MA - Vanessa Marcotte, 27, murdered, Princeton, 7 Aug 2016 #7 *Arrest*

[ForensicMass]

Yes, from near the SUV and the foliage coverage, where he was standing watching, waiting, he could see her but she could not see him watching her. You saw the height of the flowers and weeds from near the CS. They came up to the shoulders and heads of the Rescue Officers.

Yes, I do believe there was a SUV involved, per LEO. They asked for the public's help in this matter.

Yes, but I don't mean anything like a butcher knife. If he had a knife at all, it was a pocket knife. Don't most guys carry those? I don't think he had a gun at all. Either way, neither one, in jmho, was required for what happened to VM. In fact, I think he ran up behind her; grabbed her; carried her into the woods kicking and not screaming because his hand was covering her mouth or a hanky was placed in her mouth to silence her screams.

I only mentioned that blasted! phone because it was part of Mainely16's theory that UnSub placed it in his back pocket. Personally, I don't think he did because I do believe that LEO has her phone.

Just wondering, what evidence is there to suggest LE has the phone. I've seen none whatsoever.

 

[searunner]

Interesting theories, DeDee. I, too, am curious about your theory re: the phone. If you think LE has it, where do you think they found it - at or near the CS? South of CS when they came back to search again and had a small bag? (Pretty sure that was south of CS.) Ditched near Mtn Barn area to coincide with the 2:25 pm ping?

If not the latter, then I take it you don't think the 2:25 ping originated from "near Mtn Barn," correct? If so, what is your take on that 2:25 pm ping?

If you're buying coffee for the group, my order is coming!

 

[ForensicMass]

I know who Dylan Roof is, but I haven't followed.
After I posted the video, "Socks" came to mind. All you see in this video is a cam pointing down towards feet.
In relation to the video, do you think the shoe could have burned enough in the fire not to be recognized?

Not recognized by the media, yes,perhaps not. But LE would see some goop in the char. And with one partially burned shoe and the other missing, they could draw a conclusion readily.

 

[DeDee]

Interesting. If you believe he was in the tall grass, that means he had to be partially in the path set back away from the road. The grass along the road was only a few feet high. How was he sure there were no cars coming at the exact time VM walked by? you can't tell that far set back.
The phone.. I have more thoughts about the phone, but let me ask, what makes you think LE has it?
Where do you think they found it, and when?

Perp may have been squatting down; no need to be standing until he was ready to pounce. UnSub may not have seen a long ways in both directions, but he could hear and he was focused on sounds at the moment. Focused on her speed. How long would it take her to reach him, he wondered. Perhaps.

The phone may have been located on the second search we've mentioned when LEO returned to the CS. I do believe they have it. Even if they do not have her actual phone, they can request SW for the cell towers to receive any incoming/outgoing calls, emails, texts sent during a particular time frame. Rocky has a valid point about LEO not seeming to search MB only to obtain their CCTV footage, afaik.

Someone has placed their trash bins at the edge of the street.

Please call the tip line at (508) 453-7589

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/
https://cbsboston.files.wordpress.com/2016/08/princeton3.jpg?w=420&h=236
https://boston.cbslocal.com/2016/08/11/vanessa-marcotte-princeton-investigation/
http://www.ghanagrio.com/news/world...driving-after-murder-of-vanessa-marcotte.html

 

[DeDee]

Vanessa Marcotte :rose:

 

[Rocky1]

Just wondering, what evidence is there to suggest LE has the phone. I've seen none whatsoever.

I think we are building the theory on what we know happened, combined with what we know did not happen.
If you are going to rely on evidence only, then show the evidence showing the search for the phone at the Mountain Barn. In fact, forget the video, show evidence of one report mentioning it.
I'll post a video below of Fox News reporting an update
Stop the video at the 1:33 time stamp. There are 11 state police cruisers parked at 12 Brooks Station Road, across from the pond.
What do you think they are looking for? The shoe? I think one cruiser/cop would be able to see a shoe floating in the pond.
Also in the video, you will see them searching with a metal detector. Think they are looking for the shoe? If not, what do you think?
Then continue on the video and listen to the information about the Mountain Barn. Hear one thing about a search for a phone? Find it odd how there is chopper coverage there, but not one shot from along Rt.31 along the Mountain Barn?
Add it all up, then toss in the example of the picture I showed you how heavy tree cover can throw off a signal, and the mention of damage from an "IF" antenna from the phone doing the same. Then watch this.
Notice the orange line to the left of the screen. That's exactly where the IF antenna is located.

