Malaysia airlines plane may have crashed 239 people on board #22

[SilkySifaka]

Is there something that could make the pilot lose all communication abilities but still keep the plane flying? I've never heard of that before. I guess being locked out of the cockpit?

Yes, fire in the communications bus in the hatch under the floor would cause all comms to go out yet could be put out by fire extinguishers from the cockpit. The plane would then be fine but unable to reach anyone.

Doesn't explain why he wouldn't return to a KL setting for an emergency landing though if all else was ok

 

[SeekingJana]

I keep thinking about the US military base on Diego Garcia. IF the crew was able to guide the plane normally, the island seems to be a good place to land, landing gear or not.
There is a theory on a news site today ( U.K. Daily Mail, which has a new theory up every day) which states there was a mid-air hijacking for ransom. Political reasons- release of some prisoner or prisoners. Says that pilots were ordered to fly as they did.
I don't buy it, personally, because the hijackers would be killed if ransom demands not met, and when it comes down to it, no one other than the most deluded and criminal jihadists want to die in an airplane crash, and I hope their weapons would keep them from boarding any flight in 2014.

I think some of the theories and speculation about this flight are overlooking the fact that even if one pilot was somehow deranged/ suicidal AND homicidal ( which is a whole other psychological process than suicidal ideation), the other pilot wasn't.
I believe the rational co-pilot could have gotten some sort of distress signal out if there was a problem with the pilot. The question is IF there was a receiving transponder in the area to pick it up...

I still believe there was a series of catastrophic failures to the airplane which could not be avoided nor controlled and which killed all aboard. Likely the ascent to 45,000 ft. or above was the fatal event.
Also, if the pilots had O2 long enough, they could have been hypoxic still, and set the plane to fly on autopilot on the course it took. IDK. The flight path which is said to be taken is totally bizarre even in Malaysia.

I can't find any reason for the extremely low altitude dip from an abnormally and dangerously high altitude unless the person or people at the controls truly were not rationally thinking due to high CO2 levels and low O2 levels. The brain does strange things when deprived of oxygen.

 

[Hatfield]

I keep thinking about the US military base on Diego Garcia. IF the crew was able to guide the plane normally, the island seems to be a good place to land, landing gear or not.


Who are the "they" you refer to? The Malaysian pilots or a hijacker or hijackers? I'm not clear on who " they" are in your post.

There is a theory on a news site today ( U.K. Daily Mail, which has a new theory up every day) which states there was a mid-air hijacking for ransom. Political reasons- release of some prisoner or prisoners. Says that pilots were ordered to fly as they did.

I don't buy it, personally, because the hijackers would be killed if ransom demands not met, and when it comes down to it, no one other than the most deluded and criminal jihadists want to die in an airplane crash, and I hope their weapons would keep them from boarding any flight in 2014.

I think some of the theories and speculation about this flight are overlooking the fact that even if one pilot was somehow deranged and suicidal AND homicidal ( which is a whole other psychological process than suicidal ideation), the other pilot wasn't.
I believe the rational co-pilot could have gotten some sort of distress signal out if there was a problem with the pilot. The question is IF there was a receiving transponder in the area to pick it up...

I still believe there was a series of catastrophic failures to the airplane which could not be avoided nor controlled and which killed all aboard. Likely the ascent to 45,000 ft. or above was the fatal event.

"They" are whoever was operating the plane. It could be either hijackers, one of the pilots, both of the pilots, etc. Until the search crews find that plane, it will keep us all guessing who had control of that plane and why it ended up wherever they find it.

 

[SeekingJana]

"They" are whoever was operating the plane. It could be either hijackers, one of the pilots, both of the pilots, etc. Until the search crews find that plane, it will keep us all guessing who had control of that plane and why it ended up wherever they find it.

LOL, I figured that out and had edited my post already. Sorry for our small mis-communication. I think it's possible that no one was flying the plane for most of its doomed flight.

 

[cady]

NO, it's IMO an unsubstantiated claim

re "mistress" ok, media has the "sex" element, but still no drugs or rock n' roll! JMO

 

[Hatfield]

LOL, I figured that out and had edited my post already. Sorry for our small mis-communication. I think it's possible that no one was flying the plane for most of its doomed flight.

