Madeleine McCann: German prisoner identified as suspect - #15

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Lyndaloo said:
I honestly believe that could be the reason for FF comment, when CBs associates seen pics of prison transporter at the scene they would have been bricking it!
Wondering who was in the van, was it CB? What had he divulged? I think it was defo CB getting a message out to his acquaintances not to get rattled, he hasn’t spoke & defo won’t speak. I wouldn’t be surprised if Prison transporter was empty & was just used as a tactic. I think the comment came around the same time as search or just after if I recall correctly? I think FF was instructed to say it by CB to get the message out there.
Click to expand...


"I wouldn’t be surprised if Prison transporter was empty & was just used as a tactic"

Good point!
Subtly piling on the pressure imo.
 
I thought about CB, MM and the darknet again.

We are talking about the year 2006/2007, during which time CB and MT served an eight month prison sentence in Portugal. After their release from prison their ways separated. MT set off for Spain; CB continued to stray through South Portugal.

A few weeks after MM's disappearance - at the end of May or beginning of June - CB is said to have appeared in Spain with a large mobile home at MT's former place of residence. This information is based on statements by MT.

After that they seem to have had no further contact worth mentioning.


MT is the one who claimed that CB had spent a lot of time in darkweb. So this would have to have been at the beginning of 2006 or during the short visit to Spain in 2007. In prison the two of them will hardly have been online all the time.

What content did darknet have to offer in those years? Sure, it's been around a lot longer than that, and from around 2005 onward, there were more and more normal middle-class people who used Tor to access the Internet to escape government surveillance and data storage. But did darknet at that time already offer easy to reach platforms where people could exchange ideas about the abuse of small children? Quasi an everyday communication and file sharing?

I'm sceptical about this, but would be happy if someone here in the forum knows more and can enlighten me.

Certain is that the instant messaging service "Telegram", which is used by dubious circles for their communication in "secret chats", has only existed since 2013.

So I think it will be difficult to find anything about MM on the websites and in the chats of pedophiles. At best, CB might have put the stuff on the net later - in the 2010s. But these are vague hypotheses.

What makes my assumption - CB does not exchange his pictures and films - is the statement of the profiler Mark Hoffmann. Recently he explained the behaviour of some sex offenders (with reference to CB) on German television as follows: There are offenders who film their deeds exclusively for themselves and not to share these images with others. This kind of sexual obsession is also not based on obtaining satisfaction during the act. It is only when they watch the filmed action later that they get the sexual satisfaction they long for.

I conclude from this, especially in view of the rape of the 72-year-old woman, during which the camera was also constantly running, that CB belongs to exactly this group. This would mean that he sees the footage as a "holy prey, a trophy" which he would never give away.

A quick word about MT. Who is this guy? He's being referred to in the media as a hippie. In 2007 the time of the hippies was long gone, a few so-called old hippies were still hanging around here and there. But MT does not belong to this age group, he is too young for that. And besides, these old hippies may smoke pot here and there, but they are not criminals per se.

MT is cut from a different cloth. For me he is a petty criminal loser. And to such a lame duck suddenly - by the time the world has its eyes on CB and MM - the English tabloid press comes and pulls him by his few remaining dreadlocks from the Corona swamp of isolation.

This was the opportunity to stand at the front line, grinning with a fat headline and colour photo from the newspaper pages. Probably at that moment his imagination took him on a roller coaster and his memory became more and more colourful.

My personal conclusion: The witness is quite unreliable.

Everything you can believe him: He and CB stole diesel fuel together. He and CB were in jail together. CB came to him in May or June 2007 for a few days in Spain with his big camper.

What I doubt about his statements to the press: He brought darknet into play because the headlines of those days about the German paedo ring had inspired him to do so. Sell girls to Morocco? This was also in the press reports about CB and MM before MT was mentioned.

I think he has good stuff to smoke. With it he should become happy and spread his colourful stories within his close friends.
 
Miss_Paula said:
Right! Well taken care of, dear Dlk. ;)

It really is a damn complicated case and I knew most of the media won't even begin to understand it.

That's why I had it all written down for you.

Sleuths must always be one step ahead.:D[/QUOTE

Paula, If I’m remembering correctly I read in one your posts that CB was charged with extortion alongside the rape of the 72 year old. Do you have any more info on this? Was their much in the media after he was convicted giving further details?
Click to expand...

Paula, If I’m remembering correctly I read in one your posts that CB was charged with extortion alongside the rape of the 72 year old. Do you have any more info on this? Was their much in the media after he was convicted giving further details?
 
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Miss_Paula said:
I thought about CB, MM and the darknet again.