[video=youtube;WL1WlV9FQiE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WL1WlV9FQiE[/video]

Combine all this together then answer why a "local knowing the area" is going to drive past the Mountain Barn, then past the surveillance camera at the bank, instead of doing a U turn on BSR, saving miles, and beating the cam?


http://www.fox25boston.com/news/princeton-joggers-murder-development/421432376

 

[Dollcat]

I think we are building the theory on what we know happened, combined with what we know did not happen.
If you are going to rely on evidence only, then show the evidence showing the search for the phone at the Mountain Barn. In fact, forget the video, show evidence of one report mentioning it.
I'll post a video below of Fox News reporting an update
Stop the video at the 1:33 time stamp. There are 11 state police cruisers parked at 12 Brooks Station Road, across from the pond.
What do you think they are looking for? The shoe? I think one cruiser/cop would be able to see a shoe floating in the pond.
Also in the video, you will see them searching with a metal detector. Think they are looking for the shoe? If not, what do you think?
Then continue on the video and listen to the information about the Mountain Barn. Hear one thing about a search for a phone? Find it odd how there is chopper coverage there, but not one shot from along Rt.31 along the Mountain Barn?
Add it all up, then toss in the example of the picture I showed you how heavy tree cover can throw off a signal, and the mention of damage from an "IF" antenna from the phone doing the same. Then watch this.
Notice the orange line to the left of the screen. That's exactly where the IF antenna is located.

[video=youtube;WL1WlV9FQiE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WL1WlV9FQiE[/video]

Combine all this together then answer why a "local knowing the area" is going to drive past the Mountain Barn, then past the surveillance camera at the bank, instead of doing a U turn on BSR, saving miles, and beating the cam?


http://www.fox25boston.com/news/princeton-joggers-murder-development/421432376

Sorry if I missed this somehow but was an "IF" antenna damaged? So the one at MB could have been transmitting false or incomplete data? TIA

 

[DeDee]

Was reading a bit more about KV's murder case from the New York Post and noticed what her father, PV, says about the percentages of volunteer DNA.

Slain jogger’s dad can’t bear holidays: ‘There’s nothing for me to celebrate’

November 24, 2016

The dad said he also is hoping to convince cops to try to do a mass DNA screening in the neighborhood, where everyone within a selected square mile agrees to submit a sample. Detectives would then run the genetic material against the DNA left at the murder scene.

“Ninety percent of the people would probably give, and the 10 percent who don’t give it, those are the ones you watch the most,’’ Vetrano said.

http://nypost.com/2016/11/24/slain-...nksgiving-theres-nothing-for-me-to-celebrate/

 

[Rocky1]

Not recognized by the media, yes,perhaps not. But LE would see some goop in the char. And with one partially burned shoe and the other missing, they could draw a conclusion readily.

After watching the video with the Adidas, the material used in the sole is combustible, meaning fuel. Once the fuel is consumed, there is nothing left but ash, the same as wood. The top shoes' sole was ash.

Let's say for the sake of conversation it was "goop". do you think LE is going to jump the conclusion and say to the media "That's what's left of a shoe"? or do you think they are going to say nothing until they are sure and only report what they are sure of?

 

[Rocky1]

Sorry if I missed this somehow but was an "IF" antenna damaged? So the one at MB could have been transmitting false or incomplete data? TIA

We don't know if the phone was damaged or not. I posted a few examples of what may cause a false location.
I think what we are trying to do, is add up all the tiny details that we do know, and don't, and develop a theory that makes sense.
So far we have two statements from MSM in regards to a "ping"
One statement is "The Aunt said there was a "ping off the tower near the mountain barn."
The other is "There was a "ping" near the mountain barn."
We know it was too early for the statements to mean the "ping" came from cell phone records. so the assumption/theory is that it came from an app of some type. i.e. FindMyPhone.

 

[DeDee]

I think we are building the theory on what we know happened, combined with what we know did not happen.
If you are going to rely on evidence only, then show the evidence showing the search for the phone at the Mountain Barn. In fact, forget the video, show evidence of one report mentioning it.

<RSBBM>

Combine all this together then answer why a "local knowing the area" is going to drive past the Mountain Barn, then past the surveillance camera at the bank, instead of doing a U turn on BSR, saving miles, and beating the cam?

http://www.fox25boston.com/news/princeton-joggers-murder-development/421432376

At this stage, I'm not focused on his getaway path. He drove a dark SUV out BSR and vanished. I liked Evey's idea of him wearing sunglasses and baseball cap to skip the scene [either wore the cap or kept it inside the SUV] and kind of hiding his scratches on the face or throat, if any.

Interesting SS capture from the link you provided.

 

[DeDee]

I think we are building the theory on what we know happened, combined with what we know did not happen.
<RSBBM>

Also in the video, you will see them searching with a metal detector. Think they are looking for the shoe? If not, what do you think?

<RSBMFF>

http://www.fox25boston.com/news/princeton-joggers-murder-development/421432376

No! They were not looking for a shoe. It is why I posted the photo of the rescuer with the metal detector. He's not looking for a shoe but for a phone. The battery and integral parts would set off a detector easily enough. And sure enough, they walk away with a brown bag of evidence.

 

[Rocky1]

At this stage, I'm not focused on his getaway path. He drove a dark SUV out BSR and vanished. I liked Evey's idea of him wearing sunglasses and baseball cap to skip the scene [either wore the cap or kept it inside the SUV] and kind of hiding his scratches on the face or throat, if any.

Interesting SS capture from the link you provided.