It really does seem like nobody was at the controls towards the end. Because I cant imagine that with all those hours in the air that the passengers could not have broken down that door if they knew they were on a doomed flight.

Something is really strange about it. The hypoxia theory of them all being unconcious does have some possibility to it.

 

[Tiepos]

They need to check every passenger's cell phone carriers for the same type of "reconnect" signal if their service provider picked up a "roaming" reconnect to whatever towers would be in the alleged flight path when they were at the supposedly lower altitude. This may not provide a whole lot of information BUT it could help confirm the plane's exact location at a specific point in time. They would know what tower it was pinging off of.

…

I Agree!!

They knew the exact location of the plane at that moment already, yes? It was before the plane disappeared from radar.

 

[aa9511]

Playing Devil's Advocate

I only agree with the part that he or someone else was alive to turn the cellphone on

There is no confirmation that a call was made...the report is coming from "sources"

The co-pilots cellphone connected with a tower, it re-established or re-attached to the network...


http://www.nst.com.my/nation/general/call-traced-to-co-pilot-s-phone-1.562612

A different set of sources close to the investigations told the NST that checks on Fariq's phone showed that connection to the phone had been "detached" before the plane took off.

"This is usually the result of the phone being switched off.

At one point, however, when the airplane was airborne, between waypoint Igari and the spot near Penang (just before it went missing from radar), the line was 'reattached'.

"A 'reattachment' does not necessarily mean that a call was made. It can also be the result of the phone being switched on again," the sources said.


:twocents:

Yes, I don't trust nor believe Malaysia officials or whoever these "sources" are, so I'm discounting all of this latest cell phone stuff for now.

Just like the "all right, good night."

Just like, yes it's CONFIRMED co-pilot's voice.

Just like, plane flying at 45,000 or 12,000, or 5,000 or 4,000 or whatever.

Just like, all passengers have been checked and are clear.

Just like, we are not aware of any left turn.

Etc., etc..

All mumbo jumbo given out by Malaysian offical "sources." IMO.

 

[cady]

It really does seem like nobody was at the controls towards the end. Because I cant imagine that with all those hours in the air that the passengers could not have broken down that door if they knew they were on a doomed flight.

Something is really strange about it. The hypoxia theory of them all being unconcious does have some possibility to it.

Unless everyone EXCEPT the person operating the plane was behind the locked cockpit. The person in the cockpit could have wiped everyone out in a very short period of time (hypoxia) and still survived with an oxygen mask in the cockpit (which reportedly has greater capacity and is not connected to the passenger mask source) ( Way back in early threads I read that). I think that only one person was alive for the full flight, and in control, and didn't necessarily run out of fuel, but planned for and tried a "Sully" landing in the middle of the "big drink" so that little or NO debris field would be found and the plane would settle to the bottom of the ocean without a trace. Mission sort of accomplished, but for Inmarsat pings. We shall see. JMO JMO

 

[vulture]

If it means possibly preventing a terrorist from getting into a country to do nefarious deeds, I want the officals to be fashion police or whatever is needed of them. I just want them to actually think rather than just putting a stamp on.

Here is a thought. To westerners the difference between an Italian name and an Irish name or a Spanish name or a French name seems pretty obvious. (Just to name some examples). Would an Asian person distinguish between them or just think of them all as European? I know with a lot of Asian names I have no clue which are male and which are female without being told. And I know that's the same for some Asian people if they don't know I'm female if they send me an email or something. Would I be able to tell the difference between someone's name if they were from Indonesia vs. India? China vs. Korea (I think sometimes, maybe not all the time)? Malaysia vs. Sri Lanka? One part of Africa vs. another? I kind of know what a Polynesian name sounds like but would I be able to tell Kiribati from Samoa? Maori vs. Fiji? I don't think I could.

