Deceased/Not Found MD - Heather Grogg, 33, & Danielle Tyler, 18, Carroll Co, 6 Apr 2020 *arrest*

[Pleeang]

Just drove through Westminster today and was on the lookout for Missing Persons signs. I saw none. If the families aren't actively looking I fear the worst.

I had reason to leave Westminster going south and west, off the main roads, and the thought that kept going through my mind was there are plenty of woods, streams, and ponds all around...Why the heck did they drive all the way to West Virginia that night?

According to her sister, Brandie Hebb, Grogg had been a live-in babysitter for Sanford for about three months prior to Riddle’s death.

Hebb, who initially spoke on the condition of anonymity out of fear of reprisals but later went on the record, said she never had any concerns about her sister living at Sanford’s home: “They were safe people in my eyes.”

Sanford is the godfather of Hebb’s daughter.

The only time she heard her sister complain about the living situation was when Sanford and his girlfriend would leave for several hours at a time. Grogg mentioned they went to West Virginia a few times, Hebb said.

Just drove through Westminster today and was on the lookout for Missing Persons signs. I saw none. If the families aren't actively looking I fear the worst.

I had reason to leave Westminster going south and west, off the main roads, and the thought that kept going through my mind was there are plenty of woods, streams, and ponds all around...Why the heck did they drive all the way to West Virginia that night?

With two Carroll County women ‘missing and in danger,’ those close to them ‘desperate’ for a safe return
Carroll County Times article April 23, 2020

According to her sister, Brandie Hebb, Grogg had been a live-in babysitter for Sanford for about three months prior to Riddle’s death.

Hebb, who initially spoke on the condition of anonymity out of fear of reprisals but later went on the record, said she never had any concerns about her sister living at Sanford’s home: “They were safe people in my eyes.”

Sanford is the godfather of Hebb’s daughter.

The only time she heard her sister complain about the living situation was when Sanford and his girlfriend would leave for several hours at a time. Grogg mentioned they went to West Virginia a few times, Hebb said.
I found this interesting that DS and ED would go to West Virginia. Maybe this is why they took JR there. But what or who was in West Virginia??

 

[Buck187]

According to her sister, Brandie Hebb, Grogg had been a live-in babysitter for Sanford for about three months prior to Riddle’s death.

Hebb, who initially spoke on the condition of anonymity out of fear of reprisals but later went on the record, said she never had any concerns about her sister living at Sanford’s home: “They were safe people in my eyes.”

Sanford is the godfather of Hebb’s daughter.

The only time she heard her sister complain about the living situation was when Sanford and his girlfriend would leave for several hours at a time. Grogg mentioned they went to West Virginia a few times, Hebb said.



With two Carroll County women ‘missing and in danger,’ those close to them ‘desperate’ for a safe return
Carroll County Times article April 23, 2020

According to her sister, Brandie Hebb, Grogg had been a live-in babysitter for Sanford for about three months prior to Riddle’s death.

Hebb, who initially spoke on the condition of anonymity out of fear of reprisals but later went on the record, said she never had any concerns about her sister living at Sanford’s home: “They were safe people in my eyes.”

Sanford is the godfather of Hebb’s daughter.

The only time she heard her sister complain about the living situation was when Sanford and his girlfriend would leave for several hours at a time. Grogg mentioned they went to West Virginia a few times, Hebb said.
I found this interesting that DS and ED would go to West Virginia. Maybe this is why they took JR there. But what or who was in West Virginia??

Wow, that's quite a bit of info. Are you local and know some of the friends/family? I'm just wondering where you read or got your info? I am local but do not personally know any of the people involved, so not likely to learn anything except through "friend of a friend" or social media. Small town talk. Lol

The theory of a gang involvement seems to fit. I know gang activity has been on the increase here for awhile, and this is an unusually brutal crime for Carroll County.

All my own opinion only.

Yes I'm a local, and none of this makes any sense. I don't believe the girls to be missing, or dead. I believe their family are keeping quiet on their location. As I have stated before the family posted regularly back in April regarding their disappearance. Here it is May, and they're quiet as mice. Wouldn't you think you become more worried, and vigilantly doing your best to keep their info in the media? HG has 4 kids. You're telling me a mother of 4 goes missing, and hardly anyone is talking about it. I have good information that DT was seen with MM just days b4 his arrest. That she was fine, and acted normal.

I'm interested to hear heather had complained about DS & ED having left her with their kids for hours when they'd go to WV. I read before the the crime scene in WV was within Miles to DS family member. It seems like DS had alot of parts in this along with his wife, and Babysitter.

 

[MimosaMornings]

According to her sister, Brandie Hebb, Grogg had been a live-in babysitter for Sanford for about three months prior to Riddle’s death.

