maps.

HTH

 

[Alethea Dice]

Your feelings are valid. But what if SL was really late and DM just had to go? We'll never know for sure Silly Billy.

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He did say he was a few minutes late and DM already had a cold drink and was waiting for him when he arrived.

There was no time to grab a coffee when Shawn Lerner arrived a few minutes late at a Starbucks west of Toronto on a warm afternoon in late July, 2012.

<snip>

Sitting across from him with a magazine and an icy drink was a rushed Dellen Millard

 

[hopingforjustice]

As I say this, please know that in no way am I judging Laura or finding any kind of fault with her aside from having unfortunate circumstances that allowed her to stray to the wrong side of life, I am wondering if there is not some evidence or perhaps a "witness" that may have come forward to say that after the string of phone calls, Laura and DM and MS ended up hooking up that final night and a fatal drug overdose occurred? Perhaps that is why LE feels she passed on that day. The need to "get rid of the body" without attention to protect themselves and "anything" they may have going on could be the initial steps in this downward spiral.

All just my outside voice and JMO

 

[Sillybilly]

Curious to know who DM "heard about that" from.

DM had some type of relationship with LB and it seems they maintained contact for whatever reasons, he seems to have known she was missing prior to SL being in touch ... but his sole contribution amounts to nothing more than a text "heard about that, don't know where she is" and 5 minutes to spend with someone who is trying to locate her?

 

[Ont]

Curious to know who DM "heard about that" from.

DM had some type of relationship with LB and it seems they maintained contact for whatever reasons, he seems to have known she was missing prior to SL being in touch ... but his sole contribution amounts to nothing more than a text "heard about that, don't know where she is" and 5 minutes to spend with someone who is trying to locate her?

In a way this is OT but Id like to ask a couple of things & I believe by now you would know the answers to, ( I havnt been able to access the forum much lately, just come in & read when I can) 1./ how do we access our own previous posts, and 2./ which year was it VS disappeared/ was murdered?
/08 or /09? I Believe /08.. anyhow Brantford area had a big part to play I thought in all that went on but was kept quiet for some reason, is there a casino there? And more so a reserve? We have both in Tbay. I would like to know who owned that property in 2008 where Bosmas remains were found, if not the man who said he sold the property to him. There is ALOT of real estate business surrounding all of this DMs stuff & another case, and a connection to a dance school of some sort but its down the chain. Thanks if anyone can help:seeya:

 

[Ont]

I would also like add..speculation as it may be JMO --> of coarse, I believe the recent busts that have been happening, have a signifigant "purpose". All that I can say, or should I say JMO. Time will tell I suppose.

 

[MuhGruff]

Yep. Plus who doesn't have caller ID or the ability to send/receive text after the party didn't answer the phone call or an answering machine? Many people call and if no answer immediately follow with text.

Regardless the recipient would know LB had attempted contact whether they spoke to LB on every calling attempt.

Not every carrier offered call display by default or for free, Telus only just recently offered the CD feature "free" with select contracts. I had to pay $8 per month for call display and it only showed numbers in my contact list so speculating DM knew about those calls is superfluous. He had the money but some people just don't care about that stuff, or can't be bothered to wait in a 20 minute line or a 30 minute phone call to activate a feature. Of course maybe he did have call display but who checks their call history? Especially 3 years ago when not everyone had a smartphone. When I had a dumb phone I never looked at my missed calls if there wasn't a voice mail and if there was a voice mail I'd look to see who it was from because I might not want to listen to it at the moment. There are too many variables and unfortunately the only thing that might she'd light on this is seeing text message history.

Id say it's safe to assume he may have been aware that she was trying to contact him and ignored it and probably didn't notice how many times she called. If you send someone a few texts that get ignored the next step you'd take is to call them a bunch of times. DM was probably aware of her attempts but not every instance and of course he would lie of someone asked him if he was in contact with her, Lerner called his bluff so he came up with an innocuous and benign story.

If DM was ignoring her I have a feeling that it was MS who changed that (maybe it was his idea to meet up and his idea to" mess" around with her). Its already assumed in court they'll probably put all the blame on each other unless they've weave some incredible and unbelievable story but if the truth comes out I believe MS was the anchor in all of this. I have a gut feeling that MS is this cases holmolka. Not that DM is at all innocent but like PB he was involved with something less incredulous until the spark that is MS lit his tinder. JMO.

 

[Snoofo]

To be honest when people who owe me money and need more call me frequently, I have in the past ignored calls. Especially if I think drug use is a factor. Maybe DM was dismissing her (no different that LE did).

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[Snoofo]

He did say he was a few minutes late and DM already had a cold drink and was waiting for him when he arrived.