 

[Momoffourboys]

Unless everyone EXCEPT the person operating the plane was behind the locked cockpit. The person in the cockpit could have wiped everyone out in a very short period of time (hypoxia) and still survived with an oxygen mask in the cockpit (which reportedly has greater capacity and is not connected to the passenger mask source) ( Way back in early threads I read that). I think that only one person was alive for the full flight, and in control, and didn't necessarily run out of fuel, but planned for and tried a "Sully" landing in the middle of the "big drink" so that little or NO debris field would be found and the plane would settle to the bottom of the ocean without a trace. Mission sort of accomplished, but for Inmarsat pings. We shall see. JMO JMO

Yup. I totally agree with everything.
If there was only one person in the cockpit, he/she had the supply for both the pilot and co-pilot.

 

[aa9511]

Yes, I don't trust nor believe Malaysia officials or whoever these "sources" are, so I'm discounting all of this latest cell phone stuff for now.

Just like the "all right, good night."

Just like, yes it's CONFIRMED co-pilot's voice.

Just like, plane flying at 45,000 or 12,000, or 5,000 or 4,000 or whatever.

Just like, all passengers have been checked and are clear.

Just like, we are not aware of any left turn.

Etc., etc..

All mumbo jumbo given out by Malaysian offical "sources." IMO.

And just to add to this post, I think this goes much deeper than any of us realize. I think there is a terrorist link to all of this.

Obviously Malaysia is doing investigations behind-the-scenes and they HAVE NOT released accurate information in the first weeks. We know because we have one information one minute, and a few weeks later they said something completely opposite.

IFFFFFFF there is no terrorist-link in whatever information they have uncovered thus far, WHY go through such efforts to keep their investigation secret and the truth hidden? Why given out completely opposite versions, as if to lead the public down an opposite path from the truths?

IFFFFFFF no terrorist/hijacker link, why this deep need to keep everything under wraps due to "ongoing investigation."

MEANING, if it was either of the pilots or any of the crew who they suspect did this, they are all dead now.

It is not going to compromise any investigation if one or more of them are the ones who did this. They are not alive to hide any information. They can't destroy laptops, delete e-mails, destroy phones - all of the information which they left is there and is going to be there, because those people have died.

No, no, no - there is something going on, much more than Malaysia is saying.

IMO they already have a very good idea whether it was crew-related or terrorist/hijacker-related.

JMO.

 

[aa9511]

Unless everyone EXCEPT the person operating the plane was behind the locked cockpit. The person in the cockpit could have wiped everyone out in a very short period of time (hypoxia) and still survived with an oxygen mask in the cockpit (which reportedly has greater capacity and is not connected to the passenger mask source) ( Way back in early threads I read that). I think that only one person was alive for the full flight, and in control, and didn't necessarily run out of fuel, but planned for and tried a "Sully" landing in the middle of the "big drink" so that little or NO debris field would be found and the plane would settle to the bottom of the ocean without a trace. Mission sort of accomplished, but for Inmarsat pings. We shall see. JMO JMO

But why did they want the plane to sink down with no debris? What was the point of doing all this?

 

[aa9511]

Here is a thought. To westerners the difference between an Italian name and an Irish name or a Spanish name or a French name seems pretty obvious. (Just to name some examples). Would an Asian person distinguish between them or just think of them all as European? I know with a lot of Asian names I have no clue which are male and which are female without being told. And I know that's the same for some Asian people if they don't know I'm female if they send me an email or something. Would I be able to tell the difference between someone's name if they were from Indonesia vs. India? China vs. Korea (I think sometimes, maybe not all the time)? Malaysia vs. Sri Lanka? One part of Africa vs. another? I kind of know what a Polynesian name sounds like but would I be able to tell Kiribati from Samoa? Maori vs. Fiji? I don't think I could.

Yes, that's true.

But IMO European/American and Arabic-origin/Persian names are very different.

For example, yes if the passport-checker had to deterimine b/w Saudi Arabian, Syrian, Pakistani, Indian, Iranian name then yes all of what you said would be true. They would not be able to distinguish between them.

But between European/American and Arabic/Persian-origin....yes absolutely I think they could distinguish. If they cannot do that, they need some training in it. IMO.

JMO

 

[aa9511]

Inspector-General of Police Tan Sri Khalid Abu Bakar had, on April 2, said they had "obtained some clues" on what might have happened to the flight, based on the statements recorded from 176 people. This number has climbed to 205 as of yesterday.

