LIST LIST Questions and Answers #7 LIST ONLY

[Rumpole]

sorry bond, i wasn't clear - my point was that you wouldn't have smelled the chloroform in the trunk of the car b/c the smell is only perceptible when it's pretty much on top of you and the odour disappears very quickly. even w/o the decomp on top of it it's not something you'd notice.

In support;
If you get a strong smell of chloroform its probably "too late" its about then you feel woozy, and soon after faint. I have had some close encounters in lab situations, and in the old days in medical situation, briefly fainted when fumes from chloroform used for dressing removal got to me.

As Bond says, the PPM type levels of chloroform (even if "raised levels") would probably be undetectable as a "smell" and anyway be completely masked by the more pungent products of decomposition:
amines like putricene and cadaverene as well as sulphur compounds.

 

[eddeva]

In support;
If you get a strong smell of chloroform its probably "too late" its about then you feel woozy, and soon after faint. I have had some close encounters in lab situations, and in the old days in medical situation, briefly fainted when fumes from chloroform used for dressing removal got to me.

As Bond says, the PPM type levels of chloroform (even if "raised levels") would probably be undetectable as a "smell" and anyway be completely masked by the more pungent products of decomposition:
amines like putricene and cadaverene as well as sulphur compounds.

i know hercule, we both said that, now you said that, i just don't have the excuse of having ever worked in a lab, lol.

 

[secretagent]

To Seagull65--
In your post #542, the first picture, the guy in the white hat is holding up the thumb, middle and a bent index finger. To me it looks like an "E", which I have a feeling stands for extacsy(the club drug-sp?). I don't know any of the hand signs either but it sure looks like an E to me.

That hand symbol is called the "Shocker" it is representative of inserting 2 fingers in the vagina and one in the rectum, the female on the receiving end is not expecting it, hence the name "shocker"

 

[Intermezzo]

After re-reading TL's, Nate's and Cameron's interviews I've been searching WS and local news sites for Clint's interview with LE and the one that keeps coming up is the Greta Interview on Fox.
Has anyone come across it? Or has it not been released yet?
In his girlfriends, Maria K's, inteview she states she knows LE spoke with Clint.
Thanks

 

[Searchfortruth]

Does anyone know if LP's deposition is still on for later today, May 19th ?

 

[ThoughtElf]

Does anyone know if LP's deposition is still on for later today, May 19th ?

Not sure, but my guess is No. Morgan will be busy in court with JB?

 

[sumbunny]

What ever happened to dominic casey's Deposition? Why is he not being charged for failure to appear?

 

[Patty G]

What ever happened to dominic casey's Deposition? Why is he not being charged for failure to appear?

He hired an attorney on or about the day of the deposition.

 

[scrabble]

Any thoughts on Lee and Mallory getting married?

 

[sumbunny]

He hired an attorney on or about the day of the deposition.

Thanks Patty. So now does that mean he doesn't need to show up, simply for hiring an attorney?

 

[doogiesgirl]

That hand symbol is called the "Shocker" it is representative of inserting 2 fingers in the vagina and one in the rectum, the female on the receiving end is not expecting it, hence the name "shocker"

I am always happy to acquire new information, thank you, even when that info leaves me ....speechless. (Would NEVER have figured that out on my own)

 

[5stars]

Does anyone know if there is a summer school program for hidden oaks? If so,? when it ended?

 

[LancelotLink]

From http://www.myorangeclerk.com/mycler...38-16b6-4282-91c9-35c812e590fc&CaseID=1450829

5/18/2009 Deposition of Cindy Anthony
5/18/2009 Deposition part 2 of 2
5/18/2009 Deposition George Anthony
5/18/2009 Notice of Filing
5/19/2009 Notice Appearance of Counsel FOR DOMINIC CASEY

Ok, huh?
I need help understanding all of this. TIA

 

[Dear Prudence]

From http://www.myorangeclerk.com/mycler...38-16b6-4282-91c9-35c812e590fc&CaseID=1450829

5/18/2009 Deposition of Cindy Anthony
5/18/2009 Deposition part 2 of 2
5/18/2009 Deposition George Anthony
5/18/2009 Notice of Filing
5/19/2009 Notice Appearance of Counsel FOR DOMINIC CASEY

Ok, huh?
I need help understanding all of this. TIA

The link doesn't work for me. What case is this? I searched on myorangeclerk.com and couldn't find it. Could you please point me in the right direction? Thanks

 

[AZlawyer]

From http://www.myorangeclerk.com/mycler...38-16b6-4282-91c9-35c812e590fc&CaseID=1450829

5/18/2009 Deposition of Cindy Anthony
5/18/2009 Deposition part 2 of 2
5/18/2009 Deposition George Anthony
5/18/2009 Notice of Filing
5/19/2009 Notice Appearance of Counsel FOR DOMINIC CASEY

Ok, huh?
I need help understanding all of this. TIA

Morgan probably filed the deposition transcripts with the Court to give the judge the full context for purposes of his motions to compel.

