Found Deceased Malaysia - Nora Quoirin, 15, from UK, special needs, missing on vacation, Seremban, 4 Aug 2019 #4

[Hjp]

Why would someone take her if they were just going to basically abandon her? She wasn't murdered or assaulted, I can't think of another reason why someone would do this.

Good point and the answer is no one and no other reason.

No kidnapper would walk the girl a leisurely 1.6 mile stroll into the jungle, leave her there, and make the escape.
That would be silly and pointless. A waste of any kidnappers time and above all non-sensical.

Far too close for comfort too for any third party given the short distance from where she was staying.

Yes she walked there from her accomodation entirely alone.

 

[steff13]

We can't know this though. She may have had tough feet from walking bare foot generally. She may have hidden rather than walked around.

True. And I personally wouldn't conclude anything about the "scratches" without seeing them myself. I would think a doctor would have said abrasions rather than scratches anyway. Perhaps this is something that was lost in translation.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

 

[janeh]

It is true, it's such an invasion of privacy and unfortunate for the family.

But since this is an ongoing criminal investigation the information is released to the public. There will be even more released when they get all the test results back. While the details can be sensitive, you never know what can be significant or helpful in giving answers as to what happened. The body tells the story of what happened to Nora, as she can't tell the story herself.

Going through the stress of a trial is even worse.

Hopefully it won't come to that, but the family needs answers and closure so it can put their minds to rest. Imo

My comment was on response to a poster wondering why Nora not being surrounded by blood or that it hadn't been officially mentioned. Somehow my response didn't link as a reply to that person.

I was trying to explain that there is no need for this sort of information being made public at this moment in time.

Sorry for the confusion.

 

[Kubirai]

Why would someone take her if they were just going to basically abandon her? She wasn't murdered or assaulted, I can't think of another reason why someone would do this.

Police can ... it has happened before.

I imagine that Nora's desire to see the waterfall was communicated on Aug 4. Her legacy should be that ALL relevant information is provided, early in the search.

 

[steff13]

Police can ... it has happened before.

For no reason?

 

[janeh]

I’ve been wondering about this as well - what were the exact conditions of her feet? How much walking did she do during those 7 days? Do you have a link to the article? Thank you!

It was part of the announcement this morning when cause of death was reported.

 

[Eve71]

The turning point was the information that Nora really wanted to see the waterfall, not the reward.

I am speculating that a sleeping Nora was taken to the waterfall by someone following the stream, and just left there. She was extremely traumatized after waking up by herself in the forest.

She developed duodenal ulcer quickly from the stress of trying to find her way back to the cabin, hiding from strangers.

Taken there ? For what purpose?

 

[Kubirai]

It is unbelievable that Nora could have made it to that location on her own. Walking through the jungle and navigating the steep sides of the mountain requires a lot of energy.

She herself, or someone carrying her, followed the stream back towards the waterfall. That explains why dogs didn't pick up her scent.

she had not eaten for a week and was starving I would think she would have been incredibly weak. I don't see how she could have had the stamina to keep wandering around after just a few days.

Children have been found alive after not eating for several days. She drank water from the stream, and probably hid and slept in a nearby location.

 

[MsBetsy]

While I don’t blame them for taking her there with her disabilities, I just wonder why they picked it to begin with. It seems extremely boring with little to nothing to do that would occupy them beyond the first few days and they were staying for two weeks. It was described as a dream vacation by a family member (mom’s Aunt maybe?), but I wonder for whom. If it was the parents maybe they should have taken a kid-free retreat and let family stay with the kids? I don’t know. My daughter is 11 and loves all things animal, wildlife, and bird watching (we have two parrots she is obsessed with!), but after maybe 3 days, she would be done.

Well, I suppose not everyone would find a foreign country with a tropical rain forest and a resort with a pool overlooking the mountains boring.

Some would consider it a cultural and educational experience. They might enjoy the food and everything else it has to offer.

I doubt they brought their children there unwillingly. I can't imagine a child being bored in such a magical place. Maybe they enjoy learning and absorbing everything around them.
Not every child has a short attention span.

I really can't judge the parents for their choice of vacation. Everybody's likes and interests are different. Comparing them to yours just isn't productive.

 

[Marty44]

I've been told I should not elude to involvements of the family as it is wrong/disrespectful and there is no proof etc.? If we're having an open and frank discussion then everything has to be looked at. I have not accused anyone of anything. I'm tackling this from a common sense perspective with limited knowledge and info only received via the media that has been released.

From what I have been told (limited info) Nora had special needs, didn't communicate well, and didn't go anywhere ever independently. She also had some mobility issues... from this info alone you can deduce that it's highly unlikely she left that chalet/apartment alone in the dark through a window or spiral staircase(!) without anyone knowing about it. Highly statistically unlikely!

So - she was either abducted by a stranger OR... someone somewhere knows a lot more than they are telling. The fact that she appears to have been 'roaming the jungle' for a few days after the date she disappeared, and prior to being found deceased, is statistically unlikely given the information we have already been told via the media from the family.

