Malaysia airlines plane may have crashed 239 people on board #18

[Intermezzo]

4 MINS AGO
TWITTER

Newley Purnell@newley
Malaysia is examining airport security & people on #MH370, @jmwatts_ & @ByJasonNg report: http://t.co/OyUi0E6bTX http://t.co/tvkneuXr1u


HUH?? Wasn't this done already?

Yes, i think it was done already
I did read that they are going to RE-examine everything again..
I don't think that is out of the ordinary in an investigation..sometimes you have to go back to the beginning and look again

 

[time]

Malaysian investigators have focused their attention on passengers and crew with the experience to have cut off the plane's communications with air traffic control and steered it off course. The plane's pilots, Capt. Zaharie Ahmad Shah and co-pilot Fariq Abdul Hamid, have been subject to most scrutiny, but investigators haven't turned up anything suspicious relating to either man.

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304157204579470852435044352?mod=WSJ_hp_LEFTTopStories&mg=reno64-wsj&url=http%3A%2F%2Fonline.wsj.com%2Farticle%2FSB10001424052702304157204579470852435044352.html%3Fmod%3DWSJ_hp_LEFTTopStories

bbm I think it seems to the people in the know that someone/s did this intentionally. jmo

I think that's good, but every time I hear this (you BBM), I wonder if they (other countries and Malaysia) really checked every passenger out in the depth necessary to answer this question in the first place. I don't think Malaysia would do an adequate job of any start over on that either. Maybe the MI6 and CIA will do that.

 

[JerseyGirl]

True, I would be upset too:

Angry relatives of Chinese passengers aboard the Malaysian plane today demanded that Malaysia must apologise for hastily concluding that the jet had crashed in the Indian Ocean, as the hunt for debris failed to yield any leads despite sighting several objects.

http://www.abplive.in/World/2014/03...gy-as-no-clue-on-debris-of-plane#.Uzg7OvldW4I

 

[JerseyGirl]

Excerpt from CNN a few moments ago:

Host: New objects seen from search plane are being called the "MOST CREDIBLE LEAD YET." Why is that?

Guest: Well, because all the other leads have turned out to be nothing.

MORE most credible, as opposed to most credible, earlier in the week described as credible????? (poking fun at CNN).

 

[Intermezzo]

Yes, but it's officially being looked at now by the MI6 and CIA doing their own investigation into airport security and people with the help of the Malaysian authorities:

The disclosure that MI6 as well as the CIA are helping the Malaysian authorities will add to speculation the aircraft was hijacked by terrorists.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/malaysi...t-confirmed-20140330-zqop8.html#ixzz2xSZFGvDV


bbm

I think that MI6 and the CIA are helping Malaysia investigate something they had little to no experience in.
And now that MI6 and the CIA are involved they must start at the beginning.

But I agree, that there will be people who will jump to the hijack, terrorist speculation.

I believe theories or speculation must be investigated, and everything is up for debate..

IMO, I don't see enough evidence to suspect one thing over the other at this point.

:twocents:

 

[Elley Mae]

I think that's good, but every time I hear this (you BBM), I wonder if they (other countries and Malaysia) really checked every passenger out in the depth necessary to answer this question in the first place. I don't think Malaysia would do an adequate job of any start over on that either. Maybe the MI6 and CIA will do that.

Absolutely, what may not be suspicious behavior to them may be suspicious to the trained eye of experts.

 

[time]

As Defence Minister, Mr Hishammuddin is also overseeing an air force investigation into why at least three military radar stations failed to detect MH370 immediately after it turned back over the Malaysian peninsula.

Malaysia has set up an international investigation panel to look at how the flight was lost.

Malaysia's government is under pressure from the opposition to launch a formal inquiry into the handling of MH370, which has led to rowdy scenes in Parliament.

http://www.smh.com.au/world/malaysi...hecks-in-wake-of-disaster-20140330-zqoou.html

BBM1 - I am not getting this. Are they the waypoint stations? I thought the claim was that the military saw the plane but didn't think it was problematic or not their concern?

BBM2 - the ridiculous claims that they will 'do it later' and just the fact that they haven't done it yet is making me upset. Mad, really. So many other countries are using their resources, time, and money - which their citizens pay for - and yet, Malaysia couldn't readjust their standards and expectations for this long.

 

[time]

Absolutely, what may not be suspicious behavior to them may be suspicious to the trained eye of experts.

Yes, and just doing a cursory check may not show up anything anyway - what kind of checking did they do on every passenger and crew. Their activities could have been hidden well enough if they are just looking for criminal records or formal education, etc.

 

[sherlyholmes]

BBM ~ What if there was a mechanical failure and ATC was too lazy to do anything about it?

And what if they are withholding evidence? What if they know more but providing false info to us all. And the big question is what could happen to Malaysia if this turned out to be something other than just a plane crash?