We are talking about the year 2006/2007, during which time CB and MT served an eight month prison sentence in Portugal. After their release from prison their ways separated. MT set off for Spain; CB continued to stray through South Portugal.

A few weeks after MM's disappearance - at the end of May or beginning of June - CB is said to have appeared in Spain with a large mobile home at MT's former place of residence. This information is based on statements by MT.

After that they seem to have had no further contact worth mentioning.


MT is the one who claimed that CB had spent a lot of time in darkweb. So this would have to have been at the beginning of 2006 or during the short visit to Spain in 2007. In prison the two of them will hardly have been online all the time.

What content did darknet have to offer in those years? Sure, it's been around a lot longer than that, and from around 2005 onward, there were more and more normal middle-class people who used Tor to access the Internet to escape government surveillance and data storage. But did darknet at that time already offer easy to reach platforms where people could exchange ideas about the abuse of small children? Quasi an everyday communication and file sharing?

I'm sceptical about this, but would be happy if someone here in the forum knows more and can enlighten me.

Certain is that the instant messaging service "Telegram", which is used by dubious circles for their communication in "secret chats", has only existed since 2013.

So I think it will be difficult to find anything about MM on the websites and in the chats of pedophiles. At best, CB might have put the stuff on the net later - in the 2010s. But these are vague hypotheses.

What makes my assumption - CB does not exchange his pictures and films - is the statement of the profiler Mark Hoffmann. Recently he explained the behaviour of some sex offenders (with reference to CB) on German television as follows: There are offenders who film their deeds exclusively for themselves and not to share these images with others. This kind of sexual obsession is also not based on obtaining satisfaction during the act. It is only when they watch the filmed action later that they get the sexual satisfaction they long for.

I conclude from this, especially in view of the rape of the 72-year-old woman, during which the camera was also constantly running, that CB belongs to exactly this group. This would mean that he sees the footage as a "holy prey, a trophy" which he would never give away.

A quick word about MT. Who is this guy? He's being referred to in the media as a hippie. In 2007 the time of the hippies was long gone, a few so-called old hippies were still hanging around here and there. But MT does not belong to this age group, he is too young for that. And besides, these old hippies may smoke pot here and there, but they are not criminals per se.

MT is cut from a different cloth. For me he is a petty criminal loser. And to such a lame duck suddenly - by the time the world has its eyes on CB and MM - the English tabloid press comes and pulls him by his few remaining dreadlocks from the Corona swamp of isolation.

This was the opportunity to stand at the front line, grinning with a fat headline and colour photo from the newspaper pages. Probably at that moment his imagination took him on a roller coaster and his memory became more and more colourful.

My personal conclusion: The witness is quite unreliable.

Everything you can believe him: He and CB stole diesel fuel together. He and CB were in jail together. CB came to him in May or June 2007 for a few days in Spain with his big camper.

What I doubt about his statements to the press: He brought darknet into play because the headlines of those days about the German paedo ring had inspired him to do so. Sell girls to Morocco? This was also in the press reports about CB and MM before MT was mentioned.

I think he has good stuff to smoke. With it he should become happy and spread his colourful stories within his close friends.
Click to expand...
Tor was around back then so it is possible CB used it, but the term Dark Web is actually pretty abstract. It just refers to sections of the internet related to illegal activity. Though most of that is now confined to Tor onion sites, there were many child abuse websites etc around before Tor, hidden on the regular web and videos downloaded via P2P sharing. MT may have just been referring to the fact that he knew CB was involved in this. The skype transcript in 2013 is proof that CB was in contact with other paedophiles on line, how did he know them? I don't see it as much of a stretch that he was involved in this dark area of the web for quite some time.

I'm not sure what to make of MT's comments altogether. I think there is some elements of truth in what he speaks of but I get the feeling there is a lot more he knows that he is keeping quiet about in order to not implicate himself. His comments about how he felt when he learned about the rape video seem quite false to me. He claimed to be disgusted by it, yet he returns to Portugal to visit CB when he had every opportunity to cut contact with him.

In terms of the 'hippy' thing, I think it's a matter of definition. He is a pothead and likes to live an alternative lifestyle, some may call that a hippy. He was certainly a criminal too though.

I'm not sure whether CB used the darkweb to store videos. The fact he hid his USB stash would lead me to think not, since he could have instead destroyed them if he had them hidden online somewhere. But in the 2017 bar confession, it is said he showed the rape video to a friend on his phone. Given that he'd gone to the lengths to hide the material following the heat on him, would be remarkably brazen to then have the videos saved on his personal phone knowing he could be arrested again. Would have made more sense that he accessed the video via Tor on his phone. Also, where did the video come from? The original was alleged to have been destroyed and his USB stash confiscated. He must have had it backed up somewhere though if that's the case.
 