Hebb, who initially spoke on the condition of anonymity out of fear of reprisals but later went on the record, said she never had any concerns about her sister living at Sanford’s home: “They were safe people in my eyes.”

Sanford is the godfather of Hebb’s daughter.

The only time she heard her sister complain about the living situation was when Sanford and his girlfriend would leave for several hours at a time. Grogg mentioned they went to West Virginia a few times, Hebb said.



With two Carroll County women ‘missing and in danger,’ those close to them ‘desperate’ for a safe return
Carroll County Times article April 23, 2020

According to her sister, Brandie Hebb, Grogg had been a live-in babysitter for Sanford for about three months prior to Riddle’s death.

Hebb, who initially spoke on the condition of anonymity out of fear of reprisals but later went on the record, said she never had any concerns about her sister living at Sanford’s home: “They were safe people in my eyes.”

Sanford is the godfather of Hebb’s daughter.

The only time she heard her sister complain about the living situation was when Sanford and his girlfriend would leave for several hours at a time. Grogg mentioned they went to West Virginia a few times, Hebb said.
I found this interesting that DS and ED would go to West Virginia. Maybe this is why they took JR there. But what or who was in West Virginia??

She was a live in babysitter, wondering why she was complaining about being gone for several hours? Guessing Sanford and gf worked and that’s why they needed a live in babysitter. Cheaper than daycare? IDK

 

[Pleeang]

Yes I'm a local, and none of this makes any sense. I don't believe the girls to be missing, or dead. I believe their family are keeping quiet on their location. As I have stated before the family posted regularly back in April regarding their disappearance. Here it is May, and they're quiet as mice. Wouldn't you think you become more worried, and vigilantly doing your best to keep their info in the media? HG has 4 kids. You're telling me a mother of 4 goes missing, and hardly anyone is talking about it. I have good information that DT was seen with MM just days b4 his arrest. That she was fine, and acted normal.

I'm interested to hear heather had complained about DS & ED having left her with their kids for hours when they'd go to WV. I read before the the crime scene in WV was within Miles to DS family member. It seems like DS had alot of parts in this along with his wife, and Babysitter.

So if you have good information that Dt was alive a few days before MM was arrested. That would put her alive just missing April 6th. So where did she go? Virginia or is she still Around Taneytown. But MM could have still hurt her before arrested?!? Are you saying HG had a part in JR’s murder?

 

[Buck187]

So if you have good information that Dt was alive a few days before MM was arrested. That would put her alive just missing April 6th. So where did she go? Virginia or is she still Around Taneytown. But MM could have still hurt her before arrested?!? Are you saying HG had a part in JR’s murder?

HG is who lured JR over to DS home. JR was there to apparently meet HG. However JR was married. It's not reported whether or not he was having/attempting an affair, but it is rumored that methamphetamines were involved. It is also rumored HG saw JR steal drugs from DS, and told everyone there at the house which initiated the fight between JR & MM.

 

[mompalm]

I saw today, a comment from a cousin of Dani's who said Dani's last phone call made was to 911.. I did reach out via messenger to confirm and will post if I receive a response.

@Clhart82 did you ever get a response regarding DT's alleged last call being to 911? Thanks.

 

[Mayjunejuly]

HG is who lured JR over to DS home. JR was there to apparently meet HG. However JR was married. It's not reported whether or not he was having/attempting an affair, but it is rumored that methamphetamines were involved. It is also rumored HG saw JR steal drugs from DS, and told everyone there at the house which initiated the fight between JR & MM.

That sounds about right, previously I posted this theory of JR going to buy drugs & something went wrong and a fight ensued, this tracks well with MMs past of not being able to properly sell drugs (see MMs 2016 kidnapping charge that stemmed from an argument that occurred when MM & others were selling weed, where MM slashed tires & held a woman at knifepoint)... You've provided a lot of information that seems to be gathered off social media, do you know any of them personally? I totally think your argument holds weight & it tracks well with past scenarios presented. I just want to remind ppl social media is not a verrified source so tread lightly & make sure to mention your source so everyone can read it with that in mind.

Now, you posted some interesting points, like that DT was seen with MM days before his arrest... So does that mean she travelled to Virgina Beach with him? Do you by chance know the date MM left MD for VA? He was arrested by Marshalls on 4/15 in VA, a 5hr drive from Westminster... & it's been confirmed DT was last seen in Taneytown on April 6 so did she leave with MM on or after 4/6? It's odd to think the US Marshall's wouldn't find her if she is alive & was with MM, unless DT also knows someone in VA & is staying with them, but I'd assume if she went to VA with MM she would have been found with him...idk just opinion--

I also agree the social media silence from the family is odd, I also felt that ABs wife also knew more than she said which cemented my previous belief that AB is the informant. (AB's wife's FB posts are odd & gave me this impression)

As for HG, i hadn't heard anything about her trying to go to the hospital....but there was a previous post stating DT was forced into MMs car by knife & she was hurt but got away, she was able to call her friend to say she needed to go to the hospital, but then the phone died & that's the last ppl heard from her ---- idk if this is true, or if parts are true, I only mention it because the similarity of both girls needed to go to a hospital? So who knows....