Of course, we only know what we have been told via the media, so hopefully we are being told the full comprehensive truth...

 

[MsMiniSleuth]

The turning point was the information that Nora really wanted to see the waterfall, not the reward.

I am speculating that a sleeping Nora was taken to the waterfall by someone following the stream, and just left there. She was extremely traumatized after waking up by herself in the forest.

She developed duodenal ulcer quickly from the stress of trying to find her way back to the cabin, hiding from strangers.

Have you thoughts as to who the 'someone' may be?

 

[becrietz]

I want to state at first that I do believe Nora left on her own and got lost. However, I have been trying to answer the question that if she was abducted why? She was not sexually assaulted or murdered. The only thing I can think of if perhaps someone saw her earlier in the day and did take her. However once they abducted her they realized that she was mentally handicapped and this was too much for them leading to them abandoning her.

 

[Kubirai]

Taken there ? For what purpose?

Local police will probably try to figure that out, if they are allowed access.

 

[MsBetsy]

Everybody in entitled to their views

I just don’t think it was the right environment for her and this case sadly reflects that. A normal functioning child could easily get lost given a chance in such a place and they took a child that was completely dependent on them and the worst happened because she was scared and probably freaked out at being somewhere so different from home.

Maybe we should all just stay home and never provide our children with cultural opportunities.

 

[steff13]

Local police will probably try to figure that out, if they are allowed access.

But what is your theory as to why someone would do that? Why would police be denied access? They stated at the press conference today that there was no evidence of kidnapping; I doubt they are exploring that any further.

How would someone have kept her asleep taking her out of her bed, and traipsing through the jungle?

 

[MsBetsy]

She herself, or someone carrying her, followed the stream back towards the waterfall. That explains why dogs didn't pick up her scent.


Children have been found alive after not eating for several days. She drank water from the stream, and probably hid and slept in a nearby location.

Yes, and I would think the water would have made her sick in less than 24 hours. She had to have been thirsty from the first day. I can't imagine her getting around after that very well.

 

[neesaki]

Police can ... it has happened before.

I imagine that Nora's desire to see the waterfall was communicated on Aug 4. Her legacy should be that ALL relevant information is provided, early in the search.

“It has happened before”... Could you explain / elaborate on this? TIA

 

[MsBetsy]

But what is your theory as to why someone would do that? Why would police be denied access? They stated at the press conference today that there was no evidence of kidnapping; I doubt they are exploring that any further.

How would someone have kept her asleep taking her out of her bed, and traipsing through the jungle?

They have said they are still investigating. They are waiting for toxicology and DNA results and have not looked at all the evidence yet. They still have a long way to go. Imo

 

[JennyDee]

I felt from the beginning Nora had simply wandered off for reasons we will never know. I do question why the parents chose such a holiday destination with Nora’s limited mobility, it’s certainly not somewhere I’d take my children they’d be bored stiff after a few days and I’d be concerned about the lack of security ( no locks on doors, open sides, I’d not sleep at night! ) but they had booked for two weeks. I have noticed on trip advisor most only book a couple of nights at most. Another thing I noticed was the parents were certain she’d been abducted because of her limited mobility, yet how did they expect Nora to navigate the jungle treks when according to them she couldn’t even open a window ?

I wondered this aswell but maybe they do everything for her and thought she’d manage the hike with support as they booked it for 2 weeks but they must of researched it and seen some professional hikers have died doing it and have said it’s not for people with limited mobility.
They must of known there was a possibility she could of got out on her own because even the house had tight winding stairs and she’s got out past her siblings and her parents and opened a window and disappeared and knowone heard a thing even though the house has hard wooden floors.
Nora’s grandfather insisted she was kidnapped as she was to vulnerable and wouldn’t of left on her own or managed to get there on her own even after her body was discovered! He said someone must of dumped her there to get rid of her.
Maybe it’s loyalty to Nora say

I've been told I should not elude to involvements of the family as it is wrong/disrespectful and there is no proof etc.? If we're having an open and frank discussion then everything has to be looked at. I have not accused anyone of anything. I'm tackling this from a common sense perspective with limited knowledge and info only received via the media that has been released.

From what I have been told (limited info) Nora had special needs, didn't communicate well, and didn't go anywhere ever independently. She also had some mobility issues... from this info alone you can deduce that it's highly unlikely she left that chalet/apartment alone in the dark through a window or spiral staircase(!) without anyone knowing about it. Highly statistically unlikely!

So - she was either abducted by a stranger OR... someone somewhere knows a lot more than they are telling. The fact that she appears to have been 'roaming the jungle' for a few days after the date she disappeared, and prior to being found deceased, is statistically unlikely given the information we have already been told via the media from the family.

Of course, we only know what we have been told via the media, so hopefully we are being told the full comprehensive truth...

She was clearly more capable than her parents said if they booked a resort like that for 2 weeks and planned on hiking to the waterfall through a dangerous jungle.
I don’t think police would of put as much effort into finding her as they did if the parents said she probably just wandered off.