Malaysia Flight MH17 shot down in Ukraine. 298 aboard. 7/17/2014 - #3

[Isabelle]

Mr Colvin (AFP commissioner) said Australians need to be prepared for the possibility of some victims remains being left behind due to the "trauma" to bodies sustained from the plane being shot down and the "added complications" of being denied early access to the site.

"We have to prepare ourselves for the possibility that not all remains will ultimately be recovered," he said.


http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...drew-colvin-20140728-3cpf9.html#ixzz38kmfIjjL

And so the world must live with whatever Russia and the Ukraine choose to do and not to do. Have they become the world's super power? This makes my blood boil !

 

[ZaZara]

NOT ALL VICTIMS, REMAINS MAY BE INDENTIFIED

RTL-Nieuws reports:

http://www.rtlnieuws.nl/nieuws/binn...lachtoffers-worden-geidentificeerd-niet-groot

Translation:

The odds that all the victims are going to be found and identified are "not very high '. Chief Commissioner Gerard Bouman of the National Police has told the Dutch Parliament.

"It's is impossible even for me to know how many victims are currently in The Netherlands," Bouman said. That has to do with the state the remains are in. It is therefore also not possible to tell how many victims still remain in the disaster area. "The repatriation of victims is our top priority above investigations and prosecutions. ""What the members of the National Team Forensic Detection in Ukraine have seen in the body bags , is unbelievable. That was horrible, even for the most experienced colleagues. "

The bodies are released as soon as possible, stressed Bouman. "If there is an identification, the Prosecutor decides on it's release. The family-detectives then inform the next of kin. "If there are multiple victims in one family, the next-of-kin decide if they want to know as soon as one of their loved ones has been identified or only when they all have been identified."


Dutch newspaper TROUW reports more graphic details:
http://www.trouw.nl/tr/nl/4492/Nede...ms-hebben-het-er-vreselijk-moeilijk-mee.dhtml

Translation:

(...)

What is being found in the bags with human remains, is ' horrible ', Bouman reported. ' Bits and pieces together, large and small. Some pieces have also been burned or are badly damaged. ' It is impossible to say with certitude how many people there are.

 

[kimi_SFC]

Tweet from @Reuters - 1m

Australian-Dutch probe team renew efforts to access #MH17 site after fighting kept them away: http://t.co/AYk78nHwDK

http://t.co/L4bHaqFXBe

http://twitter.com/Reuters/status/493789469179269120

 

[kimi_SFC]

Tweet from @TIME - 24m

A TIME reporter was detained in Ukraine while reporting on #MH17. He saw more than he was ever supposed to http://t.co/APmjczF9ib

http://twitter.com/TIME/status/493789452972478464

 

[ZaZara]

LIVE PRESS CONFERENCE

PRESS CONFEREN PIETER-JAAP AALBERSBERG, LEADER OF INVESTIGATION IN UKRAINE


VIA REUTERS

http://www.rtlnieuws.nl/nieuws/binnenland/live-persverklaring-onderzoeksteam-oekraine

any moment now but not yet... beep beep


..... live stream of press conference has been cancelled due to technical problems ...

 

[kimi_SFC]

The Fragile Deceptions of Vladimir Putin

Once the Russian President and the pro-Russian separatists in Ukraine began telling untruths they couldn’t stop

BY SIMON SHUSTER/DONETSK | JULY 28, 2014

The young prisoner did not lift his eyes as he came towards me from the entrance of the basement where he was being kept. There was a gunman behind him, hurrying him along, and the act of climbing a small flight of stairs seemed to take all of his focus.

“Take it easy,” he told the guard behind him.

"Everything’s been beaten out of me.”

(snip)

Even in the sparse light of the rebel headquarters the wounds and bruises showed all over his face, some nearly healed, others still fresh and beginning to scab. His bare chest was visible beneath what looked like a woman’s overcoat. He appeared to be my age, about 30 years old.

(snip)

Over the weekend, it was my good fortune not to join them in that prison basement. The fighter who had filled out my arrest sheet —listing my crime as journalism —then handed it to his commanding officer for review. We chatted briefly about Moscow, in whose suburbs I was born, and after looking through my passport he said to his subordinate: “We don’t need any extra ones [hostages] right now.” Then he turned to me and asked whether I would write anything bad about them. “We haven’t hurt you yet, have we?” I agreed that they had not. But by the time I walked free from their prison, the man I had seen limping up those stairs was no longer their secret to keep.