 

[BondJamesBond]

sorry bond, i wasn't clear - my point was that you wouldn't have smelled the chloroform in the trunk of the car b/c the smell is only perceptible when it's pretty much on top of you and the odour disappears very quickly. even w/o the decomp on top of it it's not something you'd notice.

Ah..ok...got your drift now. Could also kinda have Icarus-effect too, eh?

FWIW...olfactory threshold & effects levels provided in the source linked here.

Relevant excerpts...

• "Air odor threshold* concentrations ranging from 85 to 307 parts per million (ppm) parts of air have been reported for chloroform."
  
• "In studies with human volunteers, exposure to 4,100 ppm causes serious disorientation, and 1,000 ppm caused dizziness, nausea, and after effects of fatigue and headache."
  
• "Inhalation of 10,000 ppm of chloroform vapor produces clinical anesthesia.

* meaning the level below which it cannot be detected by human shnoz

As far as I know we haven't seen concentration levels in the trunk forensics.

ETA: My apologies...for answering and answer in the question & answer thread...:doh:

 

[DogMom2JoeAndWillie]

Okay, for the chloroform questions:
1. Chloroform is considered to be "toxic" at levels as low as 500ppm. It causes dizziness, fatique and headach around 900ppm. Not sure what the levels were in the trunk.
2. Chloroform has relatively low reactivity, it isn't water soluble but IS lipid (fat) soluble, it isn't readily metabolized by humans, and the biologic half life is realtively high. Biologic half life is how long it takes to remove half of the initial concentration from the bod. This means if I have 10ppm in my body and it takes 9 days to remove half, after nine days I have 5ppm left. Then it takes another 9days to remove half of the 5ppm left, leaving 2.5ppm after 18days (two half lives). The result is that it takes a LONG time to reduce the amount in the body, and it will (mathematically) never be completely removed from the body. These properties are what contribute to its carcinogenic properties and are the reasons why it damages the liver and kidneys. Not sure what the chloroform half life is, but I'll assume that it would accumulate in the system and there would be some symptoms/side effects if used over long periods of time.
3. You can ACCIDENTALLY make chloroform with household cleaning products. The combination of household bleach (calcium hypochlorite or soduim hypochlorite) and either acetone (nail polish remover), ethanol (the stuff that gets you drunk), butanone (also called methyl ethyl ketone....it's in dry erase markers, some glues, and some paint removers), or isopropyl alcohol (rubbing alcohol). My point being that someone could have accidentally made chloroform when they cleaned up the trunk with bleach and it combined with gasoline (with ethanol added) that had been spilled in there (from gas cans).
4. If the chloroform in the trunk was from a decomposing body, my guess is that the smell of the compounds mentioned in (I think it was) eddeva's posts would be WAY stronger and more concentrated than the chloroform.

Now here's my question/what I'd like to know more about:
It would be very useful to know how much chloroform is typically released from a decomposing body, if there was any residue/evidence of cleaning compounds/household products in the trunk of the car (if chloroform was accidentally made when the car was cleaned) or which products the A's kept in their home that could be combined to make chloroform (on purpose to use as a sleep aid).
If we knew this info, we might be able to figure out more about Caylee's death.

 

[LancelotLink]

The link doesn't work for me. What case is this? I searched on myorangeclerk.com and couldn't find it. Could you please point me in the right direction? Thanks

I wish the links worked.
http://www.myorangeclerk.com/myclerk/Default.aspx
type in Casey Anthony
I chose the last one listed. It should open the Civil Case.

 

[LancelotLink]

Morgan probably filed the deposition transcripts with the Court to give the judge the full context for purposes of his motions to compel.

Ahhh. Thank you! How about the Dominic Casey thing? Thanks in advance.

 

[Searchfortruth]

"Attorneys will also depose one of Casey's friends."

This was taken from an article on WFTV's website, they are referring to ZG's attorney's deposing one of Casey's friends. Does anyone know which friend this might be ?