Laura Babcock Murder Trial 12.12.17 - Final Charge - *Verdict Watch*

[don_quixote]

Has anyone seen the rest of the rap lyrics that were not allowed to be known to the jury.? There are 7 more lines.

The article says they released the first verse only. So it looks like what they call a verse is really a stanza. So there should be another 24 lines? Go figure.

 

[Tealgrove]

I personally find it comical that DM is calling MS a desperate coward for taking the stand in the TB trial, yet his letters to CN show the exact same behaviour, if not worse. :clap:

I actually believe that he has no awareness of his "self". I don't think he understands why people don't think he's this wonderful human being. I don't think it's denial either. There is something seriously wrong in this boy's head.

I'm not attempting to make excuses for DM but I really want to understand what makes him like he is. Is his behaviour and thought processes an acquired "thing" or was he simply born this way? Nature vs nurture?

I struggle with trying to figure out if DM actually believes the lies he throws out there or does he know he's spoofing us. I know it's all lies but does he? Does he really think he can trick us into thinking he's a great guy and a brilliant guy?

Boy would I love to see a psychiatric report on him. I know we have our theories of psycopathic tendencies and personality disorders but they are just theories. What really is going on in there and what makes him tick?

MOO

 

[don_quixote]

I actually believe that he has no awareness of his "self". I don't think he understands why people don't think he's this wonderful human being. I don't think it's denial either. There is something seriously wrong in this boy's head.

I'm not attempting to make excuses for DM but I really want to understand what makes him like he is. Is his behaviour and thought processes an acquired "thing" or was he simply born this way? Nature vs nurture?

I struggle with trying to figure out if DM actually believes the lies he throws out there or does he know he's spoofing us. I know it's all lies but does he? Does he really think he can trick us into thinking he's a great guy and a brilliant guy?

Boy would I love to see a psychiatric report on him. I know we have our theories of psycopathic tendencies and personality disorders but they are just theories. What really is going on in there and what makes him tick?

MOO

This is bang on. Either he's crazy or he sincerely doesn't understand that he did something wrong. Totally disconnected from the reality. Something must be missing in his head. May be JuneBug's theory about free will is more practical than I thought, in cases like this at least.

 

[clefk27]

"The way that it went down was not how it was supposed to go down," Smich said. "Any criminal activity we've done together, no one's ever been harmed." He testified the "plan" was for the two to "scope out" Bosma's truck, and then come back later to steal it.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/news/tim-bosma-mark-smich-dellen-millard-murder-trial-1.3576641

So ... if they are convicted at this trial, will testimony like this from the TB trial be considered in their appeal of their convictions there? How does that work? Are they appealing the charges, or the process by which the charges were arrived at?

Have to think that the evidence that has come out in this trial puts MB's testimony in the TB murder trial in the category of straight up PERJURY. Can't imagine that will help his appeal at any level.
I didn't follow the TB trial as closely as this trial but now seeing the extent of Judge Code's rulings on what evidence was admissible or inadmissible and what jury could or could not hear, makes me think that this judge was exquisitely sensitive to anything that might taint this trial and be grounds for a later appeal. If both found guilty of M1. It is maddening to see certain items excluded but perhaps it is for the best. MOO.

 

[JPC]

Isn't that the same theme though? Killing for profit? Willing to "merk if the payoff is big enough"? I have never doubted that the motive for killing his father was financial. The motive for killing Tim was financial. It follows that the motive for Laura may very well have been financial as well.

I think that he killed because of how it made him feel. The money was just an added bonus. He didn't have to kill Laura or Tim to rob them and it seems as though his father gave him everything he wanted. He may have tried to sound like he had street cred using terms like merk. He didn't need to put money out for an incinerator to just rob people. He wanted to kill and to hide the evidence. MOO


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[LadyL]

I think he understands fully. He just doesn't care. IMO.

This is bang on. Either he's crazy or he sincerely doesn't understand that he did something wrong. Totally disconnected from the reality. Something must be missing in his head. May be JuneBug's theory about free will is more practical than I thought, in cases like this at least.

 

[musicaljoke]

http://torontosun.com/news/local-news/mandel

“I’m down to merk (murder) people if it’s a big enough payoff”

— Dellen Millard in a text kept from the jury.

It would be nice to have the date and time of that comment so we can fit it into billandrew's timeline.

 

[musicaljoke]

"Noudga is said to be now living out of the country. Facebook sleuths suggest she’s studying medicine in Europe."

http://torontosun.com/news/local-news/mandel

Facebook sleuths??! What kind of conterminous word is that!?

 

[Jasper52]

It would be nice to have the date and time of that comment so we can fit it into billandrew's timeline.

“I’m down to merk (murder) people if it’s a big enough payoff,” Millard texted Smich in early 2012.

Hopefully, somebody can find it and the exact date associated with it.