Also the lack of search parties, vigils, or missing signs in Westminster is very worrying....im not sure what to make of that....

Glad to have some new (possibly accurate) info to mull over & analyze! Thank you for sharing what you know/heard/seen!!!

 

[Clhart82]

@Clhart82 did you ever get a response regarding DT's alleged last call being to 911? Thanks.

Nope.. never got anything back so wasn't able to verify.

 

[Pleeang]

Been doing some research and found out that DS’s mother was arrested for human trafficking in 2013. Article was in Carroll County Times. Could this be a possibility for the girls missing? Trying to find court case. DS was arrested for retaliation against witness.
Man arrested for retaliation against witness

By BY BRETT LAKE TIMES STAFF WRITER
JUL 18, 2013 | 5:07 PM

The son of a Westminster woman arrested on a human trafficking charge last month was arrested Wednesday after police said he threatened a witness in his mother's case.

David Ray Sanford Jr., 19, of the unit block of West George Street, was released Wednesday from the Carroll County Detention Center on $5,000 bail.

According to charging documents, Sanford cursed and yelled at the witness while both were at Carroll Hospital Center June 26.

Sanford allegedly told the woman that "it is your fault my mom is in jail," according to charging documents

 

[CuriousQuiet1]

Been doing some research and found out that DS’s mother was arrested for human trafficking in 2013. Article was in Carroll County Times. Could this be a possibility for the girls missing? Trying to find court case. DS was arrested for retaliation against witness.
Man arrested for retaliation against witness

By BY BRETT LAKE TIMES STAFF WRITER
JUL 18, 2013 | 5:07 PM

The son of a Westminster woman arrested on a human trafficking charge last month was arrested Wednesday after police said he threatened a witness in his mother's case.

David Ray Sanford Jr., 19, of the unit block of West George Street, was released Wednesday from the Carroll County Detention Center on $5,000 bail.

According to charging documents, Sanford cursed and yelled at the witness while both were at Carroll Hospital Center June 26.

Sanford allegedly told the woman that "it is your fault my mom is in jail," according to charging documents

Knox posted early in this case the link for the Maryland Judiciary Case Search
MD - MD - Heather Grogg, 33, & Danielle Tyler, 18, Carroll County, 6 April 2020

I probably spent 30 minutes on that site before I gave up trying to figure out what part of DS's family was in legal trouble for what. There are David Ray Sanfords and other Sanfords with the same addresses in legal trouble in Maryland for decades. Before I searched that website I was sure MM was the bad guy. Now...I think MM and DS (Jr) are like gasoline and matches. Apart they might have just been small time crooks but together they ignited stupid crap that wasn't worth igniting.

ETA: MOO

 

[Knox]

Yes I'm a local, and none of this makes any sense. I don't believe the girls to be missing, or dead. I believe their family are keeping quiet on their location. As I have stated before the family posted regularly back in April regarding their disappearance. Here it is May, and they're quiet as mice. Wouldn't you think you become more worried, and vigilantly doing your best to keep their info in the media? HG has 4 kids. You're telling me a mother of 4 goes missing, and hardly anyone is talking about it. I have good information that DT was seen with MM just days b4 his arrest. That she was fine, and acted normal.

I'm interested to hear heather had complained about DS & ED having left her with their kids for hours when they'd go to WV. I read before the the crime scene in WV was within Miles to DS family member. It seems like DS had alot of parts in this along with his wife, and Babysitter.

I would suspect the WV trips involved drugs. Buying, transporting, or selling. IIRC, it wasn't that far to travel. I think there may be some things about JR that we don't know about, which would speak to the significance of not actually finishing him off at the house in Westminster, but in WV.

Who else besides the known trio came to that rural area to watch him die that night?

 

[Knox]

Been doing some research and found out that DS’s mother was arrested for human trafficking in 2013. Article was in Carroll County Times. Could this be a possibility for the girls missing? Trying to find court case. DS was arrested for retaliation against witness.
Man arrested for retaliation against witness

By BY BRETT LAKE TIMES STAFF WRITER
JUL 18, 2013 | 5:07 PM

The son of a Westminster woman arrested on a human trafficking charge last month was arrested Wednesday after police said he threatened a witness in his mother's case.

David Ray Sanford Jr., 19, of the unit block of West George Street, was released Wednesday from the Carroll County Detention Center on $5,000 bail.