Sent from my HUAWEI-M931 using Tapatalk

 

[Snoods]

MORE most credible, as opposed to most credible, earlier in the week described as credible????? (poking fun at CNN).

Exactly! Since now they're calling everything MOST credible lead yet or MOST promising lead yet how much more most can it get? I thought the guest's response was MOST amusing!

 

[Elley Mae]

Yes, and just doing a cursory check may not show up anything anyway - what kind of checking did they do on every passenger and crew. Their activities could have been hidden well enough if they are just looking for criminal records or formal education, etc.

Who knows, but I keep reminding myself that they don't think checking questionable passports against a system that keeps track of reported stolen passports is what tells me that a set of new/fresh, trained eyes are needed. It may be one tiny thing that someone sees that happened between two people before the boarding of the plane, who knows. jmo idk

 

[stx722]

I think that's good, but every time I hear this (you BBM), I wonder if they (other countries and Malaysia) really checked every passenger out in the depth necessary to answer this question in the first place. I don't think Malaysia would do an adequate job of any start over on that either. Maybe the MI6 and CIA will do that.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/86070e2c-b755-11e3-bf30-00144feabdc0.html#axzz2xSilT3Gf

I think this article speaks to some of the real issues at hand, regardless of whether it is later found that terrorism/hijacking was the cause of this. One of the root issues is that many countries besides Malaysia are lax in checking incoming and outgoing passengers.

Quote from article: Interpol questioned at the time why “only a handful of countries” made use of the Interpol database to check whether people boarding international flights were using stolen passports.

 

[Momoffourboys]

Malaysian investigators have focused their attention on passengers and crew with the experience to have cut off the plane's communications with air traffic control and steered it off course. The plane's pilots, Capt. Zaharie Ahmad Shah and co-pilot Fariq Abdul Hamid, have been subject to most scrutiny, but investigators haven't turned up anything suspicious relating to either man.

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles...70852435044352.html?mod=WSJ_hp_LEFTTopStories

bbm I think it seems to the people in the know that someone/s did this intentionally. jmo

I agree with you 100+%!
We just don't know who.

 

[Elley Mae]

I still entertain the possibility that this could have been done remotely. You know like a drone can be remotely controlled.

 

[CARIIS]

4 MINS AGO

TWITTER
Newly Purnell@newley
Malaysia is examining airport security & people on #MH370, @watts_ & @ByJasonNg report: http://t.co/OyUi0E6bTX http://t.co/tvkneuXr1u
HUH?? Wasn't this done already? [/quote]

AH HA ! just heard first mention CNN about a cabin crew!! 21 days later !


IMO, no

. The notion that 239 folks can be truly investigated in 3 days from many countries is not realistic

The notion that the passport kids had an alibi for their passports is classic. We learned that in months after 9-11 the 19 folks had elaborate covers for years. If they were coming out of Disney Land - well.... The claim that mom ratted out one of her children never made any sense to me. Better to say that he was seeking asylum than packing dynamite in his shoes!!

China forging the passenger manifest --what is that about?


The mention of 20 top engineers working in the aviation field on chips to make aircraft hard to track on radar is ... well...In all the little bios, that have come out about the victims, not one has been something like Joe worked for Free Scale for 21 years, was on his way to China for X, married, with 2 kids and a picture of the happy family. Not one Free Scale victim has been profiled. Anyone heard of any PR from Free Scale grieving profoundly, to the media, as a result of the tragic loss of 20 of their senior staff?


I can understand if they were General Mills Fruit Loop pros it might not e given any meaningful exploration it reeks of folks being told the classic in the interest of world security blab. For weeks the angle was Free Scale produced some microchips for some apple phones, banana phones! Pear phones (!) whatever. The reality is Free Scale main income stream is from highly evolved next generation chips for aviation, ATC, flight data management improvements etc.
I think MAl anticipated it would be a two day story and go away. The slow disclosures over time seem to indicate that they kept hoping the story would fade. IF they were making mistakes about departure time, captain training or something fine


To claim that no military radar realized a jetliner (after 9-11) was flying over their entire county , and then admitting days later that the plane was on military radar through its entire visit isn’t a mistake - it’s a mistruth

.
If there initial proclamations about having security holes are instantly discounted because they were tracking it on milt radar.



Lithium batteries do look like some toot fruitiest! The fact that they are a class 9 certified carriers make the toot fruity nonsense even more concerning
Totally noninvolved in MAL 370 - it is in their interest to keep their money making classification for dangerous goods would seem to indicate that if their motivations were pure they would have intense documentation on what is in the cargo hold. the refusal to release the manifest is incongruent to an airline trying to make sure its level 9 cert was not in danger of being revoked would be here is our manifest - dangerous goods is big bucks!
The hypersentivity by both media and public regarding the pilots locked in the cockpit to be the starting point is akin to have issues in a murder to look at spouse family first. Those folks are moved on from when there are clear rule outs regarding involvement. The pilot with his computer save would know that his SIM would be seized, the conclusion that he had not been overwriting stuff for MONTHS is more indicative of a non-sophisticated tech geek!


