Madeleine McCann: German prisoner identified as suspect - #18

[SuperdadV8]

That's The Sun talking. She thought about that years after MM disappeared, so you can't be sure which day the girl is talking about unless she gives quite conclusive clues. So, the only evidence so far is a logged call from a mobile we aren't sure if it belonged to CB and was in his hand. If she could prove BARD she heard that on May 2, 2007 you had a strong clue against CB, but I'm afraid she can't.

Yes, that really seems to be a problem.

According to other older reports, HCW used the phrase "eventually abused her" and than killed her. So it seems doubtful, if there really exists video evidence of abuse. HCW never spoke about possible abuse later IMO.

Other reports described CB as getting very upset and agressive, when he has been discovered by others of doing something "forbidden" (pics of children, secret other girlfriends, e.g.).

So there may be the possibility also, that MM woke up at the burglary, cried and the suspect killed her already in the apartment (maybe accidental) and took away her body, to get "rid" of the evidence, that she died. Has something else missing from apartment 5A been reported? Has there been any theft? Does somebody know that for sure, maybe from the PJ Files?

If THAT could be part of any confession to other people, pinning him as a professional burglar to OC at the time she vanished, should be THE missing cruicial evidence, due to the lack of forensics, right!

 

[MENDEL]

How do you know that she can't? Given how masive the story was at the time, I'd have thought it may well stick in her mind that it was the day before when she last saw CB. To give that date in the first place she must have had some trigger to recall when it happened. We only have second hand information from an apparent friend, we don’t really know what happened altogether or what she told police.

It was said that the conversation happened over dinner so its even possible she might well have used a debit card to pay in a restaraunt that night for example and there would then be proof of the date with the bank. There could be any number of things that prove the date it happened for all we know, I don't know on what basis you can state she can't prove it happened on the 2nd?

On another point, the phone number was discovered during the course of interviewing CB's associates about MM and they found it was a number he was known to have used in 2007. So the link to the number isn't as tenuous as you make out. For the Prosecutor, it's more a case of proving BARD that he had possesion of the phone on that particular night.

Can you tell me what you did on May 2, 2007?

Where did you read they had a dinner at a restaurant?

I never classified the number as that tenuous, simply not that strong (it's based on testimony by a former OC employee).

 

[MENDEL]

Yes, that really seems to be a problem.

According to other older reports, HCW used the phrase "eventually abused her" and than killed her. So it seems doubtful, if there really exists video evidence of abuse. HCW never spoke about possible abuse later IMO.

Other reports described CB as getting very upset and agressive, when he has been discovered by others of doing something "forbidden" (pics of children, secret other girlfriends, e.g.).

So there may be the possibility also, that MM woke up at the burglary, cried and the suspect killed her already in the apartment (maybe accidental) and took away her body, to get "rid" of the evidence, that she died. Has something else missing from apartment 5A been reported? Has there been any theft? Does somebody know that for sure, maybe from the PJ Files?

If THAT could be part of any confession to other people, pinning him as a professional burglar to OC at the time she vanished, should be THE missing cruicial evidence, due to the lack of forensics, right!

Super, I updated my post. Nothing material was removed from 5A. The only thing removed, but not by CB BARD, is widely known and it's not worthwhile mention here.

 

[redplanet]

FF stated:

"Just because someone is a pedophile, he doesn't kill children."

Could be a general applicable opinion, or part of a admission from the client to his solicitor.

HCW stated:
"In my personal opinion, she died in Portugal."

There should be some footage. The metadata of that footage may include a time stamp, that leads to a time, when the suspect was in portugal. Or very soon after the abduction. Maybe just hours. The statement indicates, that the abductor wasn't heading to another country after the abduction instantly.

Or the footage itself can be linked to some place in portugal.

Interesting analysis.
However, to deduce that such a video/photo was made in Portugal, based only on its metadata timestamp, would require that timestamp to be before about 23:00 on 3 May IMO.

 

[MENDEL]

Interesting analysis.
However, to deduce that a video/photo was made in Portugal, based only on its metadata timestamp, would require that timestamp to be before about 23:00 on 3 May IMO.