@Miss_Paula

Thanks for your analysis of MT. I agree entirely with your "MT is cut from a different cloth. For me he is a petty criminal loser."

He just comes across as an opportunist, a waster, someone with no credibility whatsoever.
 
Why the two friends call MT to ask what to do with the CB's videos and stuff? Are they CB's friends or just MT's? Could MT steal his best friend's stash? He had a good alibi and knew where the things were. I think the house is a big mess because they pretend it's a normal burglary.
 
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Lyndaloo said:
Paula, If I’m remembering correctly I read in one your posts that CB was charged with extortion alongside the rape of the 72 year old. Do you have any more info on this? Was their much in the media after he was convicted giving further details?
Click to expand...

Yes, I did.

I referred to a decision of the Federal Supreme Court dated April 21, 2020:

The 6th Criminal Senate of the Federal Supreme Court is to decide on the defendant's appeal against a judgement of the Regional Court in Braunschweig on 16 December2019.The Regional Court found the defendant guilty of aggravated rape in a crime unit with predatory extortion committed in Portugal in 2005. According to the judgement, on September 2, 2005, at about 10:30 p.m. in Praia da Luz (Portugal), he entered the house of a 72-year-old American woman in a mask and armed with a scimitar, tied her up and gagged her, beat her for about 15 minutes with a flexible metal object on her chest, lower abdomen, arms and buttocks, raped her vaginally and finally forced her to hand over cash.


The "predatory extortion" is part of the crime of 2005 and part of the judgement.
 
Miss_Paula said:
I thought about CB, MM and the darknet again.

We are talking about the year 2006/2007, during which time CB and MT served an eight month prison sentence in Portugal. After their release from prison their ways separated. MT set off for Spain; CB continued to stray through South Portugal.

A few weeks after MM's disappearance - at the end of May or beginning of June - CB is said to have appeared in Spain with a large mobile home at MT's former place of residence. This information is based on statements by MT.

After that they seem to have had no further contact worth mentioning.


MT is the one who claimed that CB had spent a lot of time in darkweb. So this would have to have been at the beginning of 2006 or during the short visit to Spain in 2007. In prison the two of them will hardly have been online all the time.

What content did darknet have to offer in those years? Sure, it's been around a lot longer than that, and from around 2005 onward, there were more and more normal middle-class people who used Tor to access the Internet to escape government surveillance and data storage. But did darknet at that time already offer easy to reach platforms where people could exchange ideas about the abuse of small children? Quasi an everyday communication and file sharing?

I'm sceptical about this, but would be happy if someone here in the forum knows more and can enlighten me.

Certain is that the instant messaging service "Telegram", which is used by dubious circles for their communication in "secret chats", has only existed since 2013.

So I think it will be difficult to find anything about MM on the websites and in the chats of pedophiles. At best, CB might have put the stuff on the net later - in the 2010s. But these are vague hypotheses.

What makes my assumption - CB does not exchange his pictures and films - is the statement of the profiler Mark Hoffmann. Recently he explained the behaviour of some sex offenders (with reference to CB) on German television as follows: There are offenders who film their deeds exclusively for themselves and not to share these images with others. This kind of sexual obsession is also not based on obtaining satisfaction during the act. It is only when they watch the filmed action later that they get the sexual satisfaction they long for.

I conclude from this, especially in view of the rape of the 72-year-old woman, during which the camera was also constantly running, that CB belongs to exactly this group. This would mean that he sees the footage as a "holy prey, a trophy" which he would never give away.

A quick word about MT. Who is this guy? He's being referred to in the media as a hippie. In 2007 the time of the hippies was long gone, a few so-called old hippies were still hanging around here and there. But MT does not belong to this age group, he is too young for that. And besides, these old hippies may smoke pot here and there, but they are not criminals per se.

MT is cut from a different cloth. For me he is a petty criminal loser. And to such a lame duck suddenly - by the time the world has its eyes on CB and MM - the English tabloid press comes and pulls him by his few remaining dreadlocks from the Corona swamp of isolation.

This was the opportunity to stand at the front line, grinning with a fat headline and colour photo from the newspaper pages. Probably at that moment his imagination took him on a roller coaster and his memory became more and more colourful.

My personal conclusion: The witness is quite unreliable.

Everything you can believe him: He and CB stole diesel fuel together. He and CB were in jail together. CB came to him in May or June 2007 for a few days in Spain with his big camper.

What I doubt about his statements to the press: He brought darknet into play because the headlines of those days about the German paedo ring had inspired him to do so. Sell girls to Morocco? This was also in the press reports about CB and MM before MT was mentioned.

I think he has good stuff to smoke. With it he should become happy and spread his colourful stories within his close friends.
Click to expand...