Multiple embedded videos and MUCH more @ link......

http://time.com/putin-ukraine-crash/

 

[kimi_SFC]

LIVE PRESS CONFERENCE

PRESS CONFEREN PIETER-JAAP AALBERSBERG, LEADER OF INVESTIGATION IN UKRAINE


VIA REUTERS

http://www.rtlnieuws.nl/nieuws/binnenland/live-persverklaring-onderzoeksteam-oekraine

any moment now but not yet... beep beep


..... live stream of press conference has been cancelled due to technical problems ...

:grouphug:
raying:

 

[kimi_SFC]

Tweet from @insidewldftball - 20m

Deputy PM Nick Clegg says Russia should lose the right to host the 2018 World Cup following #MH17 plane crash: http://t.co/aNRf8yIMBS

http://twitter.com/insidewldftball/status/493795636186075137



Full article headline:

28 July 2014 GMT: 16:31
Brit politico puts boot into Russia 2018, but FIFA maintains line

Published on Monday, 28 July 2014 10:47

 

[ZaZara]

REPORT PRESS CONFERENCE PIETER-JAAP AALBERSBERG, LEADER INVESTIGATION UKRAINE

RTL-nieuws reports:
http://www.rtlnieuws.nl/nieuws/binnenland/morgen-nieuwe-poging-rampplek-te-bereiken


Translation:

Tomorrow, the Dutch and Australian experts in Ukraine will once again attempt to reach the crash site of MH17, if the security situation allows this. The risk assessment will be made tomorrow morning.

Pieter-Jaap Aalbersberg, head of the repatriation mission, said this during a press conference.

The team of 38 Dutch and 11 Australians left this morning for the second time with the aim to reach the disaster area, but had to abandon that attempt just like Saturday. They turned back because there were shots being fired in the vicinity of Shakhtarsk, according to Aalbersberg . "After consulting with the OSCE we decided to return to Donetsk."

The experts want to explore the area and search for remains and personal belongings of victims.

In the meantime, work has been going on all levels, Aalbersberg emphasized. "Together with the Australians, experts and equipment are continuously flown in to organize this operation as good and as careful as possible." In Donetsk an operations centre is being set up. Search plans are under development an preparation, but fot these also a first exploration on the crash site is needed.

If the experts find remains, these are immediately salvaged. "We use a refrigerated wagon which located is near Torez. Should that not be accessible due to circumstances, then we provide alternative transport. We leave no remains behind. "


BBM

 

[Donamena]

Im confused ZaZara, aren't there still body parts on the crash site?

 

[ZaZara]

PRESS CONFERENCE IGOR STREILKOV, MAIN SUSPECT MH17

Dutch journalist @marijndt has visited a DIFFERENT press conference:


marijndt @marijndt:

Kom net uit persco met Igor Strelkov, die tweet verstuurde dat zijn mannen vliegtuig hadden neergehaald vlak na neerstorten #MH17
Strelkov, gezien als man achter neerhalen #MH17 Hij ontkent "ik heb gewone militaire opleiding en kan niet met zulke complexe wapens omgaan"
Foto's persco 'hoofdverdachte' Strelkov, in hoofdkwartier separatisten
https://twitter.com/marijndt/status/493784990388609024/photo/1

Igor Strelkov, in verband gebracht met neerhalen #MH17 houdt zijn perso paar kilometer van hotel waar 50 ongewapende Ned.marechaussee zitten

Translation:

Just left press conference with Igor Strelkov, who posted the tweet that his men had brought down plane just after crash #MH17
Strelkov, regarded as man behind the downing of MH17 He denies "I have regular military training and cannot deal with such complex weapons"
Photos persco ' prime suspect ' Strelkov, in separatists' headquarters
https://twitter.com/marijndt/status/493784990388609024/photo/1

Igor Strelkov associated with shooting down #MH17 is holding his press conference a few kilometers from hotel where 50 unarmed Dutch military police are staying.


BBM

 

[ZaZara]

Im confused ZaZara, aren't there still body parts on the crash site?

Yes there are, or at least this is assumed.

 

[kimi_SFC]

Tweet from @BBCWillVernon - 1h

#Ukraine ATO spokesman confirms to BBC (once again) that govt forces do not control the crash site of #MH17, contrary to earlier reports

http://twitter.com/BBCWillVernon/status/493818747145424898

 

[kimi_SFC]

Tweet from @CNNnewsroom - 3m

#BREAKING
U.S. to place new sanctions on #Russia this week, as investigators struggle to access #MH17 crash site http://t.co/fiP5FC6j0K

http://twitter.com/CNNnewsroom/status/493819459493052416

 

[kimi_SFC]

The Empty Spaces Left Behind by Malaysia Airlines Crash - Slide Show - NYTimes.com

Across the Netherlands, a small country of 16 million, there are empty houses, empty offices and empty seats belonging to the 194 Dutch nationals who died after Malaysia Airlines flight 17 was shot out of the sky over the eastern Ukraine, last week Thursday.