Khalid had also said the crew were among the main "subjects of the investigations".


Read more: Call traced to co-pilot's phone - General - New Straits Times http://www.nst.com.my/nation/general/call-traced-to-co-pilot-s-phone-1.562612#ixzz2yhWVlGQ6

bbm

Let's just take this name as one example:

Tan Sri Khalid Abu Bakar vs. Adam Stephen Brody

 

[SeekingJana]

Stop and think about the covert intelligence ops. in the UK, US, Australia.
All 3 nations plus more are participating with tremendous resources to " find the plane" or now, just the black boxes and recover them successfully.

IF Malaysia is lying their heads off about what happened, don't you think one of the above countries would have known it by now? It's been a month.
I really think we would know by now from international news sources if Malaysia was being deceptive-- unless entities like the CIA and MI-6 are investigating Malaysian authorities covertly as well. I still think the manpower and equipment would be withdrawn. We don't support terrorism, neither does the UK or Australia.

I think Malaysian airline spokespeople and so forth simply could not make heads nor tails out of what they were seeing and not seeing on radar and released a lot of mumbo jumbo which was probably also mis-translated during the first week or so.

IDK, just something I've kept in mind as the search has progressed.

 

[cady]

Here is a thought. To westerners the difference between an Italian name and an Irish name or a Spanish name or a French name seems pretty obvious. (Just to name some examples). Would an Asian person distinguish between them or just think of them all as European? I know with a lot of Asian names I have no clue which are male and which are female without being told. And I know that's the same for some Asian people if they don't know I'm female if they send me an email or something. Would I be able to tell the difference between someone's name if they were from Indonesia vs. India? China vs. Korea (I think sometimes, maybe not all the time)? Malaysia vs. Sri Lanka? One part of Africa vs. another? I kind of know what a Polynesian name sounds like but would I be able to tell Kiribati from Samoa? Maori vs. Fiji? I don't think I could.

I agree with you, but some fool a day or so after the event described either or both of the Iranians as black. Just nonsense, but why on earth would they even spout that out? Most countries now are multi-skincolored, multi- religious affiliation, multi-fashioned, multi-political , multi-lingual etc etc. Why can't people just report the FACTS? Drives me nuts! JMO

 

[Waddles]

I don't want this to be true and I am very open to other scenarios but from the split second the report was out that the pilot had been to the court case and was such a strong supporter of Ibrahim everything clicked and I've been very much leaning to it being that. Now that I'm reading the rumour about the threat to ditch the plane if the decision wasn't reversed, added to the rumour that the co-pilot potentially called out or potentially attempted to call out it just reinforces it all IMO

 

[Waddles]

I agree with you, but some fool a day or so after the event described either or both of the Iranians as black. Just nonsense, but why on earth would they even spout that out? Most countries now are multi-skincolored, multi- religious affiliation, multi-fashioned, multi-political , multi-lingual etc etc. Why can't people just report the FACTS? Drives me nuts! JMO

well, it seemed to be due to the fact that the official interviewed said they looked like "that Italian footballer" and someone suggested the name Balotelli and he said yeah that's it and I think it was a misunderstanding

 

[SeekingJana]

I don't want this to be true and I am very open to other scenarios but from the split second the report was out that the pilot had been to the court case and was such a strong supporter of Ibrahim everything clicked and I've been very much leaning to it being that. Now that I'm reading the rumour about the threat to ditch the plane if the decision wasn't reversed, added to the rumour that the co-pilot potentially called out or potentially attempted to call out it just reinforces it all IMO

Most of us have read these accounts. We don't know where the truth is within the rumors, but I bet intelligence agencies absolutely do by now.
The pilot's wife, friends and associates have most likely all be questioned ( interrogated?) by now.
Malaysia does NOT have the financial and physical resources to recover the black boxes, so it's in their best interests to tell the truth and release all info they have on the pilot and any other terrorists involved ( if they are involved) before the intelligence community finds out Malaysia has lied for a terrorist and cost the world millions, if not billions of dollars in search efforts.

JMO.