 

[Oreck]

Reviewing "what the jury didn't hear"... solidifies my position that in our current justice system, the rights of the "amoral" accused trump the rights of the innocent victim. When the justice system does not mete out full and truthful justice, then it becomes primarily a legal system, and no longer serves society for it's intended purpose. This should be corrected.[/QUOTE]

I totally agree.
I often wonder if the system that some other countries use of three judges would not be a fairer and better system.
No evidence hidden.
If you can't do the time. Don't do the crime.
I think would be a lot faster and fairer to society and the accused.
Then there might be no Jordan Rule.
Guilt or innocence in our present system depends on who can afford the best lawyer.

 

[don_quixote]

Reviewing "what the jury didn't hear"... solidifies my position that in our current justice system, the rights of the "amoral" accused trump the rights of the innocent victim. When the justice system does not mete out full and truthful justice, then it becomes primarily a legal system, and no longer serves society for it's intended purpose. This should be corrected.

I totally agree.
I often wonder if the system that some other countries use of three judges would not be a fairer and better system.
No evidence hidden.
If you can't do the time. Don't do the crime.
I think would be a lot faster and fairer to society and the accused.
Then there might be no Jordan Rule.
Guilt or innocence in our present system depends on who can afford the best lawyer.

It protects the rights of wrongfully accused. Don't fix what isn't broken. Stalin loved troikas.

 

[hopingforjustice]

It will be interesting to see all of what the jury didn’t hear after WM trial. DM was sloppy and my guess is that there will be details in his jailhouse letters and likely texts to MS and Isho. Wouldn’t be surprised to see SS and AM pop up again. For everyone who keeps saying that this is about theft, don’t forget that he allegedly killed his own FATHER.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

BBM

I honestly did not think I could be more disgusted with these 2 and their band of merry men and ladies then I was after TB trial. Now reading all the things we didn't get to hear during this trial actual makes me fearful of hearing what could come out after his father's trial. I am in shock and just so happy for Igor. My god..to think how much longer this could have gone on (and perhaps even has that we don't know about) makes me sick to my stomach. I hope they both rot in Hell!

 

[Grey-St]

I actually believe that he has no awareness of his "self". I don't think he understands why people don't think he's this wonderful human being. I don't think it's denial either. There is something seriously wrong in this boy's head.

I'm not attempting to make excuses for DM but I really want to understand what makes him like he is. Is his behaviour and thought processes an acquired "thing" or was he simply born this way? Nature vs nurture?

I struggle with trying to figure out if DM actually believes the lies he throws out there or does he know he's spoofing us. I know it's all lies but does he? Does he really think he can trick us into thinking he's a great guy and a brilliant guy?

Boy would I love to see a psychiatric report on him. I know we have our theories of psycopathic tendencies and personality disorders but they are just theories. What really is going on in there and what makes him tick?

MOO

I think forensic psychiatrists would have a field day with him. I wonder if he would ever even be open to an assessment. And oh how I wish I could be a fly on the wall for that.

 

[mskrisc]

No word on how those letters made it out of the Barton St jail...

Methinks that the letters will be evidence in the WM trial.

It’s been public knowledge for some time now that DM’s mom was the “ mail carrier”


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Jasper52]

It’s been public knowledge for some time now that DM’s mom was the “ mail carrier”


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Why no charges?

 

[DeaconBrodie]

It protects the rights of wrongfully accused. Don't fix what isn't broken. Stalin loved troikas.

It's easy to denounce our justice system and it certainly isn't without flaws, but I defy you to point to one in existence which is flawless.

The wealthy have always enjoyed the benefits of their justice systems and guess what, they always will. At least our does occasionally convict the wealthy, most do not.

What you really have to ask is what is the purpose of a justice system? If you believe that it actually has anything to do with justice then you will no doubt be sorely disappointed.

 

[Grey-St]

It’s been public knowledge for some time now that DM’s mom was the “ mail carrier”


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

He had closed visits, meaning no physical contact and behind a glass window. So we suspect that either a guard, or one of his lawyers who he may have had open visits with, passed the letters on to his mother to begin with. That's the part we are dying to know.

 

[bakingirl]

Does anyone know when they stop deliberating each day? I seem to recall it was 7pm during the TB trial. Just wondering if I can stop obsessing today yet!

 

[bakingirl]

IMO it's discouraging to see key evidence excluded from the trial. I realize that the judge was likely trying to prevent grounds for appeal, but still, just very discouraging.

I'm kind of sickened by some of this, especially since it could affect the outcome.

 

[Velma]

Does anyone know when they stop deliberating each day? I seem to recall it was 7pm during the TB trial. Just wondering if I can stop obsessing today yet!

Funny, I was just thinking the same. I’ve just caught up as I was away today. After reading all of the articles after the fact, I am beyond disgusted and appalled (as if I wasn’t before). I don’t have the words to express myself.

As always, Justice for Laura <3