According to charging documents, Sanford cursed and yelled at the witness while both were at Carroll Hospital Center June 26.

Sanford allegedly told the woman that "it is your fault my mom is in jail," according to charging documents

Link to entire story.
Man arrested for retaliation against witness

Good gosh, it's generational with these people!

 

[mompalm]

I'm beginning to wonder if JR may have been, or was scheduled to be, a witness in a trial against one of his attackers or their associates.

Just my own opinion.

 

[Steph8angels]

JMO

I am wondering more about DS being hired as a payback debt or money hit to kill JR. His balls were bigger with MM around and his circle of the 4 That are in custody.

Heather was MOO the one that lured JR over. Knowing or unknowing to his murder.
DT was just with wrong people caught up in a nightmare with bad people.

Someone other than the 4 arrested in JR's murder is the ring leader.

I hope JR and DT recieve Justice.
I see them both as victims.
Heather not sure.

Did Heather know JR's wife?
JR have life insurance?
I do hope his family receives answers in this horrid murder case.

I want to know Heather and JR's connection. History......

 

[CuriousQuiet1]

Just tried searching for MM in the Virginia Beach court records. His extradition hearing was scheduled for Monday but apparently he waived extradition on 5/1. He was booked into Tygart Valley Regional Jail on Thursday, 5/14. His case # is 20-M19F-00061.

The 3 men arrested are in separate jails but are all in West Virginia.

ETA: Nothing in the jail records mentions dates of preliminary hearings. How do we find out when they actually get their first day in court?

 

[abstr]

This is just insane! JMO but I think there is a lot more than all the horrific stuff we suspect going on. There a lot of crazy things happening in the area, and most of those involved in said crazy things have many interconnections with the people missing and those arrested. I have a feeling it is much bigger than this ..... and that is really scary.

 

[stattlich1]

Absolutely NO news that I know of regarding these two missing women. NOTHING. NADA. It's amazing there's no word from LE on anything at all that I know of.

@abstr, I think you're right.

Here's a shot of a new poster that's out on DT. .

HG is also missing. Both ladies still wanted on the Pittsburgh FBI web page, with DT still being right on the front page

Pittsburgh | Federal Bureau of Investigation

 

[abstr]

I have heard two gangs mentioned. Anyone have any thoughts on which it is?
There is something going on that we don’t know.... and I can’t report the crazy gossip.
I am so far away from being an insider that I cannot imagine what the close circle is hearing.

 

[mompalm]

...Like everyone here I'd like to believe that HG & DT are still alive. I can't help but feel like their family (possibly fbi too) know there whereabouts, but for reasons due to safety, are continuing to act as though they're missing. I posted here b4 regarding the lack of any missing posts from family. Strangers are posting missing post daily, but family & friends aren't!?! If they were still missing, or worse Dead, the families (sister, grandmother...) would still be posting frantically. Just as they did back in early-mid April. I have scrubbed facebook down. I have seen post after post from strangers, but none from family since May started. I've also seen where family of HG & DT will respond to t
Other post regarding the missing, but not post anything themselves. I have also seen where strangers will come back to old post asking for updates, and a family member will respond with a simple "they're still missing"...

RSBM

Just to confirm what @Buck187 has said, the family seems to have stopped making "missing" posts around 4/26 or 4/27. I have also noticed that if asked about the status of DT or HG, the response is usually brief and along the lines of Still Missing, Nothing or Not Found Yet.

DT's grandmother has still been posting on SM pages asking people to keep looking and find her safe.

All that could fit with the scenario that the families have heard something, but may not know where or how DT and HG are, and have been instructed not to give out any more info. Still must feel like they are living a nightmare and it is heartbreaking.


Just my own opinion.

 

[Local2CarrollCo]

Been doing some research and found out that DS’s mother was arrested for human trafficking in 2013. Article was in Carroll County Times. Could this be a possibility for the girls missing? Trying to find court case. DS was arrested for retaliation against witness.
Man arrested for retaliation against witness

By BY BRETT LAKE TIMES STAFF WRITER
JUL 18, 2013 | 5:07 PM

The son of a Westminster woman arrested on a human trafficking charge last month was arrested Wednesday after police said he threatened a witness in his mother's case.

David Ray Sanford Jr., 19, of the unit block of West George Street, was released Wednesday from the Carroll County Detention Center on $5,000 bail.

According to charging documents, Sanford cursed and yelled at the witness while both were at Carroll Hospital Center June 26.

Sanford allegedly told the woman that "it is your fault my mom is in jail," according to charging documents

WOW! I had not heard about that before...that is SHOCKING to read as a local. VERY disturbing, especially in relation to what has transpired with this case...wow.