Tad bits of marital discord now starting are related to culture more than concluding that there is no truth in that angle unraveling. Unlike us MAL has more sentsitity to grieving, and it would be congruent for them to hold back - just like they did before taking his SIM out of his house. Here, his Sims would be having been removed within 18 hours!! Culture not neck new made up stories.

This is the first accident I have ever heard of, wherein 36 hours detailed information would be all over the media about the cabin crews operating the segment. Years of service, how many segments flown, any write ups related to performance of duties = nothing. Anyone know how many cabin crew were even on the plane? Within 4 days dozens of flight crew friends, families, colleagues, employee records would be in the NTSB offices with a team going only over them/

The insistence that, from many countries, forever, the satellite images are the best super powers can do. All they would have to have said, all along is that due to the sensitive nature of capabilities all released satellite photos do not indicate the accuracy of out satellites. To all of us lay people, security experts do not have super eyes. There is no one that can make out anything from the silliness that has been released! Of Google earth can do what it can – it defies credibility that 500 million dollar satellites don’t have better resolution. We have telescopes looking at Pluto- come on!

The breaking mental health stressor angle is interesting and IMO, the most likely after the Free Scale. The hesitation to just dive the plane right after takeoff could be more explained by cultural, (Egyptian air suicide different culture – a culture that does not look at suicide in the same manner and has more martyr belief systems) or a family man wanting to have his family get money by not being able to prove it was suicide. People kill themselves in a variety of ways all the time. He certainly was angry with his current got – an easily discovered suicide does not have any of the implications and problems MAL is currently expediting as a result of thus far, not being able to conclusively prove suicide.

How the media convinced many that a je loaded with jet fuel can cruise across two countries ablaze for hours - without flat out exploding (TWA/ Value Jet/ Swiss Air / Air Canada/Fed Ex just to name a few, that most certainly did not fly about half the world!!--is just common sense impossibility.

I have wondered if the sudden announcment that there were no survivors might have been a desperate effort to make the story go away??

 

[Intermezzo]

Absolutely, what may not be suspicious behavior to them may be suspicious to the trained eye of experts.

true.

 

[time]

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/86070e2c-b755-11e3-bf30-00144feabdc0.html#axzz2xSilT3Gf

I think this article speaks to some of the real issues at hand, regardless of whether it is later found that terrorism/hijacking was the cause of this. One of the root issues is that many countries besides Malaysia are lax in checking incoming and outgoing passengers.

Quote from article: Interpol questioned at the time why “only a handful of countries” made use of the Interpol database to check whether people boarding international flights were using stolen passports.

I think it's astonishing that we now know this - I mean the public. I had no idea it was so easy to fly around many places on a stolen passport. I would suspect the two Iranians were the most thoroughly checked out of anyone on that place.

What bothers me about Malaysia Airlines (and who knows about other countries/airlines) is that 1.) they just spend whopping amounts of money on new planes and such but couldn't pay the extra $10 per flight to have more info transmitted nor use the Interpol database (or whatever other security measures at the airport), and, 2.) their military is claiming they couldn't coordinate an off path sighting or whatever with the airline and immediately report it - any off path plane is of concern because of a potential highjacking or emergency situation.

 

[Boodles]

This statement says more than the words it contains. I thought early on that the initial search sounded odd to have constant reversals of statements, radar, witnesses, like a red herring search to give Malaysia Airlines (Govt.) time to gather the real wreckage that remained on the surface, in reality, not wanting it to ever be found. Not asking other countries for help..

If you were a corrupt Govt. And Owned an airline that failed to follow Aircraft Airworthiness Directives that killed hundreds, and it could only be proven by investigation of the wreckage, eye witnesses and nobody was alive to tell what happened....would You want it ever found?

This is why the families are so angry and distrustful. It looks like...they know.

http://blogs.crikey.com.au/planetal...es-ceo-unsure-if-vital-repairs-done-to-mh370/

The air worthiness directive did not apply to the MH370 aircraft. That said, I still believe that Malaysia is derailing the search by holding back pertinent info.

 

[nomoresorrow]

I'd like to know which passengers were in first class. According to the link (below), we can at least eliminate the delegation of the 34 Chinese artists as groups over 9 cannot reserve first class seats.
http://www.malaysiaairlines.com/content/dam/mas/master/en/pdf/mh-experience/Boeing777_200_lo.pdf

 

[Isabelle]

So the orange object was determined to be a jelly fish? This is going to be a long and tedious search.

http://www.fox19.com/story/25110448/malaysia-suspicious-orange-object-idd-as-jellyfish

Wish we could see a pic. It must have been pretty big.