I share the same theory as you.
From what we have read, regarding possible psychopathy, ASPD, paraphilia and all of his past attacks on women and children, suggests a morally indiscriminate pattern of behavior, in which he has acted alone.
His victims seem to be chosen due to vulnerability and opportunity.
This is why I believe he took MM for himself and that she was indeed, as the stats and LE suggest, sadly killed shortly after, due to a sexually motivated abduction.
Who knows, I could be wrong, CB could have really broken the mold, this is my opinion from what information we have so far, as nothing else yet has persuaded me to change my mind.
He left soon after, for Germany, to start a 'new life' as this was his usual MO after he had committed a more serious crime (run away) a definite pattern of behavior has emerged as we have seen CB trying to 'escape' LE, on many occasions, in the past.
Hopefully, if he is the perpetrator, his time is up!


JMO.
 
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tedtink said:
"I wouldn’t be surprised if Prison transporter was empty & was just used as a tactic"

Good point!
Subtly piling on the pressure imo.
Click to expand...

Whatsoever is behind Hannover searches it had a relieving effect on CB who filed his appeal again right next day and he had waived it days before. That tells us he expected police to be in the right path and learned they aren't :(
 
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Miss_Paula said:
Yes, I did.

I referred to a decision of the Federal Supreme Court dated April 21, 2020:

The 6th Criminal Senate of the Federal Supreme Court is to decide on the defendant's appeal against a judgement of the Regional Court in Braunschweig on 16 December2019.The Regional Court found the defendant guilty of aggravated rape in a crime unit with predatory extortion committed in Portugal in 2005. According to the judgement, on September 2, 2005, at about 10:30 p.m. in Praia da Luz (Portugal), he entered the house of a 72-year-old American woman in a mask and armed with a scimitar, tied her up and gagged her, beat her for about 15 minutes with a flexible metal object on her chest, lower abdomen, arms and buttocks, raped her vaginally and finally forced her to hand over cash.


The "predatory extortion" is part of the crime of 2005 and part of the judgement.
Click to expand...

Predatory Extortion? I wonder if this is referring to CB robbing her of cash & MacBook, or could it be something else?
 
MENDEL said:
Whatsoever is behind Hannover searches it had a relieving effect on CB who filed his appeal again right next day and he had waived it days before. That tells us he expected police to be in the right path and learned they aren't :(
Click to expand...

If he is the perp, I imagine he will be very fearful now, solitary confinement, possible BKA tactical pressure, no access to his "obsession", we know he can get angry under pressure.
Let's hope the 'mask' he wears for FF slips!
jmo
 
MENDEL said:
Whatsoever is behind Hannover searches it had a relieving effect on CB who filed his appeal again right next day and he had waived it days before. That tells us he expected police to be in the right path and learned they aren't :(
Click to expand...

Yes, I commented on that when it happened, thought it 'interesting' at the time.

It did have a whiff of 'the jig might be up here' fear and then, when apparently nothing of substance was found, a bullish return to 'you've got nothing on me'.
 
MENDEL said:
Whatsoever is behind Hannover searches it had a relieving effect on CB who filed his appeal again right next day and he had waived it days before. That tells us he expected police to be in the right path and learned they aren't :(
Click to expand...


Exactly.
Nobody knows what LE have found though.
Did CB expect something to be found I wonder?
But still LE stay quiet :cool:
 
Betty_Boop88 said:
BBC reporting it as “his appeal is invalid”. Probably where UK media is getting mixed up. The appeal is invalid, not the charge.

Christian B: Madeleine McCann suspect's rape appeal 'likely invalid' — BBC News

Didn’t get reading the original Telegraph piece on it, but they edited it at 13.53 and it now reflects what the BBC are saying.

https://www-telegraph-co-uk.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/08/06/madeleine-mccann-suspect-extradited-germany-without-proper-permission/amp/?usqp=mq331AQFKAGwASA=&amp_js_v=0.1#aoh=15967106732044&referrer=https://www.google.com&amp_tf=From %1$s&ampshare=https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/08/06/madeleine-mccann-suspect-extradited-germany-without-proper-permission/

ETA - I notice they haven’t edited the hyperlink, though :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Unfortunately this is the kind of poor coverage one can expect
 
mrjitty said:
Unfortunately this is the kind of poor coverage one can expect
Click to expand...


We’re in agreement, for a change, @mrjitty ;)
While instant access to news is a great concept, unfortunately it means there’s more importance placed on getting a story out there “first” for clicks, rather than taking the time to report correctly. As we’ve repeatedly seen on this forum with MSM and with the Telegraph today, the attitude seems to be “just get it out there, it can always be edited later”. No formal retractions necessary :rolleyes:
 
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