Herr Wolter was cautious to tell it is his personal opinion she died in Portugal. So you can exclude any forensic evidence.

"In my opinion she died in Portugal"

 

[tedtink]

Great point, Red.

Unfortunately I guess it will be hard to check medical records from his area in the Algarve after 13 years.

But maybe some witness from the time may remind that.

The bandage may have just been a 'prop'.

 

[redplanet]

By examining the background features in a video/photo, is it possible find definitely the country it was made in, without also finding the exact address it was made at?

 

[MENDEL]

By examining the background features in a video/photo, is it possible find definitely the country it was made in, without also finding the exact address it was made at?

I guess you can, but that will not be strong evidence most of the time. If you see a Chinese background you can guess that's China, but it can be Chinatown.

 

[Betty_Boop88]

By examining the background features in a video/photo, is it possible find definitely the country it was made in, without also finding the exact address it was made at?

I guess you can, but that will not be strong evidence most of the time. If you see a Chinese background you can guess that's China, but it can be Chinatown.

As Photographer4 educated us all previously, it’s possible to extract the location a photo was taken from the exif data. It’ll give you the coordinates. It’s also possible to tell what kind of camera the photo was taken on. I wonder if those that “destroyed” his camera were able to tell LE what kind it was, and if that matches with any media of MM that may or may not exist.

 

[redplanet]

Yes, that really seems to be a problem.

According to other older reports, HCW used the phrase "eventually abused her" and than killed her. So it seems doubtful, if there really exists video evidence of abuse. HCW never spoke about possible abuse later IMO.

Other reports described CB as getting very upset and agressive, when he has been discovered by others of doing something "forbidden" (pics of children, secret other girlfriends, e.g.).

So there may be the possibility also, that MM woke up at the burglary, cried and the suspect killed her already in the apartment (maybe accidental) and took away her body, to get "rid" of the evidence, that she died. Has something else missing from apartment 5A been reported? Has there been any theft? Does somebody know that for sure, maybe from the PJ Files?

If THAT could be part of any confession to other people, pinning him as a professional burglar to OC at the time she vanished, should be THE missing cruicial evidence, due to the lack of forensics, right!

Yes that is an interesting possibility to be considered SuperdadV8: ".... already in the apartment (maybe accidental)...."
Missing was one child and her pyjamas (2 pieces), nothing else IMO.

 

[Dlk79]

Can you tell me what you did on May 2, 2007?

Where did you read they had a dinner at a restaurant?

I never classified the number as that tenuous, simply not that strong.

If I had happened to have been living in the Algarve at the time and my partner told me they had a horrible job to do in PDL the following day, before disappearing, and then the following day a little girl went missing from there, I'd like to think that would probably stick in my mind.

Besides, like I said, we don't know how she recalls the date or when she first recounted that conversation they had to someone. Perhaps she keeps a diary she wrote about it in. Maybe there's an email or letter arranging the dinner. My point was, you can't say she cannot prove it since you have nothing to base that statement on other than your belief she wouldn't be able to accurately recollect dates that far back. It is your opinion only, which is fine but you are stating it as a fact.

It mentions here the conversation was over dinner.

Madeleine McCann suspect had 'horrible job to do' night before she vanished

It doesn't say where it took place, I was just making the point that if it was at a restaraunt, there may be proof of the date via payment. It was just an example of how there might be proof of when it took place

Again, why is it "not that strong" then? We don't know how much police know about the number or how strong the link is, but it's clear they can definitely tie it to him. HCW said as much, his concern was that CB could try and say that on the night in question his girlfriend had the phone or something along those lines rather than CB disputing it was his number.

 

[C.greek]

Yes, that really seems to be a problem.

According to other older reports, HCW used the phrase "eventually abused her" and than killed her. So it seems doubtful, if there really exists video evidence of abuse. HCW never spoke about possible abuse later IMO.

Other reports described CB as getting very upset and agressive, when he has been discovered by others of doing something "forbidden" (pics of children, secret other girlfriends, e.g.).