If he had an icy drink and a magazine my guess is he'd already been there awhile. It may have been his suggestion to meet but it was SL who wanted information and wasn't there on time - at least he waited for him.

I wonder though, if DM never considered that SL had phone records then he could have just avoided his texts and calls instead of meeting him at all. Why did he meet him?




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[ArianeEmory]

If he had an icy drink and a magazine my guess is he'd already been there awhile. It may have been his suggestion to meet but it was SL who wanted information and wasn't there on time - at least he waited for him.

I wonder though, if DM never considered that SL had phone records then he could have just avoided his texts and calls instead of meeting him at all. Why did he meet him?

He's probably used to being able to manipulate people pretty easily, and figured it would be easier to manipulate SL in person as well as playing up Laura's proclivities ("blame the victim").

And then he most likely felt like he got away with it, since there were no repercussions at the time.

 

[Snoofo]

I can see that if he thought SL had something on him. But he didn't since he "denied" speaking to her until he was shown records. So why try to manipulate SL if he didn't know he had anything linking him to Laura? Why would he care about him at all?

Can someone remind me how it was determined here at WS that DM is so good at manipulating people? Who that has spoken up from his past said that - Sharif or the guy from elementary school? Or did someone here come to that conclusion and then it was carried forward as a truth? It's been so long and I'm getting old; my memory needs refteshing.

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[matou]

Bumping this info forward:

He also sent a text message to Mr. Millard, who he had met a couple of times, mentioning that Ms. Babcock&#8217;s last eight outgoing phone calls &#8211; lasting just a minute or two on July 2 and 3 &#8211; were to him.

Mr. Millard sent a brief reply, obtained by The Globe and Mail: &#8220;Heard about that, don&#8217;t know where she is.&#8221;

After Mr. Lerner sent three more texts pleading for information, Mr. Millard replied: &#8220;Doesn&#8217;t sum up into a text message, shall we grab a coffee later today or tomorrow?&#8221;

DM was informed that LB phoned him eight times BEFORE he met up with SL at Starbucks. His response to SL was only that he had heard the LB was missing and that he didn't know where she was. Not that he didn't phone her eight times. He must have wanted to know how SL knew about the calls. They made a date to meet up and talk, SL showed him the phone bill and DM split right away. DM was free to kill two more times. JMO

Same Globe and Mail article as previous.

 

[Snoofo]

Thanks Matou. I'm thinking he didn't want to discuss drug seeking by text. If SL can tell him how many times LB called and for how long, I don't think he would need further proof that someone found and shared LB's phone bills. JMO.

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[ArianeEmory]

I can see that if he thought SL had something on him. But he didn't since he "denied" speaking to her until he was shown records. So why try to manipulate SL if he didn't know he had anything linking him to Laura? Why would he care about him at all?

Can someone remind me how it was determined here at WS that DM is so good at manipulating people? Who that has spoken up from his past said that - Sharif or the guy from elementary school? Or did someone here come to that conclusion and then it was carried forward as a truth? It's been so long and I'm getting old; my memory needs refteshing.

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Sorry, I'm one of those people who assumes that, since he's been charged with three murders, there's probably some fire behind the smoke. I see we're fully back into Innocent Dupe mode, though, so I'll prepare myself to explain this as often as necessary.

Beyond the murder charges, the burned body on his farm, the timing of LB's disappearance paired with the purchase of the incinerator, his father's "sudden bleed in the brain" paired with his Steam profile picture, and his jailhouse writings and interview, it's glaringly obvious to me that he's spent a lot of time believing he's the smartest guy in the room, and I don't doubt that he attracts beta personalities (e.g. MS) to his alpha personality.

I guess you feel he's just a humble philosopher?

 

[Sillybilly]

Sorry, I'm one of those people who assumes that, since he's been charged with three murders, there's probably some fire behind the smoke. I see we're fully back into Innocent Dupe mode, though, so I'll prepare myself to explain this as often as necessary.

Beyond the murder charges, the burned body on his farm, the timing of LB's disappearance paired with the purchase of the incinerator, his father's "sudden bleed in the brain" paired with his Steam profile picture, and his jailhouse writings and interview, it's glaringly obvious to me that he's spent a lot of time believing he's the smartest guy in the room, and I don't doubt that he attracts beta personalities (e.g. MS) to his alpha personality.

I guess you feel he's just a humble philosopher?

<bbm>

In another thread, I had mistakenly said that both DM and MS were charged with forcible confinement in Tim's case and Alethea questioned me on it. When I went back and looked, and looked, Alethea was right ... MS is only charged with 1st degree murder in Tim's case. DM however, has the forcible confinement + 1st degree murder + theft of the truck. IMO, sounds like LE is pretty satisfied that DM is moreso the ring leader between the two.