Relatives, friends, neighbors and co-workers are reminded of those who are no longer there, uncertain what to do with the places left behind. Dutch photographer Ilvy Njiokiktjien documented the lives lost.

Sascha Meijer’s sun bed

Each summer, Sascha Meijer, 24, a journalism graduate, would return home to her family’s house in Amersfoort. During high school she and a group of friends would sunbathe, sing and try to do their homework on the terrace. “After a sleepover we would even have breakfast up there,” said a friend, Tessa Schop, 24.

“She was sharp, a really good journalist,” said a friend, Fleur Launspach. “I’m confident she would have made great documentaries in the future.”

(1st of 10 images and stories at link.....)


http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2014/07/27/world/europe/20140727PLACES.html?smid=tw-share&_r=0

:tears:


:rose:

:candle:

 

[kimi_SFC]

This image completely shatters my heart:
The bedroom of a ten year old.....!

(snip)

Isa Kooijmans’s bedroom

“Isa was so original and surprising, you could feel it especially when you were alone with her,” said PvT, 12, a cousin.

Isa, 10, did not often tidy her bedroom, which had a poster about vacations, and had left in a hurry for the family’s trip, P said. She said her cousin had told her she would teach all the children she met on vacation how to make bracelets.

“It is weird to be in her room,” P said. “You can feel something is terribly wrong, but the way she left it shows that she was happy and looking forward to her big trip.”


:rose:

:cry: :cry: :cry:

Via nytimes.com slideshow #6of10

 

[geevee]

US satellite images release show MH-17 was shot down by Russia firing into Ukraine.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/20...ages-us-show-russian-rocket-fire-into-ukraine

That statement isn't quite what the article says:

A four-page document released by the State Department seemed to show blast marks from where rockets were launched and craters where they landed. Officials said the images, which were sourced from the US director of national intelligence, showed heavy weapons fired between 21 July and 26 July, after the 17 July downing of Malaysia Airlines Flight 17, over eastern Ukraine.
--
My bolding of dates.

 

[dotr]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...ompression-following-shrapnel-hit-9632881.htm

"Russia is continuing to deny involvement in the crisis, following US Secretary of State John Kerry's plea for the country to stop providing weaponry to Ukrainian rebels.

Washington said it was not accepting Russian foreign minister Sergei Lavrov's denial that it is not contributing to the violence.

Over the weekend, Russia accused the US of being behind "an unrelenting campaign of slander against Russia, ever more relying on open lies."

 

[SouthAussie]

And so the world must live with whatever Russia and the Ukraine choose to do and not to do. Have they become the world's super power? This makes my blood boil !

I think what Mr Colvin is trying to say is that, depending on how close or far passengers were seated to the blast of the missile, some people were still clothed, some had their clothes blasted off, others may have suffered very intense destruction.
They have said that they intend to bring everyone home that they can find .. and that there is no time limit to the search and recovery.

 

[ZaZara]

Oddly, the spokesman for Ukraine's security council is saying data retrieved from the blackboxes has revealed the plane was shot down by a missile. But I would have thought the UK teams who are examining them would have handed over the results to the Dutch first, as they are in charge of the investigation?

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/...FX0VT20140728?feedType=RSS&feedName=worldNews

A second answer.

This is the propaganda war.
I mean the fact that the results of the investigation of the black boxes were mentioned by Ukraine.
Lysenko has no results. Ukraine is not a member of the investgation, so nice try.

Another example of propaganda is, unfortunately, this 40 km zone that Ukraine has established as a no-fight zone.

Jaap van Deurzen, reporter for RTL-Nieuws visited the site of the crash today.
Linke here, alas, it is all in Dutch or with Dutch subtitles.
http://www.rtlnieuws.nl/nieuws/buitenland/heel-verstandige-beslissing-om-niet-naar-rampplek-te-gaan

Reporter Jaap van Deurzen says it was a very wise decision of the Dutch Investigation Team not to travel to the location of the crash.
He did travel to the location himself, and filmed, and he admits that he should not have done it.
Fighting can start there any minute, out of the blue, and it did while he was there.

He saw a convoy of the Ukranian Forces at a checkpoint that the separatists had deserted. The rebels were no longer there, although they were quite near.
This checkpoit was the LAST CHECKPOINT 700 METERS FROM THE SITE OF THE CRASH.
If the Ukranian Forces had spotted the separatists, a fight might have broken out (almost) on the site of the crash.

So much fot the 40 km zone.