So there may be the possibility also, that MM woke up at the burglary, cried and the suspect killed her already in the apartment (maybe accidental) and took away her body, to get "rid" of the evidence, that she died. Has something else missing from apartment 5A been reported? Has there been any theft? Does somebody know that for sure, maybe from the PJ Files?

If THAT could be part of any confession to other people, pinning him as a professional burglar to OC at the time she vanished, should be THE missing cruicial evidence, due to the lack of forensics, right!

The adverb 'Eventually' used in the phrase by HCW most probably refers to time, ie as a temporal adverb. Ie first he abducted Mm, then (after some time passed, in the end, eventually... )

 

[MENDEL]

If I had happened to have been living in the Algarve at the time and my partner told me they had a horrible job to do in PDL the following day, before disappearing, and then the following day a little girl went missing from there, I'd like to think that would probably stick in my mind.

Besides, like I said, we don't know how she recalls the date or when she first recounted that conversation they had to someone. Perhaps she keeps a diary she wrote about it in. Maybe there's an email or letter arranging the dinner. My point was, you can't say she cannot prove it since you have nothing to base that statement on other than your belief she wouldn't be able to accurately recollect dates that far back. It is your opinion only, which is fine but you are stating it as a fact.

It mentions here the conversation was over dinner.

Madeleine McCann suspect had 'horrible job to do' night before she vanished

It doesn't say where it took place, I was just making the point that if it was at a restaraunt, there may be proof of the date via payment. It was just an example of how there might be proof of when it took place

Again, why is it "not that strong" then? We don't know how much police know about the number or how strong the link is, but it's clear they can definitely tie it to him. HCW said as much, his concern was that CB could try and say that on the night in question his girlfriend had the phone or something along those lines rather than CB disputing it was his number.

DLK, all I can tell is that I'm talking about factual things and you're talking about remote hypothesis. No one told where they they dined, so it could have been in a restaurant, so there could be a card payment, so... Not worth continuing to me.

 

[MENDEL]

The adverb 'Eventually' used in the phrase by HCW most probably refers to time, ie as a temporal adverb. Ie first he abducted Mm, then (after some time passed, in the end, eventually... )

Correct. "Eventually" can be tricky to translate. It means something like "in time it will happen". So, "eventually abused her" means "in time he abused her", so it happened indeed. Native speakers please correct this if needed.

 

[C.greek]

"Eventually" can be tricky to translate. It means something like "in time it will happen". So, "eventually abused her" means in time he abused her. Native speakers please correct this if needed.

What was the original word used ? Was it in german?

 

[MENDEL]

What was the original word used ? Was it in german?

If it was said by Herr Wolters, probably it was in German. Otherwise I hope he was using that word properly.

 

[redplanet]

I guess you can, but that will not be strong evidence most of the time. If you see a Chinese background you can guess that's China, but it can be Chinatown.

Agreed. What I am trying to work out is how HCW formed his opinion that death was in Portugal. I wonder does he he have a video or photo which background features prove it's in Portugal? And if so, will he release those snippets of image background via Interpol so that bellingcat-type sleuths can try to identify the address?

 

[C.greek]

If it was said by Herr Wolters, probably it was in German. Otherwise I hope he was using that word properly.

I think this is quite significant. As if used correctly it could be a good indication (to us) that they have video/photos .

 

[MENDEL]

Agreed. What I am trying to work out is how HCW formed his opinion that death was in Portugal. I wonder does he he have a video or photo which background features prove it's in Portugal? And if so, will he release those snippets of image background via Interpol so that bellingcat-type sleuths can try to identify the address?

IMHO, once he said "In my opinion", I think there's no concrete evidence it happened in Portugal, otherwise that wouldn't be his opinion, but a fact accepted by LE. He couldn't claim that was his opinion then.

 

[MENDEL]

I think this is quite significant. As if used correctly it could be a good indication (to us) that they have video/photos .

Yes, it it. But there have been very big problems with translations between German and English. That's incredible. Perhaps they're using Google Translator too much.