I am not focused on the path of escape either. I think FM was trying to use the location of the phone to determine the direction of travel.
I have posted my theory a few times as to how this all went down, and in my theory, the perp is wearing sunglasses and a helmet.

In regards to KV and the DNA.
When LE does a DNA dragnet, that's exactly what they do, zero in on the people that do not submit.
They can't force you to give DNA without a warrant. That is your 4th amendment right to refuse without a warrant.
If one refuses, LE plays the "what do you have to hide game" and tries to pressure you in to submitting.
Most people have no problem with doing so (i.e) 90 percent) however I'll give you a quick example of why one may want to reconsider.
About 15 years ago, there was a woman on Cape Cod that was murdered and the case went cold If you want the details I will post the link. Long story short LE did a DNA dragnet.
By Law, they are required to destroy all DNA samples that do no apply. They didn't. There were hundreds of men that had their DNA entered in CODIS. They sued in court to have it removed, to no avail.
I am not up to date on the KV thread, but I always thought the perp lived on 84th st. Close enough where he was able to watch her and noticed she was going to jog alone that day. Then he followed 84th st. to the entrance to the bike path and entered the park from the rear, and headed her off. That's also how he beat the cams.


http://archive.boston.com/news/local/articles/2006/11/17/trash_collector_guilty_in_truro_murder/

Edit:
Just to add the above photo is taken behind the guard rail along the gully before the path. There were many that were focused in that area searching.

 

[Rocky1]

No! They were not looking for a shoe. It is why I posted the photo of the rescuer with the metal detector. He's not looking for a shoe but for a phone. The battery and integral parts would set off a detector easily enough. And sure enough, they walk away with a brown bag of evidence.

I agree. The metal detector was one of the main reasons I believed LE thought the phone was there from the beginning.
The outer casing of the phone is metal as well.

 

[Kickoff61]

State Police searched the woods off Boylston Avenue in Princeton Monday for evidence in the death of Vanessa Marcotte.
By Michael Levenson and Travis Andersen Globe Staff August 11, 2016


According to this, it appears it was North of the scene not South.

 

[liz b.]

I am not focused on the path of escape either. I think FM was trying to use the location of the phone to determine the direction of travel.
I have posted my theory a few times as to how this all went down, and in my theory, the perp is wearing sunglasses and a helmet.

In regards to KV and the DNA.
When LE does a DNA dragnet, that's exactly what they do, zero in on the people that do not submit.
They can't force you to give DNA without a warrant. That is your 4th amendment right to refuse without a warrant.
If one refuses, LE plays the "what do you have to hide game" and tries to pressure you in to submitting.
Most people have no problem with doing so (i.e) 90 percent) however I'll give you a quick example of why one may want to reconsider.
About 15 years ago, there was a woman on Cape Cod that was murdered and the case went cold If you want the details I will post the link. Long story short LE did a DNA dragnet.
By Law, they are required to destroy all DNA samples that do no apply. They didn't. There were hundreds of men that had their DNA entered in CODIS. They sued in court to have it removed, to no avail.
I am not up to date on the KV thread, but I always thought the perp lived on 84th st. Close enough where he was able to watch her and noticed she was going to jog alone that day. Then he followed 84th st. to the entrance to the bike path and entered the park from the rear, and headed her off. That's also how he beat the cams.


http://archive.boston.com/news/local/articles/2006/11/17/trash_collector_guilty_in_truro_murder/

Edit:
Just to add the above photo is taken behind the guard rail along the gully before the path. There were many that were focused in that area searching.

Agree about the KV perp. I think he was close by, in the neighborhood. Or he knew a lot about KV's jogging route because he had known her, or watched her at some point. jmo

 

[Rocky1]

State Police searched the woods off Boylston Avenue in Princeton Monday for evidence in the death of Vanessa Marcotte.
By Michael Levenson and Travis Andersen Globe Staff August 11, 2016


According to this, it appears it was North of the scene not South.

In the link I posted the state police vehicles are parked at 12 Brook Station Road, across the road from the pond.
Boylston turns into BSR.

 

[Rocky1]

Agree about the KV perp. I think he was close by, in the neighborhood. Or he knew a lot about KV's jogging route because he had known her, or watched her at some point. jmo

Not to railroad this thread ,but, the reason I think he could see her from his house is because on that day in particular he knew the father would not be going with her, so he had to know that. I think he watched her warming up alone. 84th street . That's the only street that directly connects the bike path too. From what I remember, they were looking at cams that faced the park. They didn't see anyone because he traveled one street over behind the cams. JMO

 

[Kickoff61]

In the link I posted the state police vehicles are parked at 12 Brook Station Road, across the road from the pond.
Boylston turns into BSR.

So that would be North and you are referring to the pond I mentioned before from the google map correct?

 

[Rocky1]

So that would be North and you are referring to the pond I mentioned before from the google map correct?

Yes, north of the crime scene, and just before the intersection of Radford. The pond is on the west side of BSR. Not sure about your map, but Google 12 BSR